Purpose of the female orgasm in reproduction - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

theguyondacouch · 11-11-2003, 08:13 PM

What is the purpose of the female orgasm from a reproduction stand point only? I realize that the feamle orgasm is nessecary for a healthy sexual relationship. But, It has no obvious purpose for reproduction. What role does it play in reproduction? This is of course from a physical standpoint only. I have wondered this for a long time. Any one have any answers?

lordjeebus · 11-11-2003, 08:14 PM

I'd say it's the same as the purpose of the male orgasm -- to give a pleasurable bit of incentive for reproduction.

TinniT · 11-11-2003, 08:20 PM

anybody know Dr. Ruth? :-) :-)

theguyondacouch · 11-11-2003, 08:20 PM

This is all I got from google,

Quote:

Biological differentiation into male and female makes sexual reproduction possible. Males have two sex chromosomes, an X and a Y; females have two X chromosomes. Sexual differentiation is determined by the presence or absence of the Y chromosome. If there is no Y chromosome, development is along female lines. A specific part of the Y chromosome, the SRY (sex-determining gene region of the Y chromosome) is responsible for male differentiation (Haqq & Donahoe, 1998). This results in the differentiation of the primitive gonad into a testis rather than an ovary during early fetal development. The resulting testis produces not only testosterone but also Mullerian Inhibiting Factor (MIF) which actively suppresses any further development of those parts of the embryo which would otherwise develop into internal female reproductive organs. The testosterone stimulates development of male genitalia and reproductive organs: It also has organizing effects on the central nervous system which are not well understood but which increase the likelihood of male patterns of behavior after birth (Collaer & Hines, 1995). The SRY, or possibly other parts of the Y chromosome, may have other gender differentiating effects on the central nervous system which are not dependent on testosterone, but these have not as yet been identified.

The bisexual potential of the embryo allows for selection of development along either male or female lines (Beach, 1976). In some instances, as with the gonad becoming either a testis or an ovary, or the female reproductive tract being actively suppressed during male development, there is clear differentiation. In other cases, such as the nipples of the male or the clitoris of the female, there is no biological need to suppress their development, even though they play no direct role in sexual reproduction. This undifferentiated overlap between male and female may apply to other structures or functions, such as orgasm in the female. Whereas orgasm is essential for the male's contribution to reproduction, orgasm in the female has no obvious reproductive purpose. It has been argued that female orgasm has positive benefits which would justify its existence on evolutionary grounds, but it seems more likely that its benefits to women are a "biological bonus" resulting from the absence of active suppression of its development (Lloyd, 1993; Symons, 1979). The role that female orgasm plays in the interaction between biology and culture is probably complex, and its relevance to the cultural shaping of women's sexuality is poorly understood. There is good historical evidence, however, of the extent to which cultural constraints have made it difficult for women to realize their full biological sexual potential (Bancroft, in press-a).

The rest of the article is here

http://www.findarticles.com/cf_0/m23.../article.jhtml

theguyondacouch · 11-11-2003, 08:27 PM

Guess I should have googled it first

smallequestrian · 11-11-2003, 08:27 PM

I had to write an article review for an Anthro class a couple of years ago on the same subject. Its a synopsis of the two main arguments for why it exists. Enjoy!

