Have you donated to hurricane relief? - Page 2 - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Jinn · 09-09-2005, 06:37 AM

"Nah, screw them poor black bastards. 21 25.61% "

Still in the lead! This is like watching a prejudiced horse race or something..

SiN · 09-09-2005, 06:42 AM

Let's stick to the poll itself please ...
or, if you must discuss the poll options, do so respectfully..

Stiltzkin · 09-09-2005, 11:14 AM

I haven't donated because I strongly feel that money donated to these types of charities is being abused for corrupt reasons, and I do not wish to feed that corruption. I can't prove that the money is being used for corrupt purposes, but since I don't actually know what happens when I donate money (i.e. what exactly is the money used for when it is donated?), then I refuse to donate.

I think everyone here could at least afford to donate a quarter or a dollar, even those who claim to be horribly poor; I'm not exactly rich either, but I admit that I could donate a dollar--I just don't want to.

jorgelito · 09-09-2005, 02:16 PM

I also didn't donate because I feel like there's no need. My taxes are alread going to the aid effort.

Another thing I don't get: Why should it be fes responsibilty to provide money relief when all the people who live in hurricane region, Florida, etc (red states) are plenty aware of the risks? Let the insurance companies and private sector and local govts. take care of it. This is ridiculous.

noodle · 09-09-2005, 05:56 PM

How about...

No, I haven't and I'm not going to because I'm still recovering financially from the five storms that hit my area last year and though I feel for those who are so devastated, had the tree I parked my car under (intentionally) actually fallen on it, instead of the neighbor's house, the POS wouldn't be sucking up all of my available funds. That, and I work in social services. And... since I work in a field that relies heavily on donations, I know that sometimes funds don't end up in the hands that really need it.

texxasco · 09-09-2005, 10:57 PM

Yes, I am struggling and on a tight budget but I did donate a little bit, and helped out at a shelter. I too think we have an obligation to help others in need if we can. If you can't, for whatever reason, there's no shame in not being able. Or, if for some reason you feel like you shouldn't...well that's your choice obviously. Tragedy strikes everybody sooner or later, and it's nice to know there are people out there who are willing to step up and help out when needed.

vautrain · 09-09-2005, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stiltzkin

I haven't donated because I strongly feel that money donated to these types of charities is being abused for corrupt reasons, and I do not wish to feed that corruption. I can't prove that the money is being used for corrupt purposes, but since I don't actually know what happens when I donate money (i.e. what exactly is the money used for when it is donated?), then I refuse to donate.

I have to say, it seems odd to have a kind of blanket, unsubstantiated mistrust of charities. That said, there are some organizations that rate charities on their efficiency, as well as other metrics.

http://www.charitywatch.org/

http://www.charitynavigator.org/

raeanna74 · 09-10-2005, 01:50 PM

I have not given for several reasons.
A - barely had enough for groceries this week for my family let alone leftover money. Last week I scavanged the couch for change to get milk.
B - I'm still trying to wrap my mind around ALL these people who were warned that the storm was coming, stayed, got trapped, and now want help. I can understand helping with their housing but why did so much relief money have to go to rescue. I know this is a long debate and don't intend to get into it here. I just cannot understand it and thus have less empathy for those who were able bodied and stood around waiting for someone ELSE to give them a ride. WALK - you got two good legs. Walking would have gotten them a long ways before the storm hit. I know smarter people who were hit by the storms in Fla last year - relatives. Some of our relatives did not stay there - they were not physically fit either. They found a way out and good thing they did. They lost their homes. It took a long time but they have a new home now. How you get yourself into a situation like this and don't make an attempt to get out of it yourself - I cannot comprehend it. (end of rant)

When someone can make me understand what the TRUE situation was that made these people REAL victims. Then I will give to the REAL victims what money I am able to vacuum out of my carpet.

vautrain · 09-10-2005, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raeanna74

I know this is a long debate and don't intend to get into it here. I just cannot understand it and thus have less empathy for those who were able bodied and stood around waiting for someone ELSE to give them a ride. WALK - you got two good legs. Walking would have gotten them a long ways before the storm hit. I know smarter people who were hit by the storms in Fla last year - relatives. Some of our relatives did not stay there - they were not physically fit either. They found a way out and good thing they did. They lost their homes. It took a long time but they have a new home now. How you get yourself into a situation like this and don't make an attempt to get out of it yourself - I cannot comprehend it. (end of rant)

When someone can make me understand what the TRUE situation was that made these people REAL victims. Then I will give to the REAL victims what money I am able to vacuum out of my carpet.

