Crisis in Haiti! The U.S. is Involved. - Page 2 - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

onetime2 · 03-02-2004, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by pan6467
He maybe a kook and a flake but Kucinich did say something yesterday that had truth to it. "I suppose if they were to find oil in Haiti we'd be there in full force tomorrow."

Anyone else see the hypocrisy between this and Iraq. Granted we had been in Iraq under 2 LIES before Bush decided to use the raison du jour. That of course is "humanitarian need to get rid of a mass murderer and all round nasty fellow". Yep, no oil we don't give a damn about your country unless you have a revolt and we're going to be getting your refugees, or you're a country in Europe, or you're a country in Africa and the black leadership wants us to prove we aren't racist.

"Gotta love Bush. He is our savior," so sayeth the man living on top of the hill while in the valley the peasants starve but have a war to keep thier minds off the truth.

Yeah those damned Haitian rebels killed a hundred people and Saddam only killed tens or hundreds of thousands, invaded a neighboring country, continually fired at US planes in the no fly zone, and paid Palestinian suicide bombers' families. They are identical.

The only similarity I see is that Aristide was taking money meant to feed and support his citizens just as Hussein was.

dy156 · 03-02-2004, 06:29 AM

There was a post that mentioned a "now discredited CIA" report that Aristide was pshychotic. Not that one should trust every CIA report, but I read part of the report way back when, and I never saw anything afterward discrediting it.

Also, as an aside, I find it ironic that while so many think Bush is a religious zealot, here the Bush administration allowed a leader that's a Catholic Priest to be overthrown.

Kadath · 03-02-2004, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by dy156
Also, as an aside, I find it ironic that while so many think Bush is a religious zealot, here the Bush administration allowed a leader that's a Catholic Priest to be overthrown.

While I don't think Bush is a religious zealot, he's not a Catholic, and so if he were a zealot, it wouldn't keep him from allowing the coup. Catholic != Christian.

Lebell · 03-02-2004, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kadath
While I don't think Bush is a religious zealot, he's not a Catholic, and so if he were a zealot, it wouldn't keep him from allowing the coup. Catholic != Christian.

I hesitate to say anything when people Bush Bash, but unless you have proof that Bush believes this, this is an EXTREMELY unfair charge.

Or are you saying that zealots don't believe this?

*confused*

Kadath · 03-02-2004, 10:37 AM

Ah, let me clarify. I was refuting the logic that just because a person is Christian, they would support a Catholic priest. That is all. No comment upon what Bush actually has done or will do was intended.

Lebell · 03-02-2004, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kadath
Ah, let me clarify. I was refuting the logic that just because a person is Christian, they would support a Catholic priest. That is all. No comment upon what Bush actually has done or will do was intended.

Oh, IC

Thank you for the clarifications

smooth · 03-02-2004, 01:11 PM

Here's a portion from an article written by someone claiming to have met with Aristide: Jean Bertrand Aristide: Humanist or Despot?

Quote:

How then to reconcile Titid the humanist with what the media calls a despot of Haiti?

I don't know, and frankly, I've been struggling with that question. When I spoke with Haitians working for a few pennies an hour sewing clothes for American companies, I was frustrated that Aristide insisted on following a democratic process to raise the minimum wage knowing that the process would be slower and result in a lower minimum than if he just unilaterally raised it himself.

Aristide said, "Change takes time, Lyn. Some people have spent years paying Haitians very little. When I wanted to raise the minimum wage in 1991, they had a coup and you know what happened." He reminded me that he had gone to parliament to raise the minimum wage in 1994, though it was still very low. "Of course people should be paid more, but in a democracy we have to share power and this is what was [voted on.]" he said.

When a major American daily paper published an article that portrayed Aristide as a despot, I was aghast. "Don't you care that they're saying this about you?" I asked him. As much as I disagreed with some of his politics, I was hurt when I saw him so maligned.

Aristide always had an answer: "What is important is not journalists, it's to make democracy real. How can we say we love our brother but we let him starve? How can we say we want democracy but we do nothing when people have no home? How can people have peace in their hearts when they have no peace in their stomach?"

