Mobo and RAM configuration - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

MahlerIsGod · 11-02-2003, 08:25 PM

I have been buying my new system piece by piece over the past month and I am about ready to assemble. I have a 3.2 P4 with a ASUS motherboard supporting 800Mhz Bus speed. The last thing I have to buy is the RAM. I have my old POS Dell which has SDRAM not capable of the Bus speed and I am thinking until I scrap up enough money for the appropriate RAM (Kingston Hyper X 3200 is the way I think I am going to). What would happen if I assembled the new rig and put in the 256MB of SDRAM (from the POS Dell) into a Motherboard and Chip capable of sooooooooo much more? Does anyone have any idea? Thanks

scoobydugan · 11-02-2003, 08:31 PM

U can't use SDRam in a DDR Board...just can't happen...buy some ddr its cheap as hell....at Best Buy u can get a 512 stick of 2700 for $80...and if u dont want that u can get a 256 for like $50

Sunrise · 11-02-2003, 08:32 PM

SDRAM is no good. You're gonna need DDR.... I think you need atleast pc2700 for yours.... not sure.. maybe 3200 is THE minimum?
Anywho, why are you getting the kingston hyper x 3200?
I've got Kingston ValueRAM 3200. It has Winbond BH-5 chips as used on Corsair XMS3500 and runs at 400mhz (the rated speed) at default voltage at 2-2-2-5 turbo no problems (Cas latency rated by kingston = 2.5... but i'm using it at 2.0 with no problems at default voltage, W00T!

). Make sure you get TWO sticks to make use of dual channel - *upto* double performance.

scoobydugan · 11-02-2003, 08:35 PM

He'll be fine with 2700 if he just wants to get it up n running

longjohns · 11-02-2003, 08:56 PM

my asus will run pc2100 with an 800 fsb, p4p800 dlx

Sunrise · 11-02-2003, 08:59 PM

Well I am surprised that it runs with pc2100. But if his mobo supports dual channel, he might as well get the most performance he can out of his system and buy two sticks of ddr 400 (pc3200). Unless he wants to O/C, which then he should get something faster.

MahlerIsGod · 11-02-2003, 09:21 PM

Thanks for all the help and suggestions everyone. Can anyone think of specific examples of how putting in SDRAM instead of DDR would effect my computer in say everyday use, gaming, etc. Thanks

Sunrise · 11-02-2003, 09:25 PM

Well you can't put in the sdram, it's not compatible.
DDR is double data, sd is single data, hence ddr is twice as fast as sdram. faster ram is required because the cpu would be much faster than the cpu you were using sdram for - it executes instructions faster, so needs to be able to read and write to memory faster, otherwise it won't be working to it's full potential if you were to use slower ram.

Lasereth · 11-02-2003, 09:39 PM

DDR-RAM is SD-RAM with double date rate. DDR-SDRAM is the official name of DDR RAM; people get that confused quite often. Regular SD-RAM simply won't work in your PC, however. You'll need at least PC2100 RAM, even though there is potential issues with decreasing the RAM bus that much lower than your processor.

You can find cheap insta-DDR on the Internet fairly cheap. I think 256 MB of PC2100 is like $50 max. I'd get PC2700 just to get closer to the performance you need for that processor, though. Actually, if it were me, I'd wait and get 2x 256 MB Corsair or Kingston like you mentioned. PC3200 would be great. Two sticks will take advantage of the one feature Intel has over AMD: dual channel memory. The performance would increase dramatically over a single 512 MB stick.

Like I said before, you need DDR RAM, but I wouldn't risk buying anything below PC2700. If it were my computer, I wouldn't buy temporary RAM at all. I'd just wait and get two 256 MB sticks of the Kingston you were talking about.

-Lasereth

arch13 · 11-02-2003, 10:48 PM

Adding on to lasereth,
the reason you can't use SD-RAM is that it's 168 pin which is slightly shorter than modern DDR-SDRAM which is 184 pin in socket size.
If you try to stick some old sdram on the board it won't be long enough to fit in the memory bank.