Please, aren't there enough other threads that deal with this debate? If you don't think they are worthy of even your sympathy, much less your money, just say so, and leave it at that.

chriscsugaree · 09-13-2005, 06:12 AM

I stewed on this poll for a few days because when I first saw it I had been drinking, and my first instinct was to say some not so kind words. Sorry SiN, I hope what I am about to say is not out of bounds but I think it should be said.

One thing that bothers me about this poll is some of the choices but one in particular. There were thousands upon thousands of people who have lost their homes, schools, jobs, and many of their loved ones. For over a week the survivors lived in disgusting, unhealthy situations by no fault of their own. These people come in every skin color and many ethnic backgrounds. But one of the options did not say "Nah, screw them poor southern bastards or those bastards in New Orleans". Instead it had the option "Nah, screw them poor black bastards" which seems very racist to me. There are more intelligent ways to evoke a response, if this was the intent, than using racial slurs. If it is a real reflection of your prejudice it is also a sign of ignorance. I am also surprised to see this poll option at a board with members who have probably felt the sting of prejudice because of their own sexual and gender choices.

I also found a few of the responses here very caulous. But it is your choice and right to be caulous. It is also everyones' right to not give a donation to help these citizens at such a tragic time of their lives. But while some here may not feel they can afford to give right now, others who have replied with insensitivity are just giving excuses. You can afford a computer and an internet connection but you would have others believe you cannot afford to give even $5. I suspect that if your computer suddenly broke and you could not go online you would somehow find the funds to fix the problem. If you feel confortable in your self absorbed way of life fine. Just do not try to fool others and yourself with such excuses.

It is not about whether or not you have a quarter to give. It is about having a heart for your fellow man and a true empathy for the pain they are going through. Something a few of you here are sorely lacking.

p.s. normally I would not reply this way but as stated, there was an interest in...

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrklixx

Well, because I was interested to see why people who haven't donated choose not to... And also I wanted to see how many people would complain about the answers I gave.

mrklixx · 09-13-2005, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chriscsugaree

But one of the options did not say "Nah, screw them poor southern bastards or those bastards in New Orleans". Instead it had the option "Nah, screw them poor black bastards" which seems very racist to me. There are more intelligent ways to evoke a response, if this was the intent, than using racial slurs. If it is a real reflection of your prejudice it is also a sign of ignorance. I am also surprised to see this poll option at a board with members who have probably felt the sting of prejudice because of their own sexual and gender choices.

If I had just made a post that said "Screw them poor black bastards, because I hate them" then you might have a valid point. However, since the day after the storm, I have heard nothing but how the main reason that there is a lack of aid is racism. Everyone from the mayor of N.O. to Jesse Jackson to most of the major media outlets have claimed that "hateful white folks" are not helping victims. So there are are great number of people who, [i]at the very least/i] believe that everyone who doesn't help is a hateful callous racist. So I don't know how you could have a poll and not have that as an option, when so many people claim that is the only reason people are not helping. You are absolutely right in saying that response is ignorant, which is exactly why it is worded the way it is, because someone who would legitimately use that as their reason would say it pretty much as worded in the poll (except maybe laced with profanity and the "word that shall not be named").

Jinn · 09-13-2005, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JinnKai

"Nah, screw them poor black bastards. 21 25.61% "

Still in the lead! This is like watching a prejudiced horse race or something..

23-22, "Yes" is catching up!

As for my opinion.. it's mixed. I distrust charities, I jaded in the fact that anyone still trapped is an idiot for staying, and anyone starving isn't resourceful enough. That said, I'd be compassionate enough to donate if I could actually see it going to a useful cause. And yes, I voted screwing black bastards, but only in jest.

