Why do we.. - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

VF19 · 01-01-2004, 02:27 PM

Why do we pronounce Spanish names like the Spanish do
(like Jose, Maria, Guadalajara, Baja), but when it comes to German names (Schwarzenegger, Berlin, etc..) or other languages, we pronounce them like americans?
Is this not some form of racism?

MSD · 01-01-2004, 03:28 PM

We have a lot more first-generation Hispanic people in the country than first-generation Germans. If it were reversed, we would probably have the same effect.

It's cultural saturation, not racism.

Kadath · 01-01-2004, 03:41 PM

There was an excellent SNL skit hosted by Jimmy Smits about whiteys who were "really up on their Spanish pronunciation." Hilarious. Also, German is an ugly, horrible language and any right-minded people avoid it like the plague.

VF19 · 01-01-2004, 04:08 PM

Not to flame but I'm German and I take that as an insult.
But.. it is a ..robust language

Journeyman · 01-01-2004, 05:27 PM

A) I know a couple guys who took German in college. You have 8 or 9 different styles of the "eu/ew" sound.

B) English->White people in England.
German->White people in Germany.
Spanish->White people in Spain.
So racism doesn't factor in as much as can be guessed. It's probably more of the difference between "Latin" and "Germanic" languages. For some reason Spanish/Italian pronunciation roles off the tongue a LOT easier than German.

Ratman · 01-01-2004, 07:36 PM

If you go to any country where English is not the first language, most of the people there will speak it with an accent, if they speak it at all. Does that mean they are racists?

Americans in general are some of the worst educated people in the world when it comes to foreign languages. It really shouldn't surprise you that the majority of American pronunciation of words of foreign origin is not the same as the native pronunciation.

Finally, your location is listed as Suburbia, CA. Maybe if you went to Suburbia, PA or Suburbia, NY or some other place that has a different ethnic background, you would find that words of Germanic, Slavic and other origins are as easily pronounced as Spanish words in Cali.

VF19 · 01-01-2004, 09:41 PM

Yeah. I guess that was pretty obvious. Stupid of me.
But I've never been to the east coast (except new orleans)
and I've lived around mexicans for like, all my life so ...

Kadath · 01-01-2004, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by VF19
Not to flame but I'm German and I take that as an insult.
But.. it is a ..robust language

I want to be clear, I intended that as humor. My gf's father is a native-born German. Her grandparents still speak it, though they have lived here for decades. I actually have no problem with the language. I never consider it a flame to take offense. You are polite, almost to a fault. Also, I very much like your delicate phrasing. You are okay in my book, even if you are German.

VF19 · 01-01-2004, 10:19 PM

Glad we cleared that up.
I barely know any German anyways.

sprocket · 01-03-2004, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by VF19
Not to flame but I'm German and I take that as an insult.
But.. it is a ..robust language

actually I always though of german as a harsh language, but when i was in vienna hearing some austrian girls talk german gave me a different view of the language. It actually can sound pretty sleek and sexy coming from the right person

Stare At The Sun · 01-03-2004, 07:00 PM

German is a robust language indeed. Really, reminds me of Klingon, therefore, german is the best!

SecretMethod70 · 01-04-2004, 06:42 AM

German can be a "harsh" language when you hear it spoken by non-native speakers, sure. But it's really not nearly as bad as the rap it gets. Sure, it doesn't ooze out of your mouth the way Italian or Spanish does, but it's not really as throaty as everyone thinks.

I think most people in the US hear German being made fun of more than they hear actual German, and because of that they have an exaggerated viewpoint of the language. That "throaty" sound that everyone equates with German is not even part of the language, rather there are two different possible sounds that both take place in the back of the mouth - farther back than english speaking Americans are used to. So, it does sound different and relatively "throaty," hence the exaggeration whenever anyone makes fun of the German language. And since there aren't many opportunities to hear actual German, Americans are used to the exaggerated German they hear from fake German characters in shows, etc.

toxic515 · 01-09-2004, 06:13 PM

Russian... NOw THERE's a beautiful language... :-) just rent a fish called wanda... Truth told, MOST languages are really beautiful when spoken fluently and not butchered by bad attempts to find a restroom in a foriegn country.. Personally I think everyone should be able to find a toilet and get a beer anywhere in the world.. THEN you're pretty damned safe anywhere. ha ha ha

01-01-2004, 02:27 PM	#1 (permalink)
VF19 Banned Location: back to my old location	Why do we.. Why do we pronounce Spanish names like the Spanish do (like Jose, Maria, Guadalajara, Baja), but when it comes to German names (Schwarzenegger, Berlin, etc..) or other languages, we pronounce them like americans? Is this not some form of racism?

