Lady Sage

I am with some of the others in this thread... Money can be spent but SYD's are forever. I would find another way.

__________________
If only closed minds came with closed mouths.
Minds are like parachutes, they function best when open.
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shesus

Abaya, I see where you are coming from because many people put money and time in the porn industry or it wouldn't exist. Obviously, there are people out there that want to do that type of work. There are people out there that would be happy flipping burgers too. There are other people who was to be engineers. It's personal what you want to do with your life. She was asking for opinions and I think that she is getting a wide-range of them.

Some people are fine with it. Others are not. Anytime sex is involved it is going to be a moral issue or a hot topic anyway. One way to look at it is this and this knocked me for a loop this weekend. My step-daughter is 16 and having sex. I went crazy, what is she thinking? blah, blah. Stop...refocus...look at self. Shit. There are always double-standards involved when someone you care about is involved in something that could be life threatening or destroying. Strangers, eh I don't really care what they do or have done. Might sound horrible, but it's true. Therefore, I don't care if Randygurl does it or not, I just stated that I wouldn't and told her why. If it were a relative or close friend...well that would probably be a deal-breaker for me. I couldn't stand watching someone I cared about spiral down like the other friends I had.

On the SO issues, I wouldn't want to be with someone that had helter-skelter sex with strangers. That's my opinion. I want a person I'm with to be special, not the 'special of the week' for multiple people. She doesn't know what her future holds. She's unsure so she came to us. We obviously aren't going to make her decision for her. Maybe it would be a great thing for her and she would have no reprecussions down the road. But she does need to see both sides. That's one thing I like about TFP, you get a broad range of ideas from many backgrounds.

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Whatever did happen to your soul?
I heard you sold it

Choose Heaven for the weather and Hell for the company

Ourcrazymodern?

SEXFORMONEYMIGHTBEWRONGNOTWITHSTANDINGITSPOPULARITY.
Not that some such thing never took place!

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BE JUST AND FEAR NOT

SugahBritches

Bottomline:

Don't do anything now you will regret later. Yep, it's THAT simple.

You have doubts now, don't do it.

As far as secrets go, unless they would "personally" effect your partner, DO NOT.........I repeat, DO NOT tell them.

Ourcrazymodern?

Whoa, dude! Or, ma'am? I, too, wonder about the motivations, but one of them seemed to be money (the root of all evil ) and if one likes sex, ( ), one might get confused, especially with no "SO"! Go figure?
I'm absolutely certain that pleasure is good unless it leads to a lack of pleasure later. xx!

__________________
BE JUST AND FEAR NOT

kramus

My 2 cents - if you sincerely believe that you will never have a job/social position with a high profile, or that you will never have an SO who may eventually have a high social profile, then you do whatever you want.
The chance that the internet will come back and bite your ass will always exist. However, if you are relatively low-profile the repercussions will be limited to the reach of whoever it is who locates and disseminates the internet content. This means that not everyone who knows you will necessarily know about this part of your past.
On the other hand, if you eventually have some public standing, you can pretty well guarantee that somehow any such content will be discovered and spread until everyone who has ever heard of you will be aware of it. Witness the beaver shot of Britney Spears that has swept around the world this past week. If she was just another woman that particular picture would have a very limited spread (no pun intended), and virtually no coverage would exist. The value is created because it is malicious or salacious gossip about a public figure. If you will never be out there you will not be a target, and you will not have to worry very much about the long-term effects of your youthful adventures.

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abaya

Precisely, I agree completely. Which is why I got rather incensed at the quality of some people's replies here; for me, it is more about the psychological, emotional, and mental impact of a decision on the person, rather than the morals of other people or the laws of other lands (and yep, prostitution is very legal in many countries). It is up to the individual and what he or she can handle.

What got me off track a bit was seeing how some people morally condemned the OP for even considering such an action, but would possibly have little moral problem observing another stranger (or possibly even this one) performing sexual acts for money. To me, that is a form of cognitive dissonance, but what do I know.

Just saying... if you're going to support the industry of paying money for sexual acts, whether merely observing them or partaking in them personally, I don't think you have any room to *morally* condemn a woman for entertaining the idea of going into the business herself. And I say that as a person who definitely enjoys porn and supports the ethical production of it.

