I'm an embarrassment to the human race.
 

you know it's true.

Moving to Seattle, getting a good job...

do these things make me happy?

does my location, and my job, a manmade construct, make me happy?

no.. I chase the long term goal of finding a person who will make me happy.

I think happiness if found in the natural interaction within your social circle. You could be poor, but if you had love, you'd be fine.


I don't think anyone's story can compare to mine at this point. I'm relentlessly stupid, I go against good advice, and the catch is, I'm still not done.


I moved here after my ex expressed interest in getting back together. Apparently I made the assumption that a commitment was ever implied, even though it wasn't.

Her reasons.. She missed me, she wanted me around, she was warming up to the idea of us being together again. She was telling people that we were getting back together as soon as I made my decision.

one particular weekend she was talking to me on msn and going off about how horny she was, telling me how I was the best oral sex she's ever had, and wanted me over there right then. I wasn't supposed to be out there for another 2 weeks at this point.

This is about the time i started getting the story from her that she made out with this guy from work that had been hitting on her for 4 months. that was the last I heard about anything.

I moved out here 1 week ago and so far it goes as such.

the 21st, I arrive. tired, sleep.

22nd, I start my job search, I get 3 interviews set up, including one that night. She informs me that she actually did sleep with that guy after she told me she wouldn't, that she wasn't thinking about me, it was selfish of her, and that she may be pregnant. I'm pretty pissed.

23rd, interview goes well for 2 out of 3, I pick one to pursue for higher pay. I get that job set to start on the 25th, I read up on the effects of the plan B she took and i start to believe that her so called pregnancy symptoms are just side effects. I am still "ok" with her sleeping with this guy for some reason at this point because she's got that technical loophole that "we're not in a relationship, I can sleep with whoever I want" and she can and sill.

24th, I bum around, waiting for amanda to get off work, she informs me she's going to go out with her friend, who is a part of some burlesque dancer troupe or whatever, girls night out. Fine, I need a break away from her to think about what I'm going to do.

25th, I start work, we go out to dinner that night and get sushi, she tells me that last night was a bit out of control, that some guy was very forward with her, and her friend she was with pulled her away from the guy and they started to drive off, but the guy chased them down the street and was begging her not to go, jumped in the car and gave her a cramped lapdance and started kissing her. They kicked him out of the car, Then he proceeded to whip it out and told her to suck it in the street near the club. she declined, saying I'm not a whore... cant really blame her for the actions of some other guy, and we're not together, right?

she asks if i'm paying for dinner, I ask if we're dating, she says no, then I tell her to pay for her own shit then.

our bill comes, the guy pretty much ignores amanda and hands me the bill. Amanda says she likes how people act towards me and treat me like I have power. I pay the bill anyways, fucking sucker...


26th, work again, i come home and I get a message on my computer from the guy she left me for a year ago.

Reads as such.

So this brandon guy, I knew about, she's not interested in him. He's interested in her. He made the move on he to kiss her and she felt nothing. She wants him as a friend, but nothing more
Alberto is the guy she works with (and fuck no i'm not changing names to protect identities, let these assholes find me)
Greg, is the ex she told me she stopped talking to, who has a gf, who cheats on said GF with Amanda, and Amanda uses this to blackmail him in to fucking her whenever she feels like it. He gets tired of it and PM's me so he can wash his hands of it.

In my mind, ALL OF THIS SHIT HAPPENED BEFORE I MOVED, IT DOESN"T MATTER RIGHT?


I call her up immediately after I get this and start demanding answers, she admits to sleeping with greg, says he made up the part or misunderstood about the blowjob part and that she already told me what happened.


27th, work again. I'm off, i've been invited to a halloween party by Justin. I get home and then the truth comes out about her sucking a guys cock on wednesday, after i've shown up, after I live with her.

She did it, her story.

"well after we ran that one guy off, we were all piled in the back seat and this guy was back there with us making out with my friend, and he was reaching over and rubbing my leg, and it was kinda turning me on, then he started fingering me and eventually pulled it out and trying to get us to suck it, saying he was going to cum so fast, that he wanted to cum so badly. I was horny, and I did, but the guy was a jerk cuz he just zipped up and got out of the car and left us both sitting there once he got off."

again, she jumps on the fact that we're not together, and that she can do what she wants.

but she lied to me you know? she told me she didn't do this when her ex knew more than I did. he had to tell me.

I'm pretty much just like "fine" and go to my friends halloween party and socialize best I can. But being in seattle feels so hollow and without focus now.

so the 28th
today, I wake up and my hand is on amanda's back, and I just start rubbing it out of habit. She moans. She's enjoying it. I just stop after a while because I'm not sure what the hell i'm doing. I know she's "easy" I know she wants to be with me, but she wants to be with a lot of people right now. I'm too jealous to handle that.

I can't trust her now, she lied to me, of course, 2 wrongs make a right when you need to justify doing something. She got up and went to the living room, came back and told me she got her period so she's not pregnant, went and fell asleep on the couch, I took her cell phone....

the texts told this story.

sunday, I get here
monday, i have an interview, she's gushing at greg that she wants to come over and fuck him, or she's going to tell his gf that he cheated on her 2 weeks ago, he declines on the premise that she's fucking with me and that he's not cool with that(i like this guy and his morals all of a sudden I guess)

wednesday, the texts of her telling him what she did with the guys in the car, and a few casual flirty texts to alberto, and me.

thursday, the texts I sent after calling her about the pm I got, her texts to greg expressing her loss of power in the situation with him and her.

friday, her telling him that she'd choose him if he were an option, but that he wont let her, on top of the texts where she told me that she wasn't talking to him anymore, and a text replying to greg saying "fuck off and stay out of my life" with "whatever we'll just be fucking again in 2 months anyway, see ya later"



so dear TFPer's

have no pity for me, you've given me all the advice you can.

I apparently am so fucking stuck on her just like she's stuck on the guy she left me for that we're just a big fucking trainwreck of misguided emotion.

I confronted her about the texts and she just got angry that i'd violate her trust like that, but again, 2 wrongs make a right when I fucking feel like it.


theres no healthy relationship to be gained from this, we've done nothing but fight about her fucking guys since i've got here, and she just says she doesn't have to explain anything to me because we're not together.

But you know, I feel differently since her whole premise for the offer to begin with was for us to start dating again.

can you even compare? can you even imagine how i feel?

I know how you feel, man. You aren't alone, bro.

Everybody knows my cliche story: Newly married guy go on his second combat deployment. Batshit cheating "lonely" wife. Minute Rice style Divorce. Lies. Deceit. Debilitating pain. Broken hearts. Having to go back to the desert and deal with it alone. Questions that are never answered.

She put a grenade in your chest and waited to pull the pin later.

She's a skank, dude. You're not a tool, man... stop being used like one.

You got a good job and a future regardless of where you go.

That is a really rough situation and I cannot possibly relate to how you feel. One exception is with knowing what it's like to be in a relationship with a chronic liar/cheat. That's not fun at all and unfortunately with this person it's not likely to change. The best thing to do is to make the best of the situation by enjoying your new digs and build a new life without this menace who is fucking your over and content to live with comfortably herself while doing so. She's bad news as in bad bad bad news bears bad. Let her go, kick her arse right 100% out of your life and thank her for making you stronger as a person.

I can't compare and I wouldn't want to imagine myself in your shoes.

It's one thing to have your trust violated by someone you love - that's just one of the many risks of loving someone. But it's an entirely different case when you can't even trust yourself enough not to tirelessly waste your time and emotions on someone who very obviously does not deserve them.

If she wants to sleep around then that's perfectly fine - it's her life and her choice. But you are beyond the point of excuses and no longer deserving of advice that anyone could offer you.

What are you going to do?

i dont fucking know, all i can do is be sad.

if anyone feels like talking to me one on one about this i think it might be more effective than this forum stuff.

my msn and aim should be in my profile. if not i'll put them in as soon as I post this. I'm just at a loss here..

When you daydream about the life you want, it never includes living it Jerry Springer style, does it?
Great. Get out.
Get out NOW. I don't think she can illustrate how useless and awful she is any better than she has. Please, please, respect yourself. Get out.

