Snow White Stripper - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Sultana · 07-01-2006, 11:34 AM

Here's some news that's been burning up the airwaves in the Burlesque community. There's a show on NBC called "America's Got Talent." I don't watch it, but it seems to be an updated "Gong Show" (did I just date myself horribly there?).

Some time ago, NBC actively pursued burlesque dancers (as well as others, I'm sure) to audition for the show. Well, one of the nation's best, Michelle "Toots" Lamour, *The Ass that goes POW!* stepped up to the plate, auditioned, and was selected for the show. Michelle happens to have been crowned "Miss Exotic World 2005" (Jack and I were there to see her winning act

), and she's a wonderful person to boot.

Here's a clip of her performance on the NBC show.

Well, she managed to get selected to continue on to the semi-finals of the show, but I was rather startled by "Judge Brandy's" reaction on the clip. I thought she was quite rude, right off the top (but of course I have to keep in mind that the show is edited for punch and reaction). But also there appears to be a lot of venom on the show discussion boards about her. Half of it frankly seems like prudes who are offended by the thought that burlesque (which they only refer to as stripping

) as talent. The other half are folks who are pissed because this was on a Prime Time (9 pm, I think?) show, with kids watching.

Now of course anyone who knows me knows that I would disagree that burlesque (and even stripping) is a no-talent deal. There are folks who are tremendously talented, and there are those who aren't, just like in any endeavor.

But I guess I can see the point of folks who weren't pleased to see this kind of entertainment on "Prime Time" without warning, although it seems like that's part of the show, they don't give you any hints as to what's coming up, and "Anything Can Happen" is pretty much their motto, as far as I can tell. The previous week they had "The World's Oldest Male Stripper" or some such thing--didn't see that, though.

I have to admit my initial impulse is to shut out the naysayers, but I'm thinking they may have a bit of a point, even if they obfuscate it by saying many other stupid things along with. But I do think that parents should be responsible to monitor what the kiddies watch at 9 pm...but that's another thread, I think.

So what do you guys think?

Gilda · 07-01-2006, 12:09 PM

I don't see a big problem with it. She ended up in a bikini, with a top that didn't show much. Labling it "stripping" is a bit much, as that implies a bit more exposure than what we got there. The message board was a bit overboard, but message boards do tend to attract that kind of response, especially dedicated ones.

I thought she was pretty good, and that Brandy's reaction was way over the top. It's a talent, it's on a talent show, and it isn't a kid's show. If parents object to that, send them out of the room or change the channel.

Gilda

oracle2380 · 07-01-2006, 12:10 PM

I don't see anything wrong with stripping in general, however I don't know that national television is the appropriate setting if it's on during "Prime Time" which this does not appear to be.

Sultana · 07-01-2006, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gilda

ILabling it "stripping" is a bit much, as that implies a bit more exposure than what we got there.

Do you mean me labling this thread "stripping"? If so, I just did that because that's the name of the thread on the nbc site. I should have clarified that.

But I'm thinking that you mean "them" labling it as stripping, yes?

Gilda · 07-01-2006, 12:22 PM

Sorry that I was unclear. I meant the complaints like "stripping isn't a talent" and so forth on the message boards. I wasn't criticizing you.

Technically, in that she was taking off much of her costume, she was stripping, but using that label carries a connotation a bit more extreme than stripping down to a colorful bikini.

Gilda

maleficent · 07-01-2006, 12:27 PM

The entire show is somewhat idiotic and very few people on the show have any real talent... (I should enter and list whining as my talent- i'd probably win)

I saw the performance and thought she deserved the gong... there really wasn't much entertainment value in what she was doing and there wasn't much talent involved...

cookmo · 07-01-2006, 12:54 PM

My two cents-

Prime time t.v. is not for kids regardless of the show. "sex" is the most prevelant theme on t.v.,period. Even comedys are full of sexual innuendos. Kids should be in bed at 9.

