SofaKingA

I was just wondering if anyone knew the difference between glucosamine and glucosamine sulfate. I am planning on supplementing with a product that improves the health my cartillage since my dad has arthritis I want to keep on top of the game just in case I get it later on. Plus, I lift weights 5/7 days of the week so any active person should take it anyway. I searched the web and could not find a clear answer. Which one is more effective? Thanks!

Sage

Glucosamine sulfate is a salt. Probably whatever you're looking at that just says "Glucosamine" is a salt too, but the label doesn't list what the rest of the compound is. If it was just the glucosamine molecule, then it'd be an incomplete compound which would attract random stuff to fill in the holes in the molecular structure, and that's bad. So I'd imagine that whatever suppliment you're looking at is a compound of Glucosamine, and you need to be thinking more along the lines of dosage.

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thingstodo

Everythiing I've read previously said that the best form of glucosamine was the sulfate form. It also works especially well with chondroitin. The second article below discusses the sulfate question.

OK, here's a link:

http://www.drugdigest.org/DD/DVH/Her...samine,00.html

Glucosamine

Other Names: 2-Amino-2-Deoxyglucose, Chitosamine, Glucosamine Hydrochloride, Glucosamine Sulfate, N-acetyl Glucosamine

Who is this for?

Uses

Glucosamine is available in several different forms that are usually called “salts”. Most of the clinical studies investigating glucosamine’s medical effects have used a salt known as glucosamine sulfate, but other salts such as glucosamine hydrochloride and n-acetyl glucosamine are also sold widely. While all the salts of glucosamine contain the same general components, they may not all produce the same effects in the body. No studies have compared them, though, so not enough information is available about potential differences in their activity to know whether they are interchangeable.

Alone or combined with another dietary supplement called chondroitin, glucosamine has been studied extensively for treating osteoarthritis (OA), a condition that generally results from wear-and-tear on joints. In OA, deterioration of the cartilage, which cushions the joints, leads to pain, swelling, and loss of movement. Since glucosamine provides a major component of cartilage, it is believed that supplemental glucosamine may delay further degeneration. It may also actually help to repair deteriorating cartilage. In general, glucosamine has shown moderate ability to relieve the pain of OA, as well as to restore partial movement to affected joints. Chondroitin is believed to provide a different chemical important in the formation of cartilage, but its effects are not as well defined as glucosamine’s. Although glucosamine has been studied most for treating OA of large joints such as knees and hips, it has also showed some effectiveness for relieving arthritis in other joints such as the jaw, which is also known as the temporomandibular joint (TMJ).

Glucosamine is also important for healthy skin. Adequate amounts of it in the blood are necessary for the production of hyaluronic acid, one of the substances essential to heal skin injuries. Therefore, glucosamine plays a major role in the healing of surgical incisions and skin wounds. In a few studies, participants who began taking supplemental glucosamine before surgery and continued taking it until their incisions were completely healed showed generally faster healing with less scarring than other participants who did not take glucosamine. Wound dressings that contain a modified type of glucosamine known as poly-N-acetyl glucosamine are being studied to stop major bleeding. In other research, a few studies evaluating whether supplemental glucosamine helps to prevent or reverse wrinkling have had mixed results. Because natural production of hyaluronic acid decreases as individuals age, decreases in it may contribute to wrinkling of the skin. It is thought that increasing glucosamine may help the skin stay more flexible.

In a few small studies, n-acetyl glucosamine has shown promise for treating inflammatory bowel diseases such as Crohn’s disease and ulcerative colitis. N-acetyl glucosamine forms part of an enzyme needed to produce mucus. Therefore, it is believed to increase the production of the mucus that lines the lower gastrointestinal tract, providing a protective effect. More research for this possible use is needed.


And here's one from the Mayo Clinic that talks about the sulfated form:

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/glu...nt-glucosamine

Background

Glucosamine is a natural compound that is found in healthy cartilage. Glucosamine sulfate is a normal constituent of glycoaminoglycans in cartilage matrix and synovial fluid.

