Ireland to ban smoking - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

matthew330 · 12-12-2003, 10:56 AM

Perhaps could have gone in the politics page, but what in the world....total nonsense

http://www.sunspot.net/news/nationwo...home-headlines

CSflim · 12-12-2003, 01:23 PM

Why the fuck is it nonsense!?

I have the right to go into a restaurant/workplace canteen/pub/whatever without being forced to poison myself from YOUR second hand smoke.
Non-smoking section? Give me a break! Is there some kind of invisible barrier in between my table and yours that I'm unaware of?
If you want to, you are perfectly free to enjoy your oral carcinogens in the comfort of your own home. Or alternatively outside.

Glory's Sun · 12-12-2003, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CSflim
Why the fuck is it nonsense!?

I have the right to go into a restaurant/workplace canteen/pub/whatever without being forced to poison myself from YOUR second hand smoke.
Non-smoking section? Give me a break! Is there some kind of invisible barrier in between my table and yours that I'm unaware of?
If you want to, you are perfectly free to enjoy your oral carcinogens in the comfort of your own home. Or alternatively outside.

conversely I should have the right to smoke if I choose to do so. I think that when a state, city or country for that matter bans smoking entirely, it infringes on my right to smoke. I will be courteous and not smoke around those who choose not to but I do have rights whether I smoke or not. Non-smokers don't have any more rights than I have as a smoker. There are ways to work around this problem in public without destroying my rights or your rights. This really should go in the general discussion.. I'd like to get the whole boards reaction on this subject.

CSflim · 12-12-2003, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by guccilvr
conversely I should have the right to smoke if I choose to do so. I think that when a state, city or country for that matter bans smoking entirely, it infringes on my right to smoke. I will be courteous and not smoke around those who choose not to but I do have rights whether I smoke or not. Non-smokers don't have any more rights than I have as a smoker. There are ways to work around this problem in public without destroying my rights or your rights. This really should go in the general discussion.. I'd like to get the whole boards reaction on this subject.

You DO have the right to smoke.
I have the right NOT to smoke (directly or indirectly).

There is a way of working around it:
YOU smoke in YOUR house where I'm not around.

Glory's Sun · 12-12-2003, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CSflim
You DO have the right to smoke.
I have the right NOT to smoke (directly or indirectly).

There is a way of working around it:
YOU smoke in YOUR house where I'm not around.

so you're basically saying that I don't have a right to being out in public or in nature and smoking because you have the foremost right of being there? That is ignorant. That would be like me saying I was here first so you leave until I'm done smoking..

CSflim · 12-12-2003, 02:30 PM

You can smoke in public. Just not in confined spaces. (i.e. indoors)

when you smoke in confined spaces...so do I.

Perhaps I enjoy rolling around in mud. Disgusting, I know, but hey I enjoy it. I have the right to do it in my own home.
Do I have the right to bring a tank of mud into a restaurant and start splashing it around, covering the other patrons, who may not enjoy it? No! Of course I don't!

Halx · 12-12-2003, 02:47 PM

moved to general upon request

DerBlitzkrieger · 12-12-2003, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CSflim
You can smoke in public. Just not in confined spaces. (i.e. indoors)

when you smoke in confined spaces...so do I.

Perhaps I enjoy rolling around in mud. Disgusting, I know, but hey I enjoy it. I have the right to do it in my own home.
Do I have the right to bring a tank of mud into a restaurant and start splashing it around, covering the other patrons, who may not enjoy it? No! Of course I don't!

is there something compelling you to go out? you arent FORCED to sit in my second hand smoke when you go to a restaurant, you are there by choice. if you dont like it leave.

what it comes down to is that you are infringing on a business owners right to make their own rules in their own establishment. if he wants people to smoke in his place of business, its his right to allow that, not yours or the state.

World's King · 12-12-2003, 02:52 PM

*Insert Pro-Smoking Comment Here*

timalkin · 12-12-2003, 03:10 PM

I have the right to go about my business without suffering harm from someone else. When you smoke near me, you are causing me harm. If you want to harm yourself, be my guest, but don't do it where you include me.

