lemon0444

Well its fnally happened, Alberta is debt free. What does that mean to Albertans? Money, money, and more money. With oil prices hovering around all time highs, our surplusses just keep getting bigger. Now that we don't have to put that money towards debt anymore, we're on our way to becoming the richest province in Canada. What are you're thoughts about that. Should we share the money with the rest of the country, even though we've made many sacrifices over the past 10 years to get to where we are today? Should we hoard it? Also, what should we do with it to improve the quality of life in Alberta? This topic is pretty open, so just post anything of interest relating to Alberta and our financial situation.

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phenomi-christ-ominal!!!!

james t kirk

I would suggest that you spend it in Alberta to diversify your economy from its dependance on oil.

Not to be a wise ass, but when the oil runs out, Alberta will be broke.

Calgary has a bit of a high tech thing happening (though I have done nothing but lose money by investing in it - Wilan for example)

I would try to spend your money with an eye to the future.

Oil is king today, but it is a limited resource.

the_marq

JTK has the right idea. Many of the middle eastern nations have already started down this path to diversify their economoies so that in 20-30 years when oil is no longer King they will still have revenue streams.

As for sharing with other provinces; absolutely. This country was founded on the idea of hanging together and working with your neighbours. While it's true that AB made a lot of sacrafices to pay down the debt, at the end of the day we made all this money by simply falling ass first into a pool of oil. We should share our good fortunes with the rest of the country

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The Truth:

Johnny Cash could have kicked Bruce Lee's ass if he wanted to.

#3 in a series

metalgeek

Alberta is trying to diversify our economy, it does take time however.
I certainly hope our government has enough forsight for this.
screw splurging on healthcare, we need money for education(higher), and perhaps lower taxes on certain industries we want to promote.

I however don't think it's just because we landed ass first into a pool of oil.
BC and Saskatchewan both have fair sized oil reserves, yet there both in debt, and don't have the money Alberta does.
Why?
We stuck with the cutting of services to pay down the debt. We pushed for industry to come to us.
Alberta creates the second highest number of small businesses every year in Canada. (just over half the ones Ontario does) despite us being the 4th largest province.
Basically I think a lot of it has to do with stick to it ness, and a willingness to take risks.

Janey

deleted double entry

Janey

Invest in education. Higher education, establish centres of expertise in High Tech, and Humanities (leverage the world famous paleaology resources). Do not be exclusive in this respect. Invite all of Canadian youth to participate in elite learing. Reinvest this development into the province and Canada.

Invite immigration. The opportunities provided by new blood are boundless. This kind of forward thinking will raise Alberta to the forefront in perception of toleration and development on a global scale. Try to develop some leading edge Native peoples policy. I think they would like to move beyond the current federal apartheid like system...

From a debt free position you can dictate the rules of the game.to corporations, Invite them to play, your way. They will come.

Congratulations on the effort, use the large lever that you have to improve the opportunities of our youth!!!

lemon0444

I absolulty agree with the higher education approach. Everone who said that once the oil runs out, we'll be screwed are only half right. Alberta is diversifying its economy, and heading in a technological direction. We are going to need skilled people to run these industries. The more we have the better.

I am currently taking the Computer Engeneering Technologies program at SAIT, and I'm loving it. Its what i'm destined to do. The problem is trying to make ends meet financially. Which is why education funding was my first choice on that survey the government sent out about what to do with the surpluss.

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phenomi-christ-ominal!!!!

OFKU0

I've been to Calgary several times and always loved it. Very very friendly people. In Ontario things are going from bad to worse but no one seems to want to admit to it. (I've been to the Calgary zoo and just off hand I'd bet 3 to 1 the monkeys could do a better job of running Ottawa than the totally inept clowns who are in charge now. Let's see between the Ontario tax assessment and the city raising property taxes, adding the projected 10% increase next year,...that means in the last 3 years my property taxes have increased 83%. Give it another year and I'm sure it will top out a 100%) So maybe I'll do some research and see what benefits are viable for me if I feel like a change. Incidentally, is the housing market hot or cold.

