I hear the Scopes-Monkey Trial isn't in Kansas history textbooks... - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

guy44 · 05-06-2005, 05:50 PM

Yet again, the Kansas Board of Education will be deciding whether or not evolution should be part of the curriculum. I just...these people...so stupid...well, read for yourself:

Quote:

The hearings in Topeka, scheduled to last several days, are focusing on two proposals. The first recommends that students continue to be taught the theory of evolution because it is key to understanding biology. The other proposes that Kansas alter the definition of science, not limiting it to theories based on natural explanations.

How do you even TALK to someone who thinks science should include theories not based on natural explanations? Answer: slowly, and with small words. Ha, ha. No, just kidding. Sort of.

Yeah, frankly I'm not even sure how to finish this post. I guess I'll just ask: can someone tell me why voting NO on the latter proposal is controversial at all?

lindseylatch · 05-06-2005, 06:08 PM

wha...? but...huh?
science that isn't based on natural explanations? What would it be based on? The will of the Cosmic Muffin?

Superbelt · 05-06-2005, 07:14 PM

Can't win the game, make up new rules.

guthmund · 05-06-2005, 10:10 PM

Well, it worked with Monopoly oh, so many years ago....

Gilda · 05-06-2005, 10:38 PM

Quote:

The other proposes that Kansas alter the definition of science, not limiting it to theories based on natural explanations.

In further proposals, Kansas intends to alter the definition of math, not limiting it to the understanding and use of numbers, the definition of language arts, not limiting it to the understanding and use of language, history to include the discussion of events that have not yet occurred, Geography to include Middle Earth, Spanish to include Portugese, and PE, not to be limited to the human body.

alansmithee · 05-06-2005, 11:20 PM

You know, I don't understand liberals constant desire...
The persecution of religion in this country...
Parents need to have a say in the edu...
Natural expression is such a vague term, and the secula...
Uh..

Nope, can't do it. This is really stupid. Redefining science? I don't see what purpose this could have other than legislating ignorance. How a board of EDUCATION would take days to argue this proposal is quite mindblowing.

Paq · 05-07-2005, 01:55 PM

damn...

i am agreeing with alansmithee..

Locobot · 05-07-2005, 08:18 PM

Ah yes, when your crackpot intelligent design theories have no hold in the scientific world simply change the meaning of science, problem solved.

How could this be misconstrued as an "attack on religion" and not a case where one specific religion is attempting to subject our public schools to their peculiar ideology? Why are some Americans unable to understand that they live in a country which forbids the establishment of a religion by the government, even through the public schools.

hannukah harry · 05-08-2005, 04:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locobot

How could this be misconstrued as an "attack on religion" and not a case where one specific religion is attempting to subject our public schools to their peculiar ideology? Why are some Americans unable to understand that they live in a country which forbids the establishment of a religion by the government, even through the public schools.

easy. because people, especially when in large groups, are dumb.

aKula · 05-08-2005, 05:08 AM

Slightly off topic, but my mother (who is a Mathematician), once told me that a US state had a law in place saying that 22/7 will be considered as Pi exactly. Though I'm not sure about the truth of this story, the proposed law above has certain similarity to this story. You must remember that to the people pushing these things, evolution is clearly wrong as anything in the bible must be correct. What amazes me are what at least seems to be the large number of religious people in the USA take the story of creation as absolute truth. An Anglican Father once told me that he thought the evidence backing the theory of evolution was overwhelming. Though it is important to remember that what consists of the thoeory of evolution is constantly being changed, refined and added too, the overall idea is accepted by an overwhelming amount of the scientific community, and much of the general public aswell.

Paq · 05-08-2005, 02:08 PM

Kay from the men in black: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it."

so there ya go...

jonjon42 · 05-08-2005, 03:40 PM

I think the only thing that needs to be said about this really is whaa?
what other explanation is there in biology?

lindseylatch · 05-09-2005, 08:02 AM

22/7 is Pi...

kutulu · 05-09-2005, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lindseylatch

22/7 is Pi...

22/7 is actually an approximation of Pi. However, since we usually substitute only 3.14 in as Pi instead of 3.141592653589793238462643383279502884197169399375105820974944 it really makes no difference. There really is little difference in using 22/7, 3.14, or carrying out Pi to however many digits you want to. Although 22/7 is a slight overestimate of Pi, it's more accurate than using only 3.14.

Kadath · 05-09-2005, 09:52 AM

PI IS EXACTLY THREE!!

Charlatan · 05-09-2005, 09:59 AM

Did someone say there was pie? Yum!

flstf · 05-09-2005, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aKula

Slightly off topic, but my mother (who is a Mathematician), once told me that a US state had a law in place saying that 22/7 will be considered as Pi exactly. Though I'm not sure about the truth of this story, the proposed law above has certain similarity to this story.

