soopafreek

hey all,

after being a windows user for so long and after all the $#!7 that comes with that, i was wondering if someone could explain how one might be able to start using linux.

i saw on slashdot that KDE 3.2 was just released and i figured i might download those. but after that, what do i do?

can someone give some pointers and instructions on how one might make the switch to linux?

thanks.

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aaarrrrrgggghhhh!!!!

Fallon

First, you might want to dl and burn or buy a linux distro.
KDE by itself won't do you much good.
Now, what do you want to do with linux is my next question because that kinda directs what you'll learn.

numist

If you want to run linux, first you need whats called a distribution. It includes:

A kernel
A User Interface
Assorted Aplications

The kernel is what linux IS. The kernel is what Linus writes, and its job is to be the layer between your hardware and everything else, so nothing has to be written specifically for certain hardware to run on linux. The code is genius.

KDE itself doesnt support standards set by opendesktop, and I would reccomend GNOME anyways, because Im biased. In the next few versions look for a lot of new features and integration with GNOME and other programs.

As for a linux distribution, I highly reccomend you go to http://fedora.redhat.com and read up a bit. If you are serious, download some ISOs, and create a dual boot computer. The process is easier than the windows installer, even a kid could do it, and Ive never had it fail.

Now that you have a dual boot, spend some time in it, learn the operating system. Linux distros are usually focused with coding and such, and come with a lot of programs for that, so for the normal user it may not be as useful, but there are some alternatives.

Best part: any software worth having is free!

Come on to #tfp (see link in my sig) if you want some help in real time, theres usually someone in there who is knowlegable about linux.

Good luck.

cheerios

I'm sorry, that last bit isn't quite true. #1: the options can be confusing (swap partition for one... first time I installed linux I'm like "wtf is a swap partition???"), and i've had even red-hat fail me. It takes a bit of persistance, and some intelligence to install linux. Do your research. you'll need to know the horizontal and vertial sync on your monitor, for example, to get Xwindows to run properly. nothing a google search won't pull up, but you have to know to look.

I'm not saying RedHat's a bad choice, it's probably what I'd suggest (I've heard Mandrake and SuSe are good for newbies, as well), but it's not as "easy" as windows is. you don't just hit "next".

Please, please please please, do all of us a favor, avoid gentoo or debian for your first run-through... You'll be ruined on linux for ever.

Good luck, and if you get stuck, a google search and reading through mailing lists will often provide the answers you need. Someone has asked your question before you did, it's up to you to find it. and if all else fails, there's always IRC

juanvaldes

enjoy
http://www.knopper.net/knoppix/index-en.html

digby

I'll make the generic recommendation for Knoppix. Get the .iso from Distrowatch.com. It boots and runs entirely off a cd. No install, no configuration really, just put it in and reboot. It really couldn't be easier. I've used it on a couple of different computers with very different components, and it auto-detected all the hardware perfectly. Also, since you're running off a CD and ramdisk, you can do anything you want and not worry about messing stuff up. Deleted your kernel? Just reboot. Lost KDE? Reboot.

It's what I'm using to learn until I have time to get SuSE up and running in a few days. Then I'll be off to Debian and (maybe someday) Gentoo.

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mmmm.... pudding

sailor

Knoppix is good if you want to give it a shot without installing anything. The problem, however, is that because it runs off of a CD, it is slow to load things and you cannot install anything else. Its still a great way to tool around though.

Ill second the RedHat or Mandrake for a starter distro. Either one is easy to install and will serve you very well.

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"Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws."
--Plato

soopafreek

thanks for the info.

i don't want to buy a distro. it's supposed to be "free" software, right?

my motives for getting into linux isn't to switch over 100%. i'll be loading it on a separate machine. i should've been clearer on that.

i wanted to set up a linux box, try to get a little experience with it. install some apps like open office (all open-source, freeware or non-commercial apps -- no warez), maybe start developing on it as i pursue my CS degree.

i'm aware of the shortage of mainstream apps for linux, compatibility issues, and stuff like that. i just want to start tinkering with it.