There are, he added, "Larger forces at work here than you or me, forces that have a big stake in our small country."

Here are portions of an article I found interesting that give more historical context to the current situation:U.S.-Sponsored Regime Change in Haiti

Quote:

Cycles of Destabilization

This overthrow had been in the making since December 1990, when Haiti's first free election was held. The winning candidate, with two-thirds majority, was the populist priest Aristide, backed by a vigorous grassroots movement known as Lavalas. But seven months later, Aristide's government was overthrown in a military coup. No government on earth recognized the military junta, but as Noam Chomsky noted: "Washington maintained close intelligence and military ties with the new rulers while undermining the embargo called by the Organization of American States, even authorizing illegal shipments of oil to the regime and its wealthy supporters."

In July 1993, Aristide was made to sign the Governor's Island Accord, a US-backed "peace accord" with the illegal military junta that terrorized Haiti for three years. The Accord forbade Aristide from running for re-election once he was restored to power, and gave amnesty to the death-squad terrorists of the junta. The junta then refused to abide by the accord, prompting President Clinton to send in troops in September 1994.

Aristide finished his term, although conditions imposed on him as the cost of returning to power – such as an IMF-style "free market" reform of the economy – eroded his popularity. But Aristide continued to stand up to the IMF and international creditors, demanding a better deal that would not impose yet harsher austerity on Haiti, the poorest country in the western hemisphere.

Quote:

France was the first to call for Aristide's resignation as the rebels seized the northern half of the country in late February. The French hold grudges against Aristide for his demand last April that France pay back the $22 billion (adjusted for inflation and interest) that Haiti had to pay in 1863 for French recognition of the republic, which became independent in 1804 – the second in the hemisphere after the US in 1776, and the first independent black republic in the world. Ironically, the new uprising came weeks after Haiti had celebrated the bicentennial of its independence.

I hope people read through these articles and reexamine their beliefs about this subject instead of rejecting what might be new information that they didn't have when they formed their opinions.

doncalypso · 03-02-2004, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by hammer4all
No, I am not Haitian nor do I personally know any, but there are evidently quite a few who still have a more positive opinion of Mr. Aristide.

I myself have similar feelings as you, only about President Bush, but I don't support his ouster by a group of militant thugs financed and supported by a foreign nation. I think there are better, more democratic means for regime change in a democratic society.

Aristide fooled a lot of people.... he made it seem as though he wanted to promote change and democracy, but all he was interested was the accumulation of power and causing resentment between the masses and the middle-class and bourgeoisie of Haitian society.

He had no real interest in looking out for the welfare of the Haitian people.

hammer4all · 03-02-2004, 10:35 PM

There was a good article in the Guardian today:

Quote:

Why They Had to Crush Aristide
Haiti's Elected Leader was Regarded as a Threat by France and the US
by Peter Hallward

Jean-Bertrand Aristide was re-elected president of Haiti in November 2000 with more than 90% of the vote. He was elected by people who approved his courageous dissolution, in 1995, of the armed forces that had long terrorized Haiti and had overthrown his first administration. He was elected by people who supported his tentative efforts, made with virtually no resources or revenue, to invest in education and health. He was elected by people who shared his determination, in the face of crippling US opposition, to improve the conditions of the most poorly paid workers in the western hemisphere.

Aristide was forced from office on Sunday by people who have little in common except their opposition to his progressive policies and their refusal of the democratic process. With the enthusiastic backing of Haiti's former colonial master, a leader elected with overwhelming popular support has been driven from office by a loose association of convicted human rights abusers, seditious former army officers and pro-American business leaders.

It's obvious that Aristide's expulsion offered Jacques Chirac a long-awaited chance to restore relations with an American administration he dared to oppose over the attack on Iraq. It's even more obvious that the characterization of Aristide as yet another crazed idealist corrupted by absolute power sits perfectly with the political vision championed by George Bush, and that the Haitian leader's downfall should open the door to a yet more ruthless exploitation of Latin American labor.