As I posted earlier, if her personal ethics say she's alright with giving this a try, then by all means, go for it! You only live once. But the feeling we are all getting (including her) is that her ethics don't jive with the idea, and so I would discourage it based on that fact alone. Not on moral grounds.

/no more soapboxes tonight

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And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

ASU2003

So if I pay two girls the same amount of money...If I have a camera I'm legal, if I don't I'm going to jail? I still like the amateur porn that two people who are in a relationship make. Or the hot single girl outdoor photo shoots.

Stripping and not going beyond the basics of taking clothes off on stage wouldn't be a dealbreaker, but having sex with people you don't care about (or know), would be. And I wouldn't want my partner to keep any secrets from me, or have to lie about what they were doing for that part of their life. If you did some nude photos or amateur porn with a former boyfriend, it wouldn't be a problem. But having sex (whether you get paid or not) with college spring breakers, porn stars, guys who pay for sex, or lots of monogamous short term boyfriends wouldn't win over too many normal guys.

Plus you would always have to worry about someone you 'know' running into you outside of the bedroom. What happens if your friends and family find out?

Johnny Rotten

I agree. "Let is he who is without sin" and all that.

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spectre

Since a lot of people are having a problem with the legal/illegal argument, I'll side with mal but give a different reason.

People in porn are regularly tested for STDs as a matter of practice, but with a prostitute, getting tested is up to her and her customer has no incentive to be tested. Her next customer could be more diseased than the monkey in outbreak, but there's no guarantee that he's been tested, or that he even cares that he could be putting her in danger. Beyond that, those in porn don't really have to fear the people they're having sex with, no worry about some some random creep attacking them. For a prostitute, that danger is always there.

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No goddamn slave
I will be different" ~ Machine Head

analog

If she'd said porn, I'd say go for it if she really feels she wants to, because fucking on camera for money (assuming professional porn, not some guy in his basement with a handycam) is a lot different than getting paid by random strangers for them to get to have sex with her. A big difference, in my humble opinion. They're only doing it with other professionals, and it's a controlled and safe environment (again, assuming legit businesses).

And I didn't say it was like stabbing a child in the face for money. I was using it to illuminate the error in psychologically justifying an act simply because of monetary gain, posing an (obviously) absurd hypothetical to show through hyperbole exactly why such a line of thinking is false to use.

I also never made a judgment call on her- I only addressed the consequences of her actions as they relate to her own self-respect and self-worth... and trying to help a person make a choice that will potentially cause a lot of personal issues down the line, is much more important than giving any judgments... which i'm not doing, and haven't done.

abaya

Thanks for clarifying, analog. I went back and read your post again, and indeed I pulled your quote out of context.

I guess for me, I just think that choosing to do any kind of sex act for money is virtually the same kind of thing in my book... *as long as* the person involved is choosing to participate and be paid for it. (I am not talking about the 10-year old child prostitutes on the streets of Bangkok, here.) So that is where we differ.

Spectre, honestly, I guess I just can't assume that all porn stars *do* get tested for STD's, nor can I assume that all prostitutes avoid testing and make *no* discriminating choices about who they'll have sex with, etc. I think that there is still a lot of dangerous, unhealthy shit that goes down in the mainstream porn industry, especially with regards to addictions, and I think that a lot of prostitutes do take care of themselves, especially if they have freely chosen their profession. But that's just my perception, again.

Analog, again I appreciate you clarifying your position on not making a judgement. I think we both agree that the important thing is to evaluate whether the person has full knowledge of what their choices are, and what the consequences will be, before going into such a situation. And I think we're all trying to help the OP evaluate those things, and hashing out other things along the way.

My main issue here was just with people saying that they would never marry someone with a history like that, even if she had been tested for STDs (as if a history, in itself, made somebody evil and immoral)... while at the same time perhaps supporting the very same industry in their own personal lives. It just didn't make logical sense to me. Morals and ethics are not the same thing.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

Martel

To the OP:

All of this advice about what is right and wrong aside, it sounds to me like you already know you don't want to do this. I'd say don't let something like money pressure you into doing something you would likely feel bad about later on, and that applies to anything, not just sex.