Reasearch your board for it's needs for CAS latency and such and get an approptiate temp memory stick. Go with a generic stick of DDR333 (2700) from Tiger Direct for around 29.00 for a stick of 256mb after rebate.
Lasereth does have a point that if you have patiance it will pay to hold of on the system build until you can afford your preffered memory since giving a clean install with everything you need is always more healthy than trying to get windows to go faster with a memory upgrade.
It's the great mystery of MS. After setup, it gets a lot harder to see the gain's of adding new hardware to an existing system. We're all sill hoping Bill will explain it to us one day

rubicon · 11-03-2003, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lasereth
Two sticks will take advantage of the one feature Intel has over AMD: dual channel memory. The performance would increase dramatically over a single 512 MB stick.

Asus boards running AMD processors support dual-channel memory. This is according to the Asus mobo manual for my A7N8X Deluxe.

My PC2100 Kingston RAM just died (one year old) so I went out and upgraded to PC3200. Two stick of 256 MB to take advantage of the dual-channel. It does seem a little zippier.

Dragonlich · 11-03-2003, 12:02 PM

1) The NForce2 chipset on the A7N8X supports dual channel memory, as it would on most other boards. (note: *some* NForce boards do NOT support dual channel memory; ex. Asus A7N8X-X)
2) SD-RAM not only doesn't work, it simply won't fit in the sockets.
3) PC3200 memory is comparable in price to 2100 and 2700 memory; the price difference in my shop in my country is only a few Euros.
4) Just to confuse you even more: not all Asus 800 Mhz FSB boards support dual channel memory - check your manual first. The 865 and 875 chipsets should support it, unless you've got an exotic version, but the 845 might not support it.
5) Oh, and dual channel memory should add some 10 to 15% to your overall performance. Well, depending on what you do, of course...

Lasereth · 11-03-2003, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rubicon
Asus boards running AMD processors support dual-channel memory. This is according to the Asus mobo manual for my A7N8X Deluxe.

My PC2100 Kingston RAM just died (one year old) so I went out and upgraded to PC3200. Two stick of 256 MB to take advantage of the dual-channel. It does seem a little zippier.

Of course AMD motherboards support dual-channel memory. I figured someone would call me out on this, so I'm not surprised. It just so happens that Intel boards benefit much, much more than AMD boards with dual-channel simply because of the front-side bus differences. AMD's processors (up until the Athlon 64) simply aren't fast enough clock-speed wise to take advantage of dual channel to the extreme. If you enact the dual channel on an Intel board, expect anywhere from a 10%-50% increase in raw speed/power if you know what you're doing. AMD boards can get perhaps a 10% increase MAX. I was just letting him know that Intel boards greatly benefit from dual channel support, much more so than AMD boards.

-Lasereth

hy_ · 11-04-2003, 06:00 PM

Depends on what your motherboard supports. If it can support PC3500 or even PC4000, go for it

Get Kingston or corsair btw. :P

Dilbert1234567 · 11-05-2003, 03:41 PM

you need at least pc3200 any less and it could fry the RAM, if you wnat to over clock get faster stuff

pc3200 is capable of running at 400mhzt FPS since you are running Dual channel that makes it 800mhzt

make sure you buy in pairs daul cahnel requires that they are paired.