Gabbyness · 09-13-2005, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guccilvr

No, because I'm a selfish prick

With any luck you'll go through life without ever having anything catastrophic happen to you. Something that might require the help of others.

jorgelito · 09-13-2005, 04:33 PM

I think people are forgetting that many of the people trapped were either confined to hospital beds or in wheel chairs.

I didn't donate because I think there's plenty of charity disbursed already between the Red Cross, the Feds, athletes, entertainers, corporations/big business. Moreover, I feel I have already donated through my tax dollars.

If the Red Cross makes a plea for blood or volunteers, I would consider that (if I knew for certain the Red cross wouldn't sell my blood to a hospital as is their normal policy).

I am very impressed at how America rallied together and was so generous. It appears to me, that there is no further need for me to contribute. Especially seeing how we are turning away hundreds of millions of dollars from very willing foreign aid.

Stompy · 09-14-2005, 04:06 PM

I'm unsure of whether or not I want to donate.

It sucks what happened and all, but seeing as how the govt failed to provide adequate funding to keep the most important structures (read: levees) maintained and up-to-date, they should be the ones to pay.

I'm serious, too. If you have a city below sea level, flat out, your top priority is to maintain those levees for the WORST... and trust me, it's easily possible with the technology and money we have these days. If you can send a man to the moon, you can build a f'n levee to withstand hurricanes.

...and where should the govt get this money from, you ask? Well, there's a meaningless war going on that's costing us about $200 billion. In fact, money that was to go to the SELA (Southeast Louisiana Urban Flood Control Project) was diverted to help pay for it sometime in 2003. It's about time they take from the "meaningless war fun" and apply it to something that's *actually* relevant to our reality.

ninety09 · 09-14-2005, 05:47 PM

I donated a few dollars to the RedCross. I'm not sure of how much it'll really help, but heh, it can't hurt..

viejo gringo · 09-14-2005, 06:01 PM

I will leave tomorrow evening for 12 hour trip to Gretna...right accross the river from the superdome.....a group of men from our church are hauling several uhaul trailer loads of steaks, fajitas, and pork loin --and a BIG barba-A-Q..we are going to cook for the
guys that are working their butts off...and maybe give them a little break.....it's not much, but everything was donated.

They said to bring a sleeping bag and be completly self suffiecint....hmmmm sounds like we are on our own here...we will
see what the BIG GUY has instore for us.....more later..
Oh yea, Im 71 and I will sleep on the ground if thats what it takes...I just pray that it is enough..VG

chriscsugaree · 09-14-2005, 07:09 PM

Now you are just rationalizing. I heard a lot about the lack of response being about racism. But most of the feedback was about the incompetence of FEMA. You could have put something like "they should not be helped because they are black" so that those who chose this option revealed their own attitudes. But putting "Screw them poor black bastards" was not a reflection of anyone elses attitude because no one had voted yet. You seem to be saying that because you did not add "because I hate them" to this option it is not racist. And just because you do not see this as a valid point does not mean it is not a valid point. It just means you do not see it. My advice is for you to test this theory. Tomorrow, go out and look for the biggest black guy you can find. One who would not react to you because he considered you a physical threat. Then say to him, "Hey, you black bastard." Then quickly explain to him that you meant no racial slur because you did not say "because I hate you". Then after you get out of the hospital come back and explain it once more to everyone here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrklixx

If I had just made a post that said "Screw them poor black bastards, because I hate them" then you might have a valid point. However, since the day after the storm, I have heard nothing but how the main reason that there is a lack of aid is racism. Everyone from the mayor of N.O. to Jesse Jackson to most of the major media outlets have claimed that "hateful white folks" are not helping victims. So there are are great number of people who, [i]at the very least/i] believe that everyone who doesn't help is a hateful callous racist. So I don't know how you could have a poll and not have that as an option, when so many people claim that is the only reason people are not helping. You are absolutely right in saying that response is ignorant, which is exactly why it is worded the way it is, because someone who would legitimately use that as their reason would say it pretty much as worded in the poll (except maybe laced with profanity and the "word that shall not be named").

p.s. I am glad to see common sense and a bit of human decency is beginning to prevail in this poll.