I also don't want my eardrums damaged from you playing loud music next to me. Do it in your house where I can't hear it.

And for goodness sake, don't run around with those scissors. You might put my eye out.

powder · 12-12-2003, 03:10 PM

word

CandleInTheDark · 12-12-2003, 03:25 PM

People should have the right to ingest, consume, smoke, etc. any number of chemicals and substances in their own home. When those people chose to endanger peoples lives by their consumption of drugs, they secede their rights. Wether by driving intoxicated or second-hand smoke in publically open place, you endanger lives and cause harm.

DerBlitzkrieger · 12-12-2003, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by timalkin
I have the right to go about my business without suffering harm from someone else. When you smoke near me, you are causing me harm. If you want to harm yourself, be my guest, but don't do it where you include me.

I also don't want my eardrums damaged from you playing loud music next to me. Do it in your house where I can't hear it.

And for goodness sake, don't run around with those scissors. You might put my eye out.

you also have the right to not go where you know people are smoking.

let me put it another way. your right to not breate in second hand smoke is not more important than my right to smoke. but both are less important than a business owners right to run his establishment the way he wants to.

Cynthetiq · 12-12-2003, 03:41 PM

there are places that I've been to that the smoking section is a seperate part of the restaurant with it's own windows and doors REAL BARRIERS between the smoking and non smoking sections.

Now NYC is nonsmoking, and the people who live above bars and restaurants now hear noise MORE than ever before because people smoke outside on the sidewalk.

BentNotTwisted · 12-12-2003, 03:44 PM

First of all, I don't smoke. I agree with a smoking ban in office buildings because many people who work there can't get away from a co-worker's cigarette smoke, even if they want to. I don't think a non-smoking ordinance should be extended to pubs, bars or restaurants because of the patrons. The patrons can always choose to go to a non-smoking establishment. Smoking bans should be extended to those places because of the employees who work there who can't get away from cigarette smoke and are forced to breathe it just because of their occupation. It's either a no smoking ordinance or let the bar employees wear gas masks!

Holo · 12-12-2003, 03:47 PM

I used to smoke. I understand the want to be able to smoke most anywhere. I haven't smoked in 11 years, but I'll tell you, if I go to a bar I EXPECT smoke to be in the air. I don't go to a bar for my health, and a smoke-free bar/pub just sounds oxymoronic to me. I do dislike it when eating tho. So...

This is my solution: Every establishment like a restaurant or bar has a smoking section with a good partition separating it from the non smoking section. Install smoke handlers in the smoking section to suck up the smoke and clean up the air. It may be a bit costly to implement at firtst, but the restaurants could be given tax breaks or something to offset the costs. It could work and everyone would be happy and free to smoke or not

sixate · 12-12-2003, 03:52 PM

I'm all for people giving themselves cancer and and causing themselves to suffer a horrible painful death. More power to you, but keep that shit out of public places and where people work so people like me aren't poisoned by it. It's easily the most disgusting bad habit on the planet. Smokers are absolutely the most ignorant group of people on the planet because not only do they not care about their own health, they could give a fuck less about anyone else's health too.

Holo · 12-12-2003, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sixate
I'm all for people giving themselves cancer and and causing themselves to suffer a horrible painful death. More power to you, but keep that shit out of public places and where people work so people like me aren't poisoned by it.

I somewhat disagree with this being so poisonous. Unless you're in a small room during an AA meeting where you have some air with your cigarette smoke, I don't think it's as harmful to health as it's hyped. It's one thing at a workplace where you'd be subjected to your boss smoking at the desk across from you all day, but even at public places it's a nasty smell more than a real health risk in short time spans. Most of the food we eat would be impure by the food of olden days due to preservatives and pesticides, etc. I worked at a beer bistro for a while and we used to load the trucks inside the warehouse. Every time one of those trucks started up black soot from the diesel engines would cloud the air above. At the end of the night you have to pick the black boogers out of your nose from all the soot you'd inhale. I think that's a much larger work hazard than a cigarette.

It's easily the most disgusting bad habit on the planet.