You've got a job now, so now is the time to craigslist it up and find yourself a new apartment closer to work. Seriously. Go do that now. Right now. Stop reading TFP and feeling sorry for yourself. You've done that to death, now is the time for fucking ACTION. You got a JOB, you don't need her to survive, so MOVE. Block her cell phone number and her AIM name and any other form of communication. Get a fucking restraining order if you have to. GO DO IT NOW.

I bet you can move by November 1st.

This is going to suck for a long time. Let it. But focus on the anger, not on the sadness... you've been sad long enough. Do you really need any more proof? You don't, you know you don't.
Leave. Now.

Yep.

i third ustwo and jess. just drop this scenario and go find better places to play. the kids you're hanging out with piss in the sandbox man.

I can understand the bit about missing someone. I still miss my ex-wife, and hope that she gets herself straightened out...as she's in a HUGE mess right now. Good luck, whatever you do, but in this case, you're gonna have to look out for yourself, since she's not.

What Jess, Ustwo, and Pig said.

You've read it in TFP multiple times: the pain will stay with you for a long time, and at this moment you don't feel like it will ever get better. Cliched as it sounds, it *will* get better. In the meantime, cry, physically abuse things that you can't hurt and won't hurt you (I recommend punching the mattress or pillows, but that was just me), and then take action like Jess said. Having something to do, a goal of getting a place and getting set up, will do wonders in that it is something to occupy your mind. Keep telling yourself that you deserve better - because you DO. Now, do what Jess said. Now.

Good luck and be true.

Well, best I can say here is sack up. She's a whore who doesn't charge, and that's probably a compliment. You've got to do something at this point, and I would suggest sleeping with one of her friends, saluting her afterwards, and saying "later, bitch."

Reading that nearly made me sick... it is unbelievable how much disrespect some people can have for themselves and others. Her actions are in no way justifiable, whether she's committed to anyone or not, because she is just flat-out disrespecting everyone involved.

That being said... honestly, you're not in that bad of a spot. You're at a very significant fork in the road, one much like in the movies where you look down one fork and see grass and animals and sunlight and life, and then you look down the other and see darkness, dead trees, fog, and doom... I'll let you take a wild guess at which fork represents her.

Basically, you're in a position now to move on an make a new life in Seattle, which is a very exciting prospect. Or, you could continue to try and win this girl over, forgive her for all she has done so far, try and patch up the trust issues, and then deal with all her future promiscuity and deceit, which may or may not result in a Maury Povich "I don't know who the father is" situation in the near future.

Sometimes it is tough to choose a path, even when we know which path is the right one. The important thing to remember is that you need to look forward and focus on your future... and not let your past control or limit you from getting where you want to go or from being who you want to be.

I wouldn't say you're a disgrace to the human race; Just males in general.

Like everyone else has said, I think it'd be a good time to cut your losses. It's deathly apparent that this chick doesn't respect you (Or herself for that matter, either), so why continue to chase after something which is nothing more than a pipe dream? Personally, if it were me, I'd probably call her a whore and tell her to pound sand (But, of course, you're not me, and that's probably not something you want to do).

Actually, I wonder why you keep talking to her?

I was somebody's bitch once.

I'll never be anyone's bitch again. I am my own Bitch--I don't need to be anyone else's.

The point is, you have to go through the wringer before you learn that lesson. We've all been there. We've all done what you're doing. A favorite quote of mine goes, "Wisdom is learning from other people's mistakes." And as much as we would hope that you could learn from our lessons, and be wise, we also all know that this is one of those lessons you have to learn yourself for it to really be true.

One morning, years from now, you'll wake up and think, "I'm not her bitch any more."

I will confess to this: the ex whose bitch I was lived in an apartment next to mine a couple years ago, a few years after we broke up. Though all that time had passed, and I was in another relationship with more than a few in between, the sight of him still disturbed me.

Now, though I have said you must learn this lesson yourself, I will also say: No one deserves the kind of emotional abuse you are allowing yourself to be put through. Stop being a doormat.

My advice: Get an advance on your pay if necessary, pack up, and move. Now. Get a new cell phone while you're at it. Then you'll be set. You do not deserve this drama--you are so much better than that.

Don't go for anyone named Amanda, I've only known horrible women with that name (no offense to any ladies here if you're name is Amanda).

I can't really relate because I'm the type of person who doesn't put up with that type of bullshit - no matter how stuck I am on a person. I mean you're not in denial, you know what she does, and you know she's going to continue. I think you need to get out and meet some new ladies. And move the fuck away.

But, I've had friends who just can't leave, no matter how much advice I give, no matter how many times they cheat on eachother, no matter how big of an asshole their partner is. I've given up on giving advice, because no one takes it. So, if you're not willing to take the advice from others, you probably will stop receiving it.

Shauk, I think you know what to do here.

My advice is this: the saying "out of sight, out of mind" exists for a reason.

Move out, don't talk to her. Delete her phone number and contact information, get rid of (throw away or put into storage) everything you've got that reminds you of her.

The pain and temptation are real and will take a long time to fade. Meanwhile, you need to be looking and moving forward, not backward.

I've had people tell me that (I'm an embarrassment to the human race) after I trip the light fantastic. Despite my understanding of rhythm, there's much lost in translation to my limbs.

I love some promiscuous women, but only if they're mature. I came upon this lesson back in high school when I dated a certain Jessica. She loved sexuality. She loved it more than the Hamburgler loves hamburgers (an expression she had, not I). She loved it so much that the 3-4 times a day I could schedule in wasn't enough. I bumped it up to as much as possible. Not enough, and she cheated. She wasn't able to filter her promiscuity because of her inexperience. This, apparently, has become something of an epidemic.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not what one might call a prude, but sexuality with absolutely no ground rules is fwb, not a relationship.

Oh yeah, Shauk, I forgot to say something else:

You're not an embarrassment to the human species, or even to the male gender. I'm sympathetic and concerned, but not at all embarrassed by you.

Take this, own this, and move forward. You can do this.

Yeah, you managed to make a lot of mistakes.

So what?

Mistakes are learning experiences. The fact that you're very aware of all the wrong, bad, and otherwise ill-advised stuff you did is good, it means it's in your head and you won't make those mistakes again.

We all fuck things up here and there. Some of us have huge fuckups, some portion it out into small batches of mistakes over several relationships. Just think of it as getting a lot of learning in on one big lesson.

You'll only be an embarrassment if you walk away from this whole ordeal having learned nothing. But I think you'll learn. So hold your head up and move along, you've got some living to do.

Dude, wouldn't it feel great to just toss it all to the wind right now? Just let all the bullshit fall behind you as you head into the clean canvas of the future.
I know that's a lot to get your head wrapped around right now, but I think you know it's for the best.....

And someone above posted about respecting yourself. When you let something like this into your life, others sense/see/feel it, and they can respond accordingly. Give yourself the respect you deserve, and others will follow suit.....

Re:
 

I'm fairly successful. I mean, I'm not in any debt, or any trouble with the law, as far as outstanding tickets or whatever...

I got involved with a girl that "lives for today," as it were. All of her friends are also like that.

I bought her a car and took it back, and found two Xanax tablets in it, as well as condoms and tampons.

My point is, that circle is having fun, reproducing liberally and promiscuously, with little or no money, tons of fines and getting more each day, but they have what all of us work for anyway, and that is the physical love.

I mean, a guy will go through school to be successful and drive a nice car, but why does he want to drive a nice car? To impress women!

You see, this girl I was with hung out with dudes with mohawks and piercings... that type of crowd. They usually wouldn't have any money. I have money and a stable life financially, but no girl.

.........I would rather be in their position.

This is precisely why I don't dance. As Bono put it "...the boys play rock and roll/they know that they can't dance, at least they know."

And Shauk, you're not an embarrassment to the human race. What you are is an embarrassment to yourself. Don't sweat it, we all embarrass ourselves once in a while. As above, I had to learn that my natural rhythm, while strong in performance and composition of music, does not extend to expression through movement. I embarrassed myself a couple times, then I learned to keep my ass off the dance floor. Now you need to do the same. Do not under any circumstances allow this girl to keep fucking you around like this. It's terrible that she would treat you in such a fashion, but if you let her continue you'll have no one to blame but yourself.

