Francisco

Something The Ref posted earlier on this thread sticks with me as one reason people are talking at cross-purposes here:

[The problem here is Too Much Logic. Logic works well on a 2-term basis -- yes/no, on/off, black/white, open/closed. This is the basis of most Western thought. We like to think of ourselves of Logical (and Reasonable) individuals. But what if there were a third term in Logic? Yes/No/Maybe? On/Off/Partial? Black/White/Grey? This would up-end most of our discussion, lead to the possibility of Free Will, and punch a large hole in science as we know it.]

There actually is the "third term" in logic being used in Western thought, and rather than punching a large hole in known science, it was/is the foundation of modern science. It's referred to as inductive or (more recently) as abductive logic. The yes/no logic referred to is deductive logic.

What I see in this discussion is one person arguing from one form and others arguing from the other forms, and often the same person using all forms at once to "prove" that some gut feeling they have is in fact logical.

What form did I just use? God only knows.