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Ratman

You may not want to buy a distro, BUT...

I am also a Linux noob, and I just got the Mandrake PowerPack 9.2. It was about $70, and came with 3000 apps, plus support. I have installed it on a separate box, and as a dual boot on my laptop. The installs were flawless, including peripherals, lan. pcmcia modem, etc., networking settings with my Win2k box, internet connections over lan and modem, etc.

While Linux is free, my time is not. I wanted to get up and using Linux. With a distro that helps with the setup, I can tinker to my hearts content.

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The difference between theory and reality is that in theory there is no difference.

"God made man, but he used the monkey to do it." DEVO

propaganda

I have decided to "tinker" with it as well. I have Mandrake 9.2 installed on an old machine and its pretty nice. I also tried Redhat 9 and that is probably better if you still want a bit of the Windows enviorment. But this is how I see it but Mandrake is a nice little thing to start out with.

SecretMethod70

I couldn't find this before to post in here, but having finally come across it again, I'm gonna post it here for you soopa....

If you haven't, I highly suggest you sift through these threads - especially the first one:

<a href="http://tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4170">ATTENTION: 'Why Linux is Not for You: The Lengthy Rebuttal of a Linux User'</a>
<a href="http://tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?s=&threadid=199">Which flavor of Linux?</a>
<a href="http://tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?s=&threadid=203">Top Linux Downloads</a>
<a href="http://tfproject.org/tfp/showthread.php?s=&threadid=144">Linux software equivalents</a>

Linux is VERY different from Windows and Mac OS. Different distros leave various amounts of things to the end user to do, but one thing that can be consistantly said across the different distros is that they all generally require the user to pay FAR more attention to details and the inner workings of the OS than Windows or Mac OS.

What I would recommend is to first tinker around with Knoppix - even if you have a seperate computer to use - this way you don't spend time installing that you may not need to. If you decide you generally like Linux (and Knoppix only gives you a VERY general idea) then go ahead and try it out. I recommend Mandrake to start out on and you can download it from www.linuxiso.org Also, I recommend signing up to their mandrake-newbie mailing list assuming you have a good mail program where you can set up filters so the messages can go into their own folder (expect 100+ per day). The mailing list provided endless help to me when I was starting out. And don't forget you can ask questions here as well. Also, there is much help to be gotten on IRC. Connect to the network irc.freenode.net and there are many channels there to help out depending what you need help with. I believe the Mandrake channel is #Mandrake.

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Le temps détruit tout

"Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

hatchetman

i reccomend you have a purpous in your experimentation with any *nix system. i chose a distro based off of redhat 7.1 for routing purpouses. the distro can be found at www.clarkconnect.org its a fairly easy install and will run on a very minimal system. the only linux command i really needed to get started wa ifconfig, to get the IO and IRQ of the two network cards. theres very little official documentation but the forums are very helpful.

VF19

I didn't like Red Hat 9. It ran slow, some programs didn't open, it took 5 minutes to boot up, I didn't know how to install anything (like downloading something off the net and using it- couldnt do that) and my no. 1 problem: NO GAMING.

Slapped XP Home on my machine and it ran at least 3x faster, plus GAMING.

However I had no problems at all with just surfing the net and using some Open Office stuff (still ran slow) on RH9

meembo

Like Knoppix, there are other CD-based distros out there. I use PCLinux, based on Mandrake 9.2. Gentoo has a live CD, and there are others. DistroWatch has a great listing of different distributions

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less I say, smarter I am

SecretMethod70

Don't mean this in a bad way whatsoever, but that's the typical response of someone who tried Linux because it was "the buzz" without knowing enough about it. (Not a personal judgement at all, just a fact of life)

A signifcant number of your issues are addressed by the first link I gave above. The lack of significant gaming supoprt is something that someone trying out Linux should be fully aware of WELL before they even consider installing it. As for how to install anything, well, that's just something that comes with the territory of using a different operating system. Things work differently, and Linux isn't designed to hold your hand and make decisions for you, thus, no clear-cut installation process.

