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simivin · 01-01-2006, 06:33 PM

-----Note: I know this is long. Sorry for the length. It's mostly for those of you who followed some of the earlier parts of the story (abaya, liltippler, etc) -----

Well, since I had posted numerous times regarding my relationship, I figured I would post the final events. As you could guess, I broke things off with my GF recently. I'm not looking for advice at this point, really, so I'm not entirely sure what merit there is in posting this -- maybe just because it sucks, because it hurts, I'd like to hear opinions, and so that I (and others, hopefully) could learn a little too. As a quick preface, I understand that this is told from my perspective, but I will still try to be unbiased in the retelling. Here is what happened:

My GF and I had been fighting about my friend Sarah since September -- great friend of mine, had had questions that were never resolved, etc. In November, my GF and I broke up over all this and then got back together to give it another try and to make the most of the holidays to see if we could strengthen things up (see http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?t=97553 for her recounting of those events). Over the month of November, my GF and I did marginally better -- Sarah still came up, often times unprompted, and Thanksgiving was good but still slightly awkward because we were still sensitive.

We had a bit of a row right at the end of Nov, and I was finally saying, "you need to get over this, because it is taking a huge toll on me...and I'm not sure how much more I can take of these fights. Let's leave all this Sarah stuff behind and move on." I had toned down the amount of time I talked with Sarah (not completely, but significantly, because I wanted to try to compromise from my end), and didn't want to give any ultimatums, but we had been revisiting this issue so very often. We started December off much better -- seemingly both committed to getting over our issues. It was one of the best weekends we'd had in a very long time. Sarah came up just briefly the next week, but more in the context that my GF was bothered by thinking about that; we didn't end up fighting, which was nice. As long as we nothing related to Sarah came up, we were doing well -- making it through a nice week and a half before Christmas (she was at my apartment and parents place). At one point two weeks before Christmas, Sarah asked me if I could do her a favor and come to a company dance with her at the end of January. The guy she was seeing on and off was going to be abroad for next semester, and she didn't want to take a random guy to a company event, so asked me. I told her I'd run it by my GF and that it shouldn't be a problem. I wanted to wait for a while, however, because I didn't want to upset my GF before we went to FL for a week after Christmas.

My GF left on Wednesday before Christmas to go to her parents place. Wrote emails back and forth over the next day or so -- usual loving emails. Thursday I got online briefly and talked with Sarah, as I hadn't talked with her for about a week. Since I was in DC (where she lives) and hadn't gotten in touch with her, she gave me grief and then said she had a couple tickets to this by-invitation party or whatever at a bar. Ok, cool. I went with Sarah and had a good time, nothing really exciting really. I crashed at her place on the floor again and went home. My GF tried calling three times that night, once I was on the phone and the other two I missed -- I didn't answer/return the calls because I didn't want her to be upset overnight; I thought that if I called in the morning, it would be water under a bridge and it wouldn't matter so much. Anyway, I went to sleep thinking about my GF, how much I love her, and that I was scared to death of telling her I had hung out with Sarah, even though nothing happened.

So Friday I get back to my folks' place and give my GF a call. It went something like this:
Me: "Hey, good morning!"
Her: "Hey!"
Me: "I got your messages"
Her: "What'd you do last night?"
Me: "I went out"
Her: "With who?"
Me: "Sarah"
at this point, you could almost hear a record scratch to a halt
Me: "How was riding on your dad's harley?"
Her: "Did you call her?"

The conversation degenerated from there. She felt it was sketchy that we had been together for a week and I hadn't mentioned or called Sarah; I hadn't wanted to because I was with my GF and I knew it was a sensitive issue. She felt I was hiding this, when all I had wanted to do was avoid the problems we had had before. I told her I loved her, that Sarah didn't matter anymore...that I had gotten over that since we were doing so much better, etc. I meant everything I said, but nothing was good enough. Then I made the mistake of saying that I couldn't even tell her some things for fear of how she would respond. She asked what, and I told her (being honest) -- one of which was asking her permission to go to the dance-thing with Sarah. My GF ends up telling me "no, absolutely not." I'm not happy, because I tell her I love her, that nothing is going on with Sarah, that she has nothing to worry about. And I meant it all. I ultimately say "fine, I won't." But then she isn't happy because I'm not happy about the decision. Bad conversation all around. We hang up and finish; she leaves a message, however, saying "you're right, you should hang out with whoever you want, she's just another girl, you've never done anything wrong, I'm not happy about it, but you should be able to go."

