If you had the password...
 

If you had the password to a boyfriend/girlfriend's e-mail, facebook, myspace, whatever... would you look if they wouldn't find out?

Post as anon if you don't want the truth out there.

I would have to say that I would, and I would guess that I was probably in the majority. I guess it's a trust issue, but be that as it may I would still do it.

No. Never. This kind of snooping activity is a huge indicator of relationship problems. Trust issues and paranoia - GO!

Didn't you see that Sex and the City episode where Miranda ruins her relationship with the doctor by finding his spanking fetish porn?

I actually do have the password to Magpie's email. And all of mine comes through Thunderbird, so she doesn't even need my password to see it.

I don't look. What would I possibly want to find there?

No. I wouldn't look. That's somewhat creepy. Just a notch below memorizing the friend's names in their personal account and seeing how many you can find in real life, "just for kicks, you know".

I hardly care what my e-mail box contains, so what trivial knowledge do I seek to gain by persuing a close friend's messages, or how many thousands of friends they have?

I'm boring; eclectic, but boring. Also, I am way too apathetic (read as: trusting) to make myself paranoid over messages in a mailbox.

I have pretty incriminating shit in my inbox ... so yeah, happy I live alone!!

No, wouldn't look.

I've snooped.

Doesn't accomplish much.

If I'm suspicious of any wrongdoing on his part, of course I'd look.

I read my wife's email - but she is fully aware that I do - her computer is in the house and mine is not. I'm not looking for skeletons - don't think there are any to look for.

Would I snoop without her knowing? No.

My suggestion for the bigger question is:

What would you be looking for?

Infidelity? Money issues? Secret confessions to friends?

...

Why does it seem like everybody is digging for The Truth?

Perhaps because Real Honesty is so hard to come by.

I have my wife's passwords. I don't look at her email.

Maybe, if I had reason to suspect wrongdoing on her part, and if I had reason to believe that snooping would shed light on the situation.

Absolutely, positively not. If I don't trust her, I'm not dating her.

Exactly. If you don't trust each other, what's the point?

The fact that we don't live in an ideal world?

Sometimes I wonder if we're lucky to have so many perfectly honest and idealistic members or unlucky because so many of us are full of shit.

Thus says the murderer.

Totally anecdotal but I've always found that when it comes to relationships: hard > honest.

Hard one - if I'd done thins for my first marriage, I'd have nipped things in the bud before her affair spiraled into true infidelity.

But then I'd still be married to a lunatic who made me miserable.

All in all, letting things work out on their own without snooping will lead to a better resolution in the long run, based on my experience, but the long run might be longer than you thought.

I have the ability/skill to get into my wife's email, but not the desire.

lol@some of the responses.

Look at the divorce rates today. How common is it for kids to say 'I'll be at my Dad's this summer' instead of 'Yeah we're going on a family vacation?' My parents met at 15 and remained together. They've been married for over 40 years. Sadly, it's just not like this anymore. It's disgusting imo.

I say there's nothing wrong with being cautious and / or aware instead of naive. You have to be nowadays.

This is a total double edged sword question...if I suspected wrongdoing then yes I'd look. Although when a boyfriend grabs my phone and looks through it I find that somewhat irritating. I don't keep incriminating emails in my boxes in the first place. I trust he has nothing to hide and vice versa. When it comes to personal files on my computer as in old naked photos..yes I'm not keen on him finding those and have made him his own login so he can't find them if I'm out of the room. Fuck it's 3am...

I have her email password, and I've looked on occasion, but it's just when she gets an email from her ex (who is a total prick), and she'll tell me to go look and read it.

Dave and I have always had the passwords to each others stuff (going on 6 years now), not limited to email or social networking, but ALL things, bank accounts, forum accts etc. We do this so there is no "trying to figure out what to do" if something should happen to one of us. The only time I go into Dave's email is:

When he's away somewhere and cant and he asks me to look up something for him
When I've bought him a gift using our paypal account, because it goes to his email, and I dont want him knowing about it

I have no need to "snoop" and Im the type of person that IF (and with Dave thats a HUUUUGE if) I suspected something I'd have no issues confronting him about it and dealing with it without going behind his back.

We have each other's passwords. We don't look.

I know all of my ex's passwords. And I still don't look. That's a privacy violation.
We had an open-account policy with each other at all times, but if one wanted to look, the common courtesy was to ask. I never did, nor did he unless we were showing each other something.
Even now with the CC involved, I still wouldn't want to violate his privacy. Nor would I tolerate him doing that to me. No matter how much I've been tempted in mind-altered moments, that boundary has remained sacred.

I don't think I'd look unless I have asked questions and didn't get an answer that seemed to match the behavior. I haven't really thought about it much to be honest.