If what I am about to say offends you, I'm sorry, but it needs to be said.
Run. From the sounds of things here, she is nothing more then a fucking whore who enjoys power trips and mind games. This woman, and I use that word loosely, will suck the life out of you, and laugh at on your trip to hell. She is an emotional assassin and you need to get the fuck away from this lieing cheat spawn of fucking Satan cunt RIGHT FUCKING NOW. I know how hard it is. I still, for some ungodly fucking reason, love my lieing cheating ex to this day. But you, my friend, need to get the hell out of this situation right now. This can only end one way. Badly. Very, very badly.

you are so not a disgrace to the human race. SHE on the other hand IS!!!

And like Cromp put it, she is a SKANK!

And as I would put it...She is a FUCKIN' WHORE beyond WHORINGS. She gives prostitutes a bad name!!! cos that's exaclt what she is except that she's so cheap she doesnt even charge for it. At least the other ladies make a living.

One day she is going to fall so damn hard and I hope you wont be there to catch her.

Women like these make me go completely BEFOK (afrikaans for extremely pissed off) it just explains it with the emotion that i feel.

You need to get far away from her as possible, but hopefully in Seattle wher e you've got your new job and are trying to make it for yourself.

FUCK HER!!!! you see, no matter who you are or what you've done in the past does not warrant treatment or behavior like that.

I sorry, i have no sympathy for her for whatever comes her way! and it WILL...trust me it will, even if I have to use all my wedding savings just to come and show her myself.

And that goes for Cromps Ex as well!

OH GAAAAAASH, you won't believe how much I hate women who do that to themselves and how they hurt others in the process!

Ok, i'm going to stop bashing now and say that despite all this WHORING!!! the way you described that whole car scene that she explained to you where the guy wa making out with the friend...that made me kinda hot...but i guess it's just my recent endeavours to recruit a threesome partner :D

anyways, FUCK HER!!!

Shauk you're not the embarassment she is, atleast that's the way I view it.

You've made a huge step though, you've realised that you deserve better then what she's giving you. That remaining in that situation is wrong.

My advice, get away. move out, change your number and just sever all contact. You can't keep hoping she's going to change cause she won't and it's not fair to either of you.

Word. :thumbsup: Nail this to your forehead until it becomes a permanent part of your brain.

Shauk,

In your last thread you mentioned that if she fucks you over again, or if you can't handle it, this will seal your feelings and finally allow you to get over her.

Buddy, it's now time to walk away without a second thought and never look back.

You mentioned that your were a muso? Then throw yourself into your music again, throw yourself into something. Get out there, meet people, make friends, work hard. Basically, focus your energy one something else, focus your energy on something useful that will help you go further.

It hurts, it sucks, and it will hurt for a while longer. But you have to have faith that this pain will pass. Use it to make you stronger, learn from it, feel it.

Before long, you'll be in a better place, you may even find another woman, and you'll look back and be so glad that this is all behind you now. Don't let this make you angry, don't let it make you bitter, because now, now you'll really appreciate the good times when they happen. And if keep the right attitude, the good times will happen.

But right now, you need to focus on the challenges right in front of you, and the most pressing issue for you to deal with is to just walk away and don't look back.

I agree with this right here... Whores love to play games... and that exactly what she is doing. She will never be without someone to fuck as long as she can supposedly guilt trip her ex into fucking her, string you along, and spread her legs to anyone who looks her way in a night club. She will not change, this is the way she wants it, for a reason. When she falls flat on her face someday (she knows this will eventually happen), she will try to crawl to you, or that ex of hers. But tell her to fuck off before it gets any deeper.

Someone suggested moving (good idea, if anything to a different part of town), changing your cell number (Very good idea, Ive done this, then she cant get ahold of you, which trust me, is a good thing), and getting rid of or storing anything that reminds you of her (like they said out of sight, out of mind...). All these are good suggestions. I am pretty damn sure none of these people here would give you any terrible advice, none of us here are out to hurt you.

So in short... get rid of the psycho hose beast before she traps you for good.

You just landed a new job. Congratulations.

NOW, START LOOKING FOR SOMEPLACE ELSE TO LIVE!!!!!

Get the fuck out of that situation pronto my friend.

I never tried to boost your ego and I'm not about to now. There are plenty of others that have stated it, you don't need yet another one.

You are only an embarassment to yourself if you continue to allow this to happen to yourself. Only you need to be able to look yourself in the mirror in order to sleep at night. As you've always told me you'll do it your way.

I'm telling you now, that you won't or don't want to change it until the pain is too great, that's your choice.

I heard a great analogy this morning, it's like being in a burning building knowing that you need to get out, but yet you don't want to because being outside in the unknown of the world is even more scary than knowing the certainty of your situation. Get out of the burning building already.

You wanted to change your life, you're in mid-change still hanging onto the vestiges of your old life that is doing nothing but inhibiting your growth. You've know it for some time now.

Again, you'll do whatever you please. Be scared. Be afraid. Be angry. Be upset. Be lonely. Be sad. Be you. They are all feelings that you will have to endure and you'll live through them. It's the range of emotions that we experience in life to really know that we are alive. What is happiness without knowing sadness?

But whatever you do, please change your behavior. Get the balls, man up, rock up, or whatever you want to call it.

Don't be Kpax 2.0

Quoted for truth.

Be free, Shauk.

so, i'm not financially set enough to move out yet, so I am pretty much stuck atm, I have a good job but no income yet, I get a half check from my last job which leaves me with 100$ coming in, I wont get a real check until around the 15th of november. Even then that will be a "training" check. No commisions, just the 11$ an hour. Although i have been working my ass off, I don't know what I'll actually see by then.


right after I posted this I had moved all my stuff to the living room while she was still moping in bed, acting angry at me for taking her phone to begin with. I didn't say anything, just started packing up my clothes and moving them to the living room.

I sat down out here with the laptop and started talking to a few people who chose to AIM me as requested, meanwhile she came out of her room and started cleaning the kitchen right next to me.

akward silence for about an hour, I'm looking up apartments and roommate needed listings at this point, she then comes over with pancakes and milk.

"what the fuck is this?"

"pancakes"

"no i mean, why?"

*shrug*

"is this a peace offering?"

"they're pancakes"

"fine"

she sits across from me and we just kinda stare at eachother over pancakes for the next half hour.

"I don't want you to leave"

"why? because you can't pay rent or something?"

"no I can pay rent"

"why would I stay?"

"I didn't do that stuff to hurt you, you don't know whats going on"

"I know that I was lead to believe that you wanted to get back together"

"I do!"

"you don't act like it! this shit hurts me"

"we're not together"

"I moved out here to have you remind me of that? thanks"

"We could still get together, I just dont think of you sexually"

"what the hell does that mean?"

"sex is just sex, I don't think it means anything anymore"

"it means a lot to me"

"everything is so black and white with you"

"this whole "getting back together" thing seems like a clear intention to me, you sucking some guy off in the back of a car seemed to scribble all over that fucking line, you did it, you knew it would hurt me, you did it anyway, you don't fucking care about me, you wouldn't have done it if you did.

"I care about you, I just don't think of us as a couple"

"whatever you told me you wanted me to move out anyway, you wanted to "chase me" because of your so called primal urges, I think it's bullshit, we're civilized human beings, not primitive animals. I'm sorry i'm not like every other guy who tries to win your affection by shoving his dick in your face"

"It's not like that"

"what the fuck, you didn't even KNOW the guy!, WHATS HIS NAME?"

"...."

"you want to turn this in to a fucking power trip, you want to hurt me so bad that I leave you, pissed, never want to talk to you, you want to do all of that so I move out and youc an chase me, why? so you can prove yourself as some sick fuck who loves to power trip on how bad they can hurt people yet still manage to fuck them? you've turned in to your ex"

"i know, it's fucked up, you're right, it's all a power trip"

"whu? you're agreeing?"

"It doesn't have to be like this"

"I fucking know it doesn't have to be like this, why do you think i'm so upset? You're the one fucking everything up, i've been here 1 week and all i've heard about is how much dick you can grab, not one fucking thing about us getting back together"

"I want to get back together, I'm just scared that I've become something I don't want to be, and it might hurt you"

"what do you mean?"

"I don't think of us as a couple right now, so for some reason it doesn't bother me at all, but this is hurting me too, watching how much it hurts you, I don't think I can do it anymore"

"what? sleep with other guys?"

