tspikes51

First off, I hate making the people who frequent Tilted Sexuality strictly for sexual stuff fish through this crap... and I apologize. I feel a bit high-schoolish talking to you all about this, but it's an interesting set of circumstances here. So, without further ado, let's get the boring part over with (I'll make it short):

I'm a guy. Met her at party about a month ago. We got drunk and she took me to her place: full story. In short, as StrongBad would say, we got makey-outey. We went on a date (I paid, dinner and movie). We keep talking, she's busy, I'm busy, I lived 45 minutes away from campus at the time, so we can't go out for a while.

A week after our date, I go to a party. I get drunk, drive home (first time I've ever even thought about doing that). Prolly would have blown maybe a .04, but scared the piss out of myself. I tell her about it about 3 days later, jokingly. She says never talk to me again. I write her a letter (since she wouldn't answer her phone) telling her how horrible I felt and how that isn't really how I am (and honestly I'm not). She sends back a text message saying that she doesn't hate me or think I did it intentionally, but she doesn't tolerate that because her uncle was hit by a drunk driver. This was a week ago.

I don't want things to end between us like this. It's already obvious to me that I shouldn't have done it in the first place, and I really do feel horrible for it. I don't even want advice really, even though it's appreciated, I really want to know from a different perspective whether or not I still have a chance to just carry on a conversation with her.

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maleficent

I'm not gonna lecture or anything... cause you are smart enough to better than to drive drunk.

That's something I don't have a lot of tolerance for... I've seen the after effects of what it can do... and experienced the loss of people who were victims of a drunk driver.

What went thru your head when you told her? Especially joking about it? (I'm trying desperately not to lecture, but there is nothing funny about drunk driving... this is the rest of your life you are dealing with... )

About your only chance with this woman is to give it some time. She's got pretty strong convictions on this subject it sounds like, and it'd be wrong to try to get her to change her mind. Give it some time with her... she's not going to change her mind about the sin... but she might realize that it's OK, and to actually still like the sinner..

Good luck...

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Cynthetiq

you may not want it to end this way, but it just may be the way it ends. we cannot write the endings to our friendships, they happen the way they happen.

People will not tolerate whatever for whatever reasons, and this one is a good dealbreaker for many including me. Take your lesson of surviving both incidents, accept it and move on.

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skinnymofo

if you scared yourself, it probably was more than.04.
all i can really say to that is you technically did nothing wrong (had you been .04) that under the law is a completely safe to drive.
how does this girl react to say wine or a beer with dinner?
would she scream and leave you if you guys had had some alcohol with dinner some night and you dropped her off right after?
this is a touchy subject and i honestly dont know how to feel to it.

just give her some space for a while she will calm down eventually.

Charlatan

Definately don't give up on her just yet. Give her a little space and then try again.

If she continues to exhibit such inflexability though... you are probably better off without her. Orthodoxy of this sort will rise up and bite your ass again. Find someone who is more willing to work with you than simply dump you because of a mistake.

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Cimarron29414

What would happen in a month when you said you would call and couldn't get to a phone?

What would happen when you scheduled a date and have to cancel because you work late?

What would happen when you dropped her prize celery platter while dusting?


She sounds rather uncompromising and unforgiving. She has a point about your behavior. However, if this is the way she handles people that don't behave in her predefined expectations - she is going to live a lonely existence. I'm with Charlatan, she may have saved you a lot of future heartache.

-Cim

P.S. Government should come up with a way to transport people when those people can't drive. Or maybe private industry should come up with a method. I'll bet there would be a market for it. Like - maybe there should be people that own cars and drive other people from place to place for a reasonable fee. But, those people need to make their cars really identifiable - like painting all of their cars a bright color or something....

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Mantus

It's time for Mantus' patented - I know nothing about the people or situation but I'll throw in my two cents anyways - advice column!

Try to avoid the guilt trap, it makes for a weak relationship. Goes something like this:

You beg and plead for her to take you back. Buy her all sorts of jazz. She takes you back puts you in a guilt trap. You buys and plead some more, and more, and more, and you are her bitch and then she is like, oooooh another cock, shiny! And leaves you.


If you still wan't to persist, give her some space, like a week or two. When you talk to her again, try to keep mentions of the incident to a minimum. Tell her how much fun you've had with her and how much more fun you wana have. Tell her you are an inteligent guy that learns from his mistakes and that perhaps you need some one to keep you reigned in, if she is strong enough. Well you get the idea, no begging, keep your dignity, tell it how it is, focus on the good stuff.

Cheers. Good luck to ya.



