Kerry/McCain? - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Scipio · 03-10-2004, 04:22 PM

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/...ing_kerrys_vp/

Quote:

WASHINGTON -- Republican Sen. John McCain allowed a glimmer of hope Wednesday for Democrats fantasizing about a bipartisan dream team to defeat President Bush.

McCain said he would consider the unorthodox step of running for vice president on the Democratic ticket -- in the unlikely event he received such an offer from the presidential candidate.

"John Kerry is a close friend of mine. We have been friends for years," McCain said Wednesday when pressed to squelch speculation about a Kerry-McCain ticket. "Obviously I would entertain it."

But McCain emphasized how unlikely the whole idea was.

"It's impossible to imagine the Democratic Party seeking a pro-life, free-trading, non-protectionist, deficit hawk," the Arizona senator told ABC's "Good Morning America" during an interview about illegal steroid use. "They'd have to be taking some steroids, I think, in order to let that happen."

McCain gained a reputation as a party maverick who appeals to independent voters during his 2000 race against Bush for the Republican nomination. This year, McCain has campaigned for the president and said he would continue to do so.

Unlike some other Republican senators, he hasn't railed against Kerry, a fellow Vietnam veteran. McCain called the Kerry-Bush contest "the nastiest campaign so far that we have seen" and said he preferred campaigning for candidates instead of against their opponents.

It strikes me as highly unlikely that this will happen, but if it did, it just might split the Republican party.

Sparhawk · 03-10-2004, 04:33 PM

*drool*

As much of a Democrat as I am, I have lots in common on specific issues with Senator McCain, moreso than I do with a lot of Democrats in Congress. I was really hoping for a very tough choice in 2000 between McCain and Gore. Alas, since he fathered all those black babies in South Carolina, it wasn't to be.

Oh yeah, and to respond to Scipio's "splitting the party" comment: I think short of a really big scandal, nothing is going to tear away those loyal Republicans who strongly support Bush at a rate of something like 90%.

theusername · 03-10-2004, 04:35 PM

Bush will lose if this were to happen, plain and simple. As an idependent who plans to vote for Bush this move would change my vote.

djtestudo · 03-10-2004, 04:37 PM

I seriously doubt McCain would do this, since he wants to be president, and I'm sure that he could easily be the Republican candidate in 2008 and destroy whomever the Democrats chose, even an incumbent Kerry.

I even think he'd have a shot if he was able to find the money to be able to run as an independent.

archer2371 · 03-10-2004, 06:26 PM

Actually, if you think about it, this would be seen as a party switch over by a lot of middle of the road people I think. I believe that it was Tip O'Neill who favored the dance with the one that brung ya phrase. Loyalty means a lot to the American people and I really think that this could kill Kerry and McCain. It is highly important to people that politicians (while swarthy and tricky) at least stick with the party that they associate themselves with. We saw what happened to that one guy that jumped parties after the 2000 election, he wasn't elected again. I think that a Kerry/McCain ticket would bring about the same problems as when the United States first started out with the loser being the Veep, one will resent the other or one will disagree with the POTUS and disaster struck and that's why the office of Veep isn't looked upon as a very desirable position is because of the way it started out. If they were both Independents I could see it working out, but one is a Democrat, the other a Republican, and I just don't think that the American people would take too kindly to that.

Scipio · 03-10-2004, 07:06 PM

By split the republican party, I mean that the more libertarian republicans have been looking for a reason to leave Bush. The Texas style GOP just isn't their cup of tea, but then again neither are the Democrats. I think people trust McCain, including a lot of Democrats.

Like archer said, the decision would alienate a lot of left leaning democrats, not to mention people in the party who are working to get the pick. It would send the message that the party lacks the right guy for the job, which it doesn't (imho).

But as a centrist democrat, I'm excited by the possibility.

Ace_of_Lobster · 03-10-2004, 07:55 PM

I would vote for them.
I dont think it will happen.

Tophat665 · 03-10-2004, 08:32 PM

First, Kerry and McCain go together like Peas and Motor Oil. Yes, I'd vote for them, because they would thump Bush bloody, But I would also spend the next four years sending nastygrams to the whitehouse about the worm in their apple. I respect john McCain, but he is the wrong party. If he were the Democratic vice president in 2004, he would be the republican president in 2012, and I could live without another republican in the whitehouse for another 24 years (or more).