Available evidence from randomized controlled trials supports the use of glucosamine sulfate in the treatment of osteoarthritis, particularly of the knee. It is believed that the sulfate moiety provides clinical benefit in the synovial fluid by strengthening cartilage and aiding glycosaminoglycan synthesis. If this hypothesis is confirmed, it would mean that only the glucosamine sulfate form is effective and non-sulfated glucosamine forms are not effective. Glucosamine is commonly taken in combination with chondroitin, a glycosaminoglycan derived from articular cartilage. Use of complementary therapies, including glucosamine, is common in patients with osteoarthritis, and may allow for reduced doses of non-steroidal anti-inflammatory agents.

Polysaccharides are becoming increasingly developed as therapeutics and medical products. Glycosaminoglycans that contain N-acetyl glucosamine constituents have been the focus of research leading to medical devices. A hemostatic bandage, the Syvek Patch, has been introduced in the recent past for the control of bleeding at vascular access sites in interventional cardiology and radiology procedures. This product consists of poly-N-acetyl glucosamine (pGlcNAc) isolated in a unique fiber crystalline structural form. Clo-Sur PAD and ChitoSeal, are also available as patch hemostats. These two products both use chitosan, another N-acetyl glucosamine containing glycosaminoglycan, as their active ingredient. Detailed use of these products will not be discussed in this review.

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newtx

I am a firm believer in glucosamine-chondroitin. Never used glucosamine in any other form.

Sun Tzu

ALthough there will be many that disagree with this (namely) the ones who havent used it or for varioues other reason are against it.

Nothing will work better than Deca Durabolin. Am I advocating to get juiced out out, no. Im am stating that not only rejuevenating you soft tisse nile no other subustance it will also give the immune system a boost. This iis its done under the guidance of a DR with labwork. Males go through andropause just like females with menopause. Only it hits males alot sooner. So Doing a cyctle therapeutically once a year will have multiple effects.

The supplements already mentioned may help, then again they may not.

If you can tolerate the cost and overall side effects of NSAIDS they are effective starting with motrin, naproxisn, indomyocin, and toradol.


Deca is the best

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thingstodo

I'll have to look more into the Deca as I've never heard of it. I do feel if you treat things with NSAIDS you're only treating the symptoms, not the problem. Plus, they can become bad for your stomach. If you can actually fortify your cartilage with something else you avoid the problem altogether.

OK, checked things out - it's a steroid and require a script. I'd only use it under a doctor's supervision and advice. I noticed that two of the side effects include erectile dysfunction and cardiovascular problems. I'm fine in both of those areas and I'm 50, so I wouldn't touch the stuff just because of that. No need to go messing wioth a strong heart! I'd look at it as a treatment of last resort.

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If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves.

Stangers have the best candy.

Sun Tzu

2 possible side effects. Literally any medication or supplement has a long list of them. I'm definatley not trying to push you on to steroids., but that particular one is at the top of the line for any kind of protective strengthening. With most anabolics you will lose what you have gained once you come off. Not so with deco in regardsd to cart tissue. Unfortunately 85% of male that use it will get a priopism thats why they better have a girlfriend.

NSAIDs defiantely are bad for your gut exept toradol IM. YOu right of course the best thing to do is to stop doing whatever is causing the irratation.

There was a period when I was in the military and I was climbing ropes all day long. My arms felt like they were falling apart. Accupuncture and shiatz really helped.

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thingstodo

Now that's treating your body right. I'm a firm believer in natural eating and healing!

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If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves.

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thingstodo

I ran across this article on the site Personal Training On The Net. I'd inlcude a link but you have to be a subscriber to access the page.

Glucosamine and Chondritin

By Joe Cannon

Question:

I have read a lot of your information on glucosamine and chondritin and its use in alleviating symptoms of osteoarthritis. I myself take a glucosamine and chondritin supplement as I am a marathon runner and triathlete. Would this be recommended in general, or are true effects only seen in people with osteoarthritis? I have a few clients who are also taking this and would like to know if they are just wasting their money or if it is really helping them. Also, newer versions of the supplement contain MSM. What is this supposed to do, and how does it coincide with glucosamine? Thanks for your help.

Answer:

As you probably know, glucosamine sulfate is a naturally produced compound that is involved in the production and maintaining of cartilage. It’s also a very popular dietary supplement, used by millions to treat the pain associated with osteoarthritis. In osteoarthritis, the joint cartilage is damaged or worn away, which results in pain. Before I address your question, let me first tell you something that many people are not aware of. There is more than one type of glucosamine available to consumers. Specifically, three types are typically found in supplements: glucosamine sulfate, glucosamine HCL and NAG (N-acetyl-glucosamine). Of these three, glucosamine sulfate has the most evidence in support of its use for osteoarthritis. I suggest you look at your supplement to see which version you are taking. Now, let’s address your question.