(PS. Drunk driving jokes are worse then dead baby jokes so I've been a good boy and kept my mouth shut, but I was thinking about them and boy howdy was I tempted)

pig

To recapitulate some of the previous posters comments:

Yes, you fucked up. It happens. It's called life. That doesn't make driving drunken acceptable, but it's also not like chopping up a baby and putting it in the disposal. The drunkeness is not the crime, the hitting someone is. You were irresponsible, but she had better be pretty perfect in order for you to want to put up with that type of personality. Maybe it's just a hangup with her; fine, she'll have to learn to be less stringent about it or else alienate *a lot* of people she will meet. That's her choice.

Yours is whether or not you want to be on relationship probation with her over this, assuming it eventually could work out. If I were in your shoes, if you speak to her again and it comes up, I'd pretty much put my foot down. I'd tell her I didn't condone my behavior, but that I didn't really owe her an apology: she really wasn't involved in the situation, at all. Sure, I may have made a joke out it, but that's a common defense mechanism that virtually everyone uses to dispell being uncomfortable about their actions. She probably does it, she's probably being hypocritical, and if she wants to never speak again about it or to you again, fine - that's her choice. Out of your hands, etc. If not, then don't live in the shadow of these kinds of things. If she finds out that she can hold all of your fuck ups over you, then you're pretty much on the road to bitchville.

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guthmund

Look, you can only apologize so much. You done something stupid; you're sorry. What more is there to say?

If she doesn't cool down after a week, I'd just write her off. It's been said, but even if you do manage to straighten this out, her inflexibility is going rear its ugly head again, so, maybe you should avoid these sort of confessions in the future, yes?

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maleficent

You mean like a taxi cab?

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Martian

Whoa, what's everybody assuming she's frigid bitch from hell for? Do we even know if her uncle is still alive? Do we know when this happened? If you'd lost a family member six months ago to a drunk driver (just as an example) you'd probably be pretty anti-drunk driving too.

She had a very visceral reaction. She is very strongly against driving after drinking (probably even in very small amounts) and has difficulty reconciling a nice guy like you with the evil that is The Drunk Driver. She's confused, upset and betrayed.

Do you have a shot still? I don't know. Give it all you got if you think she's worth it, but frankly it looks to me like it's time to call this one.

Mantus - Please tell me that's not seriously how you believe women think.

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serlindsipity

if all things fail between you two, you have learned a good lesson or two. one, call a cab. its $40 versus $6000. Two - there are certain things people will never forgive others about. if its something that you may do, watch out.

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Sticky

...or maybe not.

I am not sorry for this. Somebody has to lecture (well not really lecture, but question).

What are you doing driving drunk?
Forget about the girl for a minute. Ask yourself why you drove drunk?
Are you sorry that you drove drunk, or are you sorry that you lost the girl becuase you told her about it?

If you are drunk, you don't blow a .04. There is a reason that the limit, currently anyway, is set at .08. This is the point after which the govt belives that you are drunk i.e. you can't drive a car. Any amount lower than that, according to the govt, means that you had a drink.
If you were drunk you would have blown higher than a .04.
Or conversly, if you would have blown a .04 you were not drunk.

Note: I did not mean to piss anybody off, but things need to be said. There are still too many people that do this. tspikes51 was very lucky that he did not hurt or kill anybody. It could have happened.

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Sticky The Stickman

World's King

Wait...

You met this girl at a party... you were both drunk... you go back to her house and fuck.

One date... And now she's acting all high and mighty about drinking and driving. She fucked you after knowing you for one night and she's gonna bitch about being you not be responsable? Get rid of her.

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snowy

Actually, assuming tspikes51 is the size of the average male, he could drink 3 drinks in an hour and still be legally able to drive. .08 is actually pretty damn drunk--if you've ever tried "drunk goggles" that are meant to illustrate impairment, they definitely prove this point.

Here is a chart for your perusal:



However, there's a reason it says "don't drink and drive" all over it. Don't do it. Bad idea. She's right to have chewed you out, but to be so inflexible...

Move on, dude.

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tenchi069

As for what you did, not the brightest in the world, but not the end of it ( the world that is ). Point being on that was that you got lucky. Regardless of your alchohol lvl, you didn't hit anyone and you didn't get arrested. Count your blessings there and never do it again. Learn from your mistakes and move on.

Regarding the girl. Yes things may have been fun when you went out, and possibly would have continued for awhile. As stated, everyone has deal breakers that they use as a rule to call things off with someone and this was hers. Don't blame her for being the way she is. Just move on and find another.

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tspikes51

I brought a 12 pack of High Life to the party. There were 4 left over. I weigh around 235. I started drinking at 11:00, left at 4:00, didn't drink the last hour before leaving. So that means I had 3 drinks left in me by the time I left. According to that chart, I had between a .04 and a .05. So there's that.