"I don't know"

"figure something out then, I got my shit packed, i'm borderline ready to leave and wind up living in my dad's garage or something"

"why? what the hell is that going to do for your life? what would you do there?"

"I could get away from you"

"I don't want you to leave"

"then stop hurting me,stop treating me like this"

"just calm down and stop acting like you're my boyfriend"

"you just said you wanted to get back together"

"can you just please let things flow instead of trying to force it?"

"how many other people are you going to sleep with then? I was letting things "flow" when you were sucking cock on wednesday, I was letting things flow you you let alberto fuck you in his hotel room without protection, possibly making you pregnant, possibly giving you an STD, I was letting things flow when you called greg up and told him you were going to tell his gf that he cheated on her unless he fucked you, ON FUCKING MONDAY WHILE I WAS HERE"

"you don't know why I do these things"

"you couldn't possibly justify it"

"im not over him, I fucking hate him, I told him all that shit and did all of it to make him jealous"

"is that why you had me move over here then? for your little fucking game of power with you and greg? fuck that"

"no, I just need to transition"

"we've got some fucked up train going on here, I'm chasing you, you're chasing greg, greg is chasing jaquie, no one is fucking chasing me, i'm the goddamned caboose, it's fucking lonely and shit back here, people are supposed to pair off. You dumped him, he didn't want you anyway, deal with it."

"Why do you want to get with me so bad, all i do is hurt you"

"why do you want to get with greg so bad, all he does is hurt you"

"i hate him"

"why?"

"what do you mean WHY? why not?"

"I wanna hear you say it"

"he told me he loved me, i moved out here for him, he was sleeping with other girls"

"GEE THIS SOUNDS SO FUCKING FAMILIAR"

"oh my god"

As previously stated, just go.

OH LORD NO!!! she's an embarrasment to the female species!!! to not even be able to come up with a decent enough story.

I reckon living in a cardboard box will be better than living with that disgrace of a woman.

get out NOW!!!

Sorry to hear all this.

Seattle is a great place. Big city with great people (and alotta hot chicks :)

You should do what everyone has been saying.. there are alot of nice girls out there, and next one might not be next week, but in a few months.. just leave and don't worry about it and live your life :)

I know, it's way easier said than done, but trust me, I'd rather be in Seattle right now than where I am (a small suburban city in the midwest that snows half the year).

Sigh. I hate being right so damn much.

After reading Shauk's last post, I've had a slight change of heart.

Sometimes past actions are a good indicator on whether or not someone is willing to change their present behavior; Sometimes it's not. While it would be easier to judge someone based on the past, it's not always the smartest course of action as you may find yourself trying to pull your foot from your mouth. You see, communication is 90% of a relationship. With that in mind, the problem I had with your previous post is this: She seems remorseful for her past actions while you seem intent on shoving her past mistakes down her throat, as if you want to instigate an argument (Keep in mind I'm speaking objectively). Comments such as:

and

aren't going to lead anywhere positive. No one-- And I do mean no one-- Wants to be belittled and accused of being/doing something they're not. It only makes people defensive and more apt to respond to you in a negative way. If you're not willing to listen to what she has to say, then I'd suggest simply not speaking to her at all. As it stands, it seems to me that an unecessary argument was created because you chose to act in a rather beligerent way.

Anywho, with that being said, personally I think you should sit down and try to talk to her. It won't be easy and they'll probably be a lot of hurt feelings along the way, but that's the best recourse of action if you really want to mend and wounds/fix any broken bridges. That includes telling her why you don't trust her without coming off as saying "You whore!" and/or without coming off as abrasive. I've always said that any relationship can be fixed. Both parties simply have to be willing. Maybe you feel as if you're justified in not wanting to try-- And you very well may be-- But that doesn't mean you still shouldn't try. It's entirely possible that she means it when she says that she doesn't like the person she has become/is currently and wants to work things out. Still, that's up to you to decide. Just don't let pent up anger otherwise cloud your judgment. That's my advice to you.

Wow. No.

No, no, no, no, no.

In a successful, healthy relationship communication is important. This relationship is neither. Further, if we take the above transcript as complete and accurate for simplicity's sake, her remorse is part of what makes this girl so dangerous. She shows absolutely no indication of having any idea whatsoever what she wants and instead of handling the situation in a mature and responsible manner (ie, taking some time to figure shit out) she's acting with absolutely no forethought or consideration for the people around her. She is an emotional loose cannon and if she continues to behave in this way she will eventually self-destruct. It would be very unwise for anyone to do anything other than get the fuck out of the way while they still can.

I don't see him accusing her being anything she's not. He's confronting her with her actions. She's going to pay the consequences, so long as our friend Shauk can stay the course. It's not his responsibility to fix her, or put up with her shit. He has every right to be upset and she has no defense (and indeed, does not offer one).


Also, no.

Repeat after me:

Real life is not a romantic comedy. People do not have a single epiphany and change overnight.

Ever.

If she doesn't like who she's become, that is quite frankly her problem. If she loses opportunities due to it, she has nobody to blame but herself. And if she wants to change, then it's up to her to do so. Talk is cheap and she can't even get that right...

There's no consistency here; she's all over the map. She can't decide what she wants, so she keeps swinging back and forth and shows absolutely no regard for anyone else involved. This is not a relationship that's worth fixing. Never mind even the picture her actions say and whether or not she'd be willing to back up any assertions of wanting to salvage things. Continuing to put effort into this is a losing proposition.

Shauk, I am going to be totally honest here. No attempts at levity, no beating around the bush and no pulling punches. I am going to break this situation down for you as plainly as I can, in the hopes that you will read and understand and thus be able to save yourself some aggravation. The usual disclaimer is that I'm basing all of this only on the information you've given me; thus, if you've painted an incomplete picture, any extrapolations I make based on that may be incorrect and thus throw all of my reasoning out the window. However, such inconsistencies tend to be pretty glaring and I'm not seeing any here so I feel confident in saying that I think I have a handle on things.

This girl is, bluntly, damaged goods. I don't know what's caused her to be this way. I'm quite certain that she has redeeming qualities; it turns out that nearly everybody does. That's what makes these situations so hard. If she really were a Heartless Scheming Bitch like some stock character from a B movie, it'd be easy to walk away. You did fall for her at one point and thus I feel confident in saying that you saw something else there. I have no doubt that you have a lot of good memories about this girl and that you wish more than anything that you could recapture the happiness you had.

I have seen this situation over and over again. I have no idea if you're about to fall into this trap, but I'd feel remiss if I didn't warn you. We've all seen those on again/off again couples who keep breaking up and getting back together, despite the fact that when they're together they invariably make each other miserable. These situations arise when people want to recapture the past; upon seperating from their former partner, they get to remembering the good times they had and minimizing the bad ones; they do this because they, like you and me and everyone else, want to be happy and remember this other individual as a mechanism that caused them to be happy. The problem, however, is as stated above. Something in that relationship changed to cause those two people to be no longer compatible and that former compatibility may never be recaptured. Once it's gone, it's gone. It is possible in some cases to build something new that is also positive, but this is not a common occurance and requires (among other things) that both parties recognize and accept that the past is gone and that what comes next must therefore necessarily be something new. Even if you're ready, willing and able to do that I can guarantee you that she's not.

She's not happy. She's telling the honest truth about that. She doesn't like who she's become. No prevarication there. Trouble is, I don't think she knows who she is. I don't know what event(s) changed the girl you fell for into the one that's in discussion, or even if there was a change; maybe she's always been that girl and all that's changed is your perception of her. Regardless, the picture I get from what I've read is of a girl who displays an alarming lack self-awareness; she doesn't know who she is, she doesn't know what she wants and she has no fucking clue where she's going or what she's going to do next. And rather than sit down and try to figure these things out, she's rolling around like the proverbial loose cannon and causing as much emotional damage as she possibly can. It's a very sad situation, frankly, because she's going to continue to be miserable until she can get this sorted out, if she ever does.

None of this is your fault and none of it is your responsibility. Further, if you continue to allow her to toy with you, or (God forbid) decide to give your relationship with her another chance, you will be causing her more harm than good.

She's latching on to you as an escape. She wants to use your past together as a means to pull herself out of the hole she's dug. She remembers being happy with you and is, like all the other folks in this type of situation, minimizing or completely excising any negatives. She therefore associates being with you and her own happiness and wants to use you to recapture that. The worst part of this is that it's not even you she wants; it's simply that feeling of well-being. You're the vehicle, not the objective.