I still think eating feces for sexual pleasure beats it

Smokers are absolutely the most ignorant group of people on the planet because not only do they not care about their own health, they could give a fuck less about anyone else's health too.

You could add gas-guzzling higher emission vehicle owners to that list. Or ppl who vote for a football stadium to be built instead of better schools. Let's throw on drunk drivers to be sure. It's not as common you hear anyone dying of secondhand smoke, but you always hear of victims of DUI/DWI, and the secondhand smoker is aware of risks of prolonged exposure that they could remove themselves from that environment. You can't plan to stay away from a drunk driver.

I just worry when someone calls to ban things...I think of what they'll want to ban next. I have a cellphone, and I vote to jam them in hospitals, restaurant, and theatres. You still have the choice to use one outside if you need to without infringing on someone's entertainment/meal that they paid to see/eat.I dislike the smell of cigs and don't want them around when I eat but it's up to the establishment to serve ALL of their customer's needs, not to exclude one group because it's suddenly PC to do so.

/me takes off horns and puts away pitchfork.

feelgood · 12-12-2003, 04:33 PM

Words to Ireland. Canada should follow suit. Although, alot of Cities are banning smoking in public place. When I'm in a public place, whether it'll be resturant, movie theater, etc etc I want to be able to enjoy myself while staying healthy. If people wants to smoke go ahead and smoke yourself to death, but don't fuckin do it around me while I'm indoor. Why? Because I choose to be free of second hand smoke disease. When there used to be resturant that had both smoking and non-smoking section, the whole fuckin place is a smoking section. Simply because smoke can spread easily as air can. I can choose to go to a smoking bar simply because I don't care but I do care if I'm trying to relax while watching movie or eating.

If you smokers can't handle the fact that you're being banned from smoking in public buildings such as theaters, resutrants, bars etc then you should seriously step back and take a look at the effects that your addiction is having on other people cuz otherwise you're really inconsidertive (sp).

DerBlitzkrieger · 12-12-2003, 05:00 PM

Does someone allergic to peanuts have the 'right' to go into any cookie/donut/coffee store and insist they don't use peanuts or peanut oil or other nuts in their products? Should we ban peanut cookies to establish this right? Bear in mind that this person is much more likely to be harmed by an accidentally ingested peanut than is your average nonsmoker who walks by a lit cigarette in a bar.

JStrider · 12-12-2003, 05:01 PM

well after living in california where theres no smoking.... and then coming to TX for school... i have to say i like the no smoking at all much better then the smoking/nonsmoking...

josh_s08 · 12-12-2003, 05:14 PM

This is a huge rage in a lot of towns in ohio. well, at least around here. I think it is worthless, but i dont smoke, but still, if you do, you should be able to.

Xell101 · 12-12-2003, 05:57 PM

It isn't the government's restaurant, store, place of employment, etc.

There are much bigger evils of society to smite, but undoing something that has been integrated into society generally takes a while.

Mephisto2 · 12-12-2003, 06:35 PM

I can't believe the reactions this has caused.

First of all let me state my position.

I'm Irish.
I smoke.
I SUPPORT the ban on smoking in restaurants and bars.

Smoking has been PROVEN to cause cancer. Passive smoking is also carcinogenic.

Therefore you do not have the right to smoke in a place where your smoking can and does seriously affect the health of others. Be courteous and simply step outside. Smoke all you want there. Be polite. Be considerate.

Don't be an ass and sprout nonesense about your rights.
Your rights END where someone else's rights START.

As you can see, even though I'm an addicted smoker, I feel very strongly about this. And for the record, the majority of people in Ireland (and the majority of smokers) support the government's stance on this.

So please keep your American "the Government has no right to tell me what to do" attitude where it belongs; in America.