We talked that night and I thanked her for her message. She asked what my decision was and I said that I'd want to go. Thus began 3 more hours of fighting. She kept asking why I wanted to go -- "because she's a friend, she asked me, and it'd be fun". Nothing more. The next day we fought for about an hour or so in the afternoon. Finally, she called me at 0100 on Christmas. I tried to keep it light, tried to avoid any discussions, and tried to end the conversation on that note. She didn't want to go yet, though. So she ends up saying "I don't want to break up with you, I trust you, and you should be able to do something like this" and I said "true" but my tone struck her wrong, and again, we degenerated into three hours of arguing. Finally, she said "I'm just going to go, this didn't accomplish anything" and I said "[---], I don't think I want to date anymore." We talked for an hour, with her apologizing, saying she trusts me, saying it shouldn't matter, etc. To which I basically replied, we've been doing this for four months, it hurts more and more each time, I felt attacked this time when I didn't do anything wrong whatsoever, I've showed you I love you and made a big effort, and so far nothing really has helped. I've tried to be by your side throughout all this, but until you figure this out, I can't handle it anymore, especially when I'll be moving in a semester and will be halfway across the country. My (now ex) GF tried calling back a few more hours, asking me to reconsider, asking me to consider that it was Christmas, not to ruin her brother's plans (we were supposed to go to Orlando together for her birthday and New Years).

Okay, that was entirely longer than I thought it would be. Again, an awful lot of stuff, so I'm not sure how many people will read this. It all just hurts right now, and has hurt all week, especially around the holidays and especially since we should have been together right now

I've been talking to people all week, to get perspectives and understand this. Sometimes I feel like it was a good decision -- 4 months of fighting definitely took its toll, and the hope I had that we were getting better had been damaged by those two days of fighting. On the other hand, sometimes I feel bad -- maybe she was and we were getting better? Maybe if she had just gotten over Sarah we would have been perfectly fine. Maybe more time would have helped. If I really loved her I would have stayed with her. Etc. I feel like an asshole and I feel guilty for my decision, sometimes, because of those type of thoughts -- and because I didn't forgive her when she asked on Christmas morning, after I told her I didn't want to date anymore.

Again, I'm not really looking for any particular type of response...I'm just kind of throwing this out there since it had been a running thing and some of you might have been interested in the outcome. I've heard opinions that support my side as well as those that support hers -- that this dance was too much, that I should have known better than to ask, that the history with Sarah was too much to get over so fast. I guess it came down to a matter of arguing about different things an not realizing it: I was upset she didn't trust me, she was upset that I wasn't more sensitive. She felt that the history of this issue hadn't changed; I felt that the fights kept hurting more and more. I still feel like she didn't understand what I had been telling her both days -- that Sarah was just a friend, that nothing was going on, that I love her (my GF), that I wasn't out trying to find "someone better" but was trying to make us work. I don't know. All so frustrating, because I really felt I tried to handle things well and had been trying to make my GF feel so much better after all the prior issues only to revert to the same fighting.

So that is that for now, I guess. I don't think there will be any going back on this from either of us, at least not for a while. Some questions I guess I have are just general relationship things for peoples consideration. Do you think that there are limits or thresholds for these types of things even if you love the person? I mean, marriage, maybe not, but dating? How sensitive should you be to these types of issues? Completely submissive? Compromising, ideally, I know...but was I so insensitive to think that I should be able to go with my friend? If you love someone, should you persevere until marriage through all challenges? Should it be acceptable to wonder, periodically, even when you love your SO and when you are focusing on your relationship with them (ie, I wondered about Sarah, but obviously had not done anything about it)? Do these issues generally go away -- is it age or experiences? I guess I at least have learned a lot from both sides of this situation (I've written probably 70 pages of thoughts in a week -- emotional venting and reflection). Maybe others can learn too.

Ok, I will stop there. Thanks for reading if you read it. There's more details, I guess, but that's the basic story of the last month or so. Take it all for whatever it is worth...

Sim

PS: Sarah had called to ask me to lunch over Thanksgiving when my GF was with me, but we (Sarah and I) both thought that would be bad. However, Sarah called back in the morning to suggest that my GF come too; that it'd be good for us. I unfortunately missed the call because my phone was off. I told my GF, and she thought it was a nice gesture. Later, she said that Sarah might have just been trying to look good and make her (my GF) look bad. Anyway, because of whatever circumstances and sensitivities, my GF did not get a chance to meet Sarah. It might have helped a lot -- put a face to a name; clear up some negative vibes. Conversely, it might have only made her more sensitive to "competition". I'd think the former, but who knows?