I have no idea or excuse for why I drove drunk. My best bet is that I wanted to get home before my parents got up. I am ASHAMED of myself that I drove home drunk. When I told my best friend about it, he couldn't believe it himself. I couldn't imagine having to live with myself after killing somebody. It was an awful thing to do. However, I can firmly say that you are being extremely self-righteous if you think that you would never do such a thing and that only horrible people do such things because I said the exact same thing at one time. I care much less about the girl; after all, she might only be around for a little while, this will stay with me for life.

That's pretty much what I told her, and exactly how I feel. As a guy, it's hard for me to be forwardly reprehensive about my actions. Don't bullshit and say it's any different: 99 out of 100 times, men are going to try and act confident and unemotional. It's pretty much a fact, I actually read something about it in Reader's Digest a while back. So, mal, and the rest of you wondering why, there you go. Not that it's right, it's just the way it is. Science sucks sometimes.

Anyways, I just think she's going a bit overboard by condemning me for a mistake I'm seriously sorry for. I'd also like to note that I'm probably the least likely person to drive drunk again. Not exactly sure what to do next... I'll probably just wait for a week or so, see if I run into her, and if not, drop her an IM just to see how she's doing.

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Sticky

But if you were .04 then you were not drunk when you drove.
I am not saying that all is OK, I am just saying that you were way below the limit.

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Sticky The Stickman

Sticky

I understand your response, but no I am not saying that you are horrible.
I do not think that I have any right in asking the questions of you. I wanted to get them out there to get so that you or anyopne else reading this thread would ask those questions of themselves.
I was not expecting you to answer these questions in the thread.
I could have amde all this more clear.

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Sticky The Stickman

tspikes51

That's not really the issue here. I didn't take a breathalyzer, and I'm not an expert in this area. I probably was relatively safe to drive according to the numbers (I don't remember crossing the center lines, and I also remember passing 2 police cruisers with no problem). I don't exactly know what you're trying to get at...

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analog

1. That chart only goes to 10, not very helpful for me.

2. I have no qualms about lecturing on this subject. Don't ever drive drunk again. Ever. Next time, sleep in your car.

3. I have major issues with drunk driving, but even I wouldn't immediately blast someone out of my life without finding out more about the extenuating circustances. So, there will be other dream girls, drop this one by the wayside.

jusolson00

I just gotta chim in here. And i'm not gonna sugar coat or say what is "expected". I dont see you driving home drunk, and by your explaination doesn't sound like you were very "drunk" to begin with, as being any sort of a problem. Sure it might have scared you and you might have learned a lesson, but I have a problem with everybody sounding all self rightous and lectureing people not to do it.. I've driven drunk many times back in my parting days. I couldnt take a taxi as I live a very rural community. no taxis.. And i was scared of being late for curfew, that I openly took the risk of driving drunk and not sleeping in my car. Point is.. does it make it right? no, probally not. But poeple do things for very different reasons, so I hate it when people get on their high horse and make all these generalizations about a situation. If i were at a .04 I wouldnt think twice about not driving. Hell thats probally what i would blow after going to the bars for a few hours and having 3-4 drinks. So back on point. I would give this girl some space.. let her get it out of her system and then try to contact her and apologize Don't keep trying to apologize and become her bitch. nobody likes a pushover.

Toaster126

My feeling on this has always been... sure I COULD drive. I have the ability and legal limit has not been reached, but I can also wait until more of the alcohol is out of my system. I am a high-functioning drunk, and I know I could quite easily drive home with a .08, but I don't ever NEED to. There are always more options.

If you felt like you were drunk, there are no excuses for you driving. Legal limit be damned. I hate to sound like an asshole, but that's how I feel.

This girl has issues regarding this, and I don't blame her. It's tough to lose someone to something completely preventable. I do think she should talk to you and explain why she is cutting communication better, but it's her call. I don't think you owe anyone an apology, though.

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tspikes51

Okay, my planned course of action is to drop her an IM within the next few days. Start out with just some simple conversation. If she mentions anything about it, we'll talk. If she refuses to accept my mistake as just that and move on, then I'll just calmly explain to her that the mistake's on her now and move on. Otherwise, I just let things progress again naturally. However, under no circumstances will I apologize to her or bring the subject up. I think I might just take a reverse approach to it and get her to ask me specific questions. She might just find that I'm just as, and probably more upset and confused by this whole thing than she is. I just plan to be brutally honest about it, and if she just feeds me the same lines, I'm out.