"The complex issue of female orgasm comes down to two opposing factors: is it an adaptation or an artifact. The view of female orgasm as an adaptation is really a true Darwinian look based upon that natural selection somehow favored female orgasm and that is the reason it exists. The opposing viewpoint says, in a very simplified form, that females have orgasms because males do.
The artifact argument bases itself not just on the genitalia but also use the nipples as a source of information. When you look at male nipples you wonder what their purpose is. Male nipples certainly do not lactate like they do in females, so what possible reason could they have to exist? The same approach can be taken when the penis and the clitoris are examined. The purpose of the penis is to ejaculate sperm into the female vaginally through the male’s orgasm. The clitoris does not actually serve to release gametes, as the penis does, but still retains the male function as a source of orgasm. The nipples and the genitalia of both sexes are linked together through embryology. Embryology shows that at the beginning of prenatal development males and females start out with essentially the same equipment and that it is only later in the pregnancy that the structure of the genitalia actually starts to differentiate.
Gould says that the reason males and females are structurally analogous is that it is developmentally prohibitive to waste energy on developing completely separate structures. Therefore, while orgasm was adapted for in the male with the purpose of releasing gametes through the penis, it would have been developmentally prohibitive to totally redesign the female just because the clitoris doesn’t serve the same purpose. It is also important to note why Gould and Symons would say that the clitoris doesn’t serve a purpose even though through its direct stimulation it causes orgasm. The central argument to that, is that if female orgasm was an adapted for trait, why is it such an infrequent occurrence in females as cited by the many studies in Symons article and if male orgasm is a product of sexual intercourse, then why is not the clitoris in the vagina where it would receive direct stimulation during sexual intercourse?
Of course, Alcock and Alexander would argue that orgasm is adapted for trait in females and that it is infrequent for a reason. Female orgasm, as hypothesized by Alexander is a tool to enhance pair bonds and a tool of communication. Females are more likely to have orgasms with males they prefer, in attempt to reassure the males that they are disinclined to seek sex elsewhere. If this is correct, female orgasm would show outward signs, mimic that of male orgasm, frequently involve deception, occur more often in long-term satisfying relationships with dominant or superior males, and occur less often with casual or lesser males. This all leading to the outcome that female orgasm is an adaptation in order to secure a male that will be best suited to help with parental care. Alcock looks at what Gould says, and basically says how dare you say the clitoris is useless, and to a certain extent he Alcock has a point.
Gould countered this argument with this: “its logically incorrect equation of current utility with reasons of historical origin. The range of biological utility is vastly greater than the domain of function for immediate reproductive success.” Just because female orgasm might happen more often between a couple with a better relationship now, doesn’t mean it served the same purpose at its origin. And, I think that this best relates why just because something is there, doesn’t mean that there is a direct purpose.
Unfortunately, the whole argument between the two sides seems to get lost in what appears to be a general loathing for what Alexander deems “anti-intellectual” thinking. While Alexander does seem to possess some valid points, he does, and admittedly so, really seeks to prove his point by trying to deconstruct Gould’s arguments rather than raise compelling arguments of his own. And at the same time Alexander seems to do it derisively which somewhat undermines what he is trying to say."

sexymama · 11-11-2003, 09:04 PM

I saw a show once (I believe on the Learning Channel) about human sexuality. It showed a camera inserted into a woman having an orgasm. They found that the orgasm actually caused the cervix to pulse down and pull sperm up into the uterus. It was fascinating to watch and seems like a good reason for a female orgasm. (Not to mention the pleasure

)

Dilbert1234567 · 11-11-2003, 11:30 PM

make you come back for more

bermuDa · 11-12-2003, 01:53 AM

sex feels good, they want more, increasing the chance of conception.

SecretMethod70 · 11-12-2003, 02:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sexymama
I saw a show once (I believe on the Learning Channel) about human sexuality. It showed a camera inserted into a woman having an orgasm. They found that the orgasm actually caused the cervix to pulse down and pull sperm up into the uterus. It was fascinating to watch and seems like a good reason for a female orgasm. (Not to mention the pleasure)

Also saw that. I see no reason to think otherwise. It makes perfect sense.

vveronica · 11-12-2003, 10:02 AM

okay the actual answer is simple...

If I dont get an orgasm... He is not getting the chance...
I figure it is an evolutionary thing. hundreds of thousands of years ago there was no female orgasm. and hundred thousand years from know .... Wow I hope i get to come back because it will have to be great... Guys will all be hung like horses and look like Brad Pitt and our orgasms will last for hours... sigh... damn... having to wait

oberon · 11-12-2003, 04:36 PM

I think your imagination is wild, vveronica!

I also think orgasms are mental incentives, although I suppose they might serve to push sperm where it's supposed to go...

Amano · 11-12-2003, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sexymama
I saw a show once (I believe on the Learning Channel) about human sexuality. It showed a camera inserted into a woman having an orgasm. They found that the orgasm actually caused the cervix to pulse down and pull sperm up into the uterus. It was fascinating to watch and seems like a good reason for a female orgasm. (Not to mention the pleasure)

how in the world did she orgasm with instruments placed up her, is what i want to know!

drawerfixer · 11-12-2003, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Amano
how in the world did she orgasm with instruments placed up her, is what i want to know!