If you've been reading the mainstream press over the past few weeks, you'll know that this peculiar version of events has been carefully prepared by repeated accusations that Aristide rigged fraudulent elections in 2000; unleashed violent militias against his political opponents; and brought Haiti's economy to the point of collapse and its people to the brink of humanitarian catastrophe.

But look a little harder at those elections. An exhaustive and convincing report by the International Coalition of Independent Observers concluded that "fair and peaceful elections were held" in 2000, and by the standard of the presidential elections held in the US that same year they were positively exemplary.

Why then were they characterized as "flawed" by the Organization of American States (OAS)? It was because, after Aristide's Lavalas party had won 16 out of 17 senate seats, the OAS contested the methodology used to calculate the voting percentages. Curiously, neither the US nor the OAS judged this methodology problematic in the run-up to the elections.

However, in the wake of the Lavalas victories, it was suddenly important enough to justify driving the country towards economic collapse. Bill Clinton invoked the OAS accusation to justify the crippling economic embargo against Haiti that persists to this day, and which effectively blocks the payment of about $500m in international aid.

But what about the gangs of Aristide supporters running riot in Port-au-Prince? No doubt Aristide bears some responsibility for the dozen reported deaths over the last 48 hours. But given that his supporters have no army to protect them, and given that the police force serving the entire country is just a tenth of the force that patrols New York city, it's worth remembering that this figure is a small fraction of the number killed by the rebels in recent weeks.

One of the reasons why Aristide has been consistently vilified in the press is that the Reuters and AP wire services, on which most coverage depends, rely on local media, which are all owned by Aristide's opponents. Another, more important, reason for the vilification is that Aristide never learned to pander unreservedly to foreign commercial interests. He reluctantly accepted a series of severe IMF structural adjustment plans, to the dismay of the working poor, but he refused to acquiesce in the indiscriminate privatization of state resources, and stuck to his guns over wages, education and health.

What happened in Haiti is not that a leader who was once reasonable went mad with power; the truth is that a broadly consistent Aristide was never quite prepared to abandon all his principles.

Worst of all, he remained indelibly associated with what's left of a genuine popular movement for political and economic empowerment. For this reason alone, it was essential that he not only be forced from office but utterly discredited in the eyes of his people and the world. As Noam Chomsky has said, the "threat of a good example" solicits measures of retaliation that bear no relation to the strategic or economic importance of the country in question. This is why the leaders of the world have joined together to crush a democracy in the name of democracy.

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0302-08.htm

Scipio · 03-02-2004, 11:52 PM

The waters on this issue are so muddy right now. Aristide bad! No, Aristide good!

Aristide: "They abducted me, I tell you! At gunpoint!"

Powell, Rumsfeld, et. al: "What, are you gonna listen to this guy? We'd never do anything like that! You trust us, right?"

We have evidence, and now I don't know what to think!

smooth · 03-03-2004, 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Scipio
The waters on this issue are so muddy right now. Aristide bad! No, Aristide good!

Aristide: "They abducted me, I tell you! At gunpoint!"

Powell, Rumsfeld, et. al: "What, are you gonna listen to this guy? We'd never do anything like that! You trust us, right?"

We have evidence, and now I don't know what to think!

I guess this is where character comes into play.

We have Aristide's bio, we have the rebel leaders' bios, and we know who's interest the CIA is protecting when it meddles in the affairs of other nations, along with we know who's interest our administration is protecting when it meddles (or refuses to meddle, as the case may be) in foreign affairs--their own!

Anyway, while it's possible that Aristide changed from a socialist priest who was concerned with the welfare of the downtrodden and attempted to buck the demands of the IMF and World Bank into a money hungry, power grabbing elitist; and it's possible that villians who massacred people and kept the population under military rule for decades changed into a group that cares for the masses--I don't see these as likely attitude and perspective shifts.

I don't need to go too deep into the motives of the CIA or our adminstration, but I don't see them as being very concerned with the impoverished segments of Haiti.