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" In Canada, you can tell the most blatant lie in a calm voice, and people will believe you over someone who's a little passionate about the truth." David Warren, Western Standard.

blahblah454

Being a Calgarian myself, and having every uncle and my father in the oil business I do feel that we should deversify ourselves. When we find a better source for power than oil its gonna be outta there, I dont think that we are ever going to run out of oil but what is going to happen is that we are going to discover a new energy source that is better on the environment and more efficient. But as far as money goes I think that we should share it to an extent, we shouldnt just give them money and say "here do with it what you will" but we should designate where it goes... like fixing up Saskatchewans poor poor roads.

blahblah454

and OFKU0 if you were wondering about housing in Calgary If you have about 300grand for a house (or want to get a morgage for that) then the posibilities are endless. Also just south of us is Okatokes (sp?) and its only 15 min south and there is lots of new houses going up there for sale, Im not sure what they run but my uncle just bought down there and they are really nice

skier

Not just diversify, but reduce dependance on all resource oriented industries like logging and agriculture. Yes our roots are in agriculture, but it's not exactly a winner in terms of revenue.

Expand into service industries, invest in environmental protection as well as education.

The rest i think should go to the rest of canada, primarily funding federal debt reduction so that taxes are lowered, and we can focus on health care and education for all of canada eventually.

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"Asking a bomb squad if an old bomb is still "real" is not the best thing to do if you want to save it." - denim

Fly

hey Alberta..........come grab B.C. and we'll make our own country.


weed and oil........


too bad our main resource is illegal.....

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BASTARD

SterlingStudios

colt45

saskatchewan will join..

weed, oil, lumber, potash, and uranium

plus lots of other resources..

Although alberta seems to be to pro-yankee politics for me. well some people..

tiltedbc

Alberta should buy some better WEATHER. Far too much snow and cold weather during spring, summer, fall and even winter.

splck

I'm with flyman and colt45. no time like the present.

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nice line eh?

R_R_R

The housing market is HOT HOT HOT. People keep moving here and the city is expanding by leaps and bounds. You Don't even need $300,000.00 to get a nice house. Especially if you don't mind living on the outskirts, I have friends who've bought brand new houses for 180k, and they're quite nice. Anyways, if you do decide you need a change I recommend trying it out here. We all seem to love it. Hope to see you here soon

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What am i doing on this planet?

JJRousseau

The pace of expansion is incredible. Lethbridge too!

metalgeek

bah, you people need to stop buying houses on the outskirts. Build up not out.
People move sotuh of Fish creek, and then complain it takes them 45 minutes to drive downtown. Annoys the hell out of me.
Recently read an interesting article about newfoundland and nova scotia(I think it as NS) about how they don't want the feds to take there oil revenues, and don't want them factored into there equalization payments. arghh drives me insane.

Suave

Spend it on some fucking education and health care. I swear to canola, if this shit keeps up with Klein I'm going to end up blowing his lacking grey matter across an Edmontonian sidewalk. I'm not bitter I swear.

metal, why does that drive you insane? The Maritimes just want what we have. At the moment, they're getting a raw deal in terms of their oil revenues. Alberta and Saskatchewan were given almost full control over their resources and revenues in the early 20th century; the Maritimes were not.

wolfpack0102

alberta smartest province in teh country....now use the oil to keep prices down

Averett

I've got a friend in Lethbridge and he's told me how it's just getting bigger and bigger. It's a nice sized city, visited twice. The river bottom area is really nice.

I'd imagine with this news people would want to look into heading into Alberta.

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Absence is to love what wind is to fire. It extinguishes the small, it enkindles the great.

Janey

Hey, Ontario will join too. Just so long as we don't have to use the reform. oops I mean the conservative party to lead us. while, were at it, we should include Manitoba. We could start a brand new country and call it .. Um.. Canada with our own small C conservative gov't - just no Klein, or Harper please, or Martin. Maybe we could get Justin to be our PM.

the_marq

Are you talking about Justin Trudeau ? Leading a conservative party? OK, whatever you say.