01-01-2004, 03:41 PM	#3 (permalink)
Kadath Muffled Location: Camazotz	There was an excellent SNL skit hosted by Jimmy Smits about whiteys who were "really up on their Spanish pronunciation." Hilarious. Also, German is an ugly, horrible language and any right-minded people avoid it like the plague. __________________ it's quiet in here

01-01-2004, 07:36 PM	#6 (permalink)
Ratman Addict Location: Somewhere... Across the sea...	If you go to any country where English is not the first language, most of the people there will speak it with an accent, if they speak it at all. Does that mean they are racists? Americans in general are some of the worst educated people in the world when it comes to foreign languages. It really shouldn't surprise you that the majority of American pronunciation of words of foreign origin is not the same as the native pronunciation. Finally, your location is listed as Suburbia, CA. Maybe if you went to Suburbia, PA or Suburbia, NY or some other place that has a different ethnic background, you would find that words of Germanic, Slavic and other origins are as easily pronounced as Spanish words in Cali. __________________ The difference between theory and reality is that in theory there is no difference. "God made man, but he used the monkey to do it." DEVO

01-04-2004, 06:42 AM	#12 (permalink)
SecretMethod70 Human Administrator Location: Chicago	German can be a "harsh" language when you hear it spoken by non-native speakers, sure. But it's really not nearly as bad as the rap it gets. Sure, it doesn't ooze out of your mouth the way Italian or Spanish does, but it's not really as throaty as everyone thinks. I think most people in the US hear German being made fun of more than they hear actual German, and because of that they have an exaggerated viewpoint of the language. That "throaty" sound that everyone equates with German is not even part of the language, rather there are two different possible sounds that both take place in the back of the mouth - farther back than english speaking Americans are used to. So, it does sound different and relatively "throaty," hence the exaggeration whenever anyone makes fun of the German language. And since there aren't many opportunities to hear actual German, Americans are used to the exaggerated German they hear from fake German characters in shows, etc. __________________ Le temps détruit tout "Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

01-09-2004, 06:13 PM	#13 (permalink)
toxic515 Addict Location: Texas	Russian... NOw THERE's a beautiful language... :-) just rent a fish called wanda... Truth told, MOST languages are really beautiful when spoken fluently and not butchered by bad attempts to find a restroom in a foriegn country.. Personally I think everyone should be able to find a toilet and get a beer anywhere in the world.. THEN you're pretty damned safe anywhere. ha ha ha __________________ Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana.

01-01-2004, 03:28 PM	#2 (permalink)
MSD The sky calls to us ... Super Moderator Location: CT	We have a lot more first-generation Hispanic people in the country than first-generation Germans. If it were reversed, we would probably have the same effect. It's cultural saturation, not racism.

01-01-2004, 04:08 PM	#4 (permalink)
VF19 Banned Location: back to my old location	Not to flame but I'm German and I take that as an insult. But.. it is a ..robust language

01-01-2004, 05:27 PM	#5 (permalink)
Journeyman Like John Goodman, but not. Location: SFBA, California	A) I know a couple guys who took German in college. You have 8 or 9 different styles of the "eu/ew" sound. B) English->White people in England. German->White people in Germany. Spanish->White people in Spain. So racism doesn't factor in as much as can be guessed. It's probably more of the difference between "Latin" and "Germanic" languages. For some reason Spanish/Italian pronunciation roles off the tongue a LOT easier than German.

01-01-2004, 09:41 PM	#7 (permalink)
VF19 Banned Location: back to my old location	Yeah. I guess that was pretty obvious. Stupid of me. But I've never been to the east coast (except new orleans) and I've lived around mexicans for like, all my life so ...

01-01-2004, 10:19 PM	#9 (permalink)
VF19 Banned Location: back to my old location	Glad we cleared that up. I barely know any German anyways.

01-03-2004, 07:00 PM	#11 (permalink)
Stare At The Sun Eh? Location: Somewhere over the rainbow	German is a robust language indeed. Really, reminds me of Klingon, therefore, german is the best!