Dante Hall - On Steroids or Just Freaking Good? - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

AL9045 · 09-28-2003, 02:41 PM

He's probably going to set some kind of record for kick returns this year.

BigGov · 09-28-2003, 04:16 PM

Very few people give credit where credit is due...The blockers.

It doesn't matter how good the returner is, if the blockers aren't good don't expect much. For proof see Desmond Howard.

djtestudo · 09-28-2003, 05:15 PM

I was absolutley impressed. He beat the #1 special teams D in the league. Of course, he was shut down on EVERY OTHER kick/punt. But only one mattered

AL9045 · 09-28-2003, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy4
Very few people give credit where credit is due...The blockers.

It doesn't matter how good the returner is, if the blockers aren't good don't expect much. For proof see Desmond Howard.

Well, it does matter who it is, because if the blockers were everything, we'd see much more returns for touchdowns.

Doing it 3 weeks in a row though on a kickoff or punt is almost unheard of. Is that a new record or something?

BigGov · 09-28-2003, 06:05 PM

The returner doesn't matter that much. Just get a fast guy with decent vision and you got yourself a return guy. Watching the Packers in the mid-90's you could see it best. Desmond Howard was great, but after he left, almost everyone else did just as well.

AL9045 · 09-28-2003, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy4
The returner doesn't matter that much. Just get a fast guy with decent vision and you got yourself a return guy. Watching the Packers in the mid-90's you could see it best. Desmond Howard was great, but after he left, almost everyone else did just as well.

"Just get a fast guy with decent vision." It's harder than you think. Trust me, if it was that easy, we'd be seeing one in every single game.

BigGov · 09-28-2003, 06:12 PM

No, that's why you DON'T see one every single game, there aren't that many great special teams.

You need the decent vision to see the hole, the fast guy sees the hole, he's gone. He's gone because the blockers have everyone tied up. How many special teams can consistantly block guys? Very, very few.

AL9045 · 09-28-2003, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy4
No, that's why you DON'T see one every single game, there aren't that many great special teams.

You need the decent vision to see the hole, the fast guy sees the hole, he's gone. He's gone because the blockers have everyone tied up. How many special teams can consistantly block guys? Very, very few.

Meh, it's not all the blockers. BUT they do contribute. The runner needs to know what he's doing.

At least he's not being cocky or whatever.

But whatever, this should be a praise Dante Hall thread, not whatever we're arguing about.

BigGov · 09-28-2003, 06:29 PM

Bah, guess there's still a little bad blood left in me from the Desmond Howard situation.

Hall is definately a good a returner, his blockers just deserve more credit than they're getting right now (which is about none).

stallion · 09-29-2003, 06:43 AM

Yes, that is an NFL record...

The irony is that the return was from an offsides on the kick before. They had held him to a 12 yard return and the Chiefs would have had the ball on their own 17 but instead, they had to kick it over and *BOOM*, Dante hits the gap and he is gone...

That is 6 punt or kick returns in the last 9 games going back to last year for Dante Hall...

crow_daw · 10-01-2003, 02:46 PM

He's frickin amazing.
He's obviously a really good player, because, as AL said, if it were all about the blockers, there'd be a whole lotta guys takin kicks to the house.

BigGov · 10-01-2003, 04:25 PM

I don't think you understand about the blockers.

It's a hell of alot harder to be a special teams blocker than anything else. Basically because you're running at someone who's running at you full force. Everyone needs to stick their block, and one more, to cover all the guys and allow the guy to break free.

1 good blocker will get you no where, 3, nope, 7, that's getting better, 9, you're damn good, 10, you're golden.

So, are there say 300 great special teams players in the NFL? Not a chance. Are there 100? Not likely, but lets say yes. Now divide that by 32, and you got the average. 3.1.

So, are three blockers going to get a returner in the end zone? No. If someone were to stack up and get 7, 8, 9, then yes, they can.