It's pretty easy to put a small camera in a dildo.

Mango · 11-13-2003, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sexymama
I saw a show once (I believe on the Learning Channel) about human sexuality. It showed a camera inserted into a woman having an orgasm. They found that the orgasm actually caused the cervix to pulse down and pull sperm up into the uterus. It was fascinating to watch and seems like a good reason for a female orgasm. (Not to mention the pleasure)

I saw the same show and was going to post a similar response.

Dale Kemp · 11-13-2003, 04:00 PM

SexyMama and vveronica have it right. I was going to post that, but they've beaten me to it. There is a little cup shape at the inner end of the vagina that holds semen when a woman lies on her back. Then when the cervix dips down, it presses into this little cup shape, and that squeezes the semen through the cervix, into the uterus. The poor semen still have to cross the uterus, and get up into the fallopian tubes, to find the ovum, but the woman's orgasm gives them (a far greater number of them) a good start.

tdoc · 11-15-2003, 01:26 PM

I couldn't believe it when I saw it on Discovery channel. I figured that would get censored on cable.

motdakasha · 11-16-2003, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sexymama
I saw a show once (I believe on the Learning Channel) about human sexuality. It showed a camera inserted into a woman having an orgasm. They found that the orgasm actually caused the cervix to pulse down and pull sperm up into the uterus. It was fascinating to watch and seems like a good reason for a female orgasm. (Not to mention the pleasure)

It's called The Human Animal narrated by Desmond Morris. (GOOD documentary) I think they usually try to play it once a year or so on TLC.
Near the back of the vagina is like a reservoir for sperm. When you orgasm, the muscles contract such that the cervix is dipped into the reservoir of sperm. The act of doing this makes it easier for sperm to make their way to the uterus. This is part of the biological explanation as to why men are supposed to orgasm first.

Not sure which is uterus and which is vagina? Click here.

Want to purchase the video? (It's costly, but definitely educational.) Click here.

legolas · 11-16-2003, 12:35 PM

That is facinating. I think that's great.

potato · 11-16-2003, 01:24 PM

Hehe. Nice write up/

VF19 · 11-16-2003, 03:26 PM

Makes you wonder.

But then why isnt the clit somewhere where it can be stimulated easilier (sp?)

mime64 · 11-16-2003, 05:41 PM

This is all assuming that evolution isnt the biggest bull crap lie the system ever programmed into the minds of us poor susceptible college students since middle school. Being of course there is no missing link for any 2 set of species nor is evolution reproducible in a lab unlike every other scientific truth we've come up with. But, go on kids, keep telling yourself nature is responsible for the whole orgasm thing and we'll all go on as happy little drones. Anyways, I agree that the female orgasm is really just a way of inticing the female into participating

hahaha · 11-16-2003, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sexymama
I saw a show once (I believe on the Learning Channel) about human sexuality. It showed a camera inserted into a woman having an orgasm. They found that the orgasm actually caused the cervix to pulse down and pull sperm up into the uterus. It was fascinating to watch and seems like a good reason for a female orgasm. (Not to mention the pleasure)

yeah, very interesting program, I forget what it was called though

analog · 11-21-2003, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tdoc
I couldn't believe it when I saw it on Discovery channel. I figured that would get censored on cable.

It's not hardcore porn, it's biological and medical research, and wouldn't really matter, but cable has no set of rules anyway. There's actually an entire thread on that very subject over in General Discussion, it will explain everything.

motdakasha · 11-21-2003, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by hahaha
yeah, very interesting program, I forget what it was called though

[major sarcasm]It's great how people skip right over my posts. Woo! [/major sarcasm]

I must be really boring or something.

la petite moi · 11-24-2003, 04:55 PM

I'm sure everyone before me has said this, but when a girl orgasms, she gets all lube-y and slimy, so it helps the good little spermies to go and attack the ovaries! And also, it helps a big penis go into a little hole! =D

11-11-2003, 08:13 PM	#1 (permalink)
theguyondacouch salmon? Location: Outside Providence	Purpose of the female orgasm in reproduction What is the purpose of the female orgasm from a reproduction stand point only? I realize that the feamle orgasm is nessecary for a healthy sexual relationship. But, It has no obvious purpose for reproduction. What role does it play in reproduction? This is of course from a physical standpoint only. I have wondered this for a long time. Any one have any answers? __________________ "Lick my frozen metal ass!"