__________________
Anamnesis

analog

abaya: You're very welcome, I'm glad that was cleared up- and I agree that what's best is making sure she understands the choices and future implications.

I agree.

Glory's Sun

Ok well let me pose another question..

people say they wouldn't marry someone who had helter skelter sex with random people for money. Would you marry someone who got drunk in clubs and slept with random people in a college setting?? I have a feeling that most people have and will.

So really.. what is the difference there?? You have one person standing on the street getting paid to be a "whore" and you have a girl dancing in the club getting free drinks to be a "whore". Hrmm..

It all boils down to this IMO; you have to be careful, you have to be smart.. and you have to do what's best for <b>YOU</b> and you alone.

Xera

I would strongly consider how strong a relationship REALLY can be without complete honesty. That means no lies of omission either. It's crazy but when you keep secrets, especially the big ones, from a partner you tend to begin to distrust the partner. Depending on the emotional level of commitment between partners- I wouldn't tell every guy that I dated that "hey I used to screw for money" but I would definately tell a long term partner about portions of my past that had a very big impact on how I came to be who I am. If you want to commitment you must be willing to be open and honest or the relationship is flawed from the beginning.

Don't do it. You said yourself that it doesn't turn you on, it's not something that you actually want to do, and if that's the case, don't do it. I don't personally see prostitution as morally disgusting, just as another job with unpleasant working conditions. That said, if you don't really feel comfortable with the job, don't do it.

I know there are others out there that are telling you about screwing up your physical/mental health, however I don't believe that is always an accurate assumption. You can be a prostitute that doesn't get any more screwed up in the head or STDs if you are actually doing something you want and being careful about it, but if your doing something you dont want to for money then at some point you will be screwing up your psyche.

Listen to me, I've had 4 psychology classes and suddenly I'm dispensing wisdom like I have any to give? All advice given from me is given with good intent, but i'm screwed up and frequently talk out of my ass. Just my 2 cents, take it for what its worth.

__________________

~~^~<@Xera @>~^~~

Jinn

I've always thought that was peculiar, and I have to disagree with not only you but the law banning prostition.

If you pay a girl to "make a movie" with you, having sex.. it's pornographic, and it's entirely legal.

Let's break down the ingredients:

Money changed hands (business agreement).
Woman had sex with you, for that money.
Video was sold, likely at a profit (more money made).

And yet, if you meet a girl on a streetcorner (or hell, a bar for that matter) who offers to engage in sex with you for money, it's illegal.

The ONLY difference between the two situations is a video camera. It makes me think that you should be able to avoid police stings for prostitution simply by announcing that you've brought a video camera, and that you are paying for the video, not the sex. Bullshit technicalities on human behavior never work.

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Cimarron29414

I was simply listing my knee-jerk reactions as I read. I will expound on this one, however: There are 3 billion women on the planet. Let's say 1 billion of them are within marrying age, half of them are single, etc - I don't know. Regardless, we all have standards we use to cut through that 500 million to get to the people we would actually want to have a relationship with. For me, my standards would include "having not been a prostitute". While this might seem arbitrary to you, one has to set some sort of bar and mine would include that. It doesn't mean I wouldn't be the woman's friend or give her a helping hand, it simply means I wouldn't date her.

Think of it this way: how many girls would date a man that ~used~ to be a rapist? He did the crime/time and all that, and now he's just so Schmo she meets in the supermarket. I admit that rape is worse than prostitution but that shouldn't be factored into the comparison because, hey, neither of them is a prostitute or a rapist anymore. There aren't many women who would "forgive people's past" enough to date that guy. It's just natural selection, of sorts.

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"Here lies The_Jazz: Killed by an ambitious, sparkly, pink butterfly."