That's the lense I'm using while sifting through this information.

hammer4all · 03-03-2004, 01:36 AM

Also, all you have to do is look at our past history. The United States, the CIA in particular, has a rich history in overthrowing democratic countries and installing pro-American, often murderous, dictators. Now, we don't like to talk about this -- CIA coups are rarely mentioned in our high school text books or in the U.S. corporate news media. This is perfectly understandable because it is not in government or corporate interests for people to know about it. But all of this history is widely known as fact and accepted in the alternative media and sometimes even foreign corporate media. People just have to know to look.

"The truth is so often the reverse of what has been told us by our culture that we cannot turn our heads far enough around to see it." -- Howard Zinn

hammer4all · 03-06-2004, 01:53 AM

Democracy Now! did a wonderful segment today on both the CIA coup in Iran and the attempted coup of Chavez in 2002.

Quote:

New York Times reporter Steven Kinzer discusses how the U.S. overthrew the democratically elected government of Iran. Kinzer says “I think it was the success of the Iran coup and the Guatamalan one the folllowed that sent the US off on this direction of covert action and regime change.”

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid...4/03/05/1542249

Quote:

In April 2002, a team of Irish filmmakers were in Caracas, Venezuela working on a documentary about president Hugo Chavez. They got more than they expected: they captured on film an attempted coup of the Venezuelan government and highlighted the role of the media in the coup. We play an excerpt from "The Revolution Will Not Be Televised."

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid...4/03/05/1543207

I recommend everyone watch it. You won't get this history off mainstream television.

hammer4all · 03-06-2004, 02:52 AM

Quote:

Aristide Details Last Moments In Haiti, Calls For Stop To Bloodshed In First Address To Haitian People From Exile
Commentary, Republic of Haiti President Jean-Bertrand Aristide
Flashpoints Exclusive, Mar 05, 2004
Translated by Pierre and Marie Labossiere

NOTE: President Jean-Bertrand Aristide, who left a tumultuous Haiti under shadowy circumstances Feb. 29, has delivered an impassioned address “To the Haitian People and the World” by cell phone to a Haitian journalist in the United States working with a radio station in Berkeley, CA. Aristide spoke from the Central African Republic where he has been under a virtual house arrest in the days since he was delivered from Port-au-Prince on a U.S. plane. The address was recorded by a Haitian radio producer known to Aristide for some 20 years , exclusively on Pacifica Radio’s Flashpoints News Magazine based at KPFA . Six Haitians and Americans who know Aristide listened Friday to excerpts from the message, delivered in Creole, and confirmed the voice is that of the president.
Dennis Bernstein supplied this translation also to Pacific News Service.

“In overthrowing me, they have uprooted the trunk of liberty. It will grow back because its roots are many and deep.” In the shadow of Toussaint L'Ouverture, the genius of the race. I declare in overthrowing me they have uprooted the trunk of the tree of peace, but it will grow back because the roots are L'Ouverturian.

Dear compatriots, it is with these first words that I am saluting our brothers and sisters from Africa, while I am standing on the soil of the Republic of Central Africa. Allow me to salute you by repeating that same declaration that is, “In overthrowing me, they have uprooted the trunk of the tree of peace, but it will grow back because the roots are L'Ouverturian.” In fact, during the night of the 28th of February 2004, there was a coup d’etat. One could equally say that it was a geo-political kidnapping. I can clearly say that it was terrorism disguised as diplomacy. To conclude, this coup d’etat and this kidnapping are like two quarters and 50 cents side by side.

I have always denounced the coming of this coup d’etat, but until the 27th of February, the day before, I didn't see that the crime was going to be accompanied by kidnapping as well. The 28th of February, at night, suddenly, American military personnel who were already all over Port-au-Prince descended on my house in Tabarre to tell me first that all the American security agents who have contracts with the [Haitian] government only have two options. Either they leave immediately to go to the United States, or they fight to die. Secondly, the remaining 25 of the American security agents [hired by the Haitian government] who were to come in on the 29th of February as reinforcements were under interdiction to come to Haiti. Thirdly, the foreigners and Haitian terrorists alike, who are loaded with heavy weapons, were already in position to open fire on Port-au-Prince. And right then, the Americans precisely stated that they will kill thousands of people and it will be a bloodbath; the attack is ready to start, and when the first bullet is fired nothing will stop them and nothing will make them wait until they take over, therefore the mission is to take me dead or alive.