You people know that football is often won and lost by guys that never touch the ball, right?

ddjones · 10-01-2003, 07:52 PM

The blockers have played a huge part in his success. I'm not undermining him or anything, but goodness, look at the replays, and then look at the lanes he has, they're GIGANTIC. But yeah, Hall still is unbelievable.

FunHater · 10-02-2003, 01:28 PM

I'll give plenty of credit to the blockers, but you can't undermine Dante Hall's abilities by saying it is just his blockers. He's an excellent returner. Would he be as good without the excellent blocking? No, but he's still very talented.

BigGov · 10-02-2003, 09:22 PM

Whoever said it was just his blockers?

The thing is, many people give NO credit to the blockers. Those people obviously don't know much about football and it just annoys the hell out of me personally.

livingitup101 · 10-03-2003, 12:13 PM

He's amazing. I wish I had the KC Special Teams/Defense in my fantasy league.

AL9045 · 10-03-2003, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy4
Whoever said it was just his blockers?

The thing is, many people give NO credit to the blockers. Those people obviously don't know much about football and it just annoys the hell out of me personally.

You do know how easy it is to overlook the blockers, don't you?

It's like people overlooking the holder on field goal attempts, most people just never notice that, unless the holder messes up or something.

tangledweb · 10-06-2003, 05:52 PM

I am definitely willing to give him crecit for his efforts but did anyone see the touchdown return on Sunday???

Two friggin blocks in the back to two different players - dead center of the field - and no penalty flags? Even the local channel sports guys laughed at the no-calls on the play. I know you can't catch them all, but DAMN those were obvious!

Lestat · 10-06-2003, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy4
Whoever said it was just his blockers?

The thing is, many people give NO credit to the blockers. Those people obviously don't know much about football and it just annoys the hell out of me personally.

His blockers are the main reason he scores so much. Without blockers he wouldn't have any TD's. Plus he's got mad skillz.

stallion · 10-06-2003, 08:19 PM

I don't know if anybody watched one of the many pre-game shows on Sunday that featured Dante Hall but I think it was the CBS one where he was on the field and had the 4 guys that set the wall up for him on with him and he was giving them just as much credit. Granted, his last one was mostly on his own, but he was pointing out that one of the lead blockers (Derrick Blalock) acts as his eyes during the returns. With Blalock being a running back as well, he knows how to hit the gaps. Blalock takes out the one remaining guy in Hall's way and Hall says he just follows Blalock into the hole and he is gone. Then they asked "what about the kicker?". He just laughed and joked about how they don't even worry about the kicker. One interesting point brought up was that Hall and Blalock hang out together all the time, on and off the field, which helps out as well...

inkriminator · 10-06-2003, 09:55 PM

what makes hall amazing to me is his instinct, how many other people run backwards and don't lose yard-age. or that 7 yd reception he turned into a TD last year by going forward backwards left and right.

BLOCKERS RULE!!!

FunHater · 10-07-2003, 10:00 AM

inkriminator makes an excellent point. Hall has the instincts and patience to allow his blocks to be set up. He knows how to use his blockers properly...there are a lot of people in the league who do not follow blocks well or have the patience to wait for blocks to set up. That's basically what he is doing when he is running side to side and backwards, waiting for blocking to open up a hole.

09-28-2003, 02:41 PM	#1 (permalink)
AL9045 Addict Location: Virginia	Dante Hall - On Steroids or Just Freaking Good? He's probably going to set some kind of record for kick returns this year.

09-28-2003, 04:16 PM	#2 (permalink)
BigGov WoW or Class... Location: UWW	Very few people give credit where credit is due...The blockers. It doesn't matter how good the returner is, if the blockers aren't good don't expect much. For proof see Desmond Howard. __________________ One day an Englishman, a Scotsman, and an Irishman walked into a pub together. They each bought a pint of Guinness. Just as they were about to enjoy their creamy beverage, three flies landed in each of their pints. The Englishman pushed his beer away in disgust. The Scotsman fished the fly out of his beer and continued drinking it, as if nothing had happened. The Irishman, too, picked the fly out of his drink but then held it out over the beer and yelled "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT, YOU BASTARD!"