/Oh, if you want the more complete back story, here are different threads (from each of us), in chronological order:

http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?t=94191
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?t=96151
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?t=97553

01-01-2006, 06:33 PM	#1 (permalink)
simivin Banned	The last chapter -----Note: I know this is long. Sorry for the length. It's mostly for those of you who followed some of the earlier parts of the story (abaya, liltippler, etc) ----- Well, since I had posted numerous times regarding my relationship, I figured I would post the final events. As you could guess, I broke things off with my GF recently. I'm not looking for advice at this point, really, so I'm not entirely sure what merit there is in posting this -- maybe just because it sucks, because it hurts, I'd like to hear opinions, and so that I (and others, hopefully) could learn a little too. As a quick preface, I understand that this is told from my perspective, but I will still try to be unbiased in the retelling. Here is what happened: My GF and I had been fighting about my friend Sarah since September -- great friend of mine, had had questions that were never resolved, etc. In November, my GF and I broke up over all this and then got back together to give it another try and to make the most of the holidays to see if we could strengthen things up (see http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?t=97553 for her recounting of those events). Over the month of November, my GF and I did marginally better -- Sarah still came up, often times unprompted, and Thanksgiving was good but still slightly awkward because we were still sensitive. We had a bit of a row right at the end of Nov, and I was finally saying, "you need to get over this, because it is taking a huge toll on me...and I'm not sure how much more I can take of these fights. Let's leave all this Sarah stuff behind and move on." I had toned down the amount of time I talked with Sarah (not completely, but significantly, because I wanted to try to compromise from my end), and didn't want to give any ultimatums, but we had been revisiting this issue so very often. We started December off much better -- seemingly both committed to getting over our issues. It was one of the best weekends we'd had in a very long time. Sarah came up just briefly the next week, but more in the context that my GF was bothered by thinking about that; we didn't end up fighting, which was nice. As long as we nothing related to Sarah came up, we were doing well -- making it through a nice week and a half before Christmas (she was at my apartment and parents place). At one point two weeks before Christmas, Sarah asked me if I could do her a favor and come to a company dance with her at the end of January. The guy she was seeing on and off was going to be abroad for next semester, and she didn't want to take a random guy to a company event, so asked me. I told her I'd run it by my GF and that it shouldn't be a problem. I wanted to wait for a while, however, because I didn't want to upset my GF before we went to FL for a week after Christmas. My GF left on Wednesday before Christmas to go to her parents place. Wrote emails back and forth over the next day or so -- usual loving emails. Thursday I got online briefly and talked with Sarah, as I hadn't talked with her for about a week. Since I was in DC (where she lives) and hadn't gotten in touch with her, she gave me grief and then said she had a couple tickets to this by-invitation party or whatever at a bar. Ok, cool. I went with Sarah and had a good time, nothing really exciting really. I crashed at her place on the floor again and went home. My GF tried calling three times that night, once I was on the phone and the other two I missed -- I didn't answer/return the calls because I didn't want her to be upset overnight; I thought that if I called in the morning, it would be water under a bridge and it wouldn't matter so much. Anyway, I went to sleep thinking about my GF, how much I love her, and that I was scared to death of telling her I had hung out with Sarah, even though nothing happened. So Friday I get back to my folks' place and give my GF a call. It went something like this: Me: "Hey, good morning!" Her: "Hey!" Me: "I got your messages" Her: "What'd you do last night?" Me: "I went out" Her: "With who?" Me: "Sarah" at this point, you could almost hear a record scratch to a halt Me: "How was riding on your dad's harley?" Her: "Did you call her?" The conversation degenerated from there. She felt it was sketchy that we had been together for a week and I hadn't mentioned or called Sarah; I hadn't wanted to because I was with my GF and I knew it was a sensitive issue. She felt I was hiding this, when all I had wanted to do was avoid the problems we had had before. I told her I loved her, that Sarah didn't matter anymore...that I had gotten over that since we were doing so much better, etc. I meant everything I said, but nothing was good enough. Then I made the mistake of saying that I couldn't even tell her some things for fear of how she would respond. She asked what, and I told her (being honest) -- one of which was asking her permission to go to the dance-thing with Sarah. My GF ends up telling me "no, absolutely not." I'm not happy, because I tell her I love her, that nothing is going on with Sarah, that she has nothing to worry about. And I meant it all. I ultimately say "fine, I won't." But then she isn't happy because I'm not happy about the decision. Bad conversation all around. We hang up and finish; she leaves a message, however, saying "you're right, you should hang out with whoever you want, she's just another girl, you've never done anything wrong, I'm not happy about it, but you should be able to go." We talked that night and I thanked her for her message. She asked what my decision was and I said that I'd want to go. Thus began 3 more hours of fighting. She kept asking