the_marq

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/natio...ing050303.html

It's a horrible day for the RCMP, the families of the officers killed today and the people of Northern Alberta.

We might never know what when wrong at that farm near Mayerthorpe (a little town 99% of us had never heard of till today), nevertheless I wanted to honour the memory of the Men who died their today.

Thank you for your service, we mourn your loss.

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#3 in a series

JJRousseau

Well said. A real tragedy.

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Temporary_User

Hmm, ive read this article just a while ago... sad
I read in the morning that the four where not responding on their radio's and they didnt know if it was a technical thing or not, but I assumed what had happened.
again so sad...
Its said to be common knowledge that marijuana is illigal in Canada because its illigal in the US; and it would affect trade too much if it became legal. I don't know though, because Ive read that it was illigal in Canada before it was in the US.
???
Anyways Im not a heavy smoker, I know lots that are but prefer to be with people that arent. But I think of it as Alchohol prohibition and the organized crime that started.
I know he's not Canadian, but I always loved what Abraham Lincoln said about prohibition. I think it applies to both countries

"A prohibition law strikes a blow at the very principles upon which our government was founded."

"Prohibition goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation, and makes a crime out of things that are not crimes."

IC3

I read the whole article and it makes me wonder why there was only 4 officers (Junior officer's at that) performing a raid on the farm.

It says that they lost contact with the 4 officers around 10am, 2 hours later they request help from the military..So what was going on within those 2 hours, Why weren't thier other officers sent out at the point of losing contact with the 4 officers.

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Charlatan

It is a tragedy to be sure... but something did strike me as odd when the story broke last night.


We really should legalize this stuff... we all agree that pot is relatively harmless and prohibition only drives the growth and distribution into criminal hands and away from from more "Mom and Pop" type operations.

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Janey

I heard on the news that the RCMPO & the Edmonton Police service showed up at the farm with a warrant to search for a grow op. nobody was there, but while they were serving the warrant, they discovered a stolen vehicle chop shop. The law required them to obtain a second warrant to search for the chop shop, so two junior officers were left to guard the farm, while the remainder returned for the warrant.

While they were gone, the owner returned, and attacked/killed the officers. They didn't even have time to draw.

Then when the other two officers returned with the warrant, they were ambushed. I don't think that they were expecting anything on an empty farm, which may be why the junior officers were left to deal with the guarding activities.

There should be a way to dispatch electronic warrants over their mobile computers, similar to the way work orders are dispatched to gas company vehicles who are doing work in the field. it's so awful that they had to leave the premises, and return.

so sad.


Edit: I for one have made a resolution never to partake in pot from this point going forward, (unless it's my own brothers's home grown from the sunshine coast) because every dime that is spent on it goes to support the illegals and i am now on strike.

IC3

I would be all for the legalization of weed..But i think the furthest it will go is decriminalizing it, Which is good for just the average smoker, But this shit will still be happening.

Totally legalize it, Police can direct more attention to more serious issues than somebody growing a plant.

Who cares what other countries think, Legalizing it would be the best way to deal with this.
Anybody with common sense knows Marijuana is not harmfull, The only harm it does is when people are protecting thier crop..Legalize it and tragic incidents like this wouldn't be happening.

It's a battle the police will never win, For every grow op they bust..There's probably another 4 setting up. Grow ops are everywhere now, Remember the old molson plant bust? When i was reading about that police said that they know of numerous other operations but they simply don't have the resources to pursue them at the time. I'm not really sure what "We don't have the resources means" But something was holding them back from being able to act on them.

It would also cut down on crime, Marijuana is probably the biggest "Drug" in Canada..I don't hear too much about other drug busts going on..Not the size of marijuana busts anyways.

We even have a grow op board game now..Kinda like Monopoly, I'm gonna be gettin this. It's sold out all the time though.

So ya..Legalize it.