11-11-2003, 08:27 PM	#5 (permalink)
theguyondacouch salmon? Location: Outside Providence	Guess I should have googled it first __________________ "Lick my frozen metal ass!"

11-11-2003, 08:27 PM	#6 (permalink)
smallequestrian Upright	this is an article review I wrote... I had to write an article review for an Anthro class a couple of years ago on the same subject. Its a synopsis of the two main arguments for why it exists. Enjoy! "The complex issue of female orgasm comes down to two opposing factors: is it an adaptation or an artifact. The view of female orgasm as an adaptation is really a true Darwinian look based upon that natural selection somehow favored female orgasm and that is the reason it exists. The opposing viewpoint says, in a very simplified form, that females have orgasms because males do. The artifact argument bases itself not just on the genitalia but also use the nipples as a source of information. When you look at male nipples you wonder what their purpose is. Male nipples certainly do not lactate like they do in females, so what possible reason could they have to exist? The same approach can be taken when the penis and the clitoris are examined. The purpose of the penis is to ejaculate sperm into the female vaginally through the male’s orgasm. The clitoris does not actually serve to release gametes, as the penis does, but still retains the male function as a source of orgasm. The nipples and the genitalia of both sexes are linked together through embryology. Embryology shows that at the beginning of prenatal development males and females start out with essentially the same equipment and that it is only later in the pregnancy that the structure of the genitalia actually starts to differentiate. Gould says that the reason males and females are structurally analogous is that it is developmentally prohibitive to waste energy on developing completely separate structures. Therefore, while orgasm was adapted for in the male with the purpose of releasing gametes through the penis, it would have been developmentally prohibitive to totally redesign the female just because the clitoris doesn’t serve the same purpose. It is also important to note why Gould and Symons would say that the clitoris doesn’t serve a purpose even though through its direct stimulation it causes orgasm. The central argument to that, is that if female orgasm was an adapted for trait, why is it such an infrequent occurrence in females as cited by the many studies in Symons article and if male orgasm is a product of sexual intercourse, then why is not the clitoris in the vagina where it would receive direct stimulation during sexual intercourse? Of course, Alcock and Alexander would argue that orgasm is adapted for trait in females and that it is infrequent for a reason. Female orgasm, as hypothesized by Alexander is a tool to enhance pair bonds and a tool of communication. Females are more likely to have orgasms with males they prefer, in attempt to reassure the males that they are disinclined to seek sex elsewhere. If this is correct, female orgasm would show outward signs, mimic that of male orgasm, frequently involve deception, occur more often in long-term satisfying relationships with dominant or superior males, and occur less often with casual or lesser males. This all leading to the outcome that female orgasm is an adaptation in order to secure a male that will be best suited to help with parental care. Alcock looks at what Gould says, and basically says how dare you say the clitoris is useless, and to a certain extent he Alcock has a point. Gould countered this argument with this: “its logically incorrect equation of current utility with reasons of historical origin. The range of biological utility is vastly greater than the domain of function for immediate reproductive success.” Just because female orgasm might happen more often between a couple with a better relationship now, doesn’t mean it served the same purpose at its origin. And, I think that this best relates why just because something is there, doesn’t mean that there is a direct purpose. Unfortunately, the whole argument between the two sides seems to get lost in what appears to be a general loathing for what Alexander deems “anti-intellectual” thinking. While Alexander does seem to possess some valid points, he does, and admittedly so, really seeks to prove his point by trying to deconstruct Gould’s arguments rather than raise compelling arguments of his own. And at the same time Alexander seems to do it derisively which somewhat undermines what he is trying to say."

