Originally Posted by Sbudda

Ok I'll chime in jsut for the heck of it.

That IM conversation was totally your fault. Trying to convince a Christian that Christmas isn't about Christ is like trying to convince a dog that he shouldn't eat food anymore. I'm not comparing Christians to dogs, but rather the fact that both examples flies so far against their beliefs that they can't deal with it. A better example might be trying to convince a 5 year old that his birthday is really about celebrating the baking industry. Damn, that was a crappy example too...

Sure, I can agree with you that Christmas isn't about Jesus to a great many people, but to a Christian, saying this is close to heresy. You would have been subjected to the veglia saying something like that 400 years ago. If you want to argue that Jesus was Mary dressed as a transvestite you are likely to get a similar response.

Otherwise, you both remained civil so it doesn't seem that bad. I actually prefer to cultivate friends of different dogmas. Trying to convince them of my point of view often exposed holes in my own logic that either enables me to strengthen my beliefs or discard them as useless. To me, there is nothing more harmful than an unsubstantiated belief, so debating my beliefs with others civilly is one of the best things that a person can do (in my opinion).

Of course, I prefer friends who would sooner tell me my breath stinks than to ignore it hoping it will go away.

The only advice that I would give you, is you both need to improve your debate skills considerably. While you were civil - an very important part of debate - neither of you were actually very persuasive. This is an important skill to develop, especially in a Democracy. While it may not be directly useful to you know now, when you start attending Town Meetings you'll find that the skill was worth developing.

Be happy that you have such a friend! They are few and far between.