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Yakk · 09-21-2004, 11:51 AM

All that it takes for evil to flourish is good men to do nothing.

This applies to both sides, both being in Iraq and staying out of Iraq.

America should both be in Iraq and should not be in Iraq. It is both worth the price and not worth the price. Anyone who tries to sell you a bill of goods that claims to definately answer this question is being dishonest with themselves or with you.

Did the USA go in with less than noble motives? Yes. You can find reems of evidence that the Iraq war was planned to occur well before 9/11, that it was about securing oil and American geopolitical influence in the oil-rich region, and the moral justifications are at best an excuse not a reason for the force to be there.

Did the USA go in with noble motives? Yes. Dictatorships and oppressive governments don't just 'go away'. Without external pressure, oppresive societies can maintain the status quo and crush opposition for decades if not centuries or longer. Free societies are both better for the people and produce more, free socities won in the west through crushing their less free neighbours -- the powers that be had no choice but make their nation free or have their dominion stolen by another power that be. Saddam wasn't in perfect compliance with the cease fire agreement. Islamofascism must be stopped, Islam needs to be rescued from those who would poison it and use it for evil, and building democracies in the middle east is a solution to that problem: when laws win over force, the people win.

Are all of the above issues more complex than my above sketch? Yes, of course.

This is a hard problem. Don't trust anyone who sells you simple answers.

Veitnam was both a slaughter of innocents and a sacred war against an evil memic desease.

World War II was both a stand of freedom against slavery and a geopolitical war of old powers vs a repressed rising power.

France is both a nation of unparalleled military, social and cultural history and strength and a bunch of cheese eating surrender monkies.

09-21-2004, 11:51 AM	#14 (permalink)
Yakk Wehret Den Anfängen! Location: Ontario, Canada	All that it takes for evil to flourish is good men to do nothing. This applies to both sides, both being in Iraq and staying out of Iraq. America should both be in Iraq and should not be in Iraq. It is both worth the price and not worth the price. Anyone who tries to sell you a bill of goods that claims to definately answer this question is being dishonest with themselves or with you. Did the USA go in with less than noble motives? Yes. You can find reems of evidence that the Iraq war was planned to occur well before 9/11, that it was about securing oil and American geopolitical influence in the oil-rich region, and the moral justifications are at best an excuse not a reason for the force to be there. Did the USA go in with noble motives? Yes. Dictatorships and oppressive governments don't just 'go away'. Without external pressure, oppresive societies can maintain the status quo and crush opposition for decades if not centuries or longer. Free societies are both better for the people and produce more, free socities won in the west through crushing their less free neighbours -- the powers that be had no choice but make their nation free or have their dominion stolen by another power that be. Saddam wasn't in perfect compliance with the cease fire agreement. Islamofascism must be stopped, Islam needs to be rescued from those who would poison it and use it for evil, and building democracies in the middle east is a solution to that problem: when laws win over force, the people win. Are all of the above issues more complex than my above sketch? Yes, of course. This is a hard problem. Don't trust anyone who sells you simple answers. Veitnam was both a slaughter of innocents and a sacred war against an evil memic desease. World War II was both a stand of freedom against slavery and a geopolitical war of old powers vs a repressed rising power. France is both a nation of unparalleled military, social and cultural history and strength and a bunch of cheese eating surrender monkies. __________________ Last edited by JHVH : 10-29-4004 BC at 09:00 PM. Reason: Time for a rest.