Then why did you even exchange passwords to begin with?
And how would you know he hasn't changed his passwords since you broke up unless you've tried them out? lol

same reasons that shani has the passwords...

no i don't snoop, and no i don't believe she snoops either.

Ok, this is going to be hard to answer. In all honesty, yes, I have looked when I knew the passwords. and it killed me. I found out things I wish I hadn't and then could not confront my now ex-husband about it because I felt guilty. It destroyed me. That was a long time ago though. A different time, a different place. The way he was acting and what he was doing on the computer left me feeling very insecure and not trusting. Of course, now we are separated. I cannot look back and regret; but look forward and learn. IF I ever have another SO, there will be no snooping. IF I suspect something, I will confront him immediately. Open and honest with my next relationship, if and when that happens.

I would suggest to anyone, if you suspect something is wrong, TALK about it. Don't snoop. Snooping kills relationships. Not that it is totally to blame for mine failing, but I am sure it contributed to an already failing relationship.

Same.

better question is, why are you letting your S.O. have your passwords if you dont expect them to use it at some point to check up on things?

Pfft, I'm not sure how this fits in the thread. Directly, anyway. Like age matters?

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Your parents trust each other. They grew up before the Me Me Me generation.

Trust is the foundation of a relationship, not exposure. It's like faith, ya know? You just believe. Until proven wrong, of course.

All this "plausible deniability" shit is ruining relationships today. It's selfish.

This philosophy? It's not a partnership, it's emotional chess.

Fuck that. I'll be here... arms wide open... until ya stab me in the heart.

I really want to get cromp a big ol' man hug... and a cookie.

I got to have man love for someone on here, Martian took POA from me. Heartless bastard. I loved that dirty man child! DAMN YOU MARTIAN! DAMN YOU ALL TO HELL!

*****

I've had the chance to do this before, but I chose not too. I have passwords to alot of friends' computers and email addresses. I work on alot of their computers and such. I usually don't care enough to want to do this, but with anything I've put my penis into, I care a bit more. I had a good-time booty call that left her email address password on my computer. It was open to her inbox. I saw right off the bat, emails I would love to read. I logged out and told it stop remembering the password.

I couldn't do it, even if I knew I could have gotten away with it.

I don't feel the urge. It's his space.

I know most of my SO's pins and passwords because otherwise he forgets them. We also have a "community" password that we use for everything the other might need access to.

Like Shani, I have no need to snoop, nor the desire. I sincerely doubt I ever will.

I might look, but probably not. I'm a sysadmin, so I'm used to being able to read people's email and not doing so. I'd have them change their password though, because people shouldn't share passwords.

I've been snooped on. Did not appreciate it. Only drove me further away.

I've been tempted to snoop, but I've held myself back. Don't think there was any real moral reason why I didn't do it. I just couldn't reconcile my curiosity with any substantiated suspicion.

I have passwords of emails, facebooks and MySpaces. I don't look at them. If I want to check somebody's friend's cause they're otherwise private, I ask if I can do so first.

I know the password to the computer and she saves all her other passwords in firefox. If I wanted to snoop, I could, but honestly I trust her.

This is specific to my current woman though, I have looked through an ex's phone, and I'm glad I did, because she was keeping way too much from me, and it helped me make the decision that I made.

I read my ex's email all the time.

They were exchanged in the event that something happened to one or the other of us because bills and other information that either may need in an emergency or if the other was incommunicado went to each of our email accounts.

And I don't know that he's changed them, but we've been separated several times in the past and they were the same at the time of the breakup as they were when we met. I use his newzbin and he uses my easynews so I know those are the same.

We know each others' passwords and are free to go into each others' email addresses. Our passwords are saved on the computer so if you open facebook or gmail it goes whoever used it last (unless one of us logged out). I usually log out of facebook so that she doesn't accidentally post as me (which has happened a few times).

Neither of us have anything to hide so going into our email isn't really snooping.

Nope. I wouldn't even take money from a husband/boyfriend's wallet without him being right there.

The guy I last lived with insisted I have his passwords and PINs. I knew he trusted me, so why would I betray that trust?

If I look, I make sure to hide the body.

I didn't say she should trust me. I have to go return some videotapes.

Pretty much my philosophy. I don't think it's naive to trust someone. I'm not going to go snooping through their personal stuff, because 1) I'd be absolutely furious if someone did that to me, and 2) I'd feel...dirty.

Again, I say, if you don't trust each other, what's the point? No, the world's not perfect, and not everyone is trustworthy. But if I'm letting you into my life, and into my heart (yeah, I know, that's cheesy), I'm damn sure gonna trust you. Have I paid for that? You bet. But I'm not gonna get all sneaky and bitter because of it.

