zen_tom

This is such a tragedy - they say death toll may go as high as 1000+.

On second thoughts, this might be better off going into Discussion than Politics. If Mods think it will be better off there, then please relocate.

samcol

That is unbelievable and extremely sad. I really don't even have words to comment on it.

tecoyah

Moved to GD.....less friction...heh

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avhg1

I'm going to hell for this post. All I think when I hear this headline is MOO..

Why would anyone in Iraq under the current state of the country gather in a very large group in public? It sounds like a terror bomber's dream. Use some common sense and don't go:

a. where there are very large groups of people.
b. where there will certainly be Iraqi Police.
c. any place that is a likely target for a bomber.

I feel terrible for the people this happened to and their families, but would you go stand in the middle of the crossfire in a war zone? There are places you just don't go because you know better. For example, I'm a little (5'6") white boy, I know better than to go play in the ghetto in downtown Baltimore. It shouldn't be that way for the me or the Iraqis, but that's the reality of it.

I feel the same type of compassion for the people that made the decision to stay and wait out the hurricane when they knew it was coming. It stinks to learn lessons that way.

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I shake the devil's hand daily... I'd do it hourly, but my hand gets tired.

ObieX

I've heard similar stories from that region and their religous marches. Something like this always seems to happen w/ people getting trampled. Its really not an out of the ordinary occurance.

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analog

*shakes his head*

Somewhere, the terrorists are laughing their asses off. Seriously. They have done such a good job that people are scaring themselves to death. Innocent death is always sad.

Ustwo

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3448779.stm

Saddly this sort of thing is not uncommon, gotta love that old time religion.

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Grasshopper Green

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/...ain/index.html

It's been updated to 950+ with 450 injured.


BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- Deaths mounted steadily in northeast Baghdad after a massive midday Shiite religious procession erupted into a chaotic stampede Wednesday, causing the drowning and trampling deaths of 965 pilgrims.

Authorities believe a rumor raced through the crowd that a suicide bomber was in their midst, and that created panic among the waves of pedestrians trying to cross the Al-A'imma bridge over the Tigris River. The throngs of Shiite faithful had been stopped by security checks and bogged down by concrete barriers.

Three hours earlier, an insurgent mortar attack near the Kadhimiya mosque killed seven people and wounded 36 others.

Government officials are investigating that attack and the stampede itself -- which also led to the injuries of 465 people. The death count could rise as crews search for more victims.

They also want to explore the extent of any "technical defects" on the bridge.

"This will leave a scar in our souls and will be remembered with those who died in the result of terror acts," said President Jalal Talabani, echoing the sorrow across the nation over the tragedy, which prompted comparisons to stampedes at other religious events, such as those in Mecca during the annual pilgrimage in Saudi Arabia.

Wednesday's ceremony is one that annually attracts millions of Shiite pilgrims to Baghdad.

The Shiite faithful converge on the Kadhimiya mosque in the northeastern part of Baghdad to commemorate the martyrdom of Imam Moussa al-Khadhem, a prominent figure in Shiite history. He is buried at the Kadhimiya mosque, the largest Shiite mosque in the capital.

The stampede occurred at about 11:30 a.m. (3:30 a.m. EDT) near the mosque.

As the people made their way to the mosque, authorities said, it appeared that someone in the crowd stoked fears about a bomber, apparently sparking widespread chaos among the crush of people.

In the confusion, the crowd pushed against a railing on a bridge over the Tigris River, forcing it to collapse and sending dozens into the water. Police said most people drowned but some people were crushed to death. (See video of the bridge still jammed with people after the panic.)

Health Minister Abdul Muttalib Ali confirmed that that "the chaos that happened at the Al-A'imma bridge" because of a "rumor" of a bombing. "This led to a very horrible chaos," the official said, causing people "to run in an uncontrolled way and this led to suffocation of so many people and drowning of some of them in the river."

Defense Minister Saadoun al-Dulaimi told reporters that there were concrete barriers on the bridge and people moving forward on the structure had to be searched "for security concerns."

"There had to be a search operation at the end of the bridge. So crowds gathered and a certain scream caused chaos in the crowds and the crowds just reacted and this sorrowful incident took place."

Maj.-Gen. Jawad al-Daini, commander of the al-Rusafa sector of eastern Baghdad, said barricades and barbed wires made it hard for people to walk and "that caused a congestion and suffocated some of the visitors."

Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari -- who announced a three-day mourning period -- tried to calm his beleaguered fellow citizens in a speech that addressed both the mortar attack and the stampede.