Sorry. I reckon that probably hurts, but it's the truth as I see it.

Now.

The best possible course of action for you and for her at this point is for you to Get Out, as soon as possible. You can't afford to move; do you have any friends who could spot you a couch for a few weeks? Take only the possessions you deem essential or irreplaceable and come back for the rest later, once you're established. Offer cash. Offer bribes. Do whatever's necessary. Availing yourself of a friend's hospitality for a couple weeks will be a better course of action by miles than staying in your current situation. Your current situation is poisonous, both for you and her and it will not get better until you remove yourself from it.

The pain, as has been said, will take some time to go away. It is essential that you allow yourself to heal, which means that you need to not have anything to do with her anymore. I know you probably want to help her, but you simply cannot. You cannot not fix another person; it's up to her to do that for herself, or not. Your priority, therefore, needs to be your own well-being. The good news is that this is something that is in your power. The pain will go away, if you give yourself enough time and distance to allow it. Most of the folks here (if not all of us, I don't know everyone's individual situations) is speaking from experience on this, myself included. We've all been through the pain of breaking up with someone and I have personally experienced that very peculiar pain of watching a woman I cared for very deeply engage in what I believed to be an ill-advised and self-destructive course of action without having any power to change it. I know exactly how much it sucks, I truly do. I also know that it gets better, so long as you take the steps necessary to let it.

Even if there's absolutely no way for you to change your living situation before you get paid, you can still be pro-active about the situation. Get the apartment search going now. Use your time off to check out new apartments. Check out the apartments themselves, tour the surrounding neighbourhoods, figure out where all the essential facilities are and how convenient access to those places (grocery stores, laundromats, etc) is going to be. This will serve the dual purpose of helping you choose the best possible residence for yourself and giving you a positive reason to get away from her; you do not want to be in this girl's presence any more than is absolutely necessary. If you're still sharing a bed with her, you really should start sleeping on the couch at the very least. Make every effort to not be home when she is. Have as little to do with her as possible. And if you can do something productive in the process, so much the better.

Do not under any circumstances let her know where you're moving to, once you've found a place. Changing your phone number is probably a bit extreme at this point, but if she continues to call/text you after the move, it may become necessary as well. Your relationship with her is past it's sell-by date. You need to remove it from your life.

You really do have my sympathies and I'm sorry if any of this is painful. It's not a good situation to be in; you deserve to not be in it anymore. Take care of yourself and the rest will fall into place, sooner or later.

And I leave you with words of wisdom imparted to me many moons ago. I actually meant to include this earlier, but I was unfortunately not up to my usual mental acuity last night and thus forgot. The advice that really got me was simply this :

Learn to be happy with who you are and then you can find someone with whom you can be happy together.

Good luck to you, sir.

Hell, change your phone number anyway.

Temptation is an issue with you, man.

I know it was with me.

Glad I dumped it all.

Martian, that was awesome... I would QFT, but it's just too damn long, haha. I can't even imagine how long that must have taken to write.

It is definitely time to move out, shauk... think of it like you're being evicted if you have to. Staying there is not an option, so you'll have to be resourceful and find something else temporary, which will very likely be less than ideal... but in the end, you'll be better off and can make a better life for yourself. Without her.

i'm going to sound like a broken record, but these people speak the truth. get the fsck out. seriously.

completely cut off all contact with her. resist her at every temptation. don't pick up the phone, block her emails and instant messages, block her on facebook (if you're into that); just get rid of her.

a little more than a year ago, i was in a situation where i didn't want to let go of someone that was taking me for a ride. she didn't know what she wanted and i did. her family and best friend were manipulating her against me but i refused to let go because we actually "loved" each other at one point. don't get me wrong, it was amazing in the beginning but it didn't last. there were more lows than highs. this is what i see you're in. more lows than highs. if you can't balance it or tip the scale the other way, get out.

once she decided to "move on" and leave me emotionally beaten, she then decided she wanted to still be friends. at the advice of several people here that are much wiser than I, I cut off all contact. to this day I have not spoken to her nor heard anything of her, nor do i ever want to. i've seen random pictures (those which i did not delete from my plethora of hard drives) and one on facebook before I blocked her. that's it.

after a year or so, i'm starting to finally move on. i got my head back into my job and my music. i got into different groups of people and now have a pretty nice life in an area that's relatively new to me. it's a wonderful feeling. try it! you can do this :)

A couple of things here.

1.) I don't understand your "This girl shows no remorse" remark. On numerous occassions she states how she didn't-- And doesn't-- Want to hurt Shauk, signaling she has at least a bit of remorse for what she's done.

2.) I said this earlier, but there's no better way to work out conflicts then to talk about them. But that's virtually impossible when one person doesn't wish to listen to what the other has to say, or comes off as stand-off'ish ("What the fuck is this for?" and "Fine" display an unwillingness to talk).

3.) I doubt this girl is a loose cannon. I've known loose cannons and she doesn't seem to fit the bill. If anything, she seems to be going through a bit of a transition in trying to figure out what she wants in life. You can't exactly hold that against her, can you? Personally, I wouldn't. A person can't change if you don't let them change.

It appears to me that Shauk is getting a free pass simply because he's known around TFP... No one said he doesn't have a right to be angry. Being angry, however, doesn't justify being beligerent. If I so wanted, I could confront my ex and call her a two-timing, cheating, bonafide whore and I'd be 100% right. But what would that accomplish? Aside from possibly pissing her off and causing an otherwise unecessary argument, nothing (I should know). Hurt feelings shouldn't be an excuse for overt abrasiveness. If they were, then conflicts would never be resolved. Constructive communication is always better than destructive communication. I'd be willing to bet that if both parties were willing to sit down and talk to each other without the finger pointing and accusations that things would, if nothing else, be a lot less stressful.

Anyway, where on Earth-- Or should I say TFP-- Did you ever see me say that Shauk should attempt to fix his ex-girlfriend? :orly:

Well, for one, I never mentioned anything about overnight change. If you re-read what I typed out, you'd notice that I said it's entirely possible that she doesn't like the person she's become/wants to work the relationship out. You'd be surprised at how many people have an 'epiphany', as you want to call it, overnight. I have, I'm sure you have and I'm sure a lot of people reading this thread have. But, really, there's no use in trying to qualify other people's experiences.

No one's ever said that she didn't have to fix her own problems, but she has to-- At the very least-- Be allowed to fix them without being belittled along the way. And, yes, I'll agree that talk, without action, is cheap.

As this is a fact, I don't see what's wrong with this comment.

This isn't a knock on you, per se, but I absolutely hate it when people only quote part of a sentence. I'd just like to point out to you that you left out the words "Right now". Once again, I don't see what's wrong with this comment, as they're not a couple "Right now".

If you come out swinging in an argument, you can back almost anyone into a corner and have them admit to just about anything you want to. I'm sure we've all had arguments in which we've accused the other party of being something they're not, only to have them respond with "You're totally right". It doesn't mean that you are, in fact, right, but rather that they don't see the point in arguing with you when you've already made up your mind regarding the person they are. Sure, I might be reading into her comments a bit, but I think I'm overall right.

...What's wrong with this comment? She's expressing her feelings. How's that a bad thing...?

Admitting to one's faults doesn't make you crazy or a psycho. It means you're able to take responsibility for your actions.

I'm still wondering how she's all over the map. The only thing your quotes did were to assert that:

1.) They're not in a relationship at the moment and
2.) She's made some mistakes.

It's seems readily apparent to me what she wants. She wants Shauk. I get the feeling that because Shauk has been posting about his ex for quite some time now that most people have already demonized her in their minds and, as a result, have painted her as the 'bad guy'.

*Shrugs*

Not to say that might not be true but, from what I've read, it definitely doesn't seem true. No one's perfect. Everyone makes mistakes-- Some people moreso than others. That doesn't mean that she isn't serious about the things she says. As I said earlier, it appears to me that the only reason this relationship isn't going to work is because Shauk doesn't want it to work.

Think about this; If Shauk didn't care about his ex-girlfriend, then he wouldn't post about her so much. Just food for thought.

You've got to be kidding, Infinite_Loser. Are you trying to screw with Shauk's mind even more than it already has been screwed?