At that time I told the Americans that my first preoccupation is to save the lives of those thousands of people tonight. As far as my own life is concerned, whether I am alive or whether I am dead, that is not what’s important. My first priority is to save the lives of these thousands of people tonight. As much as I was trying to use diplomacy, the more the pressure was being intensified for the Americans to start the attack. In spite of that, I took the risk of slowing down the death machine to verify the degree of danger, in relation to the degree of bluff, or the degree of intimidation.

It was more serious than a bluff. The National Palace was surrounded by white men armed to their teeth. The Tabarre area -- the residence -- was surrounded by foreigners armed to their teeth. The airport of Port-au-Prince was already under the control of these men. After a last evaluation I made during a meeting with the person in charge of Haitian security in Port-au-Prince, and the person in charge of American security, the truth was clear. There is going to be a bloodbath because we were already under an illegal foreign occupation ready to drop bodies on the ground, to spill blood, and then kidnap me dead or alive.

That meeting took place at 3 a.m. Faced with this tragedy, I decided to ask, "What guarantee do I have that there will not be a bloodbath if I decided to leave?"

In reality, all this diplomatic gymnastics did not mean anything because these military men responsible for the kidnapping operation had already taken the disposition for the success of their mission. What was said was done. This diplomacy, plus the forced signing of the letter of resignation, was not able to cover the face of the kidnapping.

From my house to the airport, everywhere there were American military men armed with heavy weapons of death. The military plane that came to get me landed while the convoy of vehicles that came to get me was near the tarmac at the airport. There were 55 seats on the plane, however, I need to point out that among those who were on the plane, there was a baby who was one and a half years old. He was the baby of one of my American security agents who has a Haitian wife. With that baby, the first stop we made was Antigua. It was not possible for the American father of that baby to get out of that plane, let alone the other people who were on the plane. When we were airborne, nobody knew where we were going. When we landed again, nobody knew where we were. We spent four hours without knowing where we were. When we got back in the air again, nobody knew where we were going. The poor baby who was on that plane; at any time anything bad could have happened. Even his father, who is an American citizen, had no authority to stop this from happening

It was not until 20 minutes before we landed in the Republic of Central Africa that I was given the official word that this is where we would be landing. We landed there. That’s a French Air Force base but fortunately there were 5 ministers from the government that came to welcome us, and they welcomed us on behalf of the President who was not in the Capital, Bangui, because that country has 623,000 sq. kilometers, so it’s big; and the President is touring inside the country. Even though the country doesn’t have that many people in it, only 3.2 million people, we were offered a beautiful welcome by the government.

We could clearly see the face of this kidnapping. We know there are people back home who are suffering, who are being killed, who are in hiding. We also know that back home there are people who understand the game, who see the game, but will not give up because if they give up, instead of finding peace, we will find death.

Therefore, I ask that everyone who loves life to come together to protect the lives of others. Everyone who doesn’t want to see bloodshed to come together so that it is life that flourishes instead of blood that has been spilled, or bodies falling. I know it’s possible that all Haitians who live in the tenth department [Haitians living abroad] understand what tragedy lies hidden under the cover of this coup d’etat, under the cover of this kidnapping. I know and they know if we stand in solidarity we will stop the spread of death and we will help life flourish. The same thing that happened to a President who was democratically elected can happen at any time, in any other country too. So therefore, that’s why solidarity is indispensable to protect a democracy that works together with life.

The constitution is the source of [Haiti’s] life. It’s the guarantee of the life. Let’s stand together under the constitution in solidarity so that it is life that unfolds, and that it is peace that flourishes and not death as we are seeing it. Courage, courage, courage! From where I am with the First Lady, we have not forgotten what Toussaint L'Ouverture has said, and that’s why we saluted all of Africa with the words of Toussaint L’Ouverture, and we are saluting all Haitians everywhere with the conviction that the roots of the tree of peace, with the spirit of Toussaint L'Ouverture inside, are alive. They can cut the tree as they have done with the machete of the coup d’etat, but they cannot cut the roots of peace. It will sprout again because it has the spirit of Toussaint L'Ouverture inside.

