Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community  

Go Back   Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community > The Academy > Tilted Politics


 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 08-06-2004, 04:09 PM   #1 (permalink)
Please touch this.
 
Halx's Avatar
 
Owner/Admin
Location: Manhattan
I think there should be some new terms used..

Right now we have two terms to describe opposite ends of the spectrum: Liberal and conservative.

However, there are 2 different spectrums in politics that these labels apply to: Social and economic.

It's all too possible to fall on one end of the social spectrum and be on the complete other end of the economic spectrum, so I think these needs to be some sort of clarification.

Since the terms liberal and conservative are used as identifying labels, I would readily assign them to the social spectrum. Meanwhile, the economic spectrum should be seen as a different field.

What are some terms that are used to describe people on opposite ends of the economic spectrum?

(And, I'm not a fan of labels.. I hate being called an independant.. but this is better for shorthand in conversational use)
__________________
You have found this post informative.
-The Administrator
[Don't Feed The Animals]
Halx is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 04:28 PM   #2 (permalink)
Walking is Still Honest
 
FoolThemAll's Avatar
 
Location: Seattle, WA
Yep. I've been using the quadrant system for a while now. I'm solidly on the right side economically, but I've got both liberal and conservative positions socially. So I'm somewhere between conservatism and libertarianism.
__________________
I wonder if we're stuck in Rome.
FoolThemAll is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 05:10 PM   #3 (permalink)
Insane
 
Well, there's always the Political Compass.



I think it does a pretty good job of portraying varying political viewpoints (both socially and economically). I fall in with the libertarian left.

Note: The American "Libertarian Party" would probably classify as libertarian right, though as the Political Compass points out, their "libertarian impulses stop short of opposition to strong law and order positions, and are more economic in substance (ie no taxes) so they are not as extremely libertarian as they are extremely right wing."

Last edited by hammer4all; 08-06-2004 at 05:30 PM..
hammer4all is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 06:14 PM   #4 (permalink)
Junk
 
Re: I think there should be some new terms used..

Quote:
Originally posted by Halx


What are some terms that are used to describe people on opposite ends of the economic spectrum?
Scumbag and douchebag come to mind first of all. Depending on who you are speaking with.
__________________
" In Canada, you can tell the most blatant lie in a calm voice, and people will believe you over someone who's a little passionate about the truth." David Warren, Western Standard.
OFKU0 is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 06:16 PM   #5 (permalink)
Human
 
SecretMethod70's Avatar
 
Administrator
Location: Chicago
Quote:
Originally posted by OFKU0
Scumbag and douchebag come to mind first of all. Depending on who you are speaking with.
You're intelligent enough to know that's got nothing to do with what he was talking about. Let's keep the dialogue above comments like that here.
__________________
Le temps détruit tout

"Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling
SecretMethod70 is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 06:17 PM   #6 (permalink)
BFG Builder
 
Location: University of Maryland
I fall within the Libertarian left as well, although I'm pretty close to the center in the economic scale. Not so much in the social scale.

I agree with the idea that saying we're liberal or conservative is a bad idea, and would suggest we adopt this a bit more. Maybe make it a sticky post?
__________________
If ignorance is bliss, you must be having an orgasm.
DelayedReaction is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 06:38 PM   #7 (permalink)
Please touch this.
 
Halx's Avatar
 
Owner/Admin
Location: Manhattan
I think the issue with that political compass is the use of 'libertarian' as a label.. people would be quick to assume party affiliation.
__________________
You have found this post informative.
-The Administrator
[Don't Feed The Animals]
Halx is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 06:40 PM   #8 (permalink)
Insane
 
Location: st. louis
you could almost replace liberaterian with mild anarchist that seems like what they are trying to go at but those words tend to have a negative conotation so they probably arent the best
__________________
"The difference between commiment and involvment is like a ham and egg breakfast the chicken was involved but the pig was commited"

"Thrice happy is the nation that has a glorious history. Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." Theodore Roosevelt
fuzyfuzer is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 06:55 PM   #9 (permalink)
Junk
 
Quote:
Originally posted by SecretMethod70
Let's keep the dialogue above comments like that here.
My apologies at attempt'd humor.
__________________
" In Canada, you can tell the most blatant lie in a calm voice, and people will believe you over someone who's a little passionate about the truth." David Warren, Western Standard.
OFKU0 is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 07:52 PM   #10 (permalink)
Insane
 
TheKak's Avatar
 
Location: Virginia
I agree, the quadrant system is a better way of doing it than "liberal" or "conservative". Call me liberal left!
__________________
Roses are red, violets are blue, I'm a schizophrenic and so am I.
TheKak is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 09:12 PM   #11 (permalink)
BFG Builder
 
Location: University of Maryland
Okay, so how about liberal instead of libertarian, conservative instead of authoritarian, and keep the left and right?
__________________
If ignorance is bliss, you must be having an orgasm.
DelayedReaction is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 09:27 PM   #12 (permalink)
Junkie
 
Location: Chicago
Whenever I think of changing terms to describe political affiliation, I'm reminded of the saying, "Meet the new boss, same as the old boss."

Whatever terms we come up with, we eventually run into the same problems of old: attempting to villify whatever label with which we disagree.

We complain of how much we disdain labels, then quickly label ourselves. What I find curious is how many people, in the attempt to not label themselves, label themselves as libertarian. This is not a jab at anyone here - lest it be taken as such. The point I am making is that we have created a new label in the hopes of escaping labels. It's normal human behavior to classify. It's what we do. Airports do it, grocery stores do it, gas stations do it, birds do it, bees do it....

