KirStang

Another member and I were thinking of heading down to NC on the 29th of May for some semi-advanced carbine training. Problem is, 1) tuition is $600, 2) ammo count is close to 2,000 (factor in another $600), and 3) housing is $85/night for a double.

Anyone from the area interested in going and carpooling/splitting the cost of housing? I know some of you ninjas are over in the sandbox, but if someone happened to be state-side, I'd love to get to know you and shoot with ya. I'm still scrounging up the funds by selling one of my spare ACOGs.

Copied from Viking Tactics Carbine 1.5 May 29-31, 2010-NC - M4Carbine.net Forums

Slims

I would offer you two a place to stay but I am unfortunately in Afghanistan.

They have a good reputation and everyone I know who has attended one of their courses speaks well of it.

I don't know if either of you guys are aware of these matches, the dates might line up with the end of your course: PHOTOS

It is a very good combat-style match on Ft. Bragg hosted by the SFARTAETC Committee...with far more movement, obstacles, climbing, etc.

Enjoy.

__________________
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." - Winston Churchill

"All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act out their dream with open eyes, to make it possible." Seven Pillars of Wisdom, T.E. Lawrence

Plan9

Slims,

Yeah, I've heard stories of that range. I definitely wanna get in on that, but I don't wanna show up and look like a bag of ass since I've hit the range 0.0 times this year so far thanks to school (lame excuse). Could be wrong, but Range37 looks like a place you play when you're in 5th gear.

...

Kir,

$1200?! Good thing we're independently wealthy college students, eh? Yeah, so I still need to order 5.56 ball if I'm going to do this class.

Honestly, the cost of gas and a shitty motel are the small slice of the $$$ pie, bro. My wussy little car can make it down there on a single tank while holding all our gear. Beds would be like $85 for two bodies. Food would be whatever you can stuff in your mouthhole from, oh, the Arby's dollar menu.

I'm guessing Walt doesn't have a bottomless wallet or will be stuck walking his chihuahua all weekend. At least that's how my friends answered.

.

You have a spare ACOG? Sell it to me, numbnuts. I'm optics poor.

__________________
Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

The_Dunedan

Dammit, I have to be in-shop that weekend...fuck. I could use a Carbine refresher. Not that I could afford it at this point, but sonofa...good to know there's training closeby, though.

Plan9

Kir,

Turns out I've got a squillion rounds coming to my place. We'll have to get together sometime before the class.

I need to send off my training application as well as a blood sample and my favorite Sesame Street character.

Really excited about this training event if for no other reason than I don't have to drive back to my place after each day.

So, yeah... word.

__________________
Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

KirStang

Really excited too . This will be my post-school vacation.

Do you realize that we just spent the amount of a good M4/FAL/MSAR/1911(etc.etc.) on a training course? Word.

---------- Post added at 07:14 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:12 AM ----------

Aw shucks =\. We'll have to do the Mid-eastern seaboard gun enthusiast get-together sometime.

Re: Range37

I have a feeling I'll look like a bumbling fool there...kinda like I did at my first IDPA match...

But those matches look like they're great. I saw a vid of one guy climbing up the side of a building, firing from the roof, then clearing a stair case. Another stage involved exiting from a vehicle and shooting a M4, M14, and SCAR, followed by weak hand pistol shooting. Definitely have to hit one of those up sometime.

LordEden

Hey, there is no way I can afford to go to this (or really have the experience to be involved with it), but if you guys want a place to crash, I'm only an hour away from the place.

Clinton, NC to Fuquary-Varina, NC

Looks to be over an hour to get there from my house, but I got the crash space. Let me know if you guys are interested in staying. My house always welcomes TFPers.

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Plan9

Eden,

Look at your southern hospitality! Always the gentlemen. I appreciate it, bro. But I do think it's worth the ~$120 to be close by.

We will, however, practice a "dynamic entry" on your house the night after class lets out. Just duck after the double-knock.

Seriously though, I think a mini-TFP meet-up is on order after 3 days of playing GI Joe. I might need a pizza or something.

__________________
Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

LordEden

Just let me know, my house is always open for you guys. You got my number, just let me know if you guys feel like coming by or not.

__________________
Vice-President of the CinnamonGirl Fan Club - The Meat of the Zombiesquirrel and CinnamonGirl Sandwich

Plan9

You and your backwards priorities.

__________________
Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

Plan9

Update: Sonuvabitch.

Just got a call from VTac stating that the class had to be canceled at its original location due to some petty range politics or whatever.

They're moving it to Fayetteville. This is okay because Fayetteville is Fayetteville. This is bad because we already booked a hotel.