Mr Mephisto

feelgood · 12-12-2003, 06:46 PM

*applause Mr Mephisto* Well worded old friend

DerBlitzkrieger · 12-12-2003, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr Mephisto
Passive smoking is also carcinogenic.

it is? could have fooled me!

http://193.78.190.200/43/1057.pdf

"The results do not support a causal relation between environmental tobacco smoke and tobacco related mortality, although they do not rule out a small effect. The association between exposure to environmental tobacco smoke and coronary heart disease and lung cancer may be considerably weaker than generally believed."

sixate · 12-12-2003, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Holo
I still think eating feces for sexual pleasure beats it

I don't. I respect shit eaters waaaay more than smokers... Shit eaters are at least smart enough to do it in the privacy of their own home behind closed doors to make sure they don't disgust anyone. They make sure that nobody else is affected by it. Smokers don't! I respect every shit eater on the face of the planet 1000x more than any smoker.

The topic is smoking, not any of the other things you listed. For the record, I'd support alcohol becoming illegal also.

Holo · 12-12-2003, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sixate
I don't. I respect shit eaters waaaay more than smokers... Shit eaters are at least smart enough to do it in the privacy of their own home behind closed doors to make sure they don't disgust anyone. They make sure that nobody else is affected by it. Smokers don't! I respect every shit eater on the face of the planet 1000x more than any smoker.

I guess that's one way to look at it...

The topic is smoking, not any of the other things you listed. For the record, I'd support alcohol becoming illegal also.

I bring up the others not to derail the topic but to show there are much worse social ills than smoking. I think your blanket condemnation of smokers is a bit extreme and was making the point there are individuals that are causing more social ills by dumping more exhaust into the air than a smoker does. I'm just tired of ban this ban that...we have to accept there are ppl different from each of us and their world may include smoking. I agree non-smokers should have pure air in eating areas as well as smokers having their areas to eat with air cleaners to absorb the smoke so it doesn't waft over. In open air public I wholly disagree.

I was a smoker over a decade ago, and I'm damn glad I quit for a number of reasons. If I was a smoker today I would support bans in eating areas. I disagree with it at bars...I mean hey you're there for the atmosphere, and part of a bar's atmosphere has always been smoky air. A bar is NOT a healthy place to be, and it shouldn't be homogenized with smoking bans. You don't like smoke, go to a non-smoking bar.I'm sure many major cities have one or soon will in light of all the bans.

I think this whole crusade of hating smokers is a bit hypocritical. There's been evidence of damage to health for decades, and only now 5 years after proof was found is there a major backlash. Cigarettes got popular because society glamorized it. I know I started smoking at 14 to look and feel more adult, and many many others did the same. It's our fault as a society this was been adopted, and like a poster above said we can't expect an overnight turnover. Till then don't punish smokers who are currently smoking, either by choice or inability to kick the addiction. Addiction is much like suicide; unless you're in the person's head or have been in a similar state you really can't make an informed judgment of what they go through.

That's why I oppose condemnation of all smokers...sure some use the world as their ashtray and are inconsiderate. Some smokers are good ppl caught in an addiction they can't beat. Because they engage in a newly unacceptable practice doesn't mean they are implicitly bad. Hitler was a vegetarian...does he get points for eating healthy?

tritium · 12-12-2003, 07:38 PM

I've stopped and started smoking again 3 times now and I blame it on having smokers around me all the time.

splck · 12-12-2003, 08:34 PM

Mr Mephisto has it right.

Smoke all you want in private, but keep your filth away from me and mine when I'm in public.

*splck welcomes Ireland to the 21 century*

Destrox · 12-12-2003, 08:58 PM

As said many times earlier, smoke all you want in private or non public places.

Smoking is a choice on your own part, if you have troubles with the fact that others around you in public places dissaprove to damn bad.

Others dont have a choice to stop breathing when you walk by, or smoke nearby. My father had a genetical form of alpha one anitripson (spelling may be off) its prettymuch 100% the same thing smokers get for lung disease. If you would have seen how even a slightest wiff of smoke in a public place would take some of his breath away you'd see where I'm comming from.

You think us non-smokers are ignorent to your rights? Get a god damn reality check, you smokers that poke your "rights" saying you can smoke anywhere you want are far more ignorent then we are.

Smoking is not a priveledge that comes with rights, it comes with rules. Rules of courtesy to others around you since you apprently dont give a rats ass about your own health.