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The Truth:

Johnny Cash could have kicked Bruce Lee's ass if he wanted to.

#3 in a series

Janey

Actually, yes I am. it's not crazy if youthink about it. the middle ground in this country is virtually identical. How else can you get Charest to be liberal premier? Sooo.. how do you make a party palatable to the country?

Marry the tempered fiscal responsibility of a small c conservative party with the not to distant social conciousness of a small L liberal party, invoke a visceral Trudeau-mania, a young guy who has charisma and pedigree, and presto! Party which can lead the great majority of voters in this country.

We only leave the far left and right out. Who needs anything more than one standard deviation from the norm anyways? Justin probably doesn't even know what the NEP was or may be able to deal with the relatively minor oil issue in a more acceptable manner ( heard that the comparable cost of oil back then would work out to about $75/bbl), so no problem.

not far fetched at all.

metalgeek

Agree with the Martin, but with an attitude like that, Alberta would never let you join.
You realize what your saying is what makes us mad right?
"Nothing from Alberta please, it's to scary, we'll put in our own guy"
I realize you might not be meaning it that way, but thats what it sounds like.
Whats not to like about Klein? straight shooter, common guy, says what he means and means what he says. He's a real guy, and ultimetly stands for the views of most Albertans.
You can complain he's cut funding, but remeber, Alberta still has the highest levels of funding for pretty much any program.

ohh, and Justin Tredeau? that name won't fly here, sorry.

JJRousseau

Umm, I think having leaders like Mr Klein and Harper is the whole point of "starting our own Western country". This may surprise you but there are some people in the West who think that Mr Martin (and the old boys of entrenched-inefficient-tax-subsidized-old-money-Central-Canadian-mega-corps) doesn't care about us in the West.

Suave

We've already got the largest amount of provincial in-migration in Canada. I think we've held that title for quite some time now.

Janey

Sorry to burst your bubble boys, but I'm a westerner too. Unless you folks are excluding people form BC in your club. And This may surprise you too, but there's people here in central Canada and in the east who think tht Mr Martin and the oil-mega-baron-corporation out west don't care about us too (thankyou Let Them Freeze In the Dark...). And in shear numbers maybe even more than in the dissaffected west. People like Klein, and the recent Mr. Harris are the Old Boys. So it seems that there is enough sniping to go around for everybody.

I didn't mean that I didn't like Klein, I meant that the old guard has too much at stake to make new, innovative strides. Which is why I included Harper and Martin. You guys think that I am eastern-centric only, But I posted my creds just to prove that I have perspective from all sides of the country. First and foremost I am a westerner, but am able to see beyond my borders.

Bossnass

I am of the understanding that Alberta and Ontario carry the entire credit side of the equalization payments. We give more then enough to the rest of Canada already.

It is not a case that resources are magically transferred into bank accounts. Albertan's have worked hard for decades to get where Alberta is now. Sacrifices have been made: long hours in trades/oilfield jobs, longer hours on the administration end, environmental reprecussions that future generations will need to deal with.

I really could go on for a while on a rant, but the bottom line is that I don't think any money should leave the province. It should be turned into a strong Albertan Health Care system. It should be used to develop more tertiary industry. It should be used to establish better, more reliable trade routes. It should be poured into municipal infastructure to support the unsustainable growth that is both a cause and a result of said money.


I honestly don't see any good reason for Alberta or BC to be part of Canada. Anyone care to explain it to me? Economically, we put lots in, but what do we get out? And has the rest of Canada helped protect our interests? (the wheat communists, the softwood blockade, the beef lockdown, etc)

JJRousseau

Bossnass. I hear you. Believe me I hear you. However... national boundaries (as right or wrong as the current ones are) must make up more than just financial profitablitiy. If Alberta were to become it's own country, then maybe Calgary would want to separate from Alberta because it was putting more in to the economy than Leduc. Then the downtown core would want out of Calgary. Then the financial district would want out of downtown. Then the 15th floor where the brokers are would want out. Etc, etc.

Countries are made up of common histories, cultures and beliefs (and yes somethimes arbitrary lines). Our problem is that, in many regards, the West has more in common with the Western US than with Eastern Canada.