__________________
Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

KirStang

Grr, our hotel is 1 hour and 1 minute away, according to google.

Plan9

Yeah, that's totally unacceptable. We'll have finagle a trade to a hotel at Bragg or book a new one.

We can't lose 2 hrs a day to travel time if we're paying for a place to stay. Makes zero sense.

__________________
Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

KirStang

Great news. Called Expedia. At first they said, "this reservation is non-refundable." When asked why they said, "because it's the rules." I tried asking a little more, but they were unhelpful. Finally, I reluctantly asked to speak to the supervisor. The expedia lady offered to call the Super 8 and fortunately, the cancellation went through.

Plan9

Gnarlyradicalmondotubular! Did you seduce her with your smoldering soap opera voice?

Cool. Okay, so now we get a place at Bragg with a 9 minute commute to the range.

__________________
Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

Plan9

Green light - Go!

It's on. KirStang and I will be leaving tomorrow at around 0700, hitting Fayetteville sometime around 1330.

I'll give all you local suckas a call once I get my gear stowed. We'll hang out and be rowdy.

__________________
Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

KirStang

Sunburns, a neck branded by a stray casing, and excellent instruction. AAR to follow.

KirStang

I recently attended the VTAC Carbine 1.5 class in Linden, NC. I was hoping to sharpen up my shooting before I ship out for basic and to reward myself for finishing my second year of law school. Hopefully I’ll shoot an ‘expert’ in BCT. 

The weather was relatively uncooperative, raining the day before Day 1 and then becoming blazing hot on Day 2. We lucked out on Day 3 though, with a light breeze. Regardless, I came away with some sun-burns. The course was taught by Dan, an active duty SF guy with approximately 15 years of experience down range.

The attendees were a mix of civilians (students, engineers), contractors (security, overseas contractors), and a lot of LEOs (narcotics, SWAT, officers).

Classes started at 0800 on day 1 and ended around 1630. We started at 0900 on Day 2 and Day 3.

The Facility

The range consisted of 3 berms, with us training exclusively on one berm. There was no gravel and due to the rain, there was a lot of mud on the range. As a result, during Day 1, and Day 2, I ended up doing a lot of shooting in the mud. I think the facility is one portion which I felt like the course could have improved on. In another class I took, we had gravel from 25 yards in. Although I suppose I received better training from running around in the mud, it really was a pain in the ass getting the mud off my gear before I stepped back in to my hotel.

The classroom portions were also taught outside, with us standing around Dan. One thing that I think could have helped would have been a quick classroom portion. I had brought a pad and pens to take copious notes but ended up only taking notes for the malfunction drill.



Staging Area:


Day 1
We started off with zeroing our weapons at 25-50-75-100 yards. Dan first explained that with a 50 yard zero, you’ll never be more than ~1.3” off from 25-200 yards. As a result, we all zeroed our weapons for 50 yards. Unlike other courses, we really took our time with getting a good zero. We spent approximately 90 minutes shooting, and then walking down range to adjust for zero. As you’ll see from this AAR, one thing I really liked about this class is that we really took our time to get it right before moving on. 10 x 5 shot groups later, I had my ACOG zeroed dead center at 100 yards.
We then moved to doing a NRA style shooting match. Dan instructed us at the various positions available and we shot from 100-25 yards in various positions, then scored our shots. We then broke for lunch.

After lunch, we started going over shooting stance. I had been taught to square up to provide maximum protection from my armor plate. However, Dan made a good point, “don’t count on the other guy shooting you to determine your shooting stance.” Consequently, we adjusted our stance for a modified weaver-type stance. This stance proved to be much more stable, and we were able to shoot much quicker as a result. We also learned some fundamentals of shooting, such as snapping your weapon up, follow-through, reset, etc. Following the instruction, we practiced drilling the stance and shooting strings.

After drilling the shooting strings over and over again, we moved to timed engagements. We shot from various distances and timed ourselves at both our speed and accuracy. Another extremely strong point of this class was the emphasis on both speed and accuracy. This wrapped up Day 1.

Day 2

Day 2 started off with malfunctions. Dan first instructed us how to clear the various malfunctions we’d see on an AR. One of the things I really liked was learning how to clear a bolt override by ‘creating space.’ We then ran the 3 little kittens drill with 3 jammed rifles.



Afterwards, we moved to turning and shooting drills.






We then moved to pistol transitions:



Dan went through the pistol transitions, then we drilled transitions over and over and over again. We’d get mags loaded with various round counts and we’d practice transitioning. For the remainder of the day, we kept our pistols on us and transitioned whenever we ran dry. I really liked practicing this and using transitions as the day went on.