You have to wonder what these guys were thinking, or should that be drinking.

Quote:

http://www.acc.umu.se/~olletg/pi/indiana.html
The estimate pi=3 is charitable. They were much farther off.

On January 15, 1897 Edwin J. Goodman of Solitude, Indiana introduced bill #246 to the Indiana House of Representatives that not only legislated \pi =16/sqrt(3) > 9, but also squared the circle and trisected an arbitrary angle. The bill said in part

Be it enacted by the General Assembly of the State of Indiana: It has been found that the circular area is to the quadrant of the circumference, as the area of an equilateral rectangle is to the square on one side. The diameter employed as the linear unit according to the present rule in computing the circle's area is entirely wrong...

The bill was passed back to the general assembly by the Committee of Education with the recommendation that it be passed. It was passed on February 5, 1897 with a vote of 67 to 0.

"An ex-teacher from the eastern part of the state was saying: 'The
case is perfectly simple. If we pass this bill which establishes a
new and correct value for pi , the author offers to our state
without cost the use of his discovery and its free publication in
our school text books, while everyone else must pay him a royalty.'"

Then, it went to the Indiana Senate. By accident, a mathematics professor from Purdue, C. A. Waldo, happened to be attending the debates on the day the bill was read to the Senate. He managed to educate some of the senators in a hurry, and the bill was tabled. It has been on the table ever since, as far as I've heard.

05-06-2005, 06:08 PM	#2 (permalink)
lindseylatch Addict Location: Seattle, WA	wha...? but...huh? science that isn't based on natural explanations? What would it be based on? The will of the Cosmic Muffin? __________________ "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities" "If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him." "It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong." -Voltaire

05-06-2005, 10:10 PM	#4 (permalink)
guthmund big damn hero	Well, it worked with Monopoly oh, so many years ago.... __________________ No signature. None. Seriously.

05-07-2005, 01:55 PM	#7 (permalink)
Paq Junkie Location: South Carolina	damn... i am agreeing with alansmithee.. __________________ Live. Chris

05-08-2005, 02:08 PM	#11 (permalink)
Paq Junkie Location: South Carolina	Kay from the men in black: A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it." so there ya go... __________________ Live. Chris

05-08-2005, 03:40 PM	#12 (permalink)
jonjon42 Psycho Location: inside my own mind	I think the only thing that needs to be said about this really is whaa? what other explanation is there in biology? __________________ A damn dirty hippie without the dirty part....

05-06-2005, 07:14 PM	#3 (permalink)
Superbelt This vexes me. I am terribly vexed. Location: Grantville, Pa	Can't win the game, make up new rules.

05-06-2005, 11:20 PM	#6 (permalink)
alansmithee Junkie	You know, I don't understand liberals constant desire... The persecution of religion in this country... Parents need to have a say in the edu... Natural expression is such a vague term, and the secula... Uh.. Nope, can't do it. This is really stupid. Redefining science? I don't see what purpose this could have other than legislating ignorance. How a board of EDUCATION would take days to argue this proposal is quite mindblowing.

05-07-2005, 08:18 PM	#8 (permalink)
Locobot is awesome!	Ah yes, when your crackpot intelligent design theories have no hold in the scientific world simply change the meaning of science, problem solved. How could this be misconstrued as an "attack on religion" and not a case where one specific religion is attempting to subject our public schools to their peculiar ideology? Why are some Americans unable to understand that they live in a country which forbids the establishment of a religion by the government, even through the public schools.

05-08-2005, 05:08 AM	#10 (permalink)
aKula Psycho	Slightly off topic, but my mother (who is a Mathematician), once told me that a US state had a law in place saying that 22/7 will be considered as Pi exactly. Though I'm not sure about the truth of this story, the proposed law above has certain similarity to this story. You must remember that to the people pushing these things, evolution is clearly wrong as anything in the bible must be correct. What amazes me are what at least seems to be the large number of religious people in the USA take the story of creation as absolute truth. An Anglican Father once told me that he thought the evidence backing the theory of evolution was overwhelming. Though it is important to remember that what consists of the thoeory of evolution is constantly being changed, refined and added too, the overall idea is accepted by an overwhelming amount of the scientific community, and much of the general public aswell.

05-09-2005, 08:02 AM	#13 (permalink)
lindseylatch Addict Location: Seattle, WA	22/7 is Pi... __________________ "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities" "If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him." "It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong." -Voltaire

05-09-2005, 09:52 AM	#15 (permalink)
Kadath Muffled Location: Camazotz	PI IS EXACTLY THREE!! __________________ it's quiet in here

05-09-2005, 09:59 AM	#16 (permalink)
Charlatan Getting it. Super Moderator Location: Lion City	Did someone say there was pie? Yum! __________________ "My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars." - Old Man Luedecke