Should it be illegal not to vote? - Page 2 - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

smooth · 03-01-2004, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bobaphat
I prefer the uninformed abstain anyway. Voting on name recognition is worse then not voting at all in my opinion.

Yeah, I'd prefer the uninformed abstained, too. But since I can't make them stay home, I'd next prefer to increase the sample size at the voting booths--hopefully that will help minimize the variance between the idiots!

Rodney · 03-01-2004, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ustwo
I personally share most of Heinleins views on life (which btw is also good for ones sex life heh) but his point was that you had to perform some sort of service that was NOT mandatory and very difficult.

I wouldn't hold out for "very difficult" -- just something that proves you understand that you owe something to the society that supports you besides your priceless presence.

Tophat665 · 03-01-2004, 04:14 PM

My inital reaction to this is, "goddamn Communist!" but, on further reflection, he has a point. Voting - taking the time to get informed, schlepp to the polls, stand in line (which there would be if it were mandatory), and wade through the ballot - has an opportunity cost, not a big one, but it is there. So it costs you something to vote, but nothing to stay home. If failure to vote were 1) leiniently enforced, 2) an infraction on the order of a parking ticket, rather than a crime, and 3) carried a minor fine, that would ilustrate to people that there is a cost to not voting. Yes, I know there is a cost to not voting - at the moment his name is Bush - but it takes a ton of work to hammer that into some folks, and usually, only age ever does bring people around.

So failure to vote is $10 or $20 bucks. I can live with that, waived if more than half the election in each category (federal, state, local) are uncontested. If you want to make the point that all the choices suck, go write in "None of the above" or "You all suck".

It's worth thinking about anyway.

(Edited to take the sting out of that first sentance.)
SF: When I say Goddam Communist, I am indulging in hyperbole. Should have stuck a

after it.

losthellhound · 03-02-2004, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Strange Famous
You could spoil the ballot paper if you didnt want to vote for any of the candidates.

This is the WRONG thing to do in an election. They count spoiled ballots as stupid people.. What you do is this. Take your ballot, hand it back to the person and say "There are no suitable candidates" this is counted, and shows more intelligence then putting a giant cross through the whole ballot

Bill O'Rights · 03-02-2004, 01:49 PM

NO! NO! NO! A thousand times, no! I do not want someone that is forced to perform their civic duty, just putting check marks on any old place on the ballot, just to get the hell out of there.

As much as I will never understand the reasoning behind those that do not vote, I would prefer they just stay home and watch TV, than to go out and make completely uninformed choices.

Redlemon · 03-02-2004, 01:53 PM

DON'T VOTE
words and music by Roy Zimmerman
© 1994 Watunes (BMI)
(From "Sing It Loud!" on Metaphor Records)

Well, I'm so happy with the status quo
It's sure to make my business grow
And, children, if you're happy, too
I've got a piece of good advice for you

Don't vote (you young, young Americans)
Don't vote (you young, young Americans)
Don't vote (you're too young, young Americans)
Who are you to say what your future will be?

Don't vote (you young, young Americans)
Don't vote (you unsung Americans)
Don't vote (hold your tongue, Americans)
Help put the mock in democracy

Well, I know my government works for me
I got my congressman on speed dial 3
And I'm proud to say he represents
All his most generous constituents

Don't vote (you young, young Americans)
Don't vote (you young, young Americans)
Don't vote (you're too young, young Americans)
Who are you to say what your future will be?

Don't vote (you young, young Americans)
Don't vote (you unsung Americans)
Don't vote (hold your tongue, Americans)
Help put the mock in democracy

(spoken)
Yes, young Americans, sit home on election day, with your thumbs up and your butts in your chairs... and your thumbs up your butts in your chairs... happy in the knowledge that vital decisions affecting every aspect of your daily life are being made for you, by a few balding billionaires on the 42nd floor.

Don't do it
Eschew it
Say, "Screw it!"
You'll only get addicted to it

Well, I'm so glad to be one of the elite
'Cause you know it keeps me off the street
And you might say I'm out of touch
And I'd say, "Thank you very much." 1

Don't vote (you young, young Americans)
Don't vote (you young, young Americans)
Don't vote (you're too young, young Americans)
Who are you to say what your future will be?

