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Originally Posted by DaveMatrix
All these Drugs were FDA approved and certainly went through the ole double blind.....
Avandia
Ephedra (Ma Huang)
[...snip...]
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I'm certainly not going to start defending the FDA - the problems with said agency are numerous, to say the least. I assume all the drugs you list turned out to have negative side effects, I only recognize a couple of them. The thing is, medical science is what allows us to *discover* the problems with these drugs in the first place. It's interesting to note ephedra on your list, since it's an herbal supplement, *not* a conventional drug! The wikipedia article covers it pretty well:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ephedra
The key problem with the FDA and herbal supplements is that they are *not* required (or allowed, as I understand it) to test them for safety and efficacy, like they do for normal drugs.
Regardless, I'd like to confine this discussion to homeopathy as much as possible, not herbal supplements.
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Originally Posted by DaveMatrix
The FDA gets much of its research funding from the pharmaceutical companys who make billions selling drugs that are improperly tested & unsafe.
They pharmaceutical companys certainly don't wont the public to buy or use homeopathic or herbal cures, they might lose a few $$$$$$.......or you may believe they're just concerned for your safety.....refer to the list of recalled FDA approved drugs........
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The FDA sucks, no doubt about it. I don't place evil conspiracies, or conventional medicine. I blame a poorly run, underfunded FDA, shackled by poor laws, and working much too closely with the industry it's supposed to monitor.
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Originally Posted by DaveMatrix
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This is the Jacques Benveniste study, I believe. James Randi put the smack down on that:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/horizon...meopathy.shtml
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Originally Posted by onesnowyowl
Actually, her doctor had no idea what was going on. She went to several specialists, including a seizure clinic at a major research hospital, in order to figure out what was causing this problem. She was diagnosed with epilepsy in her temporal lobe and put on seizure medication, but it did not clear up the problem. Finally, my father made the connection while watching a Lipitor commercial.
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I'm sorry her doctors weren't able to help, and I'm glad she's doing better. As I said before, there are *lots* of problems with the current medical system. But, the underlying science of evidence-based medicine is sound, and the only way to go.
Alright, so maybe this stuff does work - one study isn't solid proof, but it's a start. However, the substance described does not sound like a homeopathic remedy to me - it's an herbal remedy. "arnica (50 g tincture/100 g, DER 1:20)" means the herb is actually present in the cream used, if I'm not mistaken. Homeopathic remedies are dilute to the point where they generally don't have a single molecule of the original substance.
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Originally Posted by onesnowyowl
As for the homeopathy/herbal thing--a lot of homeopathic remedies are herbal remedies. Some are mineral-based. I'm not saying I use homeopathic remedies to treat bodily humors or some such ridiculous notion (which would be true homeopathy), rather I am using homeopathic medicines that are largely herbal and typically have been empirically shown to have some kind of benefit, such as the arnica gel.
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Ah, here's the rub.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy
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Substances, which in large quantities would cause symptoms similar to the disease, are administered in heavily diluted formulations. According to homeopathic belief, the process of serial dilution, with shaking at each stage of the dilution, removes any negative side-effects of the treatment and retains therapeutic powers, even past the point where no molecules of the original substance are likely to remain.
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*That's* homeopathy. If there's more than a few molecules of the 'stuff' in question, then it's not homeopathy. Homeopathy is essentially magic - based upon things like 'the law of similars'. Most homeopathic preperations are so dilute the it's likey that not a single molecule of the target substance is still present. Not one molecule. Homeopaths claim that the water has some sort of 'memory'. They tend to wax philisophical about metaphysics, and use scientific terms they don't understand, strung together in random ways. Homeopathic treatments in general aren't tested, period. And when they are tested in proper trials, they fail.
To me, it sounds like you're using is an herbal remedy. Herbel preperations have their own host of problems, but I'm trying desperately to stick to homeopathy here. Herbel remedies at least have a chance of having some effect. Homeopathic ones, not so much.
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Originally Posted by onesnowyowl
There are plenty of quacky ideas out there on the homeopathic side of things, including the entire basis of homeopathy--treating bodily humors. However, the remedies themselves should not be dismissed out of hand simply for being homeopathic; rather, they should be taken on a case-by-case basis by the user. Because of the power of the placebo effect, the consumer should have the right to decide what works for them when it comes to homeopathy.
I should note that most of the homeopathic remedies I buy are produced by Boiron USA and Nelsons. Both companies have excellent safety records in regards to their product. So even if they are just sugar pills--they are safe. They are not fly-by-night herbal diet supplement manufacturers. Nelsons has been around since 1860, and Boiron has been around since 1932.
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I don't know anything about the companies in question - but...if they are sugar pills, and someone uses them instead of a real medicine that would save their life, they are not safe.
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Originally Posted by ring
If I am not mistaken, from what I have read and what my mother has told me (she is a retired R.N.) Homeopathy is based on introducing small amounts of any substance into the body that in time will develop an immunity type of response?
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Nope. Most homeopathic preparations are so dilute, that NOT A SINGLE MOLECULE OF THE SUBSTANCE REMAINS. Not one. How does that work, you ask? It doesn't.
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Originally Posted by ring
I can see why people think of this as hocus-pocus, yet how do I explain the fact that I have been drinking 'city water' and have suffered no obvious effects from the poison we all believe it to be?
Way too many variables, in all matters, ya think?
I need data.
All I have seen in any link or article is conjecture.
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Check out the wikipedia article on homeopathy, and the original article I quoted above. A good start, right there. There are, however, lots, and lots, and lots of quack sites with bogus or ridiculous information. Ask yourself 'why should I trust this?' when reading.
Homeopathy is also based upon the theory that a substance that will produce the symptoms, when diluted according to homeopathic technique (again, so much so that probably not a single molecule survives) will cure the symptoms.
So, here's my homeopathic cure for cavities:
Take 2 1/2 tablespoons of sugar, and dissolve it in a gallon of water. Make sure it's really dissolved, then shake it.
Pour out all but 2 1/2 tablespoons of water. This is C1 dilution.
Fill the gallon jug back up. Shake, pour out all but 2 1/2 tablespoons again. Now you're at C2.
Do this 18 more times, and you're at C20. There's probably not one molecute of sugar remaining, yet, according to homeopathic principles, you have an amazing cavity-fighting solution! Drink a glass every day to keep the dentist away.
In fact, the above will probably actually help keep cavities away, if you used flouridated water. :-)