tecoyah

So....I asked our local skilled labor for a bit of help, as I am woefully inadequate on the graphic arts front. ENPoweredhome is becoming a part of AGS....which is Alternative Green Solutions. I tried to make a Logo....and ....uh....well.........I suck.

So I sent her my stick figure drawing....and she came up with an Idea. See if you can guess which one I did...heh. She is now doing a second with changes....which I will post as well.

All Bow Before the sexy Dawg queen bitch.

Attached Images

	logo.JPG (10.7 KB, 125 views)
	001Tecs.jpg (24.9 KB, 125 views)

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tecoyah

she revised.....so far so good

Attached Images

tec2.JPG (19.7 KB, 116 views)

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tecoyah

And.....drum role please......


the finished product:

Attached Images

003Tecs.jpg (40.8 KB, 105 views)

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ngdawg

Thank you for the kind words, Tec

clavus

That's nothing. You should see her naked!

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ItWasMe

I like it. Alot.

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bermuDa

There's a nice concept there (Hammer as tree trunk) but it's being lost in the busyness surrounding it, which I really don't understand.

I don't want to give what seems like a negative crit amidst so much positive feedback, but as a professional designer I feel compelled to provide feedback that is only intended to improve the quality of the image. I do not mean to put anyone down, so if you are sensitive to criticism or worried that you might misconstrue this, please just skip to the next post.

Elements of the logo and their proportions:
What is the ball background? It reads like a globe but the map is unrecognizable, and far more complicated than necessary. If you shrank it down to 1/2", would it still be readable?

What is the shadow on the tree for, Is it a sundial? It seems to add nothing to the visual message, and actually flattens the icon because it runs counter to the apparent shadow of the circle. In fact, why does everything have a shadow or bevel effect??

What is the ratio of the tree to the circle? Is there any relationship between the tree and the shadow, the circle, or the text?

What are the wavy lines? Is there any proportional relationship between the thickness of the lines (and the white space between them) and the text, or any other element in the mark? Also, the bevel effect, shadowing, and placement all seem arbitrary, except to make it run through the tree trunk. Not to say that it's not something that couldn't be integrated into the concept, but I think its use here just seems like "another layer," without adding anything to the message.

Colors:
What is the color palette of the logo? What do the colors say? In other words, what do yellow and purple say about the client? Are they appropriate? There are too many colors in use here. A good logo can be reproduced in one color if need be, but this one all seems like a shade of grey. The only element that stands out in value is the tree.

On the tree, I see shaded green areas, but there isn't enough contrast between the colors. Same with the hammer. Colors that are too close together should be edited out, or given more contrast.

My advice
Take stock of what elements you have, and choose individual items. It's always possible to return to brainstorming and come up with other imagery, but there is plenty to work with in the current logo.
Text (3 words, 11, 5, and 9 letters. Much more analysis can be done)
Circle (sphere? globe?)
Map (?)
Wavy lines (3 lines, 3 peaks and troughs)
Tree
Hammer
Shadow

There are a lot of potential concepts and images What stands out to me is the concept I mentioned at the top of my post: the tree and the hammer. But it needs to be redrawn. A lot.

What I would do is brainstorm trees and decide which tree creates the right metaphor, then draw them a few dozen times to get shapes and silhouettes that are as simple as possible while still clearly communicating the tree. Then do the same for hammers, and then see how they can be combined. Remember that white space is an important part of your logo. Most of the really strong logos communicate something in the white space, and all of them are conscious of the use of negative space. At the same time, text must also be considered: what font best communicates the message? What weights are necessary? Most importantly, what proportional relationships can be made between the stroke width, x-height, or cap-height of the text, and the imagery you're using. The text needs to have this relationship in order to seem to be a part of the signature block.

This should have been boiled down before it got dressed up. Once these questions have been answered and the thumbnails refined, I think the logo could successfully solve the problem. There's a ton more to take into consideration when doing a logomark, such as audience, application, copyright (has this been done before?), but this is more of a mock-up edit, and just concentrating on the image itself.I'm sorry I now don't have the time to draw out what I mean, but I hope this proves helpful.