Ummm... I'm pretty sure I was serious. Like I said in my post, I think that most people have already painted Amanda(?) as evil incarnate due to the fact that Shauk has quite a few posts regarding her. She might be yet she might not be.

*Shrugs*

A little objectivism (I don't think that's a word, but meh... Whatever) never hurt anyone. Also, I'm pretty sure you could come up with a better response than "You've gotta' be kidding me".

Edit: I forgot to add. No, I'm not trying to screw with anyone.

Edit #2: Also, I never said that his ex-girlfriend is a saint (Don't want anyone thinking that) or should be treated as such.

Objectivity about what? No one's saying Shauk's an angel here, let alone a victim. There's proof of that all over his journal entries about the situation, and on each and every one of the threads he started here on TFP. He certainly knows my opinion, and it's not always very kind, either.

However, there is no benefit to be gained from saying that he should "try harder" to be in a relationship with this girl. Even if he exaggerates some things in his narrative, she's got (as they say) more issues than National Geographic. Any sane man--or any man wanting to regain his sanity, after being with her--will run the hell away from anyone as toxic as this girl seems to be.

She's got to fix herself, period. She might never fix herself. But that has nothing to do with Shauk, and it shouldn't, period. This is one of life's most important lessons about relationships, in my (and many, many other people's) opinion.

The only thing I agreed with you about was that if Shauk didn't care so much about his ex, then he wouldn't post about her so much. Yeah, obviously he still cares, that's his problem... and we're trying to help him with that, at least as long as he's asking for help. In a situation like this, the hardest (and best) thing to do is kill any ounce of caring you have for someone like this, before they take you down with them into their own emotional shithole. I can't count how many times I've seen it happen, though usually it's a co-dependent girl who's hanging on to the toxic guy and won't let go until she's totally destroyed. Equal opportunity, I guess.

Blowing strangers in the back seat. Come on Dude get your balls back and move forward. You will be fine with time but the longer you fuck around the longer its gonna take. She blows strangers. What a fucking whore. I know it hurts but life goes on and as soon as you meet another chick that you really like you will forget all about her.

Shauk, if your Dad's garage is really an option, I'd take it at this point.

You need to seriously cut and run ASAP.

Neither do I, as that's not what I said. She is showing remorse. What she isn't showing is any understanding or self-control.

Again, this is true of healthy relationships. I'm normally at the front of the line advocating communication, but sometimes it's better to just cut your losses. This situation shows every indication of being one of those times.

I will never fault anyone for taking steps to be the person they want to be. I will fault someone for not trying to make the changes necessary in their life, particularly if their current actions are harming both themselves and those around them. This is not a case of self-discovery and it's not a situation where she's changing her ways for the better. She hasn't shown any signs of even wanting to do so. Being involved with a person like this is not a good idea.



I most certainly am not giving Shauk a free pass. Why should I? I know hardly anything about him; even if I did, that's just not the way I operate. What I'm doing is attempting for a bit of empathy; not with him, but with her. By using what's been described I try to put myself in her shoes and figure out why she's acting the way she's acting; assuming Shauk hasn't grossly misrepresented the situation, I feel confident in saying I have a pretty good handle on how she's feeling, which is why I feel confident in in giving the advice I have.

I don't want to vilify this poor girl. I don't think she's evil. In fact, I feel quite a bit of pity for her, as I think she's got a hard road ahead of her and there's nobody and nothing that can change that. I sincerely hope for her own sake that she will eventually be able to figure out that her problems are all a result of the way she's acting and therefore be able to change the pattern, but I don't know that I'd be terribly optimistic about that.


I won't argue that she's happy with who she is, because it's pretty clear that she's not. The part I disagree with is her wanting to work the relationship out. What she wants is to use the relationship as a life preserver, to try to cling to what she had. This is not possible, and further means that Shauk really should get gone; again, it's not him she wants, it's the comfort he brings her. And he deserves better than to be someone's security blanket.

The inconsistency arises between what she says and what she does. It's understandable, because I really don't think she has any clue at all what it is she wants or even why she wants it.

If she wanted to be with Shauk, she'd be with Shauk. It's not a complicated situation; they're living under the same bloody roof. And yet, whenever Shauk tried to get a handle on that or steer things in that direction, she was very quick to point out that they are not in a relationship. She won't commit to being in a relationship with him and seems to still want to be with this other fellow as well (trying to make him jealous, which is often a result of wanting someone and not being able to have them).

She doesn't want to be with Shauk, but she doesn't want to let him go either.

That's not in question. abaya beat me to it, but I'll say it anyway; what makes the situation difficult for Shauk is clearly that he does still care for her. I'd think that's pretty self-evident, and is also a fairly natural result of the circumstances. If he didn't about her still, he wouldn't need all of us to tell him to leave; hed've already done it.

This girl is not evil; nowhere have I asserted otherwise. As I believe I said above, I'm quite sure she has a lot of redeeming qualities. Nonetheless, she's engaged in a self-destructive behaviour pattern and all Shauk can do is remove himself from her presence before she causes him any more harm than she already has. Again, you cannot save people from themselves. It's up to her to sort herself out and there is absolutely no positive influence that Shauk can have on that process.

You've twice now made a call for objectivity, which is utterly strange to me. There is no objective truth behind emotions; they are subjective by nature. Relationships are not and should not be calculated rational things, because they're based on those subjective feelings.

I understand where you're coming from. I'd love nothing more than to see a happy ending to this situation for all parties. But the fact is that there is no happily ever after here. I will say it for you and Shauk both now, there is no possible way that these two can go back to having a positive relationship at this point. That's not entirely her fault, but it is what it is. The happy times are in the past and it will be better for both parties if they go their separate ways and keep those happy memories for what they are, instead of tarnishing them by trying to breathe life into something that's already gone.

ok so heres the deal. I finally got my head around her perspective.


heres her side.

she wanted me to move out here so we could get back together
she did not feel she had any pressure or obligation to make sure that it happened, only that it would be "possible" if the mood struck us.
she did what a single woman would do and hung out with guys she was interested in regardless.
she had sex with one of them, and thought she may have gotten pregnant.
Upon getting here she told me because she was still interested in getting back together, and thought things would be nasty if all of a sudden 3 months later I'm going "what the hell is that?" and for her "secret" to come out that way
She had no intention of telling me about anything else, nor was she obligated to do so, because we're not together.

this, actually makes sense to me. She told me about ONE thing, but i found out about EVERYTHING.

Because I straight up told her, she had no reason to tell me any of this except if she wanted to hurt me.

she only admitted to it after a while because she couldn't live with lying to me.

the only real issue I'd have at this point with her wanting to get back together with me is that her texts that I read when I flipped out, said that she'd choose him if he'd only have her back.

*shrug*

all the same though, I really should just not be so fucking attatched to the outcome of a potential relationship with her. It's just hard to differentiate between who she was for 5 years (mine) vs who she is now (not mine)

I treat her actions as though if we were still together and it just makes things go bad, because ultimately, she has expressed that she wants to make that decision, not me. Strangely enough, it's what I also asked for, I just seem to have forgotten that in my impatience.

I always have said, I want her to come back to me when she feels she's making the choice to come back to me, not out of convenience, not out of surrender (she wanted to move back to Idaho to be with me and I told her no).

Honestly, I try very had to put myself in her perspective and it makes sense, you just have to emotionally detach yourself to see it I guess.

her ex blew the lid on all of this. Had it simply been "yeah I had sex before you moved over here, I may be pregnant, and I wanted to tell you because I want to get back together with you, but don't want to have a nasty surprise" I could at least go "ok, well she was honest at least"

She's not in a hurry to get back together with me, she knows she's confused, and I'm the one putting all the pressure on it, she just feels whatever happens will happen.

I don't know that it will happen, not with her being hung up on her ex.

I can't deal with that. I don't have a problem going out and getting a different girlfriend, moving out and setting things up for whatever I feel like doing in Seattle. I understand her perspective though, it just means that the time isn't right, may never be, and I just need to stop caring so much about the outcome of our interaction.

I'm a big believer in that, you can not rely on someone else to make you happy with your life. That is something that has to come from within and as long as that unhappiness remains it will carry over into other aspects of your life, in this specific case her relationship with you. That's kinda what I meant earlier when I was saying that the situation isn't fair on either of you.