Don't vote (you young, young Americans)
Don't vote (you unsung Americans)
Don't vote (hold your tongue, Americans)
Help put the mock in democracy
I said, help put the mock in democracy

Xell101 · 03-02-2004, 07:30 PM

The day I'd not fight mandatory voting is when it is made convenient and there's a spot labled "None of the above".

Tophat665 · 03-02-2004, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Xell101
The day I'd not fight mandatory voting is when it is made convenient and there's a spot labled "None of the above".

That'd certainly help.

Bill O'Rights · 03-03-2004, 05:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Xell101
The day I'd not fight mandatory voting is when it is made convenient and there's a spot labled "None of the above".

The ballots in Nebraska have a "None Of The Above" choice. I guess I just assumed that everyplace did. I only voted once in Pennsylvania, in 1980. I don't remember if they had that option, or not. I do know that it certainly comes in handy.

kutulu · 03-04-2004, 03:40 PM

Voting should not be manditory. In a perfect world, everyone would be informed of their candidates views on the issues and everyone would vote. However, this is not a perfect world and most people seem to not even know the names of the candidates, much less what they stand for. Too many people are manipulated by cheesy advertisements also.

For the most part, I only vote when I know enough about the candidates to make an informed decision. I wish everyone would be like that.

FleaCircus · 03-04-2004, 07:53 PM

Mandatory voting? Hell no!

The next step after they force you to vote is when they force you to vote for someone in particular. It's the beginning of a slippery slope.

Tholo · 03-04-2004, 08:56 PM

worst. idea. ever.

smooth · 03-04-2004, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by FleaCircus
Mandatory voting? Hell no!

The next step after they force you to vote is when they force you to vote for someone in particular. It's the beginning of a slippery slope.

lol, your argument is a slipper slope. Were you being ironic on purpose?

gibingus · 03-05-2004, 09:46 AM

the right to not vote is integral with the right to vote. by making it manditory, you create a philosphical conflict that negates the freedom.

although nothing pisses me off more than people who don't vote. it's their choice, but what a slap in the face - to ART's trust the government thread, not voting is REALLY insulting. talk about taking it for granted. i get particularly put out when i encounter people who bitch about the state of the government, and then find out that they didn't even bother to exercise their voice.

fnaqzna · 03-05-2004, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by splck
I think mandatory voting is a good idea, but I'd rather uninformed people stay at home than go out and vote.

In the long run, I think the uninformed will just cancel each other out.

FleaCircus · 03-05-2004, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by smooth
lol, your argument is a slipper slope. Were you being ironic on purpose?

Sorta. I stand by what I said, but I just left out all of the stuff that would have to happen in between. Sometimes, an exaggerated reaction makes a better point.

Seriously, though, I think that the US is increasingly on the road to a totalitarian police state, where the illusion of freedoms that we may not actually have is what keeps us in line and helps to mask the slow march toward that police state.

And if that's the direction we're headed, compulsory voting for predetermined candidates could be in the cards somewhere down the line.

03-01-2004, 04:14 PM	#43 (permalink)
Tophat665 Minion of the scaléd ones Location: Northeast Jesusland	My inital reaction to this is, "goddamn Communist!" but, on further reflection, he has a point. Voting - taking the time to get informed, schlepp to the polls, stand in line (which there would be if it were mandatory), and wade through the ballot - has an opportunity cost, not a big one, but it is there. So it costs you something to vote, but nothing to stay home. If failure to vote were 1) leiniently enforced, 2) an infraction on the order of a parking ticket, rather than a crime, and 3) carried a minor fine, that would ilustrate to people that there is a cost to not voting. Yes, I know there is a cost to not voting - at the moment his name is Bush - but it takes a ton of work to hammer that into some folks, and usually, only age ever does bring people around. So failure to vote is $10 or $20 bucks. I can live with that, waived if more than half the election in each category (federal, state, local) are uncontested. If you want to make the point that all the choices suck, go write in "None of the above" or "You all suck". It's worth thinking about anyway. (Edited to take the sting out of that first sentance.) SF: When I say Goddam Communist, I am indulging in hyperbole. Should have stuck a after it. __________________ Light a man a fire, and he will be warm while it burns. Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life. Last edited by Tophat665; 03-01-2004 at 09:44 PM..

