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Supple Cow · 04-15-2007, 12:43 PM

SMeth - I understand what you are saying about that article and I realize what it means that the Economist printed it. My main point is that this discussion is perhaps getting too academic - how much will any given individual's life change based on either (a) the existing institutions making themselves less of a hurdle or (b) that individual accepting and embracing their own responsibility for what they do with what they have? I believe, based on my personal experience, that the latter is far more effective.

On a separate note...

"Personally, I think we have a great responsibility, as slightly privileged or highly privileged people, to put effort towards fixing those structural barriers. As I said, the structural and cultural issues feed off of each other, and these issues are still part of our legacy of slavery."

I'm not sure what to do with this statement, because it sort of sounds like you are saying everyone on this forum (or just those who have responded to this thread) are among those "slightly" or "highly privileged" people. For one thing, I consider myself neither disadvantaged nor privileged. I think that is a slippery slope to say that at some arbitrary point where people have enough 'privilege' (as defined by?), they start owing other people.

The legacy of slavery in the United States is between white and black Americans, but I don't even think that the concept of legacy is useful in any particular way. It's not beneficial to Jews today to hate or fear Germans. Why is it that White = Slaveowner Legacy and German =\= Nazi? Why does slavery need to have a legacy? What distinguishes it from other atrocities of the past? Why isn't this about the Africans (who chose to sell their fellow Africans into slavery) being evil the way we demonize Hitler? (These are just topics I'm using to frame the concept of legacy. I don't want to have a discussion about slavery and the Holocaust and which was worse.)

I don't disagree that it might be 50x harder for a black inner-city kid to achieve some kind of socio-economic fluency, but I don't agree that the institutionalized 'legacy of slavery' is the best place to start.

04-15-2007, 12:43 PM	#21 (permalink)
Supple Cow Americow, the Beautiful Location: Washington, D.C.	SMeth - I understand what you are saying about that article and I realize what it means that the Economist printed it. My main point is that this discussion is perhaps getting too academic - how much will any given individual's life change based on either (a) the existing institutions making themselves less of a hurdle or (b) that individual accepting and embracing their own responsibility for what they do with what they have? I believe, based on my personal experience, that the latter is far more effective. On a separate note... "Personally, I think we have a great responsibility, as slightly privileged or highly privileged people, to put effort towards fixing those structural barriers. As I said, the structural and cultural issues feed off of each other, and these issues are still part of our legacy of slavery." I'm not sure what to do with this statement, because it sort of sounds like you are saying everyone on this forum (or just those who have responded to this thread) are among those "slightly" or "highly privileged" people. For one thing, I consider myself neither disadvantaged nor privileged. I think that is a slippery slope to say that at some arbitrary point where people have enough 'privilege' (as defined by?), they start owing other people. The legacy of slavery in the United States is between white and black Americans, but I don't even think that the concept of legacy is useful in any particular way. It's not beneficial to Jews today to hate or fear Germans. Why is it that White = Slaveowner Legacy and German =\= Nazi? Why does slavery need to have a legacy? What distinguishes it from other atrocities of the past? Why isn't this about the Africans (who chose to sell their fellow Africans into slavery) being evil the way we demonize Hitler? (These are just topics I'm using to frame the concept of legacy. I don't want to have a discussion about slavery and the Holocaust and which was worse.) I don't disagree that it might be 50x harder for a black inner-city kid to achieve some kind of socio-economic fluency, but I don't agree that the institutionalized 'legacy of slavery' is the best place to start. Last edited by Supple Cow; 04-15-2007 at 12:45 PM..