At this point in time she's obviously not capable of putting her all into a relationship with you. If she tried and you two got together there would just be more problems because of her current situation, she might really really want to make things work but because of her own unhappiness with herself it just wouldn't.

Shauk when it comes down to it you don't have to deal with that. There's no reason for you to put your emotions on hold until she sorts out what she wants from life.

I still think you need to cut your losses and move on with your life, find someone who can value you for who you are and give you what you want in a relationship. I also still think that cutting off contact with her would be a good idea, not for her sake but for your own, you've made it obvious that you still care about her and being around her is just going to make moving forward more difficult.

What it comes down to for me is you could be waiting around for the next 5 - 10 years waiting for her to sort herself out mentally and emotionally and then she might decide that no she doesn't want you. She doesn't deserve you giving up that much of your life when you could have been happy, no one does.

In the most simple terms --

She wants a relationship based on convenience. You want a relationship based on commitment.


It is doomed to fail as long as both those statements are true.

So is this where you are rationalizing what she is doing so that you can find ways to accept it and continue to believe in her and your chances of having a relationship in the future as being greater than zero?

Just what is the dealbreaker for you and her? What is the point for you that you're willing to finally back off and move on? What does she need to do that you'll say, "Sorry, you fucked up I'm not interested in you anymore." How much more of this are you willing to take from her or from anyone for that matter?

You can know what's going to happen with you. Make your choice and decision, and move onwards and upwards.

Anything less is Kpax 2.0

After reading only what the OP posted I have a bet.

I'll bet just about anything that if you move out, get your own place/life that she will come calling. She likes chasing, likes being the one in power.

If I were you, I would do just that. Move out, move on and if she does come calling cross that bridge when you come to it. The bonus is, by then you will probably have some friends and money and a new life in Seattle. Then you can deal with it on equal terms.

No, No, No. If she does come calling she should be ignored. Remember, she asked Shauk to move out in the first place, just so she could have him on hand in case she wanted to get back together. If Shauk moves on and she asks him back, it'll probably just be a repeat of what has already happened.

Yup. She's been pulling this crap on him for the past year (after a 4 year relationship). Time to learn your lessons and move on.

How is being the chaser the one who is in power? The chaser is the one who is powerless.. I mean, sure, the chaser has the ball in their court, but the one being chased has all the power to reject or accept.

Personally, I remove people like that from my life. I cut off all contact with them, and end any discussion of them. It may not be healthy, but it works for me

-Will

Because, to this point he has accepted everytime she has pursued him. She knows this, and that's what gives her the power.

Hey Shauk, your girl is a skank-ass, good-for-nothing, can't-keep-it-in-her-pants, needy, manipulative, pathetic, blackmailing LOSER and the guys she cheats on you with have more of a conscience than she does.

She's a scab, a lowlife, a leech, a cheat, a slut, a scrub, and a fucking no-good bitch!!!!

YOU need to stop justifying her behavior for her. Don't try to understand what she's feeling cuz she's got a fucked up black heart and no respect for herself or anyone around her. Don't cut her any slack, don't give her any money. Right now you're just renting a room.

You don't need to talk to her or eat the food she makes you. You don't need to be cordial. Get the fuck out of there. She doesn't deserve you.

There are plenty of hot girls in Seattle - the fun, crunchy granola type too who will be happy to work out with you, cook a healthy meal with you, go hiking or see a midnight movie at the Egyptian. Move out of Renton!!!!!

One more time, sir.

THIS GIRL IS TOXIC. She's a grade-A loser. Her snatch is a 7-11. She's USING YOU.

Get out ASAP and DO NOT LOOK BACK.

Check Craigslist for a house or apartment share. I was able to get one in Seattle for $400 per month with $100 deposit. You can stay there for a month until you move out (or decide you like it). You might end up digging your apartment mates a whole lot.

But the most important thing... KICK THAT BITCH TO THE CURB!!!!

EDIT: Regarding the point that Infinite brings up and our role as TFPers... Shauk, you've been posting about this relationship for a long time on this board. I think all of us here want to see you happy. As such, we bat for your team. It doesn't matter if she's really a nice person or going through a phase or whatever... she doesn't treat you right and she's not going to give you the adult relationship you are looking for.
The only thing that matters is that you are happy. You've moved out to a fantastic place, you've got a new job that is better than pizza job, you're working out - you have a new life!!!! Think of living with this bitch as a remnant of your old life - a shitty but necessary step to getting over it.
By now you should realize that the relationship will not work, is not worth your time and that she is manipulative, a cheater, a lier, doesn't value her body and DOES NOT CARE ABOUT YOU. She is a self-serving narcissistic pile of shit. And I can say that without even meeting her because the facts you gave all point to that.
Stop moping and stop dwelling on the reasons behind her behavior and stop grieving. That can come later. Now is the time to take action and get yourself OUT OF A BAD SITUATION!!!!!!

Move out. The air will be better without the stench of stale, sleazy, passed-around snatch fouling it up.

On your next post here, I want to see a plan of action. You've done really really well with the move, the new job, the new lifestyle. You deserve better.

Is it wrong that "fun, crunchy granola type" gave me a hard-on?

Granola gives me a hard-on too!!!! :)

I only say that because he seems to be more than willing to over look the things that the rest of us would not tolerate in the least. I would just suggest being in a better situation before dealing with her at all.

Because she gets to be the instigator then the one making the effort. When its brought to her Then all of the sudden it's not on her terms anymore and she has to consider what he wants as well as what she wants. She wants to be able to instigate and reach out when she wants to and not when she doesn't.

*busts through Shauk's wall like the Kool-Aid man*

Shauk! Shauk, what are you doing!? I wanna know what you're doing!

,............ OH YEAAAAAAAHHHH!

Mary had a little lamb, its fleece was white as snow.

I hope you're okay, too, Shauk.

He said, she said, they said.......I'd love to know the real truth.

well I've been looking for a place to move out actually.

I realize that I can't stay here.

I can't very well bring home a girl who DOES give a shit about me and bring her to my bed, or rather, my ex girlfriends bed, lol. How odd.

like I said, the thing that hurt the most, the thing that told me EVERYTHING I needed to know, was seeing the text she sent her ex saying that she'd choose him over me that monday... the day after I had moved in with her. She was trying to get him to let her come over so they could fuck and then she had to say that when he was confused why she was doing that when I was here.

look, the reason this is hard for me is there is 5 years where she was able to prove that she was able to be the woman I wanted, OBVIOUSLY this is the wrong perspective, I KNOW this. But you can't explain emotion :\

I know we can't get together on these terms. Reading that hurt me more than anything, more than her sleeping with 3 other guys, I could get over that, it's just sex. But the fact that she'd choose this guy who she complained about forever, the fact that she'd even SAY that, destroyed any hope I had.

I expect nothing from her now, I've stopped talking to her as much as possible , and have been looking to move out. I get paid on the 5th, I expect to be out by then.

I can already see what is going to happen though. She will try her best to break me down, to pursue me, to "prove" herself to me, and to "win" by trying to fuck me or whatever she has to do in her mind. I guess as long as I deny her, i'll have the power. I just hope I find a girlfriend fairly quick to help with keeping my mind off this shit though.

I don't even want to talk to her as a friend unless she deletes his number from her phone, and the 1200 texts I had to go through to piece this drama together.

It wont happen though.

This is depressing. good job or not, i'm alone out here.

It's probably best to get over this before finding another girl. Or at least keep it light and be honest with her (the new girl) about where you are emotionally. No need to spread the misery around. Good luck and stay strong. Doing what's right is hard as hell sometimes.

yeah that probably wont happen without someone to prove to me that there is a better life waiting with their way of doing things when it comes to relationships. Until this, THIS is the best i've got. Sad I know.

Ahh. It all makes sense now. I'm a bit late to this party.
I don't know. I think the whole her brining your hopes up to get back together is what's fucking you over the most. Having that hope given to you and just smashed is definitely not easy.