why I wanted to go -- "because she's a friend, she asked me, and it'd be fun". Nothing more. The next day we fought for about an hour or so in the afternoon. Finally, she called me at 0100 on Christmas. I tried to keep it light, tried to avoid any discussions, and tried to end the conversation on that note. She didn't want to go yet, though. So she ends up saying "I don't want to break up with you, I trust you, and you should be able to do something like this" and I said "true" but my tone struck her wrong, and again, we degenerated into three hours of arguing. Finally, she said "I'm just going to go, this didn't accomplish anything" and I said "[---], I don't think I want to date anymore." We talked for an hour, with her apologizing, saying she trusts me, saying it shouldn't matter, etc. To which I basically replied, we've been doing this for four months, it hurts more and more each time, I felt attacked this time when I didn't do anything wrong whatsoever, I've showed you I love you and made a big effort, and so far nothing really has helped. I've tried to be by your side throughout all this, but until you figure this out, I can't handle it anymore, especially when I'll be moving in a semester and will be halfway across the country. My (now ex) GF tried calling back a few more hours, asking me to reconsider, asking me to consider that it was Christmas, not to ruin her brother's plans (we were supposed to go to Orlando together for her birthday and New Years). Okay, that was entirely longer than I thought it would be. Again, an awful lot of stuff, so I'm not sure how many people will read this. It all just hurts right now, and has hurt all week, especially around the holidays and especially since we should have been together right now I've been talking to people all week, to get perspectives and understand this. Sometimes I feel like it was a good decision -- 4 months of fighting definitely took its toll, and the hope I had that we were getting better had been damaged by those two days of fighting. On the other hand, sometimes I feel bad -- maybe she was and we were getting better? Maybe if she had just gotten over Sarah we would have been perfectly fine. Maybe more time would have helped. If I really loved her I would have stayed with her. Etc. I feel like an asshole and I feel guilty for my decision, sometimes, because of those type of thoughts -- and because I didn't forgive her when she asked on Christmas morning, after I told her I didn't want to date anymore. Again, I'm not really looking for any particular type of response...I'm just kind of throwing this out there since it had been a running thing and some of you might have been interested in the outcome. I've heard opinions that support my side as well as those that support hers -- that this dance was too much, that I should have known better than to ask, that the history with Sarah was too much to get over so fast. I guess it came down to a matter of arguing about different things an not realizing it: I was upset she didn't trust me, she was upset that I wasn't more sensitive. She felt that the history of this issue hadn't changed; I felt that the fights kept hurting more and more. I still feel like she didn't understand what I had been telling her both days -- that Sarah was just a friend, that nothing was going on, that I love her (my GF), that I wasn't out trying to find "someone better" but was trying to make us work. I don't know. All so frustrating, because I really felt I tried to handle things well and had been trying to make my GF feel so much better after all the prior issues only to revert to the same fighting. So that is that for now, I guess. I don't think there will be any going back on this from either of us, at least not for a while. Some questions I guess I have are just general relationship things for peoples consideration. Do you think that there are limits or thresholds for these types of things even if you love the person? I mean, marriage, maybe not, but dating? How sensitive should you be to these types of issues? Completely submissive? Compromising, ideally, I know...but was I so insensitive to think that I should be able to go with my friend? If you love someone, should you persevere until marriage through all challenges? Should it be acceptable to wonder, periodically, even when you love your SO and when you are focusing on your relationship with them (ie, I wondered about Sarah, but obviously had not done anything about it)? Do these issues generally go away -- is it age or experiences? I guess I at least have learned a lot from both sides of this situation (I've written probably 70 pages of thoughts in a week -- emotional venting and reflection). Maybe others can learn too. Ok, I will stop there. Thanks for reading if you read it. There's more details, I guess, but that's the basic story of the last month or so. Take it all for whatever it is worth... Sim PS: Sarah had called to ask me to lunch over Thanksgiving when my GF was with me, but we (Sarah and I) both thought that would be bad. However, Sarah called back in the morning to suggest that my GF come too; that it'd be good for us. I unfortunately missed the call because my phone was off. I told my GF, and she thought it was a nice gesture. Later, she said that Sarah might have just been trying to look good and make her (my GF) look bad. Anyway, because of whatever circumstances and sensitivities, my GF did not get a chance to meet Sarah. It might have helped a lot -- put a face to a name; clear up some negative vibes. Conversely, it might have only made her more sensitive to "competition". I'd think the former, but who knows? /Oh, if you want the more complete back story, here are different threads (from each of us), in chronological order: http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?t=94191 http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?t=96151 http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?t=97553 Last edited by simivin; 01-11-2006 at 09:14 AM..