I feel a lot better now that I said that.

hobo · 12-12-2003, 09:49 PM

Smoking should be about as legal as cocaine. Really, is it so hard to accept that a government would want to ban a poisonous substance from public places so that people who do not want to inhale toxins do not have to?

Mephisto2 · 12-12-2003, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by splck
*splck welcomes Ireland to the 21 century*

Erm...

What's that supposed to mean? I hope you're being sarcastic...

:-)

Mr Mephisto

splck · 12-12-2003, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr Mephisto
Erm...

What's that supposed to mean? I hope you're being sarcastic...

:-)

Mr Mephisto

Totally sarcastic dude...

homerhop · 12-13-2003, 02:11 AM

This was brought into effect mostly for the people working in these places.They have the right to work in a safe environment.
As for smoking where there is food or people trying to eat, it should have been banned years ago.

CSflim · 12-13-2003, 02:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DerBlitzkrieger
Does someone allergic to peanuts have the 'right' to go into any cookie/donut/coffee store and insist they don't use peanuts or peanut oil or other nuts in their products? Should we ban peanut cookies to establish this right?

No. But by walking in to such a shop, you won't find people leapping on him, trying to force feed him peanuts now will you?

wflol · 12-13-2003, 03:42 AM

smoking is bad mmmkay

sixate · 12-13-2003, 04:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Holo
I think this whole crusade of hating smokers is a bit hypocritical. There's been evidence of damage to health for decades, and only now 5 years after proof was found is there a major backlash. Cigarettes got popular because society glamorized it. I know I started smoking at 14 to look and feel more adult, and many many others did the same. It's our fault as a society this was been adopted, and like a poster above said we can't expect an overnight turnover. Till then don't punish smokers who are currently smoking, either by choice or inability to kick the addiction. Addiction is much like suicide; unless you're in the person's head or have been in a similar state you really can't make an informed judgment of what they go through.

All I'll say is I'll never feel sorry for anyone with an addiction. All addictions happen by choice. People choose to do the shit. That includes cigs, drugs, ancohol, and so on. Mind over matter, and my mind is more powerful that any drug. If you must know, I'm very judgemental when it comes to stuff like this. I see it as a weakness, and I won't ever be a part of it.

BTW, I don't go to bars. When my friends go out to places like that I choose to stay home or do something else. I hate the smell of cigs and don't want the shit near me. I don't drink, so why would I go to a bar? I'm not a weak dumbass who needs to hang out in crowds to feel like I belong like 90% of the rest of the sheep/population.

smooth · 12-13-2003, 05:25 AM

Wow, Sixate. Guess I should dialog out here with you instead of in the politics board, cuz I agree with everything you posted so far

Good point, CSflim.

I can't even believe someone would pull some report without any context and declare no link between second hand smoke and exposure to carcinogens.

That position baffles me; the next thing you'll do is deny the fact that smoking causes cancer. I mean, at least you have a filter in front of your mouth!

/ex-smoker, 5 yrs and ticking

Glory's Sun · 12-13-2003, 09:57 AM

I could agree to the fact that smoking is a nuisance to those who choose not to smoke, however, when you ban smoking COMPLETELY even in bars and such then you are stepping on one groups toes to make another group happy. I go to a bar to drink and hang out with friends because that's what we enjoy. I don't go to conform or try to fit it with the "90% of the sheep/population" A bar is not a healthy place. So why shouldn't I be able to smoke? We've had prohibition and I still believe that alcohol is a drug that needs more attention. Those laws have obviously changed. All I'm saying is that there are better ways to solve this than, "I have a right not to smell it" or "that shit is nasty" If the government really wanted to do something about it they could actually benefit from some of Holo's idea's. I wouldn't be surprised if you actually saw smoking only restaraunts and non-smoking only. That would kinda suck. I think the fans/ real barriers would work wonders and it would help appease both sides.

