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Slims · 01-13-2005, 12:27 PM

Ok, I have to weigh in here

The no sidestepping, at least in fencing, comes from a gentlemen using the name Kappa Ferra, who revolutionized duelling when he published his first book circa 1594. He was more or less the bruce lee of fencing.

Prior to this book, duelling was conducted on the pass. Basically, if you straighten your arm and sweep a circle with the tip of your weapon, you would sweep out an imaginary 'killing zone'. Your opponent would try to run tangent to this circle and step in just long enough to deliver a wound, and then would continue his path out of range.

Kappa Ferra was able to show that this was inefficient, and wastefull of motion. Basically, he said to line up against your opponent, and move forward and backward to kill him or to get out of his way, extra side to side motion is wasted energy since it is far easier for your opponent to simply pivot than it is for you to run sideways.

Sport fencing today is conducted on a strip, and is fairly linear. We do have side steps, they are called incortadas (sp?) but they are of limited usefullness.

It has been my experience fencing SCA fencers and watching even our newbie sport fencers beat the better SCA types that it is really quite easy to simply rotate to keep a "traditional" fencer straight in front of you. Also, when you are moving sideways, you shorten your stance out of necessity, and you are involved in a motion that makes you less able to react and move forward or backward instantly, which will give someon e all the opportunity they need to lunge, stab, and retreat.

If you ever want to see this, go to a major SCA tournament. Odds are the winner will be a sport fencer.

Interestingly, despite claims to the contrary, modern sport fencing, at least Epee, while obviously adapted somewhat for a sporting type competition has remained relatively unchanged since the days of kappa ferra. What worked then works now. He developed linear fencing, and the modern parries, as well as incorporated many linear attacks into one school (lunges, for instance, had been around, just not widely used).

The development of linear fencing occured simply because it's practitioners were winning all the duels.

Kendo is highly stylized and rigid. It is controlled both by practical considerations (certain blows don't work against an armored opponent) as well as asthetic ones (you shouldn't chop someones head off, you should cleave it down the middle). It is a fascinating sport, but due to it's rigidity is only really usefull against another practioner of kendo. A skilled japanese swordsman who knows which rules to break, will easily defeat the best kendo practitioner.

It, too, is mostly linear, but also because it is the most efficient way to conduct a sword fight.

01-13-2005, 12:27 PM	#15 (permalink)
Slims Eccentric insomniac Location: North Carolina	Ok, I have to weigh in here The no sidestepping, at least in fencing, comes from a gentlemen using the name Kappa Ferra, who revolutionized duelling when he published his first book circa 1594. He was more or less the bruce lee of fencing. Prior to this book, duelling was conducted on the pass. Basically, if you straighten your arm and sweep a circle with the tip of your weapon, you would sweep out an imaginary 'killing zone'. Your opponent would try to run tangent to this circle and step in just long enough to deliver a wound, and then would continue his path out of range. Kappa Ferra was able to show that this was inefficient, and wastefull of motion. Basically, he said to line up against your opponent, and move forward and backward to kill him or to get out of his way, extra side to side motion is wasted energy since it is far easier for your opponent to simply pivot than it is for you to run sideways. Sport fencing today is conducted on a strip, and is fairly linear. We do have side steps, they are called incortadas (sp?) but they are of limited usefullness. It has been my experience fencing SCA fencers and watching even our newbie sport fencers beat the better SCA types that it is really quite easy to simply rotate to keep a "traditional" fencer straight in front of you. Also, when you are moving sideways, you shorten your stance out of necessity, and you are involved in a motion that makes you less able to react and move forward or backward instantly, which will give someon e all the opportunity they need to lunge, stab, and retreat. If you ever want to see this, go to a major SCA tournament. Odds are the winner will be a sport fencer. Interestingly, despite claims to the contrary, modern sport fencing, at least Epee, while obviously adapted somewhat for a sporting type competition has remained relatively unchanged since the days of kappa ferra. What worked then works now. He developed linear fencing, and the modern parries, as well as incorporated many linear attacks into one school (lunges, for instance, had been around, just not widely used). The development of linear fencing occured simply because it's practitioners were winning all the duels. Kendo is highly stylized and rigid. It is controlled both by practical considerations (certain blows don't work against an armored opponent) as well as asthetic ones (you shouldn't chop someones head off, you should cleave it down the middle). It is a fascinating sport, but due to it's rigidity is only really usefull against another practioner of kendo. A skilled japanese swordsman who knows which rules to break, will easily defeat the best kendo practitioner. It, too, is mostly linear, but also because it is the most efficient way to conduct a sword fight. __________________ "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." - Winston Churchill "All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act out their dream with open eyes, to make it possible." Seven Pillars of Wisdom, T.E. Lawrence Last edited by Slims; 01-13-2005 at 12:30 PM..