Anyways, this is a bit off-topic, but I wanted to use this as an opportunity to highlight the fact that NO ONE should try Linux without doing a significant amount of research as to wat they're getting themselves into first. Linux is not "some other program" to install as some of the buzz seems to make it seem. Linux is an entirely different operating system. A different way of thinking, a different way of doing things, and a different way of computing essentially.

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Le temps détruit tout

"Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

VF19

I actually knew that I couldn't play games, and there aren't file extensions, and all that stuff before I tried Redhat.
I just didn't want to pay the $90 for XP home (which I eventually gave in to)


Just now I D/L Knoppix and tried that, it actually ran fast. Plus it was easy to use and stuff.
Now I might consider dual booting RH9 and XP.

SecretMethod70

One thing to keep in mind with RedHat is that if you prefer to use KDE (the desktop manager Knoppix uses) you're pretty much screwed. RedHat has sucky support for KDE and have crippled it in their distro-specific modifications. And that's just *one* reason I don't like Red Hat

If you want to try out/play around with Linux I'd HIGHLY suggest Mandrake over Red Hat

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Le temps détruit tout

"Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling

soopafreek

okay, i downloaded an iso of knoppix 3.3.

i burned the cd and tried to install it on a "spare parts" computer i've got laying around. the hard drive has no OS on it.

anyway, it starts going through a configuration to detect the sound and video card, etc. but then it says "starting X11" and then the screen goes blank. the cd drive and hard drive are still spinning, so i think something's going on, but the monitor just blanks out.

i even tried the "failsafe" install.... same thing.

is it a hardware compatibility issue? it's an older monitor and older video card.

AMD Athlon 700MHz
256MB RAM
Riva128 vid

any help is appreciated. thanks!

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aaarrrrrgggghhhh!!!!

Latch

If you decide to try Fedora (much to SMeth's disgust hehe)....

I was browsing and just found this article called "Fedora: Road To The Desktop" on Flexbeta. Looking at it, it looks like a very helpful (and useful) article for linux newbies that takes you through stuff step by step. Give it a read:

http://www.flexbeta.net/main/article...ion=show&id=42

sailor

I recently installed Fedora, and I must say, I like it. Very polished, very nice.

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"Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws."
--Plato

soopafreek

well, i'll try downloading the iso's for fedora too, but can anyone help me out with the knoppix issue?

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aaarrrrrgggghhhh!!!!

Cocktopus

Riva 128? I remember those. I passed one up for a Voodoo2. Anyway knoppix should work ok with the Riva. How old and what res is the monitor? Sounds like knoppix is picking up the wrong monitor/resolution.

If the drives seem to be spinning after the picture goes out, let it "boot" completely (2-3min just to be safe) and then try ctrl alt - (minus) a few times to change the resolution (ctl alt + increases res).

soopafreek

cool. that worked!

i'm using an old 14" monitor on this rig so when i finally got the desktop, there are "hidden" areas outside the viewable area.... and i'm on the lowest res possible 640x480. yikes!

thanks.

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aaarrrrrgggghhhh!!!!

JasWalker

I've got a dual boot with XP and Mandrake 9.something. Install was a breeze and it wasn't to difficult to configure my multi monitor setup. You may want to check it out.

bacon_masta

i have to argue with that one. mandrake 9.2 is much more versatile, and just as easy to use. if you seriously want to learn linux, be prepared to read a whole shitload of documentation. you'll try to figure out how to do something, and be referred to something else, then to something else, then to something else, then to something else, and so on. check out linuxforum.com and linuxiso.org for tons of information and links to more information, plus all the most popular linux distros.