I suspected, asked, got a negative answer.
...
After that, of course I went through her phone. What I found, it completely annihilated me. I haven't been the same person since.

Maybe you got confused on what I was saying.

I was trying to show how my parents fell in love at a young age and remained together. Actually, it's the same with all their siblings as well. They all met young and stayed together. These sorts of relationships just don't happen anymore. And it's sad.
A lot of people say this. But I don't understand why. I'd honestly be flattered lol. It did happen once before and I thought it was adorable. I had nothing to hide of course. If I did, then I would definitely be furious.
As we all know, you take a chance on getting hurt when entering any sort of relationship. When tension's in the air with a significant other, a simple 'are you cheating on me' question will not always get an honest answer lol. Especially nowadays.

Not that I'm any different than anyone but I have been hurt very badly by men as well as women in my past. I choose to avoid having my heart ripped out again if at all possible - all while knowing that if I do start looking for trouble, there's a damn good chance I will indeed find it. I think it's a control thing. I must have the upper hand even when getting fucked over, if that makes sense.

My motto - expect the worst and hope for the best.

Can I just point out that my parents got together at 17, and after over 40 years together split up.

My Dad admitted that he'd suffered depression for at least 15 years, largely as a result of being in a loveless marriage and falling for another woman (but he did nothing about it).

It was only when he explained this to my mother (and the other woman) that everyone told him he was being an arse and should leave my mother.

Divorce and separation statistics clearly show that this is not a new phenomenon, and that relationships have always failed.

No really Daniel_ you are a clever man. And I'm not being sarcastic. I have never looked at divorce in a glass half full kind of way. Thankyou.

Perspective, baby. If our privacy wasn't respected, we're more likely to mistrust.

When I was much younger I was a snooper. People can grow and change also, depending on their experiences.

right on the words with the question of are you cheating on me will get a honest answer. the relationship was going really well and suddenly it took a deep turn into silence and constant ignoring, chat messages closed when i walked in the room. so i asked that of him, got a no and he was enraged. i told that i was being possessive, etc.

it wasn't til then i went to snooping. yes, i felt dirty about it, but the hostility i got made it too hard to not look. however, i found the correct answer. he was and had plans of moving away from the area without saying another word with a old ex of his. confrontation with print outs of said emails and chat messages, the plan went out the window. i had hoped for the best, but expected the worst and found it.

the second time, again same one, i don't know why i bothered staying with him. he got to acting all suspicious again. we went from having a really good relationship again and then went into the same routine. i never asked this time. he had decided to hook up again with a different ex who was in a relationship herself, and she was too afraid to leave him and he was giving her time to before telling me he was gone.

so, sometimes, it pays to. and yes, we had each other's passwords to everything. i didn't do anything, i had nothing to hide. thus the openness of said information. why he didn't change the passwords after the first time i don't know, but i caught him in the act once again.

plus at the time this was going down prior to the breakup, we had mutually agreed to move to a place closer to his grandmother to help her more. i had already signed the lease and came back to a WTF did you sign it. i was completely confused and said you already put your signature on the papers before i even did mine.

so, my snooping came about to too much suspicion of actions and attitude. am i proud of myself? no. i sometimes wish i never did it. but the other times, i'm glad because i would have come home and he'd have packed up and left without me having a clue.

Yep, and snooping can be a hard habit to break...

Well I'm the kind of cat who is killed by curiosity. No matter whose email address and password I got, I'd go looking. And not for anything incriminating, dirty, infidelity, etc., just because I'm intensely curious about the mundane day-to-day details about people that goes on.. a kind of "vicarious living" if you will. I'd read their spam and their letters to grandma, and skip the dirty letters to the ex.

If I were specifically wondering about infidelity, I wouldn't go snooping in an email inbox to find out.

I'm the kind of person "life casting" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lifecasting_(video_stream) is aimed at .. not so I can catch anything dirty, but so I can watch Random Joe walk around town, order Starbucks, tie his shoes... etc., etc.

Snooping is a great way of playing the Untouchable Game:

Curiosity or not, snooping is violating the trust and privacy of your partner. You're going around them to find your own answers. Or "answers."

I figure If you don't have trust and privacy in a relationship... you don't have doodly squat. You gotta be "me and you, alright?" and roll with it.

All this "hit the silk" contingency plan shit only makes us into the dickhead that Henry Rollins was ranting about above.

...

Also: I've learned that the same people that snoop are the same people that don't want to go to marriage counseling.

I won't carry on a serious relationship with someone I don't feel I can trust, and I have no problem being held to that same standard. If I snooped, how could someone trust me?
I have to disagree with you for two reasons.

First, my generation hasn't had time to prove that our relationships can last. I'm 25, but I have cousins who have been married for close to 10 years (in fact, one of my cousins met her husband at age 15 and dated through college) and are happy together, never fight, have two kids, and I would put $1000 down to say that they will still be together in 30 years.