Hrm. I think this can be boiled down to people wanting what they can't have. Like, you want your ex because she doesn't seem so interested in you. The reverse is true too, where people don't want what they can have. When your ex saw your willingness to get back with her, it was too easy for her. No dice. I don't know how helpful that is, but I think it makes sense :S

:( :( :(
That's very sad to read. I really hope you can find some new friends and start enjoying life again.
In the meantime, you can always count on the TFP for company :)
edit: (ehug->shauk)

Yes, but the key word is "here." You're IN SEATTLE. That, in itself, kicks ass. It is one of the best places you could possibly be "alone," if that makes sense... so much to see and do, and if you ask me, the people are kick-ass once you start making friends and finding cool places to hang out. I can't think of any better place to start one's life over, really.

Carpe diem, man. Seize the day. You want to look back on this time in your life as when you really got going, when life opened up for you and you never looked back... that's the outlook you need to have. Make the most of it while you have the opportunity. :thumbsup:

Damn, abaya... this post almost makes me want to pack up and move out there right now instead of next summer like I had planned. :)

Well, do it then. :D Yeah, I'm partially biased, I lived in Seattle for 22 of my 28 years... I know it's changed a lot in the last 5 years, but it's still the best city in the US, if you ask me. :)

And I am always a fan of picking up and starting over some place new... I've done it too many times to count. Not to run away from things, but to run towards, I guess.

This is a great philosphy in general. I have found that the darkest times of my life are those when I grew the most. My greatest personal triumphs have always been when life was kicking my ass. years later I am now grateful for those times. They prompted me to take action.

... alone and depressed FOR NOW. It's ok, you're going through heartbreak and you just moved out there!

Seattle's so awesome for starting over. I'd really recommend doing a house share. It's cheap and you can live with a lot of people at various stages in their lives (settled, searching, starting over) but they'll be young and fun and mostly single and you'll have that bit of social support. My house had musical instruments, a bunch of cats, and two PS2s... we'd watch football and Colbert together, go see movies, play GTA or just kick it on the porch with some beers and gas station fried chicken. Pretty much an instant social circle.

It was a really great time and really good for getting me out of my loneliness.

If you want to meet some people you can try couchsurfing.net - a lot of the people on there are really friendly and will dig showing you around the city. It's a starting point at least...

No worries, the light is at the end of the tunnel. And if anything, you have plenty of support here. :thumbsup:

And dude, once you're out, do not look back!!! You're leaving that chapter and going on to bigger and better things!! Btw, I also recommend getting a library card if you're a reader/movie fan. You can take out 100 items at once from the Seattle Public Library system and request them to be brought to your local branch for pickup. It got me through the winter cheaply... and yes, the winters are damn depressing. I read a lot of comic books (btw, if you're a comic fan, Seattle is home to the incomparable Fantagraphics!).

reminds me of the song from Avenue Q - For Now

good luck bro... I seriously hope you find your way...

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Well I can't compete in any relationship stories, since I have never had one (thats MY story)

G.E.T O.U.T NOW!!
Don't let her know you are going, look for room to rent/roommate/apartment whatever and during the first week you have it stay with Amanda(plead headache) and slowly move everything out, until the last day you rent a uhaul for furniture/TV.
On that day leave a note with the key on the top of the toilet seat (can't miss it) and just walk out no forwarding, no numbers nothing.

I refuse to offer any (more) advice. It will be disregarded anyway. Just like all the other advice that's been offered all this time.

You gotta do what you gotta do. Experience all the pain and drama you need. You will get *exactly* as much of that as you allow, and you allow a lot.

Folks, you gotta remember that all we know of the girl in question is represented through the filter of the person telling us. So I also refuse to jump on the "she's a skank, whore, cunt" bandwagon. She may well be, but that is completely irrelevant. It is only Shauk's actions that need to be addressed.

I am done offering sympathy. I will offer congratulations when real action is taken, and real progress is made. I hope that's soon.

I... I just had to call her a skank. Sorry. I have needs.

Good point, Sultana... but I think we're all drama queens at some dot on our life time line.

I was. I got over it. Now I use it to make bad jokes.

Shauk should do the same. Humor heals all.

I should add that I've been there, I've done/allowed that, and part of my frustration with this situation is because I see myself at least partially reflected.

I don't intend to look down my nose at Shauk.

But bad situations happen to everyone (not just to those who *deserve* it, whoever decides that), and it's incumbent upon the idividual to learn to protect oneself. No one is going to rescue you from this situation and the pain it brings. Just you. So the sooner you do it, the sooner it's over.

One rarely seens another person take years to remove a band-aid.

Well, I can only echo the advice given so far. Which it sounds like has been given over and over. Everyone's situation is different, it is their own, and so it is also up to them in how they deal with it. Sounds like Shauk is finally doing something about it. Every person has to come to that realization, that nothing is going to change unless you start to make changes. And once you do, it'll be confusing still, you might have an idea of what that change needs to be but if you are in a comfort zone, it's hard. Change IS hard but so rewarding. People can give you advice until it sounds like a broken record, but hopefully some day it sinks in.

Personally I wouldn't be content to just let it go, the sex with other people. But again, I'm not in that situation so it's more of an outside view. It's easy to look at a situation you aren't in and say what you would do if you were, but once there infinitely harder to make that same decision, especially when emotions are involved. My husband cheated on me at the beginning of our relationship, I forgave him and now we've been married for 2 years and I do love him. There are time when I wonder if I made the right decision regardless of the fact that I love him and I know that the person I was a few years before meeting him wouldn't have been so forgiving, yes people do change. But you can't put your life on hold for them. No matter how much you care. You can move on with your life (no matter how hard that is) and they can move on with theirs.

You know what, that's all I can say. I'm repeating others and you have to make your decisions for you. So good luck, hope your search for an apartment goes well and you can move as soon as possible. Seattle sounds like a fantastic place to be.

Well, I can only agree with all the advice that's been given and also second what someone else said earlier. Don't tell her you're moving out. Move while she's out. It's the only way with this type of chick. You are responsible for your own happiness and most of your own misery. If you stay with her you choose misery and pain. So leave and start new and fresh. You are the master of your own destiny. You deserve someone who will love you and treat you better. Someone who will supplement your happiness and not cause you to feel constant dread and worry. It's time to move onto that new path. Don't ever let this happen to you again.

Yup, you're alone out there.
Remember your other goals.
Find a gym.
Find a hobby or engage in one you've neglected.
Find other people who enjoy that hobby.
Find other people just to be around, whether you're interacting or not.
Take a healthy cooking class, a tai chi class, karate, anything lower cost.
Whatever.
Find a friend.

eh, someone found me....

now I just gotta figure out if I should meet them. How to make me nervous 101.... "show interest"

Shauk, you should get into karate / judo / MMA... you're a big boy!

Get yourself some martial arts training. Meet people. Get buff. Learn discipline.

...

Some girl has her eye on ya, huh?! Go for it. Talking to girls is fun.

Agreed, I talk to as many as possible for this very reason :)

I lose myself when a girl seems like she's showing interest. I can't think properly, my hands sweat, the whole nine yards. And by "I can't think properly", I mean my brain stops working.

Perfect example:

I was doing my show and my friend/cohost was in Luxembourg, so we were recording with him on an internet call (through aol or skype or something). He had a British chick there. She had a fucking incredible voice. I'm a bit of a sucker for nice English accents, and he'd sent a picture of her and she was hot. She made me SO damn nervous that when asked to give her things to say in her accent for the benefit of the listeners, all I could come up with was "farm", "chair", and "bottle". FARM! Who the hell has a sexy chick with an even sexier voice who's flirting with you say FARM?!

So there you go. Good times.

Farm?! Hahahah!

...

Shauk: You don't keep any trinkets from this chick around, do you?

trinkets? you mean, my ex?

no, I don't. I'm not materialistic at all, everything I own is functional, a tool, or a storage medium. I'm not the least bit sentimental.

Fahm.

Did you move out yet?

emotionally, yeah, i'm fucking gone. Just waiting for the finances to catch up and trying to find a good place to hit. I am trying to stay near this area cuz even though my job is like half an hour north, I spend half my work day driving anyways so shaving the commute is really shaving 1/10th of my actual drive time in a day, so it seems silly, since I'm not having an issue with where I live now as far as getting to work on time. I just kinda wanna move a little closer to Seattle, or perhaps in Seattle, but still be a stones throw from Tacoma cuz I know a few people down there now.

can I have my congratulations now sultana?

No... she's probably dead. But still looking like a total hottie.

Run.The.Fuck.Far.Far.Away. Now.