Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community - View Single Post - Filtherton... Here's our hijack thread...

Scipio · 01-27-2004, 07:42 PM

I appreciate your efforts to make your point of view more clear. It's always helpful to know just what it is we're disagreeing about. People on both sides of this issue have a personal stake in it, as atheism and religion of any kind are in the most fundamental form of opposition, which is to say that they are 100% mutually exclusive.

But, that's not what we're talking about, is it?

Here are a few of my thoughts on the matter. One, the founders did inherit an intellectual tradition that was largely religious and largely Christian. However, the intellectual movements of the time were inevitably becoming secular. In 1779, Hume's Dialogues Concerning Natural Religion were published. This work had the effect of removing religion from serious philosophy (an effect that has lasted to this day). It is also important to note freedom of religious practice and freedom from a religious government are protected in the constitution. Granted, the Bill of Rights was not in the original constitution, but the wonderful democratic process that went on during the time put them there.

To these men, the world was viewed as a wonderful machine created by God. This idea has its roots in Newton, who produced a theory that explained how things move. There are a couple of points worth making about the religiosity of the founders. One is that many of the founders practiced a form of Christianity called Deism, which basically viewed God as an inventor. He created the world in such a way that it would work perfectly without further intervention, and God was therefore unnecessary in everyday life. This view empowered men to try to understand the world. It was a religious school that worked very hard to accomodate science. Secondly, the mentions and incantations related to God in much of the writing in the time was not meant literally. The "In God we trust" on currency serves a largely ceremonial purpose. This practice is called ceremonial deism. Note here that I'm not talking specifically about your quotes. Ceremonial deism is mostly written.

The thing is, none of our governing documents establish christianity as our religion. Indeed, that is expressly forbidden by the greatest thing those religious men ever wrote. Religion may have been important to them, but they knew that the only just government is one that stays as far away from religion as it can.

01-27-2004, 07:42 PM	#7 (permalink)
Scipio Mencken Location: College	I appreciate your efforts to make your point of view more clear. It's always helpful to know just what it is we're disagreeing about. People on both sides of this issue have a personal stake in it, as atheism and religion of any kind are in the most fundamental form of opposition, which is to say that they are 100% mutually exclusive. But, that's not what we're talking about, is it? Here are a few of my thoughts on the matter. One, the founders did inherit an intellectual tradition that was largely religious and largely Christian. However, the intellectual movements of the time were inevitably becoming secular. In 1779, Hume's Dialogues Concerning Natural Religion were published. This work had the effect of removing religion from serious philosophy (an effect that has lasted to this day). It is also important to note freedom of religious practice and freedom from a religious government are protected in the constitution. Granted, the Bill of Rights was not in the original constitution, but the wonderful democratic process that went on during the time put them there. To these men, the world was viewed as a wonderful machine created by God. This idea has its roots in Newton, who produced a theory that explained how things move. There are a couple of points worth making about the religiosity of the founders. One is that many of the founders practiced a form of Christianity called Deism, which basically viewed God as an inventor. He created the world in such a way that it would work perfectly without further intervention, and God was therefore unnecessary in everyday life. This view empowered men to try to understand the world. It was a religious school that worked very hard to accomodate science. Secondly, the mentions and incantations related to God in much of the writing in the time was not meant literally. The "In God we trust" on currency serves a largely ceremonial purpose. This practice is called ceremonial deism. Note here that I'm not talking specifically about your quotes. Ceremonial deism is mostly written. The thing is, none of our governing documents establish christianity as our religion. Indeed, that is expressly forbidden by the greatest thing those religious men ever wrote. Religion may have been important to them, but they knew that the only just government is one that stays as far away from religion as it can. __________________ "Erections lasting more than 4 hours, though rare, require immediate medical attention."