Second, I think you're clinging to a romanticized Leave it to Beaver-style vision of how things were back then. Maybe people didn't divorce, but people turned a blind eye to depression-related alcohol abuse and men hitting their wives. No generation wants to admit it, but shit has been the same for a long time. Look back at the glory days of ancient Athens and you'll see infidelity, teen pregnancy, rampant drug and alcohol use, and all the stuff that people blame on those damn kids these days. Sure, there were waves of puritanism and conservative backlash movements, but not a lot has changed.

Whiz-bang. +1.

And they didn't have skeezy Craigslist hookups. Main streamers were against divorce.

Now ya can get a divorce over the phone for $300 and nobody is shocked.

Because nobody lives forever and having the pin's and passwords makes cleaning up after the funeral much much easier. I spent days cracking my brother's email password for my sister in law so that she could retrieve email address's of some of his friends and our relatives (ones I don't talk too, some I don't even admit they exist) to pass along the message of his passing on. There was a forum he was on quite a lot, some of the regulars knew of his condition and asked to be kept informed but it was a invite only forum and stupid me didn't think to have him invite me before it was too late (denial at its best I guess). I don't why but his (inset a LOT and I mean a lot of swearing here) bank wanted not only a marriage certificate and death certificate but his dam PIN code before they would let her access their joint account as it required both their signatures and she didn't have his pin code, more red tape and stress when really not needed.


Because it would be a betrayal of trust. My wife has all my codes/pins for emergency use, I trust her to use them in that way only, not to use them to spy on me. To spy on a person means you don't trust them and what kind of relationship can survive without trust?

One thing I missed, how could you be flattered that someone was snooping in your stuff? While there are ways to piss me off and get your calls and other messages ignored until I cool down, I discovered last that the only thing that can enrage me to the point that I will completely cut off contact with someone is unsubstantiated false accusations. I can take criticism, insults, and angry tirades, but falsely accusing me is an attack on my character and I will not tolerate it. This was at work, and I was not the primary contact person for the client organization, so it made it easy for me to mail back their $2000 check and refuse to accept their phone calls. They haven't been back since and I will not work with them if they do come back.

If you don't feel that my word is good enough, then you can find someone else who will put up with your suspicion. I will not willingly lie to someone I care about.

Not true in all cases. I was more than willing to go to counseling. HE refused.

Ugh :(. So sad.

I definitely don't know the specifics with your parents. But I'm sort of insinuating people just don't even try anymore. Divorce is more common than herpes and / or cold sores these days. But that's another thread altogether lol.
I'm sorry :/.

It sounds like in some twisted way, he wanted you to catch him. He obviously has issues. And what keeps me moving forward is never forgetting how shitty karma can be.
But most people here are talking about willingly exchanging passwords and such. Is it actually 'snooping' anymore when this is done between two people?
*loud buzzer*

You're way wrong there. At least in my case. I've always (I think,) been the one who wanted to work shit out. Even after catching them fucking me over with some other cu**, I never wanted to give up. I always throw myself into my relationships 364% without holding back. Walking away from them is extremely painful. As I was saying up above, it's like couples don't even try anymore. They just divorce without a second thought and bitch about it for the rest of their lives.

But don't get me wrong - I'm not saying divorce isn't always the wrong thing to do.
Makes complete sense. However I just have trust issues period, thanks to my choices in men and my overall luck in the past. But they don't keep me from getting involved again. I can indeed love yet still have reservations.
I almost used that same exact metaphor in one of my posts lol.

And you're right. This is how I was raised. Little girls are supposed to grow up, get married, have babies and live happily ever after. But it's not that way anymore. Men and women alike have all turned into lazy and selfish pigs. Marriage means nothing sacred anymore. If it ain't working, just divorce. It's just a sign of the times. Call me old fashioned if you will. I call it having morals.

It's almost like you're on both sides of the fence though. You talk about how you won't be with anyone unless you trust them. Yet 'Leave It To Beaver' is passe.
Giving your significant other (especially a woman,) passwords to your personal email accounts is like leaving an opened package of Oreos in front of a 5-year-old lol. They're going to indulge. Fact.

---------- Post added at 06:14 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:13 PM ----------

Man, this was a lot of quoting. I think I got everyone tho. :o

Unfeminism'd! Sympathetic men are currently engaged in social reparations... to take care of crimes against women for the last million or so years.

I see it more like he's gonna trust someone but he's got realistic expectations about the modern relationship dynamic and roles of partners. I mean, he's not going to tell you to stop posting and get back in the kitchen to fetch him another beer. We're all equals now, right? For better or worse.