Dragonlich · 11-06-2003, 01:53 AM

Some experience here: yes, buy in pairs, but don't go buying sets that are specially selected for it (at a huge premium). Two similar dimms of the same manufacturer work fine. Furthermore, I have regular Corsair PC3200 memory (value series), and have had no problems overclocking that a bit (10%), nor have I ever heard my PC-building technical staff complain about it. (I work at a computer store)

11-02-2003, 08:25 PM	#1 (permalink)
MahlerIsGod At The Globe Showing Will How Its Done Location: London/Elysium	Mobo and RAM configuration I have been buying my new system piece by piece over the past month and I am about ready to assemble. I have a 3.2 P4 with a ASUS motherboard supporting 800Mhz Bus speed. The last thing I have to buy is the RAM. I have my old POS Dell which has SDRAM not capable of the Bus speed and I am thinking until I scrap up enough money for the appropriate RAM (Kingston Hyper X 3200 is the way I think I am going to). What would happen if I assembled the new rig and put in the 256MB of SDRAM (from the POS Dell) into a Motherboard and Chip capable of sooooooooo much more? Does anyone have any idea? Thanks __________________ "But a work of art is a conscious human effort that has to do with communication. It is that or its nothing. When an accident is applauded as a work of art, when a cult grows up around the deliciousness of inadvertent beauty, we are in the presence of the greatest decadence the West has known in its history."

11-02-2003, 09:21 PM	#7 (permalink)
MahlerIsGod At The Globe Showing Will How Its Done Location: London/Elysium	Thanks for all the help and suggestions everyone. Can anyone think of specific examples of how putting in SDRAM instead of DDR would effect my computer in say everyday use, gaming, etc. Thanks __________________ "But a work of art is a conscious human effort that has to do with communication. It is that or its nothing. When an accident is applauded as a work of art, when a cult grows up around the deliciousness of inadvertent beauty, we are in the presence of the greatest decadence the West has known in its history."

11-02-2003, 09:39 PM	#9 (permalink)
Lasereth Knight of the Old Republic Location: Winston-Salem, NC	DDR-RAM is SD-RAM with double date rate. DDR-SDRAM is the official name of DDR RAM; people get that confused quite often. Regular SD-RAM simply won't work in your PC, however. You'll need at least PC2100 RAM, even though there is potential issues with decreasing the RAM bus that much lower than your processor. You can find cheap insta-DDR on the Internet fairly cheap. I think 256 MB of PC2100 is like $50 max. I'd get PC2700 just to get closer to the performance you need for that processor, though. Actually, if it were me, I'd wait and get 2x 256 MB Corsair or Kingston like you mentioned. PC3200 would be great. Two sticks will take advantage of the one feature Intel has over AMD: dual channel memory. The performance would increase dramatically over a single 512 MB stick. Like I said before, you need DDR RAM, but I wouldn't risk buying anything below PC2700. If it were my computer, I wouldn't buy temporary RAM at all. I'd just wait and get two 256 MB sticks of the Kingston you were talking about. -Lasereth __________________ "A Darwinian attacks his theory, seeking to find flaws. An ID believer defends his theory, seeking to conceal flaws." -Roger Ebert

11-02-2003, 10:48 PM	#10 (permalink)
arch13 Loves my girl in thongs Location: North of Mexico, South of Canada	Adding on to lasereth, the reason you can't use SD-RAM is that it's 168 pin which is slightly shorter than modern DDR-SDRAM which is 184 pin in socket size. If you try to stick some old sdram on the board it won't be long enough to fit in the memory bank. Reasearch your board for it's needs for CAS latency and such and get an approptiate temp memory stick. Go with a generic stick of DDR333 (2700) from Tiger Direct for around 29.00 for a stick of 256mb after rebate. Lasereth does have a point that if you have patiance it will pay to hold of on the system build until you can afford your preffered memory since giving a clean install with everything you need is always more healthy than trying to get windows to go faster with a memory upgrade. It's the great mystery of MS. After setup, it gets a lot harder to see the gain's of adding new hardware to an existing system. We're all sill hoping Bill will explain it to us one day __________________ Seen on an employer evaluation: "The wheel is turning but the hamsters dead" ____________________________ Is arch13 really a porn diety ? find out after the film at 11. -Nanofever