Granted, client satisfaction is also a factor. If they're happy with this then it's not necessary to go any further, but as a designer, there's always room for improvement.

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tecoyah

The company is a green building contractor, combined with energy efficiency consulting. the logo intends to project the elements of Wind(wavy lines) Earth (green parts of globe) Water (blue parts of globe) and Sun ( yellow glow on planet rim). It does not wish to be flashy or in your face, as the company itself is not, and we chose the purple colors to reflect peace and calm. The tree is a pine as that is standard lumber for building in the US, and the shadow it places represents passive solar applications, as well as pointing out the influence of the rising sun.

Each part of this logo has been chosen to represent an aspect of the company, but I do appreciate the input from a marketing standpoint, thank you.

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ngdawg

Also, keeping the text and lines flat did nothing for the layout; by beveling the lines, they look a bit more like they're off the globe-they're air movement, running to the right as 'moving forward'.
Tree and its shadow: a bit of a license, but nature taking back the earth; the hammer is because they're contractors.
Generally speaking, the logo would not be seen at this size-it's meant to be on letterheads, etc. Had it been left without shadowing effects, it'd be one big blue and purple blur. I refined, then would look at it as a letterhead (about 1 inch square) and add or subtract-which is why you see darker pieces on the tree. At 1 inch, they add a depth that is lost at this size. Same with the lines, at 1 inch, they'd look like a printing error without the shadowing.
As a designer, it is not my final decision as to what gets used. I work with the people that want what they want; color, elements, style of text is not the designer's choice. Best we can do is turn their ideas into reality. In this case, if you knew what was asked and what the company actually does, each element would be understandable; as it is, the logo gives a pretty clear idea of that. Too much analyzing gets in the way; it's more of a "this is what we are, this is what we like" deal in every case.( I've done logos and designs that I know needed more work, but the people that I did them for loved what was given. Just this week, a Christmas card I literally threw together last minute got a "Yes!!" response and was ordered by the client-this after showing her 20 others our studio offered.)
I like the colorfulness of this one. Actually, there are only 5 colors-6 if you include the shadows(in case they have to pay for color plates at any time) , but it seems like more.
I appreciate the critique. Nothing's in stone and I can always adjust the details.

bermuDa

The designer is not a drawing tool for the client. If you give them something that is unfinished, they could still love it because they don't know any better (I would not show a client 20 different variations to choose from, even 5 is too many). If all you do is appease them and sacrifice your own creative and professional integrity by showing work you know to be incomplete or undeveloped, you are not acting in their best interest. I've gone against my better judgment before because I let the client push me around, and now I know better.

The job of a logo is to communicate in one breath the identity of the company or group it represents. It's a visual sentence. There are a lot of subjects in the sentence you're trying to spell out, and as it stands, it doesn't communicate what you're telling me. If it seems to you like it's hitting all the points but other people don't get it, it's not their problem, you're too close to it to see objectively how it might be mis-communicating.

I have to take exception to this, because typography is a MAJOR component of design, and it is absolutely the designer's job to understand how the type communicates. If the client wants to use a particular font because it's a part of their identity that they want to keep it's one thing, but if they want to use Comic Sans or Papyrus because they don't want to pay for a font, it's time to regulate. Clients are an important part of the process, but they are not the designer, the art director, or the dictator.

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ngdawg

Why are you arguing this?
I am very well aware of what are 'major components, including font styles and such and the designer is not the one making the choices and paying for them-the designer presents what he/she designed and the client chooses.
Newsflash: A designer is a drawing tool or no one would need one, they could do everything themselves. I've also gone against my better judgment and guess what? Everyone walked away happy.
My boss has a degree in marketing and had no problem with the logo. Only 'rule' that was broken was that it's more than 3 colors.
Tec's happy, I'm pleased, his contractors approved it....that's what matters.

hunnychile

The ngdawg is one of the most "tuned-in" and talented people ever to post on tfp. Really.