ShaniFaye

I hardly think you can compare a man being a rapist (ie violent idiot) to a woman exhanging money for sex...thats ridiculous

Lots of men consider women to be prostituting themselves if they pay for dinner and then fuck the girl (again that person is an idiot), thats one reason if I knew I wanted to screw a guy, I paid either for every thing or my share (thats one of the things Dave loved about me when we first met)

Self esteem, legalities aside...to answer the OP, I would never be with a man I couldnt share 100% of my past with. As Dave always says, the past is not "dead" its whats made me into the person he loves and cherishes. I have a sexual history that would make some men turn and run scared, on the other hand there are guys that are not intimidated or put off by it at all. All men are different, thats why its so hard to find the "right" one sometimes. I dont want someone to "forgive" my past, Im not looking for absolution from a mate, he can either understand it or move on.

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Crack

This argument reminds me of a joke...

John is retiring after 20 years of working, he gets thrown a party by all his friends and co-workers. They all start chanting "speech, speech!" he makes his way up to the podium, and begins: "Friends, Family, Well Wishers... I am here today to not only retire, but to offer some advice. You can build a thousand bridges, but do they call you John the Bridge-builder? No. You can mend a thousand broken bones, but do they call you John the Healer? No. You can sleep with a thousand women, but do they call you John the Ladies Man? No. But... I swear to god, you suck one little dick..."

This is something that is going to stick with you for as long as you live. Even if no one else knows, you will.

__________________
Crack, you and I are long overdue for a vicious bout of mansex.

~Halx

shesus

I'm guess this is to me since helter skelter is used. No, as others have mentioned that is a deal breaker for me. I never wanted to be with a guy that slept with random people and I never was. If I found out they were, end of relationship for me. The only reason I mentioned this is because the OP asks if she should tell and if it would make a difference. As some people stated it wouldn't matter, but other people do care about that. Same with smoking, drinking, or any action that people do. I had people not date me because I smoked. And that's a lot smaller than prostituting oneself. I never had relationships with these people because if someone is choosing to have random sex it says something about their character. Every action makes you the person you are today. So even if the act is in the past, the outcome of it is still in the present.

This thread has turned away from the OP in a way. I think she should tell people she is sexually involved with, outside of prostitution, because of the fact that diseases could be involved. Also, if she is going to be serious with a person, it would be a weight on her not to tell and try to keep a secret. The truth generally comes out sometime anyway. Why do something now that you are certain or might think you will be ashamed of in the future?

That's just my opinion and I'm entitled to it. You've heard of the asshole analogy I'm sure. Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one and some of them stink more than others. I don't care if you agree or disagree, I just think that people who feel the way I do are being made to feel like there is something wrong with our thinking. We are all different and it would be boring if we all thought the same way.

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Whatever did happen to your soul?
I heard you sold it

Choose Heaven for the weather and Hell for the company

sapiens

I don't see the inconsistency. The people we find attractive for long-term romantic relationships are often qualitatively different from those that we find attractive for short-term sexual relationships (whether the relationship is real or fantasy via pornography). It seems reasonable to me that someone could be attracted to promiscuous sexuality in a short-term partner, but not be interested in that same promiscuity in a long-term partner.

Regarding sexual histories: Individuals looking for long-term partners must have some criteria they use to select their partners. I would expect these criteria to be more selective in long-term relationships than in short-term relationships. There area more costs involved in making the wrong decision regarding a long-term partner. Across a variety of domains, the best predictor of future behavior is past behavior. I would guess that a promiscuous sexual history predicts infidelity better than many other relationship variables. If I had the time, I might check existing empirical research.

Glory's Sun

You are entilted to your opinion and you have the right to offend it. I wasn't singling you out, or anyone else for that matter. I don't think you're wrong. It's your choice. I'm just trying to grasp the understanding of where you're coming from. I'm also putting out scenarios to kind of see why one method of thinking is ok and another is not when they are virtually the same situation.

nothing more.

n0nsensical

well, in case anyone cares for my opinion, which...yeah..., i would have much more of a problem with a woman hiding the fact that she was a prostitute than with the fact that she was a prostitute. now obviously, this doesn't mean you have to come out on the first date and be all like, 'Hey, btw...', but if we're talking serious relationship it should all be out. i can imagine marrying someone who was once a prostitute; i can't imagine marrying someone without the mutual knowledge and trust of each other necessary to allow something like this to come out.

then again, i also think prostitution should be legal, so maybe most people have more of a problem with the act itself than I do (i.e., as usual, ymmv).