03-02-2004, 01:49 PM	#45 (permalink)
Bill O'Rights will always be an Alyson Hanniganite Location: In the dust of the archives	NO! NO! NO! A thousand times, no! I do not want someone that is forced to perform their civic duty, just putting check marks on any old place on the ballot, just to get the hell out of there. As much as I will never understand the reasoning behind those that do not vote, I would prefer they just stay home and watch TV, than to go out and make completely uninformed choices. __________________ "I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires." - Susan B. Anthony "Hedonism with rules isn't hedonism at all, it's the Republican party." - JumpinJesus It is indisputable that true beauty lies within...but a nice rack sure doesn't hurt. Last edited by Bill O'Rights; 03-02-2004 at 01:51 PM..

03-02-2004, 01:53 PM	#46 (permalink)
Redlemon Devoted Donor Location: New England	DON'T VOTE words and music by Roy Zimmerman © 1994 Watunes (BMI) (From "Sing It Loud!" on Metaphor Records) Well, I'm so happy with the status quo It's sure to make my business grow And, children, if you're happy, too I've got a piece of good advice for you Don't vote (you young, young Americans) Don't vote (you young, young Americans) Don't vote (you're too young, young Americans) Who are you to say what your future will be? Don't vote (you young, young Americans) Don't vote (you unsung Americans) Don't vote (hold your tongue, Americans) Help put the mock in democracy Well, I know my government works for me I got my congressman on speed dial 3 And I'm proud to say he represents All his most generous constituents Don't vote (you young, young Americans) Don't vote (you young, young Americans) Don't vote (you're too young, young Americans) Who are you to say what your future will be? Don't vote (you young, young Americans) Don't vote (you unsung Americans) Don't vote (hold your tongue, Americans) Help put the mock in democracy (spoken) Yes, young Americans, sit home on election day, with your thumbs up and your butts in your chairs... and your thumbs up your butts in your chairs... happy in the knowledge that vital decisions affecting every aspect of your daily life are being made for you, by a few balding billionaires on the 42nd floor. Don't do it Eschew it Say, "Screw it!" You'll only get addicted to it Well, I'm so glad to be one of the elite 'Cause you know it keeps me off the street And you might say I'm out of touch And I'd say, "Thank you very much." 1 Don't vote (you young, young Americans) Don't vote (you young, young Americans) Don't vote (you're too young, young Americans) Who are you to say what your future will be? Don't vote (you young, young Americans) Don't vote (you unsung Americans) Don't vote (hold your tongue, Americans) Help put the mock in democracy I said, help put the mock in democracy __________________ I can't read your signature. Sorry.

03-04-2004, 07:53 PM	#51 (permalink)
FleaCircus Insane Location: Denver, CO	Mandatory voting? Hell no! The next step after they force you to vote is when they force you to vote for someone in particular. It's the beginning of a slippery slope. __________________ "We must have waffles. We must all have waffles, forthwith. Oh, we must think. We must all have waffles and think, each and every one of us to the very best of his ability." -- Professor Goldthwait Higginson Dorr, Ph.D.

03-04-2004, 08:56 PM	#52 (permalink)
Tholo Crazy	worst. idea. ever. __________________ "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."

03-02-2004, 07:30 PM	#47 (permalink)
Xell101 Junkie	The day I'd not fight mandatory voting is when it is made convenient and there's a spot labled "None of the above".

03-04-2004, 03:40 PM	#50 (permalink)
kutulu Junkie	Voting should not be manditory. In a perfect world, everyone would be informed of their candidates views on the issues and everyone would vote. However, this is not a perfect world and most people seem to not even know the names of the candidates, much less what they stand for. Too many people are manipulated by cheesy advertisements also. For the most part, I only vote when I know enough about the candidates to make an informed decision. I wish everyone would be like that.

03-05-2004, 09:46 AM	#54 (permalink)
gibingus Insane Location: 38° 51' N 77° 2' W	the right to not vote is integral with the right to vote. by making it manditory, you create a philosphical conflict that negates the freedom. although nothing pisses me off more than people who don't vote. it's their choice, but what a slap in the face - to ART's trust the government thread, not voting is REALLY insulting. talk about taking it for granted. i get particularly put out when i encounter people who bitch about the state of the government, and then find out that they didn't even bother to exercise their voice. __________________ if everyone is thinking alike, chances are no one is thinking.