So women are incapable of restraint / self control? Pfft, I coulda told you that. I've seen the first season of Sex and the City.

Kidding, of course. Men and women are equally curious creatures. The biggest thing that separates us? Bullshit notions.

...

I wholeheartedly recommend divorce to anyone who's unhappy with their marriage.

I mean... it's so good for the economy.

I'll never burn my bras.
They're too expensive and pretty.

lol

I'm calling bullshit and I actually agree with Crompmeister.
PEOPLE have issues with self-control. It's individual. Some do, some don't.
I don't have a problem with oreos or my ex's emails.
Blanket statements bother me.

What part?

lol

So... how do you feel about mothering my legions?

Can you hammer a 6" spike through a board with your penis?

I... I have a smoothspot.

But you betcha. I can hip thrust a railroad spike through a Buick.

...

Hey, how about I give you the password to my Gmail and you figure out if I'm an asshole or not. That sounds like a good plan based on this thread.

I'll take the password, sure. I'm sure someone on here would throw me a couple bucks for it or something.

But I've already concluded you're as harmless as bebeh kitty bear with some sort of loaded firearm :o.

I assure you that my firearms are as empty as my head.

...

Enough bullshit, back on topic: I can understand the utility of having a partner's passwords if you're married and share important things such as bank accounts... but personal email and such? Total landmine. Let them have that space to themselves.

If you really wanna share emails... get a joint email account. It's safer that way. And so sickeningly cute. "Jan&Ted4eva@gmail.com."

Then again... sharing a joint bank account is considered a suicide attempt in some countries.

As Noodle said, bullshit. Not even close to a fact. Insulting, as a matter of fact. And it's not June Cleaver. It's believing that two people can base a good relationship with a foundation of trust. Otherwise, that relationship is destined for doom.

It seems as though you're on both side of the fence. You think the sanctity of marriage should be upheld at nearly all costs, yet you think females are incapable of self-control, respect and trust?

Yeah. And all men cheat.

I'll be honest....Yes and it had NOTHING to do with trust. The time I am thinking about has to do with the TFP and trying to discover who my new boyfriend was.....he even warned me not to snoop because the content was very outdated and during another period of his life but I couldn't help myself. He was so interesting to me I really wanted to know more about him without asking and receiving the whole 'new relationship" censorship......I snooped and found. I didn't find out anything that was wrong/illegal/immoral....but it was still painful. I am hoping that this very important lesson was learned and will stick.

No, women do that, too. I blame the French. And my lack of genitalia.

Crompsin TFP Rule #4: Never mention TFP to a potential significant other. They'll see the "real you" and nobody likes that.

Statements like this kill me when I know I've never cheated (turned it down actually... while drunk) when every girl I've dated has cheated on me.

One even pulled the "I was in another country, you know how that goes" excuse.

Women aren't evil cheaters. Men aren't evil cheaters. PEOPLE are evil cheaters.

Human nature is ugly; unless you are on the giving side, you are on the receiving side.

I love you jewels.

First of all, I don't think there's a 'these days' type of issue going on here. There have always been thing that people think of as private in relationships, snooping is no new concept. Your opinion that people don't try anymore is just that, your opinion. I tend to disagree.

Also, your last comment there about the oreos..yeah, that's definitely not a fact. Many people here have stated that they have no disire to snoop, are we to assume they lied?

In my relationships, I have never felt the need to snoop. I just don't feel like that is a way to accomplish anything. Right now, I pretty much have full access to all of my SO's important accounts and I have no desire to look at any of them. If I need to use his computer for something, or look for something in his email, I always ask as a courtesy and he does the same.

My question was direct and wasn't a honest answer unfortunately, neither was the second time around. I don't believe in cheating and honestly think it is the most disrespectful thing to someone.

I want to quote woods, but haven't a clue how to put it in. I may have been at the computers for 20 years but even I don't know alot of things.

I know this is going to sound vindictive but, shitty karma can come back on one. And I hope that it seriously does with him. I've found a new life. I began a new life. I didn't change myself completely but I came to alot of the problems I had with trust as well as made myself much less paranoid.

Also, I gave it my 150% to make it work, even after the first two incidents it was the last one of him taking off with my best friend that was the complete break down of my life to the point of seeking medical attention to survive.

I have a wonderful spiritual spouse. It's a piece of paper. It's not important to me. I have my daughter. And I have my peace of mind that I didn't have before. And he was actually met online in EverQuest 2 and he lived in Minnesota and moved to Virginia just for me. The memories of that first meeting still gives me the shivers down your spine that is of pure joy and happiness you knew you were to look for in the future.

I gotta stop rambling on posts LoL

I have nothing to hide. Never have. But I respect people's privacy, and I expect the same in return. The thought that my significant other has to be somehow involved in EVERY SINGLE THING I do is baffling to me. I would not be flattered...I would be offended.