We should all bow to her highness and most benevolent!
Hehehe, yeah, she rocks

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ngdawg

Damn, thanks! And I didn't even have to bribe you! But, please don't bow!

bermuDa

I'm sorry you have such a low opinion of your profession. If the only difference between a designer and their clients is the technical ability to draw their logo, you may be right. I just think there's a whole lot more to it than appeasing the client, and when I saw this logo it didn't look finished.

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Jetée

How old is this?

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ngdawg

How old is what?


Bermuda, I don't have a low opinion of anything, what I have is the opinion that the person who's paying me makes the final decision. It's not my place to teach anyone the mechanics of art, the 'rules' of those mechanics or anything else. My job is to please the client. Period. And if you believe it is your job to teach them what you're told from marketing class, then you should be a teacher.
I will acquiesce to the beveled air streams and the sun/shadow line is even now. I also have gone over it probably about 5 times to correct errors like uneven lines, overlaps, etc. See, I make sure it's perfect after it's chosen, not force my idea of perfection before knowing what the choice is.

bermuDa

I'm not talking about marketing, or teaching the client on the finer points of proportional relationships. I'm talking about taking pride in having a thoughtful solution, where all of the decisions have a clear purpose. I believe that a majority of those decisions are better off being made through thumbnailing, on paper; the computer is a powerful tool but i think people move to it before the concept is tight enough, and end up using it to make small edits (like the ones in this thread) when big ones are called for. Just because it was done on the computer doesn't mean it's a refined concept.

If all parties are satisfied that's fine, I just wouldn't be satisfied showing this to a client.

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ngdawg

You're making assumptions because you weren't in on the decision making process(and even I wasn't in on the beginning, only given what was agreed upon) nor privy to the finished work while watching over my shoulder.
Your critique was considered and I made some changes within the parameters of what the clients had approved and wanted.
This thread was intended as a "Thank you" because of someone's pride in his new venture; while I appreciate your difference of style in design, etc., at this point, you're now basically just hammering where it isn't necessary.
As a designer, it's necessary to have a relatively thick skin because everyone's taste is so vastly different that there are bound to be things that would be considered awful as well as things being considered 'perfect'.
There is no, repeat no such thing as 'perfection' in art or design. Perfection is a concept that changes continuously and arriving at one's idea of it is not a constant.
When someone comes to me, whether at work or otherwise and says "I need this or that and it has to include that or this", the solving of a puzzle begins.
Elements to be included: check. Possible font/text styles to present: check.
Present a couple of ideas: check. Make changes, suggestions: check. Do over.
Do over again. Make finite corrections. Do over.
However, working for a studio, the process can't be drawn out; if something is needed before the end of a workday, you better know the shortcuts that will still get you the approval. Then work on the concept of technical perfection. In every case so far working for this studio, I see things I could have improved upon, but the work was already in use because it was deemed 'perfect'.
In this case, the client knew exactly what was wanted and needed, from color to concept, so the process wasn't too difficult. I was quite surprised that it was approved-not because I don't like it (I do-it's different enough to be noticed, but not, to me, as jumbled as you think it is)
In your eyes, what you are only seeing here without knowing the discussions behind it, it may seem 'unfinished'. To those that had a say in what they wanted, it fit the bill. It is also a concept that can be evolved as the company evolves. There isn't a company in existence that hasn't changed or dropped its logo for something newer. Even old standbys like Morton Salt or Campbell's Soup change their icons while still keeping the basic design or premise.
In regards to what seems unrelated, hard to grasp or unfinished, the first thing that comes to mind is the golden arches of MacDonald's. No clue what they're supposed to mean other that a big M, but everyone knows them. But to represent a fast food joint? They don't. In showing this to a friend without explaining what it was, he at least understood that it has something to do with being, as he said, "environmentally friendly", so in that respect, the message was sent.
It's not the designer's job to make a case for swaying someone to their way of thinking-something you seem to want to do; it's the designer's job to do the best he/she can to please the client and still be pleased with the finished product as something they can say "I made that". I have no qualms here.

ngdawg

Finished...at least until i find something else to fix...

Attached Images

tecfinal2smweb.jpg (19.3 KB, 50 views)