Many studies over the past several years do find that glucosamine sulfate can help reduce the pain and stiffness associated with osteoarthritis. Most studies involved glucosamine helping treat osteoarthritis of the knee. As a marathon runner, this is good news for you. Other areas of the body may also be helped, but the knee is most often looked at in research.

Usually four to eight weeks of glucosamine treatment is needed before significant pain reduction is noticed. This also depends on the severity of osteoarthritis as well. In other words, less severe cases may notice relief sooner. Conversely, some research finds that in very severe cases of osteoarthritis, glucosamine may not help at all. The pain relief associated with glucosamine does not appear to be related to the placebo effect. In other words, glucosamine has been shown to reduce pain more than when using nothing at all.

It’s also important to mention that glucosamine appears to only be effective for the most common type of arthritis: osteoarthritis. This supplement does not seem to help other types of this disorder.

Because of its effects on arthritis, some may take glucosamine to help ward off arthritis before it starts. This I think was at the heart of your question. While glucosamine sulfate does not yet appear to re-grow cartilage, I feel one of the most intriguing things about this supplement is new research, which is hinting that this may actually slow the progression of osteoarthritis. In other words, glucosamine may help you hold on to your joint cartilage longer if you have osteoarthritis. So far though, there is no solid evidence that glucosamine sulfate can help reduce osteoarthritis from occurring in people who subject their joints to repeated trauma, like running marathons. This study would be difficult to do and would require many years, if not decades. Nevertheless, given its possible effects on helping one maintain joint cartilage, for athletes like you, glucosamine sulfate may be something to consider.

Some glucosamine products combine it with another popular supplement called chondroitin sulfate. Chondroitin sulfate also has some research that it may help reduce osteoarthritis, but it is less than that of glucosamine. Some add the two together because of the thought that they might provide a broader spectrum of benefits than either would alone. However, research so far has not conclusively shown that glucosamine plus chondroitin is better than glucosamine alone.

Glucosamine sulfate appears to be safe with no significant side effects. Because it is a sugar bonded to an amino acid, some have speculated that glucosamine might interfere with blood sugar levels. This might be an issue for diabetics and those with heart disease. Some research shows that glucosamine does not impact blood sugar levels but, to be on the safe side, diabetics and persons with heart disease should consult their endocrinologist and/or cardiologist before experimenting with this supplement.

The other product you mentioned was MSM. This is the downstream metabolic byproduct of DMSO, a once popular but now illegal arthritis treatment in the 1970s. MSM is also found in small amounts in various fruits and vegetables. Like chondroitin mentioned previously, some arthritis-related supplements include MSM. Again, the thought was that the combination would be more effective than glucosamine alone. There is some research that MSM in conjunction with glucosamine can mildly help osteoarthritis of the knee; however, the evidence in support of MSM is less than that of glucosamine. Whether MSM plus chondroitin plus glucosamine is more effective than glucosamine alone is also not well known. If I had to choose, I’d pick glucosamine over MSM or chondroitin. If no significant reduction in pain is noticed after four to eight weeks, try switching to another brand of glucosamine sulfate.

I hope that helps.

References:

Cannon, Joe (2006). Nutritional Supplements: What Works and Why. A Review from A to Zinc and Beyond. www.Joe-Cannon.com
Kim LS, Axelrod LJ, Howard P, et al. Efficacy of methylsulfonylmethane (MSM) in osteoarthritis pain of the knee: a pilot clinical trial. Osteoarthritis Cartilage 2006;14:286-94.
Reginster JY, Deroisy R, Rovati LC, et al. Long-term effects of glucosamine sulfate on osteoarthritis progression: a randomized, placebo-controlled trial. Lancet 2001;357:251-6.
Towheed TE, Maxwell L, Anastassiades TP, et al. Glucosamine therapy for treating osteoarthritis. Cochrane Database Syst Rev 2005;(2):CD002946.

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If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves.

Stangers have the best candy.