Cynthetiq

WTF???? If it's not the responsibility for FTC to regulate how businesses are allowed to contact people then who is responsible for it? I for one am registered to the NY state do not call registry...and I screen all my calls. I'm definitely calling my congressperson and senator. This is just rediculous.

link
Court blocks Do Not Call Registry
Associated Press


A federal judge has ruled that the Federal Trade Commission overstepped its authority in creating the national do-not-call list against telemarketers. The ruling Tuesday came in a lawsuit brought by telemarketers who challenged the list of 50 million people who said they do not want to receive business solicitation calls. The list was to go into effect Oct. 1.

U.S. DISTRICT JUDGE Lee R. West said the main issue in the case was "whether the FTC had the authority to promulgate a national do-not-call registry. The court finds it did not."
House Energy and Commerce Committee Chairman Billy Tauzin, R-La., and Rep. John Dingell, D-Mich., said Wednesday they were confident the ruling would be overturned and believe Congress did give the FTC the necessary authority. "We will continue to monitor the situation and will take whatever legislative action is necessary to ensure consumers can stop intrusive calls from unwanted telemarketers," they said in a joint statement. The House committee authorized the list.

Calls to the FTC were not immediately returned Wednesday.

Direct Marketing Association Inc., one of the plaintiffs, said it was happy with the ruling, even though it "acknowledges the wishes of millions of U.S. consumers who have expressed their preferences not to receive telephone-marketing solicitations -- as evidenced by the millions of phone numbers registered on the FTC list."



The suit was filed by DMA, U.S. Security, Chartered Benefit Services Inc., Global Contact Services Inc. and InfoCision Management Corp.

The telemarketing industry estimates the do-not-call list could cut its business in half, costing it up to $50 billion in sales each year.

More than a dozen states with do-not-call lists planned to add their lists to the national registry this summer, the FTC said.

Telemarketers would have to check the list every three months to see who doesn't want to be called. Those who call listed people could be fined up to $11,000 for each violation.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

Thraeryn

I don't think it's government's place to regulate business that way. Short of the property destruction of throwing a brick with a note through a potential customer's window, or plastering handbills to a potential customer's car, government shouldn't really step in. I have worked for telemarketers before, and the phone numbers don't appear out of thin air. I also don't purchase any goods or services from ANY marketer who uses telephone marketing.

And if all of us would take that stance, the calls would end.

G_Lock

OMYG this is such bull shit. I cannot believe that a court would block it. I am already signed up on my state's do not call list, and most of the telemarketers stopped. But I was looking forward to the national list. I think this is rediculus. First off, I have now started getting one or two calls every so often from a telemarketer on MY CELL PHONE! You would think that with all the things going on, they would allow something like this, but I guess not. Man if they can't allow telemarketers to be stopped, how are they EVER going to try to do anything about e-mail SPAM. I hope this gets appealed, if it can.

G_Lock

meepa

It's not a ban on telemarketing, it's an avenue for people who do not want to be solicited to have their wishes respected. The government isn't forcing people to sign up, so I don't see where any argument is for this. I hope it gets overturned.

G_Lock

I understand your point. But if they want to sign up, they should be allowed. And more importantly how about the fact that telemarketers are now calling people's cell phones. I mean calling a person on their land line is one thing, but making someone use thier cell phone is ridiculus. I mean so many people out there are short on air time minutes as it is, and now they have to waste one when they answer the phone and it is a recording, I mean come on. I seriously hope they at least ban telemarketers from calling a person's cell phone.

G_Lock

Cynthetiq

with number portability it will become harder to tell who's a cell and who's a land line...

and I CHOOSE to NOT BE CALLED. Which isn't much of a regulation but ... Thrae... no regulation at all? So then companies should be allowed to pollute, scam, cheat, and lie in order to do business ala Enron, MCI, TYCO?

If there are no rules to follow, then what conscience does the corporate body have to follow? remember a corporate body has all the rights as a human body does...

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

Charlatan

This is the problem with the Libertarian point of view... there is a need for regualtion... Crooked businesses have proven this time and again.

__________________
"My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars."
- Old Man Luedecke

tj2001cobra

I do not understand why people think that they shold have the right to call me on a phone line that I am paying for. Whether it be a land-line or a cell phone, I have to pay for these things. If I wanted to be called, that is one thing. I do not want to buy a fucking vacuum cleaner over the phone and I dont have any siding on my house that needs to be replaced.

Maybe we should start a class action suit suing telemarketers for wasting our time. I am sure that we could come up with a dollar value per minute.

Thraeryn

Don't give me that "dollar value" crap. People aren't willing to take surveys when there is a guaranteed cash outcome.

And I'm not talking about not having regulations for businesses. People who soil the environment should be breaking the law and should be punished. People who are swindling other people out of their money are breaking the law and should be punished. People who are calling a number that they got from a card you filled out, to try and promote a product or offer you a service, should not be breaking the law.