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Antikarma

Please, not to say I disagree with you, but lets not turn the death of four men into a platform for political views. These men died in the line of duty, protecting the average Joe and defending the current laws ofthe country. This is a senseless tragedy.

The time for finger pointing and politicising is not now. For now, lets just honour the men who were taken from us much to soon.

Oddly, this has only reaffirmed my wife's determination to quit her job and get accepted into the RCMP adademy.

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BigBen

I mourn the loss of anyone killed serving thier country. I think that every member of the RCMP and local police are heroes, every day. I shall drink to their memories tonight.

Remember folks, Bill C-38, proposed by the last session of Parliament (not this one, it was still on the table when the Cretien gov't dissolved parliament)

The "De-criminalization" of cannibis that was proposed would have made things WORSE for the grow-ops. The sentences would have doubled, easily. Only the possessors of the substance would have gotten the 'tickets'.

If the whole car-chop-shop thing is true, then the cops were probably really happy they had found it, for the sentencing for that kind of operation would have put this guy away for way longer than a grow-op, no matter what the size.

Heroes, man. We can't pay those guys enough for what they do.

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Charlatan

I don't think we are trying to politicize this per se... we (at least I was) trying to point out that this sort of situation could be avoided with the elimination of prohibition.

It just underscores our outrage that our police are having to be put into situations like this when it isn't neccessary.

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the_marq

Hear hear.

I was just about to say the same thing, but I couldn't figure out a way to phrase it without being overly confrontational.

Thanks....and good luck to your wife.

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The Truth:

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#3 in a series

vox_rox

This is the crux of this thing. whether or not pot should be controlled under the criminal code is irrelevant to the fact that these men did not deserve to lose their life over it, or even over a chop shop.

Although they work in an environment of danger everyday, this is a serious and tragic event, and although they may never read this, the families, friends, and RCMP members who knew these men have my deepest condolences.

There is no good news here, and there is nothing good that can come of this, regardless of political views. It's all bad.

Peace,

Pierre

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IC3

I couldn't have said that better.

I know it looks like i was pointing fingers, I wasn't..What charlatan said is the point i was trying to get across.

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"To win any battle, you must fight as if you were already dead" -Musashi

vbuser

Condolences to those RCMP officers et. al.

What's the environment in Edmonton & surrounding area atm?

Toronto is devestated, and says we'll send officers if needed.

Demeter

This happened not that far from here. The marajuana grow-op is a mute point. The RCMP were there regarding stolen property (and illegals weapons too, I think, more info will come out as time goes by).
The sting was very poorly planned and I'm sure the shit will hit the fan over this one. They were too few in number & poorly equipted. The shooter had a very violent & disturbed past. The RCMP knew this. This is very upsetting. Those men should not be dead...
The saddest part is the RCMP arrived at the farm Wed. afternoon and it was 9 am the next day before backup arrived (apparently with the warrant htey needed.) Of course the shooter re-entered the property by then. This is what happens when everything that can go wrong, does.

kramus

Every now and then a real nasty crazy gets a chance to be extra nasty crazy. Lets use this as a reason to be polite, clear in our speach, deliberate in our movements and calm in our reactions with our front-line people in the police services field. They have enough crap that can go wrong without us folks firing up their adrenilin just because we get a little bent over a routine traffic stop/check. Thankyou for doing your job folks. You guys and the miliatary and the firefighters and emergency response people everywhere. Thanks all of you.

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BigBen

Shit.

I have been in some cluster-fuck performances in my lifetime, but at no moment did I think my life was in danger.

Wait a sec. Scratch that. On second thought Only luck, The Big Man Upstairs and ignorance has kept me alive this long.

I did get drunk last night, and several times thought of those guys. What a way to kill a good buzz.

Remember the 7 P's:
Proper
Preparation and
Planning
Prevents
Piss
Poor
Performance.

Those poor families. What can we do? I feel helpless.