Tophat665 · 09-14-2005, 08:16 PM

I give the government a ton of money every year to deal with just this kind of thing. Of course, they piss it awy on pork and phony wars and arguing about whether or not they evolved from monkeys (they didn't, I did.) and then the pittance left over for disaster planning they put in the hands of a man who's chief qualification is that he once arranged a horse show....

I am philosophically apposed to charity. Doing together what we can't do individually is what government is <i>for</i>.

View Poll Results: Have you donated to hurrcane Katrina relief?
Yes I have donated services, money, or supplies.	29	27.10%
Yes I have donated, and plan to do so again.	14	13.08%
No I have not donated yet, but I plan to do so in the near future.	12	11.21%
Nah, screw them poor black bastards.	25	23.36%
No, I am ethicaly or religiously opposed to charity.	6	5.61%
No, it's not my country, it's not my problem.	5	4.67%
No, I'm poorer than than any of those affected, and can't even afford to drop a quarter in the hurricane relief jar at 7-11	16	14.95%
Voters: 107. You may not vote on this poll

09-09-2005, 06:37 AM	#41 (permalink)
Jinn Lover - Protector - Teacher Location: Seattle, WA	"Nah, screw them poor black bastards. 21 25.61% " Still in the lead! This is like watching a prejudiced horse race or something.. __________________ "I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel

09-09-2005, 06:42 AM	#42 (permalink)
SiN strangelove Location: ...more here than there...	Let's stick to the poll itself please ... or, if you must discuss the poll options, do so respectfully.. __________________ - + - ° GiRLie GeeK ° - + - ° 01110010011011110110111101110100001000000110110101100101 Therell be days/When Ill stray/I may appear to be/Constantly out of reach/I give in to sin/Because I like to practise what I preach

09-09-2005, 02:16 PM	#44 (permalink)
jorgelito All important elusive independent swing voter... Location: People's Republic of KKKalifornia	I also didn't donate because I feel like there's no need. My taxes are alread going to the aid effort. Another thing I don't get: Why should it be fes responsibilty to provide money relief when all the people who live in hurricane region, Florida, etc (red states) are plenty aware of the risks? Let the insurance companies and private sector and local govts. take care of it. This is ridiculous. __________________ "The race is not always to the swift, nor battle to the strong, but to the one that endures to the end." "Demand more from yourself, more than anyone else could ever ask!" - My recruiter

09-09-2005, 10:57 PM	#46 (permalink)
texxasco Insane Location: Somewhere in East Texas	Yes, I am struggling and on a tight budget but I did donate a little bit, and helped out at a shelter. I too think we have an obligation to help others in need if we can. If you can't, for whatever reason, there's no shame in not being able. Or, if for some reason you feel like you shouldn't...well that's your choice obviously. Tragedy strikes everybody sooner or later, and it's nice to know there are people out there who are willing to step up and help out when needed. __________________ ...A Bad Day of Fishing is Better Than a Great Day at Work!

09-09-2005, 11:14 AM	#43 (permalink)
Stiltzkin Junkie	I haven't donated because I strongly feel that money donated to these types of charities is being abused for corrupt reasons, and I do not wish to feed that corruption. I can't prove that the money is being used for corrupt purposes, but since I don't actually know what happens when I donate money (i.e. what exactly is the money used for when it is donated?), then I refuse to donate. I think everyone here could at least afford to donate a quarter or a dollar, even those who claim to be horribly poor; I'm not exactly rich either, but I admit that I could donate a dollar--I just don't want to.