Ted Koppel is far and away the better choice if you want to come from cloud-cuckoo land for the VP. Walter Cronkite is better yet (though, of course, he has the sense to say "are you out of your fucking mind?!?!!" if asked)

Ustwo · 03-10-2004, 08:36 PM

Why do people act like the Vice president means diddly/squat for the most part?

The old joke about their job being to wait for someone to die (president/state funerals around the world) is pretty much still true.

Tophat665 · 03-10-2004, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ustwo
Why do people act like the Vice president means diddly/squat for the most part?

The old joke about their job being to wait for someone to die (president/state funerals around the world) is pretty much still true.

Now, correct me if I am wrong, but it seems to me that between a half and a third of the time the guy who is VP in the president's second term is the next president.

djtestudo · 03-10-2004, 09:53 PM

6 of 16 (I think...counted in my head

), so about 40% or so.

Not counting assasinated presidents, or presidents who took over more then halfway into the term (i.e. LBJ, Ford).

Scipio · 03-10-2004, 09:54 PM

Increasingly, the vice president is playing a larger role in the White House. Al Gore had more of a role than anyone before him. Dick Cheney has been the most influential VP ever. The position has really grown over the last 10 years. I wouldn't count out its actual value or its symbolic value on a ticket.

onetime2 · 03-11-2004, 05:22 AM

It wouldn't split the Republican party. Core Republican voters do not like John Kerry and wouldn't be swayed by throwing McCain into the mix as the second fiddle. McCain would lose any hope of a Republican nomination for President in the near future and there's no chance in hell that the Dems would ever push for him as the number 1 contender.

tecoyah · 03-11-2004, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ustwo
Why do people act like the Vice president means diddly/squat for the most part?

The old joke about their job being to wait for someone to die (president/state funerals around the world) is pretty much still true.

You of all people should realize the error in this statement. Do you actually think ...even for a second, that GWB is calling most of the shots in this administration. I mean , the guy cant even pronounce most multi-syllable words. Cheney has the power and is smart enough to hide behind the curtain and pull the strings.

Ustwo · 03-11-2004, 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by tecoyah
You of all people should realize the error in this statement. Do you actually think ...even for a second, that GWB is calling most of the shots in this administration. I mean , the guy cant even pronounce most multi-syllable words. Cheney has the power and is smart enough to hide behind the curtain and pull the strings.

Damn straight GWB is. Time to let go of the liberal 'GWB is a moron' myth.

Also how much influence does anyone think the 'ex-republican' McCain would have in a Kerry ultra liberal white house? Give me a break.

McCain is still looking at 2008. He would be mostly dead as Kerry's VP, and COMPLETELY dead if he lost as Kerry's running mate.

mml · 03-11-2004, 01:15 PM

I said it on another thread, but there is NO way McCain is becoming a Democrat or joining Kerry on the ticket. McCain is the co-chair of the Arizona committee to re-elect Bush and he is a stong (albeit independent) Republican. I don't think he is going to run for the presidency again, unless there is a groundswell of grassroots support to do so. Many of the GOP heavies do not care for his independent nature.

As far as Ustwo's comment about the "ultra-liberal" Kerry White House, I think he is off the mark. I think President Kerry will put together a "center - left" administration and frankly someone like McCain would fit in well, much like former Secretary of Defense William Cohen(a Republican) did in the Clinton Administration. But I guess we will find out next January when Kerry takes office.

Ustwo · 03-11-2004, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mml
As far as Ustwo's comment about the "ultra-liberal" Kerry White House, I think he is off the mark. I think President Kerry will put together a "center - left" administration and frankly someone like McCain would fit in well, much like former Secretary of Defense William Cohen(a Republican) did in the Clinton Administration. But I guess we will find out next January when Kerry takes office.

Oh how they 'forget' the first two years of the 'centrist' Clinton whos liberal follies gave us the 1994 Republican revolution.

In a mythical world where Kerry is president he would have to pay the piper and cow tow to the many special interest deomcrat interest groups.

mml · 03-11-2004, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ustwo
Oh how they 'forget' the first two years of the 'centrist' Clinton whos liberal follies gave us the 1994 Republican revolution.