09-28-2003, 05:15 PM	#3 (permalink)
djtestudo Baltimoron Location: Beeeeeautiful Bel Air, MD	I was absolutley impressed. He beat the #1 special teams D in the league. Of course, he was shut down on EVERY OTHER kick/punt. But only one mattered __________________ "Final thought: I just rented Michael Moore's Bowling for Columbine. Frankly, it was the worst sports movie I've ever seen." --Peter Schmuck, The (Baltimore) Sun

09-28-2003, 06:05 PM	#5 (permalink)
BigGov WoW or Class... Location: UWW	The returner doesn't matter that much. Just get a fast guy with decent vision and you got yourself a return guy. Watching the Packers in the mid-90's you could see it best. Desmond Howard was great, but after he left, almost everyone else did just as well. __________________ One day an Englishman, a Scotsman, and an Irishman walked into a pub together. They each bought a pint of Guinness. Just as they were about to enjoy their creamy beverage, three flies landed in each of their pints. The Englishman pushed his beer away in disgust. The Scotsman fished the fly out of his beer and continued drinking it, as if nothing had happened. The Irishman, too, picked the fly out of his drink but then held it out over the beer and yelled "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT, YOU BASTARD!" Last edited by BigGov; 09-28-2003 at 06:09 PM..

09-28-2003, 06:12 PM	#7 (permalink)
BigGov WoW or Class... Location: UWW	No, that's why you DON'T see one every single game, there aren't that many great special teams. You need the decent vision to see the hole, the fast guy sees the hole, he's gone. He's gone because the blockers have everyone tied up. How many special teams can consistantly block guys? Very, very few. __________________ One day an Englishman, a Scotsman, and an Irishman walked into a pub together. They each bought a pint of Guinness. Just as they were about to enjoy their creamy beverage, three flies landed in each of their pints. The Englishman pushed his beer away in disgust. The Scotsman fished the fly out of his beer and continued drinking it, as if nothing had happened. The Irishman, too, picked the fly out of his drink but then held it out over the beer and yelled "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT, YOU BASTARD!"

09-28-2003, 06:29 PM	#9 (permalink)
BigGov WoW or Class... Location: UWW	Bah, guess there's still a little bad blood left in me from the Desmond Howard situation. Hall is definately a good a returner, his blockers just deserve more credit than they're getting right now (which is about none). __________________ One day an Englishman, a Scotsman, and an Irishman walked into a pub together. They each bought a pint of Guinness. Just as they were about to enjoy their creamy beverage, three flies landed in each of their pints. The Englishman pushed his beer away in disgust. The Scotsman fished the fly out of his beer and continued drinking it, as if nothing had happened. The Irishman, too, picked the fly out of his drink but then held it out over the beer and yelled "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT, YOU BASTARD!"

09-29-2003, 06:43 AM	#10 (permalink)
stallion Upright	Yes, that is an NFL record... The irony is that the return was from an offsides on the kick before. They had held him to a 12 yard return and the Chiefs would have had the ball on their own 17 but instead, they had to kick it over and BOOM, Dante hits the gap and he is gone... That is 6 punt or kick returns in the last 9 games going back to last year for Dante Hall...

10-01-2003, 02:46 PM	#11 (permalink)
crow_daw Idolator Location: Vol Country	He's frickin amazing. He's obviously a really good player, because, as AL said, if it were all about the blockers, there'd be a whole lotta guys takin kicks to the house. __________________ "We each have a star, all we have to do is find it. Once you do, everyone who sees it will be blinded." - Earl Simmons