Bossnass

I understand the whole concept of why countries are formed and so on, which is my entire point. I've spent time all across Canada (alright, I'm never been to the terrirories, but I have been to Fort McMurray a couple times and High Level once). I like most all Canadians, even the argumentivite Canadiens. I just don't have much in common with them. And in a political sense, I don't like how I've never been represented. Alberta pays a great deal to be part of Canada, but because of population distrubitution, it has little say.

On a side note, I don't think the Calgary-Alberta and Alberta-Canada comparsion is really sound. I understand the point, but the levels don't line up nicely. Calgary has a need for Alberta. Calgarians and Edmontonians are good natured rivals- but ideologically speaking they are generally in agreement (yes, I know that is a sweeping generalization). Albertans (generalized) are less in agreement with, say Nova Scotians.

Bossnass

And the whole Newfoundland Labrador oil deal doesn't sit right with me either. Cod fishing collapsed, and they have been carried by the rest of Canada (Alberta, Ontario) for years and years. Now they have used Canadian funds to develop offshore oil. They have good projections, 20 years of resources, and now they don't want to share.

This might seem contrary to my prior post; but it is the same issue. Newfoundland has the potential to be in the position that Alberta currently is in; they just are aren't willing to pay the same dues that Alberta has been paying for 100 years, and they've only been around for 55 and have been riding the wave for the last half of that.

I don't so much disagree with the stance that newfoundland's preimer has taken; I just don't think that they should be able to get away without paying thier share as soon as it looks better for them to leave the confederation.

Fly

until the Stamps and Esks take the field together.....then.....look the hell out.

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BASTARD

SterlingStudios

Suave

One problem with Alberta and BC separating, is that we'd be governed by people like Klein federally. One of the good things about being a part of Canada is that the Liberals have kept the Neo-Liberal PC psychopaths from wreaking total havok upon our fair province and turning it into a full on Texas (no offense to Texans, I just prefer universal health care and such).

Janey

Ah, the quiet majority stirs....

JJRousseau

Janey, you may be right. I don't know. Here in BC, there is no clear majority as the right and left evenly split the province - and neither side is particularly quiet. Can't say for Alberta but Klein does keep getting elected, so...

I don't want to live in a Texas either. I don't think those kind of values will ever form a government in Canada. But I do believe that there is a moderate ground for Canada that is further away from our current big government/welfare state mentality.

Janey

I 100% absolutely agree with you JJ.

As a person who runs her own business, I am appalled at the amount of money and mismanagement of money that goes around the goverment. I get sick of all the $$ that go out for welfare, not for people that deserve it, but for those who are playing the system. andt he gov't allows it to happen at the coprorate level too.

splck

Heh, I think the whole idea of of Western Canada separation is to get away from Ontario and the center of the universe crowd . Manitoba would be welcome...of course
The thought of another Trudeau as PM makes me shiver. As much as I hate the idea, people from central Canada would probably flock behind the man.

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nice line eh?

metalgeek

I agree, I think there are a large number of Canadians who hate the current large arguably corrupt and inneficient (well for us at least, not saying it's on third world terms) government, and would like something smaller.
Basically conservitive views on finance and government, and liberal views of social welfare. unfortunetly none of the parties really offer this at the moment. the Conservitives are conservitive on both, and the liberals are semi conservitive on cash, but definetly not on government, and well, the NDP will never form a majority government.
In some ways a new party like Green would be nice but currently, it's filled with to many kooks. (the ones that don't flock to the Conservitive/Alliance)
But this is my view, and not the SUV driving soccer mum view unfortunetly.

JJRousseau

EXACTLY!!!!!! Welcome to Libertarian country! But seriously, I think the above sums up the values of a large chunk of the Canadian populous - and yet there are no parties to represent those views. When Mr Martin was finance minister under the Cretin gov't, he seemed to be that social liberal, fiscal conservative but when he was elected leader of the party, he took a sharp left turn. I still have wet dreams that he is just fooling his party and is really a closet conservative. )