12-12-2003, 10:56 AM	#1 (permalink)
matthew330 Banned	Ireland to ban smoking Perhaps could have gone in the politics page, but what in the world....total nonsense http://www.sunspot.net/news/nationwo...home-headlines

12-12-2003, 01:23 PM	#2 (permalink)
CSflim Sky Piercer Location: Ireland	Why the fuck is it nonsense!? I have the right to go into a restaurant/workplace canteen/pub/whatever without being forced to poison myself from YOUR second hand smoke. Non-smoking section? Give me a break! Is there some kind of invisible barrier in between my table and yours that I'm unaware of? If you want to, you are perfectly free to enjoy your oral carcinogens in the comfort of your own home. Or alternatively outside. __________________

12-12-2003, 02:30 PM	#6 (permalink)
CSflim Sky Piercer Location: Ireland	You can smoke in public. Just not in confined spaces. (i.e. indoors) when you smoke in confined spaces...so do I. Perhaps I enjoy rolling around in mud. Disgusting, I know, but hey I enjoy it. I have the right to do it in my own home. Do I have the right to bring a tank of mud into a restaurant and start splashing it around, covering the other patrons, who may not enjoy it? No! Of course I don't! __________________

12-12-2003, 02:47 PM	#7 (permalink)
Halx Please touch this. Owner/Admin Location: Manhattan	moved to general upon request __________________ You have found this post informative. -The Administrator [Don't Feed The Animals]

12-12-2003, 02:52 PM	#9 (permalink)
World's King Here Location: Denver City Denver	Insert Pro-Smoking Comment Here __________________ heavy is the head that wears the crown

12-12-2003, 03:10 PM	#10 (permalink)
timalkin Addict Location: watching from the treeline	I have the right to go about my business without suffering harm from someone else. When you smoke near me, you are causing me harm. If you want to harm yourself, be my guest, but don't do it where you include me. I also don't want my eardrums damaged from you playing loud music next to me. Do it in your house where I can't hear it. And for goodness sake, don't run around with those scissors. You might put my eye out.

12-12-2003, 03:10 PM	#11 (permalink)
powder Loser Location: ski town	word

12-12-2003, 03:25 PM	#12 (permalink)
CandleInTheDark Addict Location: Where the music's loudest	People should have the right to ingest, consume, smoke, etc. any number of chemicals and substances in their own home. When those people chose to endanger peoples lives by their consumption of drugs, they secede their rights. Wether by driving intoxicated or second-hand smoke in publically open place, you endanger lives and cause harm. __________________ Where there is doubt there is freedom.

12-12-2003, 03:41 PM	#14 (permalink)
Cynthetiq Tilted Cat Head Administrator Location: Manhattan, NY	there are places that I've been to that the smoking section is a seperate part of the restaurant with it's own windows and doors REAL BARRIERS between the smoking and non smoking sections. Now NYC is nonsmoking, and the people who live above bars and restaurants now hear noise MORE than ever before because people smoke outside on the sidewalk. __________________ I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. What's the best nation in the world? DO-NATION!

12-12-2003, 03:44 PM	#15 (permalink)
BentNotTwisted Optimistic Skeptic Location: Midway between a Beehive and Centennial	First of all, I don't smoke. I agree with a smoking ban in office buildings because many people who work there can't get away from a co-worker's cigarette smoke, even if they want to. I don't think a non-smoking ordinance should be extended to pubs, bars or restaurants because of the patrons. The patrons can always choose to go to a non-smoking establishment. Smoking bans should be extended to those places because of the employees who work there who can't get away from cigarette smoke and are forced to breathe it just because of their occupation. It's either a no smoking ordinance or let the bar employees wear gas masks!

12-12-2003, 03:47 PM	#16 (permalink)
Holo A Real American	I used to smoke. I understand the want to be able to smoke most anywhere. I haven't smoked in 11 years, but I'll tell you, if I go to a bar I EXPECT smoke to be in the air. I don't go to a bar for my health, and a smoke-free bar/pub just sounds oxymoronic to me. I do dislike it when eating tho. So... This is my solution: Every establishment like a restaurant or bar has a smoking section with a good partition separating it from the non smoking section. Install smoke handlers in the smoking section to suck up the smoke and clean up the air. It may be a bit costly to implement at firtst, but the restaurants could be given tax breaks or something to offset the costs. It could work and everyone would be happy and free to smoke or not __________________ I happen to like the words "fuck", "cock", "pussy", "tits", "cunt", "twat", "shit" and even "bitch". As long as I am not using them to describe you, don't go telling me whether or not I can/should use them...that is, if you want me to continue refraining from using them to describe you. ~Prince