10-01-2003, 04:25 PM	#12 (permalink)
BigGov WoW or Class... Location: UWW	I don't think you understand about the blockers. It's a hell of alot harder to be a special teams blocker than anything else. Basically because you're running at someone who's running at you full force. Everyone needs to stick their block, and one more, to cover all the guys and allow the guy to break free. 1 good blocker will get you no where, 3, nope, 7, that's getting better, 9, you're damn good, 10, you're golden. So, are there say 300 great special teams players in the NFL? Not a chance. Are there 100? Not likely, but lets say yes. Now divide that by 32, and you got the average. 3.1. So, are three blockers going to get a returner in the end zone? No. If someone were to stack up and get 7, 8, 9, then yes, they can. You people know that football is often won and lost by guys that never touch the ball, right? __________________ One day an Englishman, a Scotsman, and an Irishman walked into a pub together. They each bought a pint of Guinness. Just as they were about to enjoy their creamy beverage, three flies landed in each of their pints. The Englishman pushed his beer away in disgust. The Scotsman fished the fly out of his beer and continued drinking it, as if nothing had happened. The Irishman, too, picked the fly out of his drink but then held it out over the beer and yelled "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT, YOU BASTARD!"

10-01-2003, 07:52 PM	#13 (permalink)
ddjones Upright	The blockers have played a huge part in his success. I'm not undermining him or anything, but goodness, look at the replays, and then look at the lanes he has, they're GIGANTIC. But yeah, Hall still is unbelievable.

10-02-2003, 01:28 PM	#14 (permalink)
FunHater Tilted Location: Sherwood Park, AB	I'll give plenty of credit to the blockers, but you can't undermine Dante Hall's abilities by saying it is just his blockers. He's an excellent returner. Would he be as good without the excellent blocking? No, but he's still very talented.

10-02-2003, 09:22 PM	#15 (permalink)
BigGov WoW or Class... Location: UWW	Whoever said it was just his blockers? The thing is, many people give NO credit to the blockers. Those people obviously don't know much about football and it just annoys the hell out of me personally. __________________ One day an Englishman, a Scotsman, and an Irishman walked into a pub together. They each bought a pint of Guinness. Just as they were about to enjoy their creamy beverage, three flies landed in each of their pints. The Englishman pushed his beer away in disgust. The Scotsman fished the fly out of his beer and continued drinking it, as if nothing had happened. The Irishman, too, picked the fly out of his drink but then held it out over the beer and yelled "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT, YOU BASTARD!"

10-03-2003, 12:13 PM	#16 (permalink)
livingitup101 Crazy	He's amazing. I wish I had the KC Special Teams/Defense in my fantasy league.

10-06-2003, 05:52 PM	#18 (permalink)
tangledweb slightly impaired Location: Down South	I am definitely willing to give him crecit for his efforts but did anyone see the touchdown return on Sunday??? Two friggin blocks in the back to two different players - dead center of the field - and no penalty flags? Even the local channel sports guys laughed at the no-calls on the play. I know you can't catch them all, but DAMN those were obvious!

10-06-2003, 08:19 PM	#20 (permalink)
stallion Upright	I don't know if anybody watched one of the many pre-game shows on Sunday that featured Dante Hall but I think it was the CBS one where he was on the field and had the 4 guys that set the wall up for him on with him and he was giving them just as much credit. Granted, his last one was mostly on his own, but he was pointing out that one of the lead blockers (Derrick Blalock) acts as his eyes during the returns. With Blalock being a running back as well, he knows how to hit the gaps. Blalock takes out the one remaining guy in Hall's way and Hall says he just follows Blalock into the hole and he is gone. Then they asked "what about the kicker?". He just laughed and joked about how they don't even worry about the kicker. One interesting point brought up was that Hall and Blalock hang out together all the time, on and off the field, which helps out as well...

10-06-2003, 09:55 PM	#21 (permalink)
inkriminator Insane	what makes hall amazing to me is his instinct, how many other people run backwards and don't lose yard-age. or that 7 yd reception he turned into a TD last year by going forward backwards left and right. BLOCKERS RULE!!!

10-07-2003, 10:00 AM	#22 (permalink)
FunHater Tilted Location: Sherwood Park, AB	inkriminator makes an excellent point. Hall has the instincts and patience to allow his blocks to be set up. He knows how to use his blockers properly...there are a lot of people in the league who do not follow blocks well or have the patience to wait for blocks to set up. That's basically what he is doing when he is running side to side and backwards, waiting for blocking to open up a hole.