In a mythical world where Kerry is president he would have to pay the piper and cow tow to the many special interest deomcrat interest groups.

Solid shot Ustwo, but the term "ultra-liberal" is still overstated.

In the very real world, where Bush IS president, he has spent much of the last three years cow towing to the many Republican special interest groups and corporations he is beholden to. Don't get too high and mighty - you know, glass houses and all.

Ustwo · 03-11-2004, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mml
Solid shot Ustwo, but the term "ultra-liberal" is still overstated.

In the very real world, where Bush IS president, he has spent much of the last three years cow towing to the many Republican special interest groups and corporations he is beholden to. Don't get too high and mighty - you know, glass houses and all.

Such as?

rsl12 · 03-12-2004, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ustwo
Such as?

Are you serious? Have you looked at where Bush's $100 million in campaign funds has come from?

Ustwo · 03-12-2004, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rsl12
Are you serious? Have you looked at where Bush's $100 million in campaign funds has come from?

From me partly

Now that doesn't answer the question, which groups has he 'supported' which would be out of character or just because he felt he had to, to get their support.

On the other hand Kerry voted for NAFTA and the Unions who are supporting him are expecting a flip flop on that (Hoffa said Kerry is 'growing in understanding').

03-10-2004, 04:33 PM	#2 (permalink)
Sparhawk Dubya Location: VA	drool As much of a Democrat as I am, I have lots in common on specific issues with Senator McCain, moreso than I do with a lot of Democrats in Congress. I was really hoping for a very tough choice in 2000 between McCain and Gore. Alas, since he fathered all those black babies in South Carolina, it wasn't to be. Oh yeah, and to respond to Scipio's "splitting the party" comment: I think short of a really big scandal, nothing is going to tear away those loyal Republicans who strongly support Bush at a rate of something like 90%. __________________ "In Iraq, no doubt about it, it's tough. It's hard work. It's incredibly hard. It's - and it's hard work. I understand how hard it is. I get the casualty reports every day. I see on the TV screens how hard it is. But it's necessary work. We're making progress. It is hard work."

03-10-2004, 04:37 PM	#4 (permalink)
djtestudo Baltimoron Location: Beeeeeautiful Bel Air, MD	I seriously doubt McCain would do this, since he wants to be president, and I'm sure that he could easily be the Republican candidate in 2008 and destroy whomever the Democrats chose, even an incumbent Kerry. I even think he'd have a shot if he was able to find the money to be able to run as an independent. __________________ "Final thought: I just rented Michael Moore's Bowling for Columbine. Frankly, it was the worst sports movie I've ever seen." --Peter Schmuck, The (Baltimore) Sun

03-10-2004, 06:26 PM	#5 (permalink)
archer2371 Sarge of Blood Gulch Red Outpost Number One Location: On the front lines against our very enemy	Actually, if you think about it, this would be seen as a party switch over by a lot of middle of the road people I think. I believe that it was Tip O'Neill who favored the dance with the one that brung ya phrase. Loyalty means a lot to the American people and I really think that this could kill Kerry and McCain. It is highly important to people that politicians (while swarthy and tricky) at least stick with the party that they associate themselves with. We saw what happened to that one guy that jumped parties after the 2000 election, he wasn't elected again. I think that a Kerry/McCain ticket would bring about the same problems as when the United States first started out with the loser being the Veep, one will resent the other or one will disagree with the POTUS and disaster struck and that's why the office of Veep isn't looked upon as a very desirable position is because of the way it started out. If they were both Independents I could see it working out, but one is a Democrat, the other a Republican, and I just don't think that the American people would take too kindly to that. __________________ "This ain't no Ice Cream Social!" "Hey Grif, Chupathingy...how bout that? I like it...got a ring to it." "I have no earthly idea what it is I just saw, or what this place is, or where in the hell O'Malley is! My only choice is to blame Grif for coming up with such a flawed plan. Stupid, stupid Grif."