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trache

As analog said, "2. I have no qualms about lecturing on this subject. Don't ever drive drunk again. Ever. Next time, sleep in your car. "

If you do sleepin your car, do NOT put the keys in the ignition. Don't even start the car, even to keep yourself warm. If a police officer happens upon you, you will be charged for driving drunk (even if the car is in park).

I happened upon this thread and I can understand why everyone is lecturing, but a lecture probably wasn't what he is looking for, so why the threadjacking everyone? He just wants to know how to deal with the aftermath.

At any rate, first encounters happen at every stage of life. She doesn't know you and you don't know her. For her to make a snap decision of your character like after one night - that doesn't show any empathy on anyone's part except her own because of the things that happened in her past.

She sounds to me very selfish and unforgiving. It looks like you could be headed for trouble down the road anyway if you get involved with her. If you're bent on seeing this girl, I suggest calling her instead of throwing an instant message (if you have her phone number that is). At least that shows you're making an effort; instant messaging is so easy anyone can do it these days.

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Jinn

Likewise, sit in the passenger seat. In some states, sitting in the driver's seat, even with the ignition off, is OUI or DUI..

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rebeldog

Yeah, I have this policy about not trusting people who don't drink. Not that this is a direct reflection of that policy, but it comes close.

You were wrong and you know you were wrong, so it doesn't do a lot of good for her to beat up on you about it. Mabybe she is compensating for things she cannot control. Sounds to me like a girl with issues, I'm kind of supprised I never dated her....Or maybe I did.

tspikes51

I put up some away messages with a couple of harmless, popular jokes about women (i.e. "Why don't women need to wear watches... Because there's a clock on the stove," a joke that my roomie's girl told us) you know, the kind of stuff that's so far fetched that it would be obvious from the start that somebody actually thought that way. Little did I know (and much to my delight) that she was reading these messages. This was the end of last week.

Two nights ago, I put up an away message that was to the effect of "why won't women give me a second chance?" She woke me up with the answer "ur kind of racist and sexist." The only possibly racist comment I remember making around her is "he's Asian, of course he drives an Accord" which I thought was pretty benign. I said, "okay, I can see why you'd think that." Then she proceeded to tell me that those jokes I put up really offended her. For some reason, I apologized, and said I'm really not racist (which I'm not).

Needless to say, I'm not pursuing her anymore. Basically what I took out of this is that she's really judgemental. I have a big problem with people that can't look at a person as a whole. I could understand it if I were actually sexist, but there's a line between actually being sexist and finding humor in gender-based jokes.

Thanks for the advice all, I've sure learned a lot here.

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match000

I haven't read the entire thread, but the fact that you're still on her buddy list and that she bothers reading your away messages says a lot... doesn't it?

tspikes51

Yes... it says to me either A) this chick is desperate, B) this girl read somewhere that she should do something like this (I think one of her favorite books was "He's Not That Into You," which I think is a book that tries to help girls "understand" guy) to form a healthy relationship or some piece of equally worthless bullshit in Cosmo, which says to me she's a weak person, or C) she wants to abuse me as much as possible without at least having the common courtesy to give me ass. Any way you slice it, I think she's got some growing up to do before I would reconsider entering a relationship, she now seems really high-schoolish to me, and she's definitely cramping my style right now. My choice is simple now, don't talk to her unless I happen to see her (where a simple greeting is all I will initiate), and if she brings any of this up ever again without realizing the impact it had on me, tell her to go fuck herself until she grows up. That's all I'm gonna say about it.

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"I'm telling you, we need to get rid of a few people or a million."
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pan6467

TS,

No offense my friend but having read this it sounds you got some, messed up telling her about your driving incident... (may not have been what you did as much as how you made it sound....trust me I am king of foot in mouth).

I speak from personal experience.

It also sounds like, after reading this, you may have obsessed about her a bit, but not known much about her.... bad combination, been there done that and things I thought would get her "attention" so we could at least talk, backfired.

The away messages to you may have seemed harmless, but some people have been raised differently. She may sound judgemental, or she may have Asians in her family and took offense to what you thought was a harmless joke.

This one very lovely lady and I started dating and we talked about politics and issues, and we talked about prejudices. I told her that the only prejudice I had was against Filipino women, because when I was in the Navy, I saw guys marry them, bring them to the States and then when the men would go to sea the women were out cheating.....

Turns out her uncle was Navy and married to a Filipino woman and she was close to her. I came off as a real asshole to her. She didn't tell me that night but when she didn't call or answer my calls, a mutual friend told me to lay off her because of what I said. To me I was being honest to her, I showed prejudiced and hatred.

It also showed me how prejudice can destroy a relationship fast.