REDDAWN

I hate how telemarketers lie when I ask if it's important...

so every time they call i go, "You know, time is money. And since time is money, unless you pay me 20 bucks a minute im gonna have to hang up"

But what I really hate is when they call back. It's so stupid, they bitch at you because you hung up. I don't know who they are, I don't think ill ever meet them so why the hell do they call back? Do they think ILL CARE?!

MacGnG

damn those bastards!

since the list hasnt even taken effect yet we'll see when it starts....

until then... tazer the phone when they call

G_Lock

Man I have been seeing this article on all sorts of boards over the internet. In fact one of these boards had this Judge's Home Phone #, Court House number, and all his secretary's numbers posted so people could call in and complain. This is definately making a LOT of people VERY angry. I just hope the FTC continues to fight.

G_Lock

Cynthetiq

I do not fill out those cards. I never fill them out and yet they still call me. I just moved. I will not fill out new ones... and yet they will still call me. The NYTimes has called me many times. I tell the TM guy that I'm reading it for free online, why am I going to pay for it? They hang up at that point.

If I gave it to be called, sure, but I don't. I don't ask to be spammed, why should I have to delete all that crap from my inbox? I don't ask for it in my mailbox and yet I still get mail addressed to RESIDENT. I don't want it. It's a waste to resources and time.

I should be allowed to OPT out somehow someway. Just like if I filled out that blasted card you claim I did.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

punx1325

I know that telemarketers are just trying to do their job...but damn when they call every hour it gets really old. I don't mind non-profit organizations like DARE, make-a-wish, MADD, etc... because that is how they survive. But I screen all my calls because I really don't want a new long distance plan. Just think when they resort to calling our cell phones.....

__________________
If something seems too good to be true, then it probably is....

rockogre

It just had to be an OKLAHOMA judge that did this, fuckin moron.

The news quoted 50 Million people on the list. To me this is the same as 50 Million people voting that this is the will of the people. 50 Million of us don't want to be called in our homes, on our equipment, on phone service that WE pay for.

If I filled out a card requesting more information about something I would expect to be called. I NEVER fill that crap out just like I never use my real e-mail address to log into assorted crap on the net. Telemarketers responding to actual requests for information are not the scum calling me about every piece of cheap crap they can come up with.

I smell money changing hands somewhere and a foul smell to this whole debacle.

I bet that the judge won't accept unwanted calls from YOU!

__________________
Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you,
Jesus Christ and the American G. I.
One died for your soul, the other for your freedom

Dano069

We signed up too. Too bad.

My favorite quote from some telemarketing rep was, "We don't want to call people who don't want to hear from us."

Hmm, then why block the legislation?

When we got privacy manager, our telemarketing calls dropped by 95% And yes, I'm willing to pay the monthly fee to get some peace.

__________________
I may look attentive, but I'm taking peeks down your blouse faster than the human eye can follow.

Redlemon

Guess what? That exemption exists in the (on hold) law. It is the "buisness relationship" portion.

I'm thankful that I live in a state that already has a DNC list, and it works amazingly well. Today's paper said that the state law will still stand, even if the federal one goes down.

Sapper

I am shocked. This ALLOWS businesses to HARASS private citizens. I for one am TOTALLY against the court's rulings.

__________________
rm -f /bin/laden

Bill O'Rights

Whew!!

__________________
"I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires." - Susan B. Anthony

"Hedonism with rules isn't hedonism at all, it's the Republican party." - JumpinJesus

It is indisputable that true beauty lies within...but a nice rack sure doesn't hurt.

bender

Just a question here why is it that telemarketers are perhaps having the ability to earn a living taken away from them ?

I know that they're a pain in the ass but I would rather take a call and say no thanks, then to have to pay more in taxes to support more unemployed people.

If you have someone making five bucks an hour they are still paying taxes and being a productive member of your community that helps.

Cynthetiq

well then... gimme your phone number.. i'll tell them to call you... and... RETOOL THE WORKERS, give them new skills.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

bender

I really don't think that many people would choose getting hung up on as a career, lol
but hey to each there own.

CyN1caL

I was really ticked when I heard about this. I signed up for that list a good while ago and was pretty excited when September rolled around, hoping the calls would finally end.

Especially recently this happened:

A telemarker calls, and I tell them I'm not interested.

I hang up and all is good.

Phone rings a couple seconds later, no answer.

Phone from then on, rings once and stops, and it goes on for almost TEN MINUTES!

I x69 the number, and low and behold, it's the telemarker. I SCREAM at him, and he tells me it was a computer problem, and it should be fixed now.


Ugh, I don't want them calling me. Anyone have any clever things to say to telemarkers that don't get the idea that you aren't interested?