Deltona Couple

Forgive me please for the threadjacking....

But, JinnKai, they ARE someone ELSES mother, daughter, sister, so where is the difference? where is the set standard? It's ok for say MY sister to do it while you sit back and enjoy watching, but not ok for YOUR sister to do it while someone else watches?...Double standard there.....


It all goes to the intent of your actions. If you pay two girls to have sex with each other, and it is NOT filmed for a PROFIT making company, then it is considered prostitution.(even if you video it for your own enjoyment, since the INTENT was not for your profit, it is illegal.) If you pay a person to have sex with YOU, the same standard applies; If you are selling the tape for legitimate profit, it is legal. The illegality comes from offering money for sexual favors when the intent is for self gratification only. MANY prostitutes around the US have been able to find a loophole in the laws BECAUSE of the specific letter of the law....Example: You hire a prostitute to come to your home and pose nude for you. You take photographs(any kind, nudity not required) and you pay her for letting you take the photos....Now neither one of you has broken the law...but the prostitute is SOOO attracted to you that she CHOOSES to have sex with you....since you didn't pay her to have SEX with you, only for the photos, then neither one of you have TECHNICALLY broken the law, but the end result is still the same. This has actually been used as a legal defense in New York and California, and SUCEEDED in winning.

Gotta find the loophole...lol

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LoganSnake

I'm one of those people who need to know everything about their partners and in turn I open up myself to them. If I found out that my parter had this kind of thing in her past, I don't think that I would be able to let it go off my mind. I would not be able to be with a woman who has practiced prostitution.

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abaya

Shesus, I hope you were not offended by my comments. To be clear, I do think it's perfectly fine and normal to have arbitrary reasons to not date someone... hell, that's normal. People are human, and it's absolutely necessary and healthy to know one's deal-breaking limits. I think what the OP is trying to figure out is this very issue... what are her limits, and what might be the limits of someone she'd like to marry or date seriously in the future?

My only issue (and not with you) was the inconsistency I saw between people who see prostitution as a deal-breaker (which is valid) and even morally condemn a woman for seeking that job, and yet may very well go support the very same industry of sex-for-money with their own money and/or time. Why the difference? Why not just support someone who once did something that you also enjoyed watching, as long as that person was clean and careful and participated of her own will? (for the record, I am also seeing quite a few people voice that opinion here, and I'm glad for that)

I see this as being some kind of cognitive dissonance, double-standard, etc, and it bothers me. It would be like if I refused to date a smoker because that was a deal-breaker for me and I considered it somehow "wrong," but then went out and bought stock in the tobacco industry or something. Maybe a poor analogy, but you get my drift?

Meh, this thread is an interesting discussion, but it is a bit of a threadjack. I retire.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

LoganSnake

abaya, I see your point. The thing is, despite what my opinions on prostitution are, the simple fact is that I wouldn't want to be with a person who has took part in such a venue. I may not have anything against it, but I simply wouldn't feel comlpetely right being with somebody who had sex for money with many people before me.

The same thoughts apply to your tobacco analogy. I don't like being around people who smoke simply for the fact that I can't stand cigarette smoke. I have no problems, however, with people smoking. It's just a personal preference to not be around smokers while they are in the act.

__________________
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Cimarron29414

Please note that I did say "I admit rape is worse that prostitution". What I was trying to equate were two illegal, sexually-oriented pasts. Perhaps I should have said "male prostitute", although most women's impression of that involves Richard Gere and they might not think of it as being that bad. That's why I didn't use it. The thing is, I believe most men probably view a former prostitute with the same unease that most women view former rapists - meaning, most men would find the thought of having sex with them as displeasurable as the later for women. That was the *feeling* I was trying to capture. I was not trying to equate the two in terms of which is more dangerous to society, etc.

Bringing this back to my original post: The only point I am trying to make is that MOST people, when it comes to selecting a spouse, would not accept a past that involved prostitution.