Anyway, let it go man. She obviously has an opinion of you now that seemingly you will never be able to change. It happens, trust me..... live and learn.

Women tend to pick up a lot more of what the man says, than we men pick up from what the women say (verbally or through body language), and we may not even realize we said or reacted a certain way because we just didn't think.

She may have let the Asian joke go, but then when you told her about being drunk, she thought you and her weren't a match. The away messages may have been the final draw or she thought you were meaning them toward her.

If you truly like this lady and wish to try to rectify everything, try writing her a letter from your heart explaining you have faults and you're young, but you really would like to get to know her and see her again.

One of three things will happen:

1) she'll ignore it r send a nasty letter back

2) she'll read it and send you a letter back explaining that she just doesn't think it will work

or

3) it'll break the ice and the two of you will start talking again.

There's also the great possibility she was horny, found you used you for her kicks and thrills and never wanted anything. And she's just using excuses to try to get rid of you, so that she doesn't feel cheap or bad..... That would not surprise me, men and women have done it since the beginning of time to each other.

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match000

I think if you really think this way and are not kidding/forcing yourself into saying this out of some secret obsession over her (I'm not trying to sound sarcastic or rude), then this is a good choice. If you do somehow still like her, and that you think this attitude will somehow make her like you more, then well, I guess you'd be playing games then.

But hey, I have no experience, so what do I know.

highthief

I agree with this - yes, you made a mistake, but anyone worth being with will forgive you at least one mistake (and in the case of a serious relationship, many more than one).

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tspikes51

So, I saw her at work today... one of the strangest feelings I think you can have is talk to somebody you wish would just disappear. She was with some girlfriends, so I can't really accurately gauge anything, but all that was said was "what's up" when I went down the same aisle she was in whilst coming back from break. She didn't even look at me walking out the door. This came as a relief to me, I didn't have to feel like I was forced to talk to her.

Also, her away message last night said "I'm going to bed since no guy will call me. I'm tired of the jerks." I was tempted to respond with "I wonder why?" Either it's an attempt to get me to call her, or talking about another guy. Either way, sounds like she's desperate, which is reassuring to me.

pan, I think you nailed it... I was a bit obsessed, but hey, the first one always hits hard (first girl I'd dated in 2 years, first girl I'd gone that far sexually on) I think. At any rate, I'm not worried about any kind of reconciliation, whether it be my reputation (she's really the only person I know that doesn't think that I'm a good guy), or especially a relationship. Her loss, not mine.

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tspikes51

So, just so you all know, last night she sent me an instant message out of the blue, and after a bit of idle chatter, she apologized to me for acting like she did. She said that she was trying to find reasons not to like me because she was scared of being in a relationship. So I figure I'll give her another shot.

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"I'm telling you, we need to get rid of a few people or a million."
-Maddox

Sweetpea

She seems a bit immature to me...

Do what you like but don't expect it to get serious any time soon until she grows up a bit (or allot)

On a side note: I wouldn't write someone off the First time they drove drunk, but hell yeah, i'd read them the riot act ... but IF they did it again, then i wouldn't hang out with them/be friends with them or date them.
Drunk driving = bad. But i highly doubt you'll do it again, as you've learned your lesson i think

Take is slow with this gal and/or just have fun.

sweetpea

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tspikes51

Yep, that's what I intend to do, sweetpea. She told me she hadn't ever "liked" someone before (I know, I thought we all got over this in high-school), and I'm not really looking at getting "serious" with her just quite yet, it's just that she said that she really "liked [me] from the get-go" and that she still does, and I kind of feel an obligation to let this play out; at least let her learn under some caring guidance (lest she learn from some random asshole).

Oh, and you definitely don't have to worry about me ever drinking and driving again.

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Toaster126

This sounds like disaster waiting to happen.

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"The truth is that our finest moments are most likely to occur when we are feeling deeply uncomfortable, unhappy, or unfulfilled. For it is only in such moments, propelled by our discomfort, that we are likely to step out of our ruts and start searching for different ways or truer answers." (M. Scott Peck)

ktspktsp

As I was reading this thread, I was thinking "maybe she was just trying to come up with an excuse not to see him again". And that's what the situation apparently was, according to post #34.

This does not seem healthy. Proceed at your own risk.

JumpinJesus

It sounds to me like she's a bit manipulative. In an earlier post you posted that if she brought it up again, you'd tell her to go fuck herself until she grows up.

I'd say that this is still in order. If she's not old enough to be upfront and is playing this kind of game (ignoring your greeting, leaving childish-sounding away messages) then she's not mature enough to handle dating.

I'd not even waste any more time on her. Let her grow up.

Meh, but it's your choice, so do what you gotta do.

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