*shrug* I think this is the essential difference. While I've been very badly hurt as well, I don't feel the need to be in control. I don't want the upper hand... I just want equal ground.

THIS is where I went wrong. 3 times.

Yeah, I don't talk about TFP with my wife. Ever. I love her to death, but she is not nearly as open minded as I am.

On the PW issue, I don't want to know, and when I do, I don't snoop anyways.

My wife, earlier in our relationship, had me tested by having a girl hit on me, dug through my wallet and checked my chat logs. After some mild confrontations and scandals (I was a wild child), I explained to her the premise behind depeche mode's policy of truth. If you won't like the outcome, don't ask the question. I've never cheated, but I told her if she keeps up the shenanigans, I'll leave eventually. It was that day that she said she would drop the paranoia and old scandals (like hanging out with a girl that hit on me once, etc) and our lives have been better for it, ever since.

Take a step back from teh screen and breathe!

I am female lol.

And I obviously haven't stated one sex is better than the other.
Approximately 50% of all marriages THESE DAYS end in divorce. If you need citing, please feel free to use Google for loads of various references. This is no opinion.

What, do you think it's because people are just meaner now or something? No.
You folks are misusing the word 'snoop.'

If partners willingly exchanged passwords, then it's not snooping. The op used the phrase 'if they would never find out.' Those of you who are getting your panties in a bunch over the word 'snoop' need to chill. No one here on the board has accused you of doing this. But I do absolutely believe that at some point and time, if a couple has openly exchanged this information, each individual has indeed logged on to the other's account. You even said you did.
You were just a 5-year-old with manners. You asked first lol.
Reading this was very familiar. This happened to me in 1995. The two of them were fucking around behind my back, calling ME crazy for questioning whether or not this was happening. They denied it every time for about 2-3 months. I went ape shit, struggling with 'hey, maybe I really am just paranoid,' until I walked in late one night and caught them on my brand new sectional.

I let him keep my sectional.

You have to keep reminding yourself that all the bad you do in life, you get in return threefold. And the same applies with all the good. I hope this gives you some peace / piece of mind. :o

That's the point. It's NOT sad. My father (who I care about deeply) was made miserable by doing "what he ought to".

Leaving my mother brought him peace, happiness and an end to depression - not because she was bad in any way (she was not) but because she wasn't RIGHT for him.

In a more intimately mobile society he had the option of moving on, which he felt he wasn't entitled to because of his generation's view that "once you say I DO you live with the consequences".

My mother now has a new BF, and no longer has to watch her partner be sick and miserable without knowing why.

My father now lives with his new GF, and enjoys the shared interests that he never could with my mother.

Breaking up was in the long run a good thing for them. As a chemistry graduate, I would liken the pain of separation to the activation energy of a chemical reaction, and the better life that they both have now as the product.

If you're not right for each other, meaning miserable, then it's time to rethink and see if it can be fixed with counseling or if it's time to go separate ways.

My parents have been together for 49 years (omg i didn't think about this til now), however they are complete opposites of each other. By this I mean, my father is laid back, has a sense of humor, and is generally a smartass and know prankster. I have no problems with him, I have gotten better relationship with him as I got older.

Now my mother? Good god don't tell a joke in her presence, she won't get it. Everything is serious even if it's some tiny issue. She comes across as a ..... well.... I'd call her a bitch at times but since we have cleared up a few mental issues she's gotten a bit better. But the sense of humor is still a bit lacking. How the hell they survived these years I'll never know. I know they've been with each other with the good and bad .... lots of bad actually. Taken care of the other when the other was "down".

PS woodS I forgot to mention..... she had left her husband and was staying with me when it started.... Got a S/O in the house? I wouldn't recommend letting your best friend or such to stay longer than a couple of days. Maybe not at all.

uhmmmm...this is the real me.....sorry.:paranoid:

Deep dark, huh? I think maybe I should have included the word "context" in there.

I see a lot of misconceptions about divorce statistics going on in this thread.

Divorce rates have increased since the introduction of no-fault divorce (1950-1970), certainly, but the per capita rate of divorce (number of divorces per 1000 people) has actually decreased since 1980. General divorce rates have actually held fairly steady since the 1970s. Additionally, marriages that end in divorce last about 7 years on average.

I'm sorry, woods, but you're buying into the idea that somehow yesterday was better than today. I see plenty of long-term marriages surviving today. My parents have been married for 27 years, and I fully expect them to stay married until death separates them. My SO's parents are the same, and his family is full of similar, stable marriages. I also see marriages break apart; divorce has touched both of our extended families, but in both cases, the divorce was for a good reason, and certainly not for any lack of trying. People don't throw in the towel on a 25+ year marriage without a good reason. Regardless of how long a marriage has lasted, the alternatives must outweigh the costs for divorce to take place.