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skier

I was just talking to a friend who's father knew one of the officers very well- She told me that the police went to this guy's farm to get a truck back. Apparantly when he bought it there was a dent in it, and he went back to the dealership and said he wanted a new truck, but the dealer said they would just fix the dent. He stopped making payments and the dealership called the police. The rest of her story was a little confusing about what happened afterwards though. Presumably they found evidence of a grow op?

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IC3

I am not sure in what order, But they either found a grow op then came across a chop shop or vice versca..So 2 officers left to get a warrant for the chop shop or the grow op (Whichever one that they discovered after) 2 officers stayed on the property. The owner returned and killed the 2 officers that were there and apparently ambushed the other 2 returning officers..The owner either killed himself or was killed by a police officer during the shooting. I think he probably killed himself.

__________________
"To win any battle, you must fight as if you were already dead" -Musashi

RCAlyra2004

I am deeply saddened by what has happened here. My prayers are with the families of the the slain officers.

All of this was over 20 Marijuana plants and one repossesed pick up truck? That is what the media is now saying.

The media is only now beginning to explain how well the RCMP knew about the situation That resulted in he deaths of three of their officers. Whatever went wrong in their planning for this event it need not be discovered for the purpose of BLAME but in order that lives would not be lost in the future.

Again... My prayers are for the families of those who have passed on.

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BigBen

That ceremony was beautiful. I cried, and hard, when the father talked about his son, and when the twin remembered his brother. Fuck me, those guys did have their whole lives in front of them.

The whole ceremony was fantastic, except for :

Ralph Klein. Oh, man, is that what you sound like when you are sober?? Go get yourself a drink. How can you be elected over and over again?

That singer in the COWBOY HAT: HEY FUCK HOLE, did you look around and notice that EVERYONE ELSE TOOK THEIR FUCKING HAT OFF? I could care less about you and your fashion statement. I looked in the dress regulations and could not find "Cowboy Hat" under RELIGIOUS HEADDRESS. You disgraced yourself and enraged me when you showed up like that. Why did noone say anything? My wife told me to relax, but I found myself screaming at the TV. Maybe it is just misplaced anger I am feeling for the loss of those guys. Please tell me how you guys felt about this.

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Hey, if you are impressed with my memorizing pi to 10 digits, you should see the size of my penis.

the_marq

Right there with you man, I am relieved to learn I am not the only Canadian outraged by that sort of behavior.

BTW, do you know who it was? I feel like sending an email.

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The Truth:

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#3 in a series

Bossnass

I think it was Ian Tyson.

I come from a line of RCMP. A red serge coat in a picture box hanging in my grandma's bedroom. Not that that is really relavent, but it seems to have a little more resonance now.

I have two friends from high school that trained with two of the fallen officers in Regina, one of them returned my message yesterday; he was stuck on duty way up north in High Level. He related a pretty interesting fact about the last week, since the shooting. No crimes have happened, no calls have been made to the station. Either no one is commiting crimes or no one is reporting them. There has been one traffic violation over a week. This is signifcant because they are normally pretty occupied; the population, as he describes it, is 'troubled natives and mostly asshole tradesmen' which results in regular conflicts between and within each group. That these guys aren't 'stirring up shit' is remarkable.

Further, my understanding is that the shooter made death threats against the truck dealer, had been reported for dealing drugs, and had outstanding weapon search charges, so four officers went to investigate. Four were sent because he was a known offender, normally in a remote area only two would have gone. The shooter wasn't there, or was hiding, but they saw evidence of a chop shop. However, with due process they couldn't search without an appropriate warrant so one car left to get the paper and the other stayed to watch for the shooter. At that point, reports are unclear, even to other RCMP officers. But a third officer was getting a ride from a fourth to relieve one of the orignal two later that day. Later, aparently the next morning when the warrent was ready, all four were found shot with a high-powered rifle. Why no-one reacted to the lack of radio communications overnight is unclear.

Of course, when I was told that, I was also told that it was all heresay, but I consider the source to be sound.