03-10-2004, 07:06 PM	#6 (permalink)
Scipio Mencken Location: College	By split the republican party, I mean that the more libertarian republicans have been looking for a reason to leave Bush. The Texas style GOP just isn't their cup of tea, but then again neither are the Democrats. I think people trust McCain, including a lot of Democrats. Like archer said, the decision would alienate a lot of left leaning democrats, not to mention people in the party who are working to get the pick. It would send the message that the party lacks the right guy for the job, which it doesn't (imho). But as a centrist democrat, I'm excited by the possibility. __________________ "Erections lasting more than 4 hours, though rare, require immediate medical attention."

03-10-2004, 07:55 PM	#7 (permalink)
Ace_of_Lobster Crazy	I would vote for them. I dont think it will happen. __________________ "Hundreds of men must have told you how beautiful you are. Would you displease the gods to hear it once more? I wouldn't. Im young and I hope to see a god before I die." -Patera Silk

03-10-2004, 04:35 PM	#3 (permalink)
theusername Insane	Bush will lose if this were to happen, plain and simple. As an idependent who plans to vote for Bush this move would change my vote.

03-10-2004, 08:32 PM	#8 (permalink)
Tophat665 Minion of the scaléd ones Location: Northeast Jesusland	First, Kerry and McCain go together like Peas and Motor Oil. Yes, I'd vote for them, because they would thump Bush bloody, But I would also spend the next four years sending nastygrams to the whitehouse about the worm in their apple. I respect john McCain, but he is the wrong party. If he were the Democratic vice president in 2004, he would be the republican president in 2012, and I could live without another republican in the whitehouse for another 24 years (or more). Ted Koppel is far and away the better choice if you want to come from cloud-cuckoo land for the VP. Walter Cronkite is better yet (though, of course, he has the sense to say "are you out of your fucking mind?!?!!" if asked) __________________ Light a man a fire, and he will be warm while it burns. Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life.

03-10-2004, 08:36 PM	#9 (permalink)
Ustwo Pissing in the cornflakes	Why do people act like the Vice president means diddly/squat for the most part? The old joke about their job being to wait for someone to die (president/state funerals around the world) is pretty much still true. __________________ Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.

03-10-2004, 09:53 PM	#11 (permalink)
djtestudo Baltimoron Location: Beeeeeautiful Bel Air, MD	6 of 16 (I think...counted in my head ), so about 40% or so. Not counting assasinated presidents, or presidents who took over more then halfway into the term (i.e. LBJ, Ford). __________________ "Final thought: I just rented Michael Moore's Bowling for Columbine. Frankly, it was the worst sports movie I've ever seen." --Peter Schmuck, The (Baltimore) Sun

03-10-2004, 09:54 PM	#12 (permalink)
Scipio Mencken Location: College	Increasingly, the vice president is playing a larger role in the White House. Al Gore had more of a role than anyone before him. Dick Cheney has been the most influential VP ever. The position has really grown over the last 10 years. I wouldn't count out its actual value or its symbolic value on a ticket. __________________ "Erections lasting more than 4 hours, though rare, require immediate medical attention."

03-11-2004, 05:22 AM	#13 (permalink)
onetime2 Junkie Location: NJ	It wouldn't split the Republican party. Core Republican voters do not like John Kerry and wouldn't be swayed by throwing McCain into the mix as the second fiddle. McCain would lose any hope of a Republican nomination for President in the near future and there's no chance in hell that the Dems would ever push for him as the number 1 contender. __________________ Strive to be more curious than ignorant.

03-11-2004, 01:15 PM	#16 (permalink)
mml Adrift Location: Wandering in the Desert of Life	I said it on another thread, but there is NO way McCain is becoming a Democrat or joining Kerry on the ticket. McCain is the co-chair of the Arizona committee to re-elect Bush and he is a stong (albeit independent) Republican. I don't think he is going to run for the presidency again, unless there is a groundswell of grassroots support to do so. Many of the GOP heavies do not care for his independent nature. As far as Ustwo's comment about the "ultra-liberal" Kerry White House, I think he is off the mark. I think President Kerry will put together a "center - left" administration and frankly someone like McCain would fit in well, much like former Secretary of Defense William Cohen(a Republican) did in the Clinton Administration. But I guess we will find out next January when Kerry takes office. __________________ Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so." -Douglas Adams