12-12-2003, 03:52 PM	#17 (permalink)
sixate Registered User Location: Somewhere in Ohio	I'm all for people giving themselves cancer and and causing themselves to suffer a horrible painful death. More power to you, but keep that shit out of public places and where people work so people like me aren't poisoned by it. It's easily the most disgusting bad habit on the planet. Smokers are absolutely the most ignorant group of people on the planet because not only do they not care about their own health, they could give a fuck less about anyone else's health too.

12-12-2003, 04:33 PM	#19 (permalink)
feelgood Free Mars! Location: I dunno, there's white people around me saying "eh" all the time	Words to Ireland. Canada should follow suit. Although, alot of Cities are banning smoking in public place. When I'm in a public place, whether it'll be resturant, movie theater, etc etc I want to be able to enjoy myself while staying healthy. If people wants to smoke go ahead and smoke yourself to death, but don't fuckin do it around me while I'm indoor. Why? Because I choose to be free of second hand smoke disease. When there used to be resturant that had both smoking and non-smoking section, the whole fuckin place is a smoking section. Simply because smoke can spread easily as air can. I can choose to go to a smoking bar simply because I don't care but I do care if I'm trying to relax while watching movie or eating. If you smokers can't handle the fact that you're being banned from smoking in public buildings such as theaters, resutrants, bars etc then you should seriously step back and take a look at the effects that your addiction is having on other people cuz otherwise you're really inconsidertive (sp). __________________ Looking out the window, that's an act of war. Staring at my shoes, that's an act of war. Committing an act of war? Oh you better believe that's an act of war

12-12-2003, 05:00 PM	#20 (permalink)
DerBlitzkrieger Tilted Location: under the bridge	Does someone allergic to peanuts have the 'right' to go into any cookie/donut/coffee store and insist they don't use peanuts or peanut oil or other nuts in their products? Should we ban peanut cookies to establish this right? Bear in mind that this person is much more likely to be harmed by an accidentally ingested peanut than is your average nonsmoker who walks by a lit cigarette in a bar. __________________ 300,000 Kilometers per second: It's not just a good idea. Its the law.

12-12-2003, 05:01 PM	#21 (permalink)
JStrider Poo-tee-weet? Location: The Woodlands, TX	well after living in california where theres no smoking.... and then coming to TX for school... i have to say i like the no smoking at all much better then the smoking/nonsmoking... __________________ -=JStrider=- ~Clatto Verata Nicto

12-12-2003, 05:14 PM	#22 (permalink)
josh_s08 Insane	This is a huge rage in a lot of towns in ohio. well, at least around here. I think it is worthless, but i dont smoke, but still, if you do, you should be able to.

12-12-2003, 05:57 PM	#23 (permalink)
Xell101 Junkie	It isn't the government's restaurant, store, place of employment, etc. There are much bigger evils of society to smite, but undoing something that has been integrated into society generally takes a while.

12-12-2003, 06:35 PM	#24 (permalink)
Mephisto2 Junkie	I can't believe the reactions this has caused. First of all let me state my position. I'm Irish. I smoke. I SUPPORT the ban on smoking in restaurants and bars. Smoking has been PROVEN to cause cancer. Passive smoking is also carcinogenic. Therefore you do not have the right to smoke in a place where your smoking can and does seriously affect the health of others. Be courteous and simply step outside. Smoke all you want there. Be polite. Be considerate. Don't be an ass and sprout nonesense about your rights. Your rights END where someone else's rights START. As you can see, even though I'm an addicted smoker, I feel very strongly about this. And for the record, the majority of people in Ireland (and the majority of smokers) support the government's stance on this. So please keep your American "the Government has no right to tell me what to do" attitude where it belongs; in America. Mr Mephisto

12-12-2003, 06:46 PM	#25 (permalink)
feelgood Free Mars! Location: I dunno, there's white people around me saying "eh" all the time	applause Mr Mephisto Well worded old friend __________________ Looking out the window, that's an act of war. Staring at my shoes, that's an act of war. Committing an act of war? Oh you better believe that's an act of war

12-12-2003, 07:38 PM	#29 (permalink)
tritium Professor of Drinkology	I've stopped and started smoking again 3 times now and I blame it on having smokers around me all the time. __________________ Blah.