The real reason why divorce rates seem higher is because of the introduction of no-fault divorce. Prior to no-fault divorce, it was very difficult for women in particular to get out of bad marriages.

The CDC does a great job of tracking marriage and divorce trends. You can read a report here: http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/series/sr_23/sr23_022.pdf

/threadjack

I'll give it a shot if there's mutual interest, but I won't stay with someone I can't trust. It's also possible that I can trust someone, they can trust me, and we just drift apart after a while or don't have the same interests. June Cleaver would never cheat on me, but I'm pretty sure she wouldn't react very favorably if I suggested she strap on some gravity boots and 69 while hanging upside down.

I see why you see me as on the fence, but I think you also seem to be. I want my relationship based on mutual trust but don't really find the traditional way of doing things appealing, while you like the traditional marriage and family idea (which comes with loving each other till death do you part,) but are afraid it won't work out that way and worry that your worst fears are true.

I think this is one of those things where we have to agree to disagree. I hope you find someone who never makes you suspicious enough to want to snoop, because it sounds like some people in the past have screwed you over pretty badly and you blame your "choices in men," and probably at least subconsciously feel responsible, which you shouldn't.
The annual divorce rate is 3.6 per 1000 people. The marriage rate is 7.5 per 1000. This doesn't take into account the 54.5 million married couples out there. Yes, for every 2 couples married this year, one will divorce, but there are a whole lot of people who were already married who will stay married, and the ones who divorce are not all from this year's new marriages. It's a really deceptive statistic.

I understand what you mean - wasn't saying 'oh it's too bad they didn't try.' I just hate to hear about any divorce, unless there's some sort of abuse or cheating involved. It's great your parents are both happier now.
GET OUT OF MY BRAIN! lol

This slut was breaking up with her bf of 4 years. She started spending the night. Started with a couple nights / week then it turned into every night. When she wasn't around, I pitched a fit to him saying I didn't want her living with us, etc. Of course, he stood up for 'poor her and her unfortunate situation.' I will never allow anything like this to happen again.

Last I heard, they're still together. Glad I could help. pft.
I am over him completely though. It's the situation that I'm still aching over. Being screwed, in general. Fuckerz.
They've decreased slightly, but not by much. I found a killer graph last night that showed where it shot sky high and pretty much held steady. But I didn't post it because I didn't want to derail too badly.
I'm with you on everything you said here. It's not like 100% of marriages are ending in divorce. Of course there are those that will last. And I said earlier that no, I don't necessarily believe divorce is always a bad thing.
I'll agree that this is 'a' reason. But not 'the' reason.
I dunno - she always struck me as a dirty, dirty gutter slut.
Totally.
That's very sweet (and true) of you to say. Thank you. :o

:lol: Oh, she totally was.



I'd also like to mention, even if it's not that important, that my best friend, my (now ex-) husband, and me shared an apartment for a while. It was fine.

I shared an apartment with my wife and her classmate/friend one summer. She was decently attractive but a total slut. She was all about anon sex with no protection, had constant yeast infections (or something else, she always complained but never went to the doc), etc. I wouldn't fuck her with someone else's dick, seriously. My buddy came over one night for a party and I told him, as a friend, that he shouldn't fuck her. He was bewildered, but when I explained why he took my warning well and thanked me for saving his dick :lol:

She tried to hook up with my wife while I was out of town for a summer job. My wife called crying when she was alone and I had to quit my job and move back. She was scared of psycho slut LOL. We kicked her out a month later.

lmao .. sorry.. i swear.. but if i didn't know you were out of my area i'd have to say you're a damned mirror of me.

i'm the same way, i feel completely over the guy but the situation i went through still gives me nightmares

The United Bank of Switzerland at this very moment....

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Well it's been quite a few years now that my wife has had them and I can say for a fact that she hasn't looked at my 2 main email accounts (work and personal), they are on a FreeBSD box that reminds you when you last logged in an keeps a log of all accesses of email (as well as other things) that I review regularly to make sure that it is still secure and hacker free. As for my throwaway accounts (yahoo/gmail etc) I delete or forward and delete as soon as I read the messages. So offhand I'd say she trusts me enough not to even bother spying on me. Oh yeah she does have the ROOT password but honestly she hasn't a clue how to cover her tracks that I wouldn't see the first time I did a system review, to be candid the command line is not her friend at all :shakehead: no matter how much I try teach her otherwise.

I have never felt I needed to do it. I don't think I would. I am pretty honest and straight-forward and I expect the same back. Without trust, I can't be with someone for long.