11-11-2003, 09:04 PM	#7 (permalink)
sexymama My own person -- his by choice Location: Lebell's arms	I saw a show once (I believe on the Learning Channel) about human sexuality. It showed a camera inserted into a woman having an orgasm. They found that the orgasm actually caused the cervix to pulse down and pull sperm up into the uterus. It was fascinating to watch and seems like a good reason for a female orgasm. (Not to mention the pleasure) __________________ If you can go deeply into lovemaking, the ego disappears. That is the beauty of lovemaking, that it is another source of a glimpse of god It's not about being perfect; it's about developing some skill at managing imperfection.

11-11-2003, 11:30 PM	#8 (permalink)
Dilbert1234567 Devils Cabana Boy Location: Central Coast CA	make you come back for more __________________ Donate Blood! "Love is not finding the perfect person, but learning to see an imperfect person perfectly." -Sam Keen

11-11-2003, 08:14 PM	#2 (permalink)
lordjeebus ‚±‚Ìˆó˜U‚ª–Ú‚É“ü‚ç‚Ê‚© Location: College	I'd say it's the same as the purpose of the male orgasm -- to give a pleasurable bit of incentive for reproduction.

11-11-2003, 08:20 PM	#3 (permalink)
TinniT Crazy	anybody know Dr. Ruth? :-) :-)

11-12-2003, 01:53 AM	#9 (permalink)
bermuDa don't ignore this--> Location: CA	sex feels good, they want more, increasing the chance of conception. __________________ I am the very model of a moderator gentleman.

11-12-2003, 10:02 AM	#11 (permalink)
vveronica Psycho Location: northern california	okay the actual answer is simple... If I dont get an orgasm... He is not getting the chance... I figure it is an evolutionary thing. hundreds of thousands of years ago there was no female orgasm. and hundred thousand years from know .... Wow I hope i get to come back because it will have to be great... Guys will all be hung like horses and look like Brad Pitt and our orgasms will last for hours... sigh... damn... having to wait __________________ ...We find ourselves in a struggle for our very right to exsist... We will not go quietly into the night... We will not give up without a fight...

11-12-2003, 04:36 PM	#12 (permalink)
oberon Quadrature Amplitude Modulator Location: Denver	I think your imagination is wild, vveronica! I also think orgasms are mental incentives, although I suppose they might serve to push sperm where it's supposed to go... __________________ "There are finer fish in the sea than have ever been caught." -- Irish proverb

11-13-2003, 04:00 PM	#16 (permalink)
Dale Kemp Crazy Location: New Mexico	SexyMama and vveronica have it right. I was going to post that, but they've beaten me to it. There is a little cup shape at the inner end of the vagina that holds semen when a woman lies on her back. Then when the cervix dips down, it presses into this little cup shape, and that squeezes the semen through the cervix, into the uterus. The poor semen still have to cross the uterus, and get up into the fallopian tubes, to find the ovum, but the woman's orgasm gives them (a far greater number of them) a good start. __________________ Trueheart

11-15-2003, 01:26 PM	#17 (permalink)
tdoc Tilted	I couldn't believe it when I saw it on Discovery channel. I figured that would get censored on cable.

11-16-2003, 12:35 PM	#19 (permalink)
legolas shit faced cockmaster Location: CT	That is facinating. I think that's great. __________________ "To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems."

11-16-2003, 01:24 PM	#20 (permalink)
potato Banned	Hehe. Nice write up/

11-16-2003, 03:26 PM	#21 (permalink)
VF19 Banned Location: back to my old location	Makes you wonder. But then why isnt the clit somewhere where it can be stimulated easilier (sp?)

11-16-2003, 05:41 PM	#22 (permalink)
mime64 Upright	Yeah ok This is all assuming that evolution isnt the biggest bull crap lie the system ever programmed into the minds of us poor susceptible college students since middle school. Being of course there is no missing link for any 2 set of species nor is evolution reproducible in a lab unlike every other scientific truth we've come up with. But, go on kids, keep telling yourself nature is responsible for the whole orgasm thing and we'll all go on as happy little drones. Anyways, I agree that the female orgasm is really just a way of inticing the female into participating

11-24-2003, 04:55 PM	#26 (permalink)
la petite moi Filling the Void. Location: California	I'm sure everyone before me has said this, but when a girl orgasms, she gets all lube-y and slimy, so it helps the good little spermies to go and attack the ovaries! And also, it helps a big penis go into a little hole! =D