12-12-2003, 08:34 PM	#30 (permalink)
splck it's jam Location: Lowerainland BC	Mr Mephisto has it right. Smoke all you want in private, but keep your filth away from me and mine when I'm in public. splck welcomes Ireland to the 21 century __________________ nice line eh?

12-12-2003, 08:58 PM	#31 (permalink)
Destrox Metal and Rock 4 Life Location: Phoenix	As said many times earlier, smoke all you want in private or non public places. Smoking is a choice on your own part, if you have troubles with the fact that others around you in public places dissaprove to damn bad. Others dont have a choice to stop breathing when you walk by, or smoke nearby. My father had a genetical form of alpha one anitripson (spelling may be off) its prettymuch 100% the same thing smokers get for lung disease. If you would have seen how even a slightest wiff of smoke in a public place would take some of his breath away you'd see where I'm comming from. You think us non-smokers are ignorent to your rights? Get a god damn reality check, you smokers that poke your "rights" saying you can smoke anywhere you want are far more ignorent then we are. Smoking is not a priveledge that comes with rights, it comes with rules. Rules of courtesy to others around you since you apprently dont give a rats ass about your own health. I feel a lot better now that I said that. __________________ You bore me.... next.

12-12-2003, 09:49 PM	#32 (permalink)
hobo Archangel of Change	Smoking should be about as legal as cocaine. Really, is it so hard to accept that a government would want to ban a poisonous substance from public places so that people who do not want to inhale toxins do not have to?

12-13-2003, 02:11 AM	#35 (permalink)
homerhop Insane Location: ÉIRE	This was brought into effect mostly for the people working in these places.They have the right to work in a safe environment. As for smoking where there is food or people trying to eat, it should have been banned years ago. __________________ its evolution baby

12-13-2003, 03:42 AM	#37 (permalink)
wflol Tilted	smoking is bad mmmkay

12-13-2003, 05:25 AM	#39 (permalink)
smooth Junkie Location: Right here	Wow, Sixate. Guess I should dialog out here with you instead of in the politics board, cuz I agree with everything you posted so far Good point, CSflim. I can't even believe someone would pull some report without any context and declare no link between second hand smoke and exposure to carcinogens. That position baffles me; the next thing you'll do is deny the fact that smoking causes cancer. I mean, at least you have a filter in front of your mouth! /ex-smoker, 5 yrs and ticking __________________ "The theory of a free press is that truth will emerge from free discussion, not that it will be presented perfectly and instantly in any one account." -- Walter Lippmann "You measure democracy by the freedom it gives its dissidents, not the freedom it gives its assimilated conformists." -- Abbie Hoffman

12-13-2003, 09:57 AM	#40 (permalink)
Glory's Sun Registered User	I could agree to the fact that smoking is a nuisance to those who choose not to smoke, however, when you ban smoking COMPLETELY even in bars and such then you are stepping on one groups toes to make another group happy. I go to a bar to drink and hang out with friends because that's what we enjoy. I don't go to conform or try to fit it with the "90% of the sheep/population" A bar is not a healthy place. So why shouldn't I be able to smoke? We've had prohibition and I still believe that alcohol is a drug that needs more attention. Those laws have obviously changed. All I'm saying is that there are better ways to solve this than, "I have a right not to smell it" or "that shit is nasty" If the government really wanted to do something about it they could actually benefit from some of Holo's idea's. I wouldn't be surprised if you actually saw smoking only restaraunts and non-smoking only. That would kinda suck. I think the fans/ real barriers would work wonders and it would help appease both sides.