Melllvar

I agree, the whole blocking is fishy. Last night on the news, a person in the telemarketing industry was whining how it'll hurt business and ruin the economy. Whatever. Luckly, I haven't been pestered with calls and most cases it's a non-profit org., which doesn't bother me. The thing that gets me, is why they make bills to benefit us, then retract them. What's the point then?

__________________
"They shoot without shame
In the name of a piece of dirt
For a change of accent
Or the colour of your shirt
Better the pride that resides
In a citizen of the world
Than the pride that divides
When a colorful rag is unfurled"

-Neil Peart

Holo

I'm all for anything that will get spam off my phone. It's naive to say " don't sign up for antying" since the previous owner of my phone # signed up for literally EVERYTHING. We get the recordings too so we can't bitch to be taken off their call list. MCI called 6 times in one year to sell us long distance after we told them no each time and don't call back. Same with The Times.


We also give stores and other less trustworthy agencies our Disctinctive Ring # so we know not to pick it up. We call it the "Spam Ring". If It weren't for caller ID and distinct ring I would have a lot more aggravation in my life.

__________________
I happen to like the words "fuck", "cock", "pussy", "tits", "cunt", "twat", "shit" and even "bitch". As long as I am not using them to describe you, don't go telling me whether or not I can/should use them...that is, if you want me to continue refraining from using them to describe you. ~Prince

G_Lock

Man, more bad news...

Quote:
Thursday, September 25, 2003 7:16 p.m. ET

DENVER (Reuters) - A second federal judge on Thursday blocked the popular "do not call" program that would declare 50 million telephone numbers off limits for telemarketers, saying it violated constitutional protections for free speech.

News of the judge's decision came less than an hour after Congress overrode another legal hurdle to the Federal Trade Commission-run list thrown up by a federal judge in Oklahoma City early this week.

The latest legal ruling could prove more difficult to overcome as it cannot be remedied in Congress and must be decided in the courts.

U.S. District Judge Edward Nottingham in Denver said, "The Federal Trade Commission has chosen to entangle itself too much in the consumers' decision by manipulating consumer choice and favoring speech by charitable (organizations) over commercial speech."

The FTC's list would prevent telemarketers from calling the phone numbers of those who did not want to hear from them. It would not apply to political or charitable calls.

FTC officials have said in the past that blocking those calls could risk infringing free speech.

The Denver decision came shortly after Congress bolstered the FTC's authority to run the program, answering the Oklahoma City judge's objection.

Well thats just great. What's next. Don't these judges have something better to judge on that this.

G_Lock

grayman

Hate to say I told you so, but these are my comments from June 29th:

__________________
That's right - I'm a guy in a suit eating a Blizzard. F U.

Cynthetiq

it's not free speech if I have to pay for it...

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

Fire

I used to be a telemarketer- and you know what- the whole buisiness is a fucking scam- there is big money in the buying and selling of phone lists- these lists are generated several ways- 1- you fill out a card- maybe as part of a survey, or to win something in a "free drawing" - the original complier can call you, and once they have ruined your dinner a few times, they then sell their lists of #s to another company, and so on -2 you donate to a charity or political action committee- a lot of charities sell donor info- it is quite proffitable- your info is then sold around as in ex.1 - 3 recently companies have sprung up that compile demographics based phone lists- sophistication levels vary, sometimes its as simple as checking the phone book for addresses in affluent or other target areas, and can get quite high tech. 4- you buy a product from a mail order company or online, and the company sells your info to other simmilar companies or on the open market. 5- you move and have the bad luck of getting assigned a # that has been sold to 100000 firms.

Note that all telemarketing is a numbers game- with a cetain list you can predict your revenues fairly well, and then when you are done sell it off to another firm. to avoid becoming desirable to many companies do everything you can to give out as little info as possible on yourself, IF YOU ARE CALLED BY A TELEMARKETER
Don't bother to get pissed at the drone on the phone- 1- ask them the name of the firm they work for. 2 Tell them politely to take you off their calling list- this is something that they must do by FEDERAL LAW and costs the firm big if they violate it as well as cutting into their revenues, as it is one more name they cannot sell. some disreputable firms may break the rules, but for most it is not worth the fines. if the firm calls you back call your states attourney general and bitch up a storm- remember, at this point everyone hates telemarketers, so you will inconvenience them at least as much as you were inconvenienced. while I too gain great satisfaction from screaming at phone jockeys, I post this info to hurt their masters, the true source of this evil

__________________
Thought the harder, Heart the bolder,
Mood the more as our might lessens

The_Dude

This bill just prevents telemarketers from calling you, which leaves a lot of other people from calling you.

i've read somewhere that charities are exempt from this and so the law is not applied equally.

__________________
"Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity." - Darrel K Royal

spectre

Absolutely correct. It's commercial speech, and commercial speech is not protected. It's the reason why companies can't spam fax machines. It's the same reason why I think this law should be passed.

__________________
"Fuck these chains
No goddamn slave
I will be different" ~ Machine Head