Instead of railing against labels, I say create more and give more political choice. It's not the labels that voters hate, it's the lack of choice in identifying themselves that they hate. Not all liberals back every action of the Democratic party and not all conservatives back every action of the Republican party. Having only two solid choices tends to force us into a box with which we're not entirely comfortable. I'd like to see a more Parliamentary system in which a third party candidate can translate votes into representative seats in the house. Maybe then we can have more choice and more a sense of ownership in our government.
__________________
"I can normally tell how intelligent a man is by how stupid he thinks I am" - Cormac McCarthy, All The Pretty Horses
JumpinJesus is offline  
Old 08-06-2004, 09:30 PM   #13 (permalink)
MSD
The sky calls to us ...
 
MSD's Avatar
 
Super Moderator
Location: CT
Quote:
Originally posted by fuzyfuzer
you could almost replace liberaterian with mild anarchist that seems like what they are trying to go at but those words tend to have a negative conotation so they probably arent the best
Anti-authoritarian has a nice, positive-sounding ring to it.

I think that opinions on foreign policy should also be factored in, and are separate enough from economic issues that they deserve thier own axis, which would make the compass a cube.

On the political compass, I fall between -5 and -6 on the vertical axis, and between 2 and 3 on the economic. This is a big change since my introduction to Tilted Politics, when I was around -9, -9.
MSD is offline  
Old 08-07-2004, 06:45 AM   #14 (permalink)
Walking is Still Honest
 
FoolThemAll's Avatar
 
Location: Seattle, WA
Quote:
Originally posted by MrSelfDestruct
Anti-authoritarian has a nice, positive-sounding ring to it.
ANARCHY!!!!!!!! PUNK RAWK!!!!

What'd be the term for those on the border of authoritarian and anti-authoritarian like myself, though? Double-agent?
__________________
I wonder if we're stuck in Rome.
FoolThemAll is offline  
Old 08-07-2004, 01:01 PM   #15 (permalink)
Insane
 
Location: st. louis
Quote:
Originally posted by DelayedReaction
Okay, so how about liberal instead of libertarian, conservative instead of authoritarian, and keep the left and right?
that dosen't quite work because liberitarian is really standing for someone who wants personal liberties over government control and i don't think that liberal really stands for that personally, i don't know. how about incrising control on top and increasing freedoms and responsabilities on the bottom.
__________________
"The difference between commiment and involvment is like a ham and egg breakfast the chicken was involved but the pig was commited"

"Thrice happy is the nation that has a glorious history. Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." Theodore Roosevelt
fuzyfuzer is offline  
Old 08-07-2004, 03:02 PM   #16 (permalink)
BFG Builder
 
Location: University of Maryland
Fine then. Up/Down, Left/Right?

I'm down-left myself. :P
__________________
If ignorance is bliss, you must be having an orgasm.
DelayedReaction is offline  
Old 08-07-2004, 07:23 PM   #17 (permalink)
Insane
 
Location: st. louis
somtimes simpleast are the best i think
__________________
"The difference between commiment and involvment is like a ham and egg breakfast the chicken was involved but the pig was commited"

"Thrice happy is the nation that has a glorious history. Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." Theodore Roosevelt
fuzyfuzer is offline  
Old 08-07-2004, 08:42 PM   #18 (permalink)
MSD
The sky calls to us ...
 
MSD's Avatar
 
Super Moderator
Location: CT
Quote:
Originally posted by FoolThemAll
ANARCHY!!!!!!!! PUNK RAWK!!!!

What'd be the term for those on the border of authoritarian and anti-authoritarian like myself, though? Double-agent?
"Moderate"
MSD is offline  
Old 08-07-2004, 11:18 PM   #19 (permalink)
I change
 
ARTelevision's Avatar
 
Location: USA
I am quite cognizant of authority as a requirement for excellence in human existence, so I'm content with the description "authoritarian".
I also prefer being "right" to being wrong.
__________________
create evolution
ARTelevision is offline  
Old 08-09-2004, 05:01 AM   #20 (permalink)
Muffled
 
Kadath's Avatar
 
Location: Camazotz
Quote:
Originally posted by ARTelevision
I also prefer being "right" to being wrong.
Aw, come on! That's no better than "douchebag"!

I'm fine with being labeled liberal. If someone wants to dismiss me because of a label, he is ignorant at best.
__________________
it's quiet in here
Kadath is offline  
Old 08-09-2004, 05:36 AM   #21 (permalink)
I change
 
ARTelevision's Avatar
 
Location: USA
Yes. I agree it's a bit lame.

Well, let's see. Authoritarian just about covers the whole thing.

And in the context of this discussion, there's no need for me to assign right or left affiliation, as Authoritarian actually well conveys my positions.

Thanks.
__________________
create evolution
ARTelevision is offline  
Old 08-09-2004, 06:57 AM   #22 (permalink)
Banned
 
Location: Massachusetts, USA
"Right" and "Left" aren't exactly finely-tuned terms, either. They're like using a stone axe to measure microns of difference, in some ways. They get to the same place by different paths.

"Liberal" doesn't mean what it used to, either. It's used more sloppily these days, as I understand it, which has distorted a previous meaning beyond use.
denim is offline  
Old 08-10-2004, 11:05 AM   #23 (permalink)
Insane
 
Bentley Little's Avatar
 
Location: In my head...
I wholeheartedly hate the labels, because I can be conservative on fiscal issues, and liberal on social issues. This is part of the Libertarian ideals (which when asked what "side" I belong to, I say Libertarian). I would prefer to say, I am not conservative nor liberal, but that I believe in less government and more power/rights/freedoms to the people.
__________________
That is my 2 cents.
Bentley Little is offline  
 

Tags
terms


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 04:18 AM.

Tilted Forum Project

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
© 2002-2012 Tilted Forum Project

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360