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"Here lies The_Jazz: Killed by an ambitious, sparkly, pink butterfly."

mixedmedia

This may be so if you are "shopping" for a husband or wife, but once you are in love with a person you may not find it as easy to summarily reject them on these grounds.

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PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

Glory's Sun

hear hear!!

I agree to a point and notice how many people marry others even when they weren't the "perfect" choice. Perhaps it's because they finally realize that nobody is perfect.

I mean seriously, how many people who think sex for money is wrong (prostitution) wouldn't sleep with a pornstar? I can't say I wouldn't. Hell, most people (women and men) have that one celeb/person that they just want to jump no matter what.

I'm not a romantic, but I'd like to think that once love comes into the picture it releases the "bonds" of mistakes and brings something better about. Actually, I bet that's why I'm married, because if shit I've done in the past really mattered, I would be a lonely man.

It's not wrong to have deal breakers, but IMO it is wrong to say no to someone whom you might care about because of their past especially if you weren't a part of that past.

Jozrael

Why's that wrong? If you'll just be full of negative feelings from it, there are plenty of other people out there that you could care for. When entering a relationship, and indeed at points within, you have to weigh your options. What's wrong with saying the grass is greener over there? As long as it's for a legitimate reason and doesn't become a habit, nothing wrong with switching people. As long as you know what you want in your heart.

vox_rox

I would do it and I would tell those who, when the time was right, needed to know.

The reason I say this is beacuse everything you do becomes part of who you are, so if someone really loves you, they love you for that reason.

If you tell them a secret, that should not be the end of a relationship and, if it is, it is quite possibly something that was not meant to be.

Just my $0.02 worth, YMMV.

Peace,

Pierre

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shakran

By that logic I should be able to do anything I want to -- - kill someone, for instance, and whoever I date shouldn't leave me when she finds out because having killed that guy is a part of me and if she really loves me. . ..

There are many, MANY people who cannot bring themselves to love a prostitute or a former prostitute. I strongly suspect randygurl is one of those people, and it would certainly suck to go through the rest of your life hating yourself for what you did because working retail was too hard.

mixedmedia

Well, for one, prostitution is not the same as killing someone. Killing someone intentionally, that is. Murder. Most people would see a grave difference just on the self-defensive level alone.

My point is that once you are in love, many people find it very easy to accept the flaws and foibles in that person's past. Especially in this case in which the OP is describing a temporary situation (the vagary of her choice to stop when she intended to notwithstanding). But very rarely is this something you will find out from someone on the first few dates. At least, I wouldn't tell someone I was seeing casually.

As for the question of money, it is not that working retail is too hard...it is the AMOUNT of money in comparison to working retail, I am sure. You've already labeled prostitutes as unmarryable - at least by you. No need to call them lazy, too.

Once again, she should refrain from going through with this because she feels compunction about how it will affect her emotionally, mentally - her OWN feelings of self-worth. Not because someone won't love her. Someone will.

__________________
Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus
PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

randygurl

Just to clarify - I work as a receptionist in a law firm not in retail!

If you had checked my profile, you would have seen that.....

Coyote Hunter

I agree with Sultana 100% If it doesnt feal right don't do it

Sue

I have no need to hide anything from my bf. There's only one thing in my life that I've kept completely private, but even while we were just getting to know each other, I felt I should let him know, so I did, and there was no issue with it. Why hide something? If you feel like you trust the person well enough, and you see yourself with this person for a long time, then just tell them. They may not like it at first, but eventually they'll be glad you were honest with them. Just my 2 cents.

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shakran

My apologies for getting your job wrong. However, I very much doubt that I'm alone in the fact that I do not check the profiles of everyone in the thread every time I reply. If it's important information for the topic, it should be included in the OP.

macmanmike6100

If you have this much concern about it, I'd say that you're already (rightly) telling yourself not to do it, especially because it's just for money, whatever the amount (well, almost).

There have to be other ways to get the cash you need, whether it's eating out less, buying fewer clothes, dry-cleaning less, or asking for a raise. But earning a bit extra shouldn't be this harrowing and shouldn't be such that it makes you concerned about future relationships/marriage.

Good luck and do let us know how it goes.