Brandi needs to get over herself. I'm not a fan, but I'm sure she has a video or two out there thats much more revealing, which kids most likely saw 10 times a day on M.T.V.

Krycheck · 07-01-2006, 12:56 PM

There's a big difference between *just* stripping and burlesque!

Problem with her performing on that show is that she didn't have time to do her full set (I'm assuming) and it just looked like a strip tease. Also she may have been used more for "effect" than talent. There's a lot of talk about this now and I think they got what they wanted. The fact that she was pursued shows that imho.

/me goes back to looking at her web site...

*Edit for clarifacation

Sultana · 07-01-2006, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maleficent

*snip*I saw the performance and thought she deserved the gong... there really wasn't much entertainment value in what she was doing and there wasn't much talent involved...

OK, perhaps it wasn't entertaining to you, everyone is different in what they like. But I *will* tell you she is talented, whether it's something that you may enjoy or not.

And not to be snotty or anything, but I wasn't asking if people here enjoyed the clip, but whether they think it's a bad thing that this was on a show and at a time that kids could conceivably have watched it.

ASU2003 · 07-01-2006, 01:29 PM

Even I thought that was a little inappropriate. It wasn't because of the fact that taking off clothes could be considered a great talent, but because it is SNOW WHITE. I'm not sure how many girls under 12 were watching, but the message that sends out is wrong. (ie. the only way girls can get attention is to take off their clothes and look hot, and use a Disney costume even). And, if NBC warmed the viewers before, it might not have been as bad.

Wow, I never thought that I would side with the uptight parents.

But I did download that clip, and edited out the judges. It was good to watch by myself, but if I was watching with my parents, it would have been awkward.

And kids don't need to go to bed by 9pm. I never went to bed before 11pm.

Jack1.0 · 07-01-2006, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cookmo

My two cents-
Brandi needs to get over herself. I'm not a fan, but I'm sure she has a video or two out there thats much more revealing, which kids most likely saw 10 times a day on M.T.V.

I couldn't agree more cookmo!

If people were appalled at this appearing on what they thought was a "Family Show" , they need to spend more time watching the shows that their kids watch. NBC doesn't promote the show as a family show, in fact NBC the web page for the show says "You never know what to expect when you tune in to America's Got Talent!" on the link to the male stripper that appear the week earlier. I have seen things air in prime time(and earlier) shows that I consider far more inappropriate than this performance by Michelle. While I would not want my 9 year old nephew to watch the performance I would also accept my obligation as a parent to observe the entertainment that he is watching and change the channel or turn off something that I felt was not suitable(not just TV programming).

Myself and many others feel that modern burlesque dance movement promotes a healthy acceptance of all body types and one's own sexuality. Something I hope we can all appreciate here at TFP. I think that the focus here should be on parental responsibility to regulate what their children watch, be it television, video games, or any other entertainment.

p.s. Maybe NBC could have given parents 10 seconds warning....... but the nature of the routine was evident after the first 15 seconds and parents were free to exercise their responsibility at any time.

ASU2003 · 07-01-2006, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack1.0

While I would not want my 9 year old nephew to watch the performance I would also accept my obligation as a parent to observe the entertainment that he is watching and change the channel or turn off something that I felt was not suitable(not just TV programming).

The modern burlesque dance movement promotes a healthy acceptance of all body types and one's own sexuality. Something I hope we can all appreciate here at TFP.

Would you explain why you changed the channel? Wouldn't that send the message that something is wrong or bad about nudity?

I don't know what to do, that is why I'm not a parent.

Sultana · 07-01-2006, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASU2003

but the message that sends out is wrong. (ie. the only way girls can get attention is to take off their clothes and look hot, and use a Disney costume even).

While I don't take issue with your position of thinking it was inappropriate, I can hardly agree that it sent a message that that's the *only* way girls can get attention...

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASU2003

Would you explain why you changed the channel? Wouldn't that send the message that something is wrong or bad about nudity?

I don't know what to do, that is why I'm not a parent.