I wouldnt ask my girlfriend for her passwords... she knows my bank card PIN, but not any of my passwords (not that I dont trust her or have secret things - there is just no reason she would ever need them)

It wasn't the finding of things you wished you hadn't, that destroyed you, it was the fact that your ex was disrespectful of you and the relationship you had...disrespectful enough to have done the things he wanted to keep hidden from you. Why live a lie? It's probably the best thing that happened in your relationship, at that time...for you to find out...it was dead already, but it sounds as if he was willing to go on living a lie...maybe for convenience, or maybe because he was getting away with it and had the best of both worlds. You deserve better than that. I don't hide anything from my SO...he knows my passwords, my mistakes, my hangups, my desires, my past...he can ask me anything, and he'll get the truth in return. If I felt there was something about my life that he shouldn't know...then that's something that shouldn't be in my life.

You should feel no guilt about the end of your marriage...you should feel joy! Marriage is about love, not deceit. Good thing you're free of it.

Shared passwords before, but nothing exciting in it anyways (got asked to check a few things for my ex, but didn't rummage through everything).

I'm usually trusting enough to not snoop.

I know I'm going to take a lot of abuse for this one. But I did the mother-of-all violations of trust and privacy. I read my ex-wife's diary. We'd been married for 6 years, I've always known where she kept it, always had all her passwords, as she had mine, and had never snooped. Then over several months she started doing things that made me suspicious. Nothing that I could really pin down, I work a lot. Little things, little mannerisms, little clues. So one day I had to know. I sat down, read her diary, and I was right. She'd been having an affair, and was planning on leaving me.

So, yes, doing it was wrong. But here's how these things are supposed to go. I snoop, I find nothing, I feel like an asshole, and I don't do it anymore. Not I snoop, and I find out all my suspicions are confirmed. I certainly found enough to not feel any guilt about violation of privacy. I suppose the opinion would be that I should have just asked, but I didn't want to insult her if I was just being paranoid.

So all this talk about uncompromising trust is well and good, I suppose, in an ideal world. But in my mind, what I found justified my actions. All of the people talking about how the quality of marriage has gone down, how people don't try enough, etc., are probably right. But being in the Army for 8 years, I've seen enough people betrayed, enough marriages fail, that I don't really know if I'll ever be able to achieve that uncompromising trust that would be ideal. At the very least, it'll take a long time.

On a side note, my fiancee introduced me to TFP, so I know that she stops in here to read. She might not like all of this, but since she helped me recover from the wreckage of my divorce while I was in Iraq, I think she'll understand.

Unbelievable! How did you avoid succumbing to the overwhelming need to know everything about your partner even though it violated their trust, privacy, and simple human dignity to do such?

/sarcasm

It's nice to see some people still have scruples.

...

That sounds familiar.

I have. It was a weird time in both my life and our relationship - I was a young, crazy 18 year old, angry and paranoid. And he was stationed in South Korea. So yeah, I obsessively hacked into his e-mail account. It was stupid and childish, and I hope I'm past such things.

His e-mail password hasn't changed, but I haven't snooped since I gew up. Oh, and after he came home I confessed everything. He rolled his eyes and laughed at me.

I would LIKE to.. but I wouldn't. Not even if he had left his account open on the browser or something. Unless I saw something fishy right off the bat. If I saw something like, "Hey horny, this is Britney, the girl you fucked last Saturday..." then of course I'd look! :P

Kinda like Spiritsoar I had an experience.

In a 7yr relationship my fiancee was always accusing me of cheating, even though she was a drop dead gorgeous (in my eyes) model. I had no reason to ever snoop in her diary or phone or stuff.
One night she confronted me (again) that she had "hard proof" I was cheating this time. I again wondered what ingenious story she might have since the highlight of most days on campus were sitting in the computer lab cold and hungry, or cleaning toilets at my dad's shop.

She found a letter of me writing to a girl talking about how positive life can be and that one day we can see each other again and it was signed LOVE and my name.
The only problem was I wrote this letter in class and stuffed it in the back of the thick textbook. She actually flipped through ALL my text books at some point that night and found that folded letter!

Oh, it was to my little sister who was away in treatment and not doing well. Apparently I didnt address the letter "dear sister" but I just started writing.

this was just ONE incident of many that I should have had a lightbulb turn on in my head telling me something was wrong.

The day I did find out something was wrong (her having an affair), her defensive remark was "well, you have to had known for years and been ok with it, its in my damn diary that's in the room, and don't tell me you didn't read it!"



speechless....................

snooping is bad. I am still defensive and hide passwords and emails, though they are just bills usually.

Nope. I'm not the jealous type and I've never been given a reason to look. Even if I had a strong suspicion, I wouldn't look. I've had the opportunity to do so in the pass and readily declined it. Respect for one's privacy is too much of an priority for me.