Speaking in a nationally televised TV address, he tried to calm fears and tempers, urging Iraqis "to be patient with the current circumstances" and called on the country's Shiites, Sunnis and Christians "to think about the benefit of Iraq."

"We heard the news that some of those enemies attacked innocent people with mortars killing our faithful sons. This attack caused chaos among the Iraqi people in other areas in Baghdad and then because of the technical defects of the bridge, many people were martyred."

Al-Jaafari also offered his "gratitude and appreciation to the Iraqi people who continued with their commemoration despite what happened and I want to thank the Iraqi government who helped the Iraqi people and did not stop providing their assistance and security to the people."

The tragedy came amid an atmosphere of general tension in the capital and throughout the society -- daily warfare across the nation, suicide bombings that had been rife in the capital, the continual tensions between Sunni Arabs and Shiite Arabs, and an attack in the same area in March 2004 during the Ashura commemoration, another Shiite holy period.

Al-Dulaimi -- who spoke at a press briefing later with Interior Minister Bayan Jabr -- stressed that the security had been tight in Baghdad and in southern cities around the so-called Triangle of Death for the Shiite pilgrims heading to the capital.

They pointed to a number of security actions that helped keep order, such as the foiling of car bombings and suicide attackers and the disarming of improvised explosive devices. In one case, an Afghan insurgent headed toward Kadhimiya was killed.

Al-Dulaimi believes all necessary measures had been taken to protect the pilgrims.

The bridge across the Tigris, called the Al-A'imma, is not only a main thoroughfare leading to the shrine, it is also an important juncture in Baghdad -- separating Kadhimiya and Adhamiya.

The largest Shiite mosque in Baghdad is in Kadhimiya, where there is a strong Shiite community, and the largest Sunni mosque in Adhamiya, which has been a longtime insurgent stronghold with a strong Sunni Arab presence.

Al-Dulaimi discounted any theories that this incident was sparked by Sunni-Shiite sectarian violence.

He and other officials thought the bridge should have been closed. Instead, it was opened to accommodate the throngs of pilgrims.

The bridge -- which frequently has been closed to vehicle and/or pedestrian traffic for security reasons over the past few months -- is also near a joint U.S.-Iraqi military base.



Very sad....all the needless death.

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Trisk

While you may be right, and it may not have been the smartest thing to do to join a large crowd of people as they headed someplace in Iraq....common sense and religion don't always mix well, and in Iraq (as well as many "dangerous" places in the middle east) there are many very, very religious people. If it is a requirement of a religion to go somewhere or do something, there are many people who would go, despite any risks that they may suspect could come up during the event.
Anyways, even before American troops came to this area, Iraq and much of the middle east was still in a similar position of danger. There are just way too many feuding religious groups scattered throughout the middle east and religious gatherings are a source of danger whether or not the area is in a "war-zone".
And it's not quite the same as your example with you, as a white boy, venturing into the ghettos of baltimore. Terror bombers tend to target areas with American troops and American supporters rather than their own religious events and places of worship. A better comparison would be you, as a black person, venturing into an area that is disputed as territory between two gangs. You wouldn't be out of place there, and may not even be a target there. But the area is dangerous and you may get caught in the cross-fire.

Still, the thing that popped to mind when I heard of this event is that this is true terrorism. Make people so terrified of what might happen that they kill each other, and you don't have to lift a finger.
For all we know, the rumor may have just been one terrified person voicing their fears and causing a panic. While the terrorists would still be responsible, in a way, because it was fear of them that caused this panic....it is likely that they actually had nothing to do with the event, and hadn't planned it at all.

It's really sad. But then again, I would say the same about many events going on there right now. This is just another drop of water in the bucket.

Psycho Dad

Exactly what I thought when I first read about it. None of the suicide bombings I have read about anywhere, Iraq or otherwise has killed as many as easily. And I would bet it safe to assume that many if not most of the victims had no idea of the suicide bomb rumor. They likely just saw the wall of people closing in on them and panic overcame them until they were part of it.

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Don't always trust the opinions of experts.

Janie

It is a sad state of affairs, and very unfortunate the series of events which caused all this. The reality of it is events such as these have been taking place for millennia. It is only recently we expect nearly complete immunity from war and enemies. Soldiers may be fighting somewhere else, but us at home won't die. It seems to me it is this complacency that brings about such complete and overwhelming terror.

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irateplatypus

this defies easy analysis... on one hand, you have a gigantic crowd of people who obviously feel safe enough in their surroundings to gather like that, but on the other the mere threat of a bomb drives a stampede killing hundreds. interesting... very tragic, but also interesting.

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