There's nothing inherently wrong or bad with nudity, but that doesn't mean that it's completely appropriate for youngsters.

Europeans don't seem to worry about nudity for their kids, and they haven't imploded yet.

Jack1.0 · 07-01-2006, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASU2003

Would you explain why you changed the channel? Wouldn't that send the message that something is wrong or bad about nudity?

I would change the channel if my 9 year old Nephew was in the room for the same reason that I would not take him to a burlesque show. It is intended for mature adults. I was raised in europe and have actually seen childrens shows aired that had family nudity in them. The nudity was never presented within a sexual context. Regardless of how beautiful or entertaining a burlesque act may be it is still presented within an adult sexual context.

raeanna74 · 07-01-2006, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cookmo

My two cents-

Prime time t.v. is not for kids regardless of the show. "sex" is the most prevelant theme on t.v.,period. Even comedys are full of sexual innuendos. Kids should be in bed at 9.

Brandi needs to get over herself. I'm not a fan, but I'm sure she has a video or two out there thats much more revealing, which kids most likely saw 10 times a day on M.T.V.

You said all I'd probably have said and just about the same way I think.

Our daughter is normally in bed by 9:00ish if not before. Older kids in their pre-teens and teens, I'd just use the opportunity to address the subject of sexuality, respecting their bodies, and making responsible decisions. When you watch TV it's nigh impossible to avoid sexual subjects. It's your choice to watch it or not.

DEI37 · 07-01-2006, 06:07 PM

That clip was awesome. Sultana, I love what you do, and if you say someone's good, I'd tend to believe it. It sure looked like she had fun there. I will say that I think the show is retarded, but then again, I'm not an American Idol fan, so you probably get the idea that I don't care for that kind of TV.

07-01-2006, 11:34 AM	#1 (permalink)
Sultana Falling Angel Location: L.A. L.A. land	Snow White Stripper Here's some news that's been burning up the airwaves in the Burlesque community. There's a show on NBC called "America's Got Talent." I don't watch it, but it seems to be an updated "Gong Show" (did I just date myself horribly there?). Some time ago, NBC actively pursued burlesque dancers (as well as others, I'm sure) to audition for the show. Well, one of the nation's best, Michelle "Toots" Lamour, The Ass that goes POW! stepped up to the plate, auditioned, and was selected for the show. Michelle happens to have been crowned "Miss Exotic World 2005" (Jack and I were there to see her winning act ), and she's a wonderful person to boot. Here's a clip of her performance on the NBC show. Well, she managed to get selected to continue on to the semi-finals of the show, but I was rather startled by "Judge Brandy's" reaction on the clip. I thought she was quite rude, right off the top (but of course I have to keep in mind that the show is edited for punch and reaction). But also there appears to be a lot of venom on the show discussion boards about her. Half of it frankly seems like prudes who are offended by the thought that burlesque (which they only refer to as stripping ) as talent. The other half are folks who are pissed because this was on a Prime Time (9 pm, I think?) show, with kids watching. Now of course anyone who knows me knows that I would disagree that burlesque (and even stripping) is a no-talent deal. There are folks who are tremendously talented, and there are those who aren't, just like in any endeavor. But I guess I can see the point of folks who weren't pleased to see this kind of entertainment on "Prime Time" without warning, although it seems like that's part of the show, they don't give you any hints as to what's coming up, and "Anything Can Happen" is pretty much their motto, as far as I can tell. The previous week they had "The World's Oldest Male Stripper" or some such thing--didn't see that, though. I have to admit my initial impulse is to shut out the naysayers, but I'm thinking they may have a bit of a point, even if they obfuscate it by saying many other stupid things along with. But I do think that parents should be responsible to monitor what the kiddies watch at 9 pm...but that's another thread, I think. So what do you guys think? __________________ "Love is a snowmobile racing across the tundra and then suddenly it flips over, pinning you underneath. At night, the ice weasels come." - Matt Groening My goal? To fulfill my potential.

