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Jaron · 07-23-2003, 09:15 AM

Good point, but it's not so much that the religion or the religious have failed me as I've been influenced by it to try other things.

My views were... erm... phrased a bit strongly, yes. I don't hate the religious, but I do hate the religion. It's my personal belief that everyone's entitled to their own views, and if they just don't bullshit around about it then it's totally fine with me. If someone's got something that gives them hope, something to live for, motivation to get up in the morning, even something that acts as their emotional safety net, then more power to them. That is to say, provided that they actually believe what they're talking about and not fucking around.

Honestly, the root of the problem I have with most religious or spiritual individuals that I meet is that they don't really know what they're talking about. I'll admit that I'm an asshole about it and take merciless advantage of them through their ignorance... but hell, whatever. Specifics for the different religions are different, of course.

Take Christianity, for example.

A few of the problems I have with Christianity, especifically (and I'm picking on Christianity because I know more people belonging to that faith than any other):
1) The general segregationism, in that you're either a "believer" or a "nonbeliever"; even within the entirety of the faith, I've seen a large amount of friction between the different communities, even within the same congregation. The general attitude I've come across among Christians is that "if you're not one of us then you're somehow a lesser person."
2) The lack of faith, especially when things get hard to deal with. I've seen so many people realize that they don't actually really believe in what they were professing to believe in: for example, if they're preaching about the whole "adultery" thing and are caught sleeping with their girlfriend or some whore later that day. What I'm talking about is people who don't hold to what they say, and then try to bullshit their way out of it.
3) The blind faith. So many people take things as they see them simply because they were told to by a higher authority. This doesn't just apply to religions. It applies to a good number of people. This type of person will defend a doctrine or a law to their dying breath simply because it is what they are SUPPOSED to believe. Trying to talk to these people is like trying to talk to an animate brick wall, when the brick wall is bleating something along the lines of "That's just the way things are."

However, I've also got alot of respect for the religion as based on the scriptures. Jesus Christ was talking about basically being a nice guy, putting other people before you (and the local deity before that, but hey... I don't agree with everything, eh?). He was preaching acceptance (not conformity), and saying alot of things that're really actually fucking good. (Incidentally, I have about a dozen different English translations, and have read them all.)

However, the problem I have with this is that so much of what's in the actual Bible relies on interpretation. Having gone to a Christian school in Hong Kong (also having dropped out from there), I was placed in the mandatory Bible class. When I wasn't sleeping or eating, I'd argue constantly with the teacher over points of theology, basically to prove one point: Nobody's interpretation is infallible. Interpretation is entirely subjective, and when it's presented as "The Bible Truth," I get exasperated. Especially when you mix that with blind faith...

Again, this doesn't just apply to Christians. I'm using Christianity as an example because it's the religion that I know best. It applies to general spirituality, religion, and philosophy as well.

And hell... one thing that I've always held to is that I'm probably wrong, so tell me why. Especially the Christians. (Honestly, this is me actually really wanting to know how you see it... not just being a jackass.)

07-23-2003, 09:15 AM	#13 (permalink)
Jaron Crazy Location: Hong Kong.	Good point, but it's not so much that the religion or the religious have failed me as I've been influenced by it to try other things. My views were... erm... phrased a bit strongly, yes. I don't hate the religious, but I do hate the religion. It's my personal belief that everyone's entitled to their own views, and if they just don't bullshit around about it then it's totally fine with me. If someone's got something that gives them hope, something to live for, motivation to get up in the morning, even something that acts as their emotional safety net, then more power to them. That is to say, provided that they actually believe what they're talking about and not fucking around. Honestly, the root of the problem I have with most religious or spiritual individuals that I meet is that they don't really know what they're talking about. I'll admit that I'm an asshole about it and take merciless advantage of them through their ignorance... but hell, whatever. Specifics for the different religions are different, of course. Take Christianity, for example. A few of the problems I have with Christianity, especifically (and I'm picking on Christianity because I know more people belonging to that faith than any other): 1) The general segregationism, in that you're either a "believer" or a "nonbeliever"; even within the entirety of the faith, I've seen a large amount of friction between the different communities, even within the same congregation. The general attitude I've come across among Christians is that "if you're not one of us then you're somehow a lesser person." 2) The lack of faith, especially when things get hard to deal with. I've seen so many people realize that they don't actually really believe in what they were professing to believe in: for example, if they're preaching about the whole "adultery" thing and are caught sleeping with their girlfriend or some whore later that day. What I'm talking about is people who don't hold to what they say, and then try to bullshit their way out of it. 3) The blind faith. So many people take things as they see them simply because they were told to by a higher authority. This doesn't just apply to religions. It applies to a good number of people. This type of person will defend a doctrine or a law to their dying breath simply because it is what they are SUPPOSED to believe. Trying to talk to these people is like trying to talk to an animate brick wall, when the brick wall is bleating something along the lines of "That's just the way things are." However, I've also got alot of respect for the religion as based on the scriptures. Jesus Christ was talking about basically being a nice guy, putting other people before you (and the local deity before that, but hey... I don't agree with everything, eh?). He was preaching acceptance (not conformity), and saying alot of things that're really actually fucking good. (Incidentally, I have about a dozen different English translations, and have read them all.) However, the problem I have with this is that so much of what's in the actual Bible relies on interpretation. Having gone to a Christian school in Hong Kong (also having dropped out from there), I was placed in the mandatory Bible class. When I wasn't sleeping or eating, I'd argue constantly with the teacher over points of theology, basically to prove one point: Nobody's interpretation is infallible. Interpretation is entirely subjective, and when it's presented as "The Bible Truth," I get exasperated. Especially when you mix that with blind faith... Again, this doesn't just apply to Christians. I'm using Christianity as an example because it's the religion that I know best. It applies to general spirituality, religion, and philosophy as well. And hell... one thing that I've always held to is that I'm probably wrong, so tell me why. Especially the Christians. (Honestly, this is me actually really wanting to know how you see it... not just being a jackass.)