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roachboy · 10-26-2007, 09:03 AM

strange that this is happening in a cartoon thread, aint it?

anyway:
let's see if we can sharpen the stick a little.

if i understand the underlying argument in host's number 22 correctly, it is that the iraq war can be understood as a type of class warfare carried out by a particular fraction of the dominant economic class--the one which is linked together by participation in one or more republican patronage network(s).

so if qui bono is a basic question in assessing the meaning(s) of a given situation...and it is...it follows that the war in iraq is an expression of the class interests of these elements of the republican patronage network, which stand to benefit financially from the ongoing debacle.

it is an important claim.
it is a shame that it was not presented more clearly.

the posts cuts to the core of such arguments as ustwo is making in the thread.

he is implicitly put into a position of having to choose whether to address this claim, and by so doing abandon the premises from which he has been arguing--or finding some way to dismiss the claim--which i assume is the function of the "i dont read cut-and-paste posts" pronouncement made either in this thread or another, i cant remember (and dont really care).

if host is correct, then any claim that the iraq debacle is in or serves any "national interest" is absurd---unless ustwo really does accept that the economic interests of the fraction of the dominant order which is tied together by participation in a republican patronage network and "the national interest" are the same---but that would require an argument, and i dont think ustwo can or will make such an argument--you cant simultaneously hold that an interest is both particular and general without making a detailed presentation of how that might be true.

another way: admitting that there is a class interest being served through the iraq debacle undercuts the illusion of national interest being served by it. it undercuts the idea of national interest tout court.

but that notion is itself an expression of another pathology.

so it's easier to proceed as if this claim was not on the table.
but it is.

10-26-2007, 09:03 AM	#26 (permalink)
roachboy Super Moderator Location: essex ma	strange that this is happening in a cartoon thread, aint it? anyway: let's see if we can sharpen the stick a little. if i understand the underlying argument in host's number 22 correctly, it is that the iraq war can be understood as a type of class warfare carried out by a particular fraction of the dominant economic class--the one which is linked together by participation in one or more republican patronage network(s). so if qui bono is a basic question in assessing the meaning(s) of a given situation...and it is...it follows that the war in iraq is an expression of the class interests of these elements of the republican patronage network, which stand to benefit financially from the ongoing debacle. it is an important claim. it is a shame that it was not presented more clearly. the posts cuts to the core of such arguments as ustwo is making in the thread. he is implicitly put into a position of having to choose whether to address this claim, and by so doing abandon the premises from which he has been arguing--or finding some way to dismiss the claim--which i assume is the function of the "i dont read cut-and-paste posts" pronouncement made either in this thread or another, i cant remember (and dont really care). if host is correct, then any claim that the iraq debacle is in or serves any "national interest" is absurd---unless ustwo really does accept that the economic interests of the fraction of the dominant order which is tied together by participation in a republican patronage network and "the national interest" are the same---but that would require an argument, and i dont think ustwo can or will make such an argument--you cant simultaneously hold that an interest is both particular and general without making a detailed presentation of how that might be true. another way: admitting that there is a class interest being served through the iraq debacle undercuts the illusion of national interest being served by it. it undercuts the idea of national interest tout court. but that notion is itself an expression of another pathology. so it's easier to proceed as if this claim was not on the table. but it is. __________________ a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear it make you sick. -kamau brathwaite Last edited by roachboy; 10-26-2007 at 09:07 AM..