Finally, we ran moving & shooting drills



As stated before, we transitioned to our pistol when we ran dry, so in essence we were practicing moving, shooting and transitioning. In previous carbine courses, we did not continuously practice transitioning, so this was great.

Day 3

We shot steel on Day 3



We began with shooting positions, sitting, brokeback prone, SBU prone, modified kneeling, rice paddy squat, etc.




We then moved to weak-side transitions. We first learned how to transition, then transitioned over and over again, before running transitions hot—over and over again.

After drilling transitions, we moved to barricade shooting.



After shooting barricade, we ran various competitive drills and timed drills which really stressed transitions, speed, accuracy, and incorporated pretty much everything we learned during the day.

General Comments/Cliff Notes
The strength of this class was the emphasis on speed and accuracy, as well as the repetitive training to build muscle memory. A couple things I *personally* felt could have been improved, was that I think this course could have been more pedagogical. For example, we walked towards the left by stepping OVER with our right foot, which seemed like we were crossing our feet. Dan told us that it’s not ‘crossing our feet’ so much as creating a stable platform to move left. I think Dan could have explained that one more. We also ran in to a lot of unorthodox things, like placing our muzzle on to the grass and clearing a stuck casing. Most schools are highly against muzzle on the ground (for fear of mud getting in there). Dan explained that by saying in theater, you will most likely use it on concrete or on a vehicle. I felt like that could have been explained more too.

Nonetheless, the instruction was great and I really learned *a lot* and really had the opportunity to practice and build muscle memory.

Gear Queer notes:
For those who aren’t addicted to hardware, stop here, but for those who like gear comments read on:

I ran a large CIRAS which was heavy and uncomfortable. I ran plates for about 2 hours then ditched the plates and ran without it. I tried shifting the weight of the CIRAS on to my hip by putting a battle belt underneath it but the weight still ended up on my shoulders. Another student ran a London Bridge Trading Plate Carrier (6094A) no problems, so I am looking in to purchasing one of those. Most of the students ran belt rigs, which seems to be in vogue right now. However, I am not sure if belt rigs are run the same way in theater, so I am leery of using one. In addition, belt rigs aren’t ambidextrous so I’m still on the fence. I’ll most likely buy a belt rig and try to run it underneath my PC as second line gear.
My LWRC ran great through ~1,500 rounds. Around ~1,300 rounds I had one spontaneous double feed and another double feed caused by improper hand placement during weak-side firing. A lot of guys had rifles going down, so I was pleased that I only had 1 double feed (which came during a competitive event, but thanks to my teammate’s excellent shooting I had time to quickly clear the two double feeds and we won the event).

I also ran an ACOG, which was *great* for 100 yard and 50 yard shooting. However, during weak side shooting in unconventional positions I could NOT get a sight picture. With my rifle canted and in an awkward position, I tried transitioning to the MRD on top, but at 50 yards I was missing poppers.

The BAD lever was *EXCELLENT* highly recommended. Fast reloads, great for locking bolt back during malfunctions.

Lessons Learned:
Buy sunscreen.

Wear something to cover your neck. I got showered with brass during a competitive event (really distracting from shooting) and had another spent casing brand a hole in my neck.

Account for your shots.

Load up ~20 mags before doing to class (pain in the ass to load mags while sweaty and tired with 20lbs of gear on).

When weak-side transitioning: Firing grip to magwell!

Safety on when moving. Always be mindful of your safety.

Hope this provided a good review of the Carbine 1.5. If anything is not kosher, PM or email me and I'll pull it down. It really was a pleasure shooting with everyone.

Plan9

Nice AAR. I'll throw in some comments in a bit.

And you've got duplicate pictures up there, bro.

Guy in the DCUs was ate up from the plate up, too.

__________________
Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

KirStang

Fixed.

http://webgear.londonbridgetrading.c...3-5AE5516BC014

for you PSD ninjas

ChrisJericho

awww where's all the sexy multicam gear?

looks like the guy in DCU's is running a tactical pontiac vibe, the choice of true operators worldwide.

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"A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows us that faith proves nothing." - Friedrich Nietzsche

Blobert!

That's awesome. Nothing scares big brother more than knowing ex-super soldiers are tactifying the general population. Sign me up!

Willravel

Vikings used firearms? I always pictured them with blunt weapons, swords and shields.

KirStang

Oh you should see pics of some SF guys:

The trainer in said class?

Big brawny Norse guy.

The SF guy detained in Pakistan?

Big Brawny Norse guy. Indeed he looked like The Brawny man.

However, instead of using viking ships these days, they seem to use Chinooks for their bootay and plundar. Arrrrrrr.

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