09-10-2005, 01:50 PM	#48 (permalink)
raeanna74 I'm not a blonde! I'm knot! I'm knot! I'm knot! Location: Upper Michigan	I have not given for several reasons. A - barely had enough for groceries this week for my family let alone leftover money. Last week I scavanged the couch for change to get milk. B - I'm still trying to wrap my mind around ALL these people who were warned that the storm was coming, stayed, got trapped, and now want help. I can understand helping with their housing but why did so much relief money have to go to rescue. I know this is a long debate and don't intend to get into it here. I just cannot understand it and thus have less empathy for those who were able bodied and stood around waiting for someone ELSE to give them a ride. WALK - you got two good legs. Walking would have gotten them a long ways before the storm hit. I know smarter people who were hit by the storms in Fla last year - relatives. Some of our relatives did not stay there - they were not physically fit either. They found a way out and good thing they did. They lost their homes. It took a long time but they have a new home now. How you get yourself into a situation like this and don't make an attempt to get out of it yourself - I cannot comprehend it. (end of rant) When someone can make me understand what the TRUE situation was that made these people REAL victims. Then I will give to the REAL victims what money I am able to vacuum out of my carpet. __________________ "Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

09-13-2005, 04:33 PM	#54 (permalink)
jorgelito All important elusive independent swing voter... Location: People's Republic of KKKalifornia	I think people are forgetting that many of the people trapped were either confined to hospital beds or in wheel chairs. I didn't donate because I think there's plenty of charity disbursed already between the Red Cross, the Feds, athletes, entertainers, corporations/big business. Moreover, I feel I have already donated through my tax dollars. If the Red Cross makes a plea for blood or volunteers, I would consider that (if I knew for certain the Red cross wouldn't sell my blood to a hospital as is their normal policy). I am very impressed at how America rallied together and was so generous. It appears to me, that there is no further need for me to contribute. Especially seeing how we are turning away hundreds of millions of dollars from very willing foreign aid. __________________ "The race is not always to the swift, nor battle to the strong, but to the one that endures to the end." "Demand more from yourself, more than anyone else could ever ask!" - My recruiter

09-14-2005, 04:06 PM	#55 (permalink)
Stompy Banned from being Banned Location: Donkey	I'm unsure of whether or not I want to donate. It sucks what happened and all, but seeing as how the govt failed to provide adequate funding to keep the most important structures (read: levees) maintained and up-to-date, they should be the ones to pay. I'm serious, too. If you have a city below sea level, flat out, your top priority is to maintain those levees for the WORST... and trust me, it's easily possible with the technology and money we have these days. If you can send a man to the moon, you can build a f'n levee to withstand hurricanes. ...and where should the govt get this money from, you ask? Well, there's a meaningless war going on that's costing us about $200 billion. In fact, money that was to go to the SELA (Southeast Louisiana Urban Flood Control Project) was diverted to help pay for it sometime in 2003. It's about time they take from the "meaningless war fun" and apply it to something that's actually relevant to our reality. __________________ I love lamp. Last edited by Stompy; 09-14-2005 at 04:11 PM..

09-14-2005, 05:47 PM	#56 (permalink)
ninety09 Flavour of the Weak Location: Canada	I donated a few dollars to the RedCross. I'm not sure of how much it'll really help, but heh, it can't hurt..

09-14-2005, 06:01 PM	#57 (permalink)
viejo gringo Registered User Location: Deep South Texas	I will leave tomorrow evening for 12 hour trip to Gretna...right accross the river from the superdome.....a group of men from our church are hauling several uhaul trailer loads of steaks, fajitas, and pork loin --and a BIG barba-A-Q..we are going to cook for the guys that are working their butts off...and maybe give them a little break.....it's not much, but everything was donated. They said to bring a sleeping bag and be completly self suffiecint....hmmmm sounds like we are on our own here...we will see what the BIG GUY has instore for us.....more later.. Oh yea, Im 71 and I will sleep on the ground if thats what it takes...I just pray that it is enough..VG

09-14-2005, 08:16 PM	#59 (permalink)
Tophat665 Minion of the scaléd ones Location: Northeast Jesusland	I give the government a ton of money every year to deal with just this kind of thing. Of course, they piss it awy on pork and phony wars and arguing about whether or not they evolved from monkeys (they didn't, I did.) and then the pittance left over for disaster planning they put in the hands of a man who's chief qualification is that he once arranged a horse show.... I am philosophically apposed to charity. Doing together what we can't do individually is what government is <i>for</i>. __________________ Light a man a fire, and he will be warm while it burns. Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life.