07-01-2006, 12:10 PM	#3 (permalink)
oracle2380 Upright Location: Up in Washington watching the puddles grow.	I don't see anything wrong with stripping in general, however I don't know that national television is the appropriate setting if it's on during "Prime Time" which this does not appear to be. __________________ "Two roads diverged in a wood, and I- I took the one less traveled by, And that has made all the difference." - Robert Frost

07-01-2006, 12:27 PM	#6 (permalink)
maleficent Junkie Moderator Emeritus Location: Chicago	The entire show is somewhat idiotic and very few people on the show have any real talent... (I should enter and list whining as my talent- i'd probably win) I saw the performance and thought she deserved the gong... there really wasn't much entertainment value in what she was doing and there wasn't much talent involved... __________________ Free your heart from hatred. Free your mind from worries. Live simply. Give more. Expect less.

07-01-2006, 12:56 PM	#8 (permalink)
Krycheck Sultana ruined my evil persona Location: Los Angeles	There's a big difference between just stripping and burlesque! Problem with her performing on that show is that she didn't have time to do her full set (I'm assuming) and it just looked like a strip tease. Also she may have been used more for "effect" than talent. There's a lot of talk about this now and I think they got what they wanted. The fact that she was pursued shows that imho. /me goes back to looking at her web site... Edit for clarifacation __________________ His pants are tight...but his morals are loose!!* Last edited by Krycheck; 07-01-2006 at 01:07 PM..

07-01-2006, 06:07 PM	#16 (permalink)
DEI37 Go faster! Location: Wisconsin	That clip was awesome. Sultana, I love what you do, and if you say someone's good, I'd tend to believe it. It sure looked like she had fun there. I will say that I think the show is retarded, but then again, I'm not an American Idol fan, so you probably get the idea that I don't care for that kind of TV. __________________ Generally speaking, if you were to get what you really deserve, you might be unpleasantly surprised.

07-01-2006, 12:09 PM	#2 (permalink)
Gilda 32 flavors and then some Location: Out on a wire.	I don't see a big problem with it. She ended up in a bikini, with a top that didn't show much. Labling it "stripping" is a bit much, as that implies a bit more exposure than what we got there. The message board was a bit overboard, but message boards do tend to attract that kind of response, especially dedicated ones. I thought she was pretty good, and that Brandy's reaction was way over the top. It's a talent, it's on a talent show, and it isn't a kid's show. If parents object to that, send them out of the room or change the channel. Gilda

07-01-2006, 12:22 PM	#5 (permalink)
Gilda 32 flavors and then some Location: Out on a wire.	Sorry that I was unclear. I meant the complaints like "stripping isn't a talent" and so forth on the message boards. I wasn't criticizing you. Technically, in that she was taking off much of her costume, she was stripping, but using that label carries a connotation a bit more extreme than stripping down to a colorful bikini. Gilda

07-01-2006, 12:54 PM	#7 (permalink)
cookmo Insane Location: Ohio	My two cents- Prime time t.v. is not for kids regardless of the show. "sex" is the most prevelant theme on t.v.,period. Even comedys are full of sexual innuendos. Kids should be in bed at 9. Brandi needs to get over herself. I'm not a fan, but I'm sure she has a video or two out there thats much more revealing, which kids most likely saw 10 times a day on M.T.V.

07-01-2006, 01:29 PM	#10 (permalink)
ASU2003 immoral minority Location: Back in Ohio	Even I thought that was a little inappropriate. It wasn't because of the fact that taking off clothes could be considered a great talent, but because it is SNOW WHITE. I'm not sure how many girls under 12 were watching, but the message that sends out is wrong. (ie. the only way girls can get attention is to take off their clothes and look hot, and use a Disney costume even). And, if NBC warmed the viewers before, it might not have been as bad. Wow, I never thought that I would side with the uptight parents. But I did download that clip, and edited out the judges. It was good to watch by myself, but if I was watching with my parents, it would have been awkward. And kids don't need to go to bed by 9pm. I never went to bed before 11pm.