11-05-2003, 03:41 PM	#15 (permalink)
Dilbert1234567 Devils Cabana Boy Location: Central Coast CA	you need at least pc3200 any less and it could fry the RAM, if you wnat to over clock get faster stuff pc3200 is capable of running at 400mhzt FPS since you are running Dual channel that makes it 800mhzt make sure you buy in pairs daul cahnel requires that they are paired. __________________ Donate Blood! "Love is not finding the perfect person, but learning to see an imperfect person perfectly." -Sam Keen

11-02-2003, 08:31 PM	#2 (permalink)
scoobydugan Crazy	U can't use SDRam in a DDR Board...just can't happen...buy some ddr its cheap as hell....at Best Buy u can get a 512 stick of 2700 for $80...and if u dont want that u can get a 256 for like $50

11-02-2003, 08:32 PM	#3 (permalink)
Sunrise Crazy Location: Melbourne, Australia	SDRAM is no good. You're gonna need DDR.... I think you need atleast pc2700 for yours.... not sure.. maybe 3200 is THE minimum? Anywho, why are you getting the kingston hyper x 3200? I've got Kingston ValueRAM 3200. It has Winbond BH-5 chips as used on Corsair XMS3500 and runs at 400mhz (the rated speed) at default voltage at 2-2-2-5 turbo no problems (Cas latency rated by kingston = 2.5... but i'm using it at 2.0 with no problems at default voltage, W00T! ). Make sure you get TWO sticks to make use of dual channel - upto double performance.

11-02-2003, 08:35 PM	#4 (permalink)
scoobydugan Crazy	He'll be fine with 2700 if he just wants to get it up n running

11-02-2003, 08:56 PM	#5 (permalink)
longjohns Insane	my asus will run pc2100 with an 800 fsb, p4p800 dlx

11-02-2003, 08:59 PM	#6 (permalink)
Sunrise Crazy Location: Melbourne, Australia	Well I am surprised that it runs with pc2100. But if his mobo supports dual channel, he might as well get the most performance he can out of his system and buy two sticks of ddr 400 (pc3200). Unless he wants to O/C, which then he should get something faster.

11-02-2003, 09:25 PM	#8 (permalink)
Sunrise Crazy Location: Melbourne, Australia	Well you can't put in the sdram, it's not compatible. DDR is double data, sd is single data, hence ddr is twice as fast as sdram. faster ram is required because the cpu would be much faster than the cpu you were using sdram for - it executes instructions faster, so needs to be able to read and write to memory faster, otherwise it won't be working to it's full potential if you were to use slower ram.

11-03-2003, 12:02 PM	#12 (permalink)
Dragonlich 42, baby! Location: The Netherlands	1) The NForce2 chipset on the A7N8X supports dual channel memory, as it would on most other boards. (note: some NForce boards do NOT support dual channel memory; ex. Asus A7N8X-X) 2) SD-RAM not only doesn't work, it simply won't fit in the sockets. 3) PC3200 memory is comparable in price to 2100 and 2700 memory; the price difference in my shop in my country is only a few Euros. 4) Just to confuse you even more: not all Asus 800 Mhz FSB boards support dual channel memory - check your manual first. The 865 and 875 chipsets should support it, unless you've got an exotic version, but the 845 might not support it. 5) Oh, and dual channel memory should add some 10 to 15% to your overall performance. Well, depending on what you do, of course...

11-04-2003, 06:00 PM	#14 (permalink)
hy_ Crazy	Depends on what your motherboard supports. If it can support PC3500 or even PC4000, go for it Get Kingston or corsair btw. :P

11-06-2003, 01:53 AM	#16 (permalink)
Dragonlich 42, baby! Location: The Netherlands	Some experience here: yes, buy in pairs, but don't go buying sets that are specially selected for it (at a huge premium). Two similar dimms of the same manufacturer work fine. Furthermore, I have regular Corsair PC3200 memory (value series), and have had no problems overclocking that a bit (10%), nor have I ever heard my PC-building technical staff complain about it. (I work at a computer store)