Jean-Bertrand Aristide
President of Republic of Haiti
As translated by Pierre and Marie LaBossiere

http://www.flashpoints.net/

hammer4all · 03-06-2004, 02:55 AM

Quote:

Aristide Supporters Denounce Haiti 'Occupation'

PORT-AU-PRINCE, Haiti (Reuters) - Thousands of furious supporters of exiled President Jean-Bertrand Aristide poured out of Haiti's slums and into the streets on Friday, marching on the U.S. Embassy to denounce the "occupation" of their homeland and demand Aristide's return.

The formation of a new government moved ahead with the appointment of a council of seven "wise men" charged with picking a prime minister, while the estimate of the death toll after a month-long revolt soared to well over 200.

A crowd estimated at more than 10,000 materialized suddenly in Port-au-Prince, seething at Aristide's flight to Africa five days ago, hurling slurs at U.S. Marines and calling President Bush (news - web sites) a "terrorist."

Hundreds held up their hands, with fingers extended, shouting "Aristide five years," the rallying cry of those who wanted him to finish his term. Heavily armed U.S. troops watched from the embassy rooftop as the crowd marched past.

"Bush terrorist! Bush terrorist!," they chanted, waving Haitian flags or T-shirts bearing photos of Aristide.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...m/haiti_dc_170

Ustwo · 03-06-2004, 08:36 AM

Quote:

Aristide wasn't forced out
March 06,2004
ERIC STEINKOPFF
DAILY NEWS STAFF

If Jim Refinger knows one thing it's this: Ousted Haitian president Jean Bertrand Aristide is safe.

There was no kidnapping, as some sources reported. There was no injury. And for Refinger there was no mystery.

Refinger was there. The former Jacksonville police sniper and retired Marine was part of a private security team hired to protect Aristide's inner circle.

"We left with him (but) I won't talk about where we went," Refinger said Friday from his home in Jacksonville where he just returned. "We escorted him safely out.

"Everything was done with the full knowledge and cooperation of the president. There was no forcing the president to go anywhere. We protected our principal without a shot fired and he is safe."

Refinger works for Steele Foundation, a security firm based in San Francisco. The company has protection details all over the world and does industrial security and risk analysis, Refinger said.

Aristide had a presidential protection unit, and a team from Steele mirrored the unit in an inner circle. Refinger's job was running the outer circle that kept the inner circle safe.

"We were protecting the protectors, and we worked closely with the Haitian counter-ambush team," he said.

A good fit

http://www.jdnews.com/SiteProcessor....6&Section=News

How can anyone take this credibly, this guy is a former marine, and obviously a tool of the corporate media, and may be a member of the skull and bones society, plus I heard rumors he was a doorman for the illuminati.

I mean come on, how can we take the word of an American who's job it was to protect Arisitide, when Aristide himself says otherwise. After all isn't OBVIOUS that America wanted Haiti for its rich supply of umm voodoo zombies. How can we not take the word of a corrupt politician? I'm sure he is not bitter, after all the US saved him once already, I'm sure he didn't expect us to pull his chestnuts out of the fire a second time.

In short, any thinking person can know for a fact that the US just wanted to overthrow another peaceful and democratically elected leader, just like they did in Iraq.

hammer4all · 03-06-2004, 03:16 PM

03-02-2004, 06:29 AM	#42 (permalink)
dy156 cookie Location: in the backwoods	There was a post that mentioned a "now discredited CIA" report that Aristide was pshychotic. Not that one should trust every CIA report, but I read part of the report way back when, and I never saw anything afterward discrediting it. Also, as an aside, I find it ironic that while so many think Bush is a religious zealot, here the Bush administration allowed a leader that's a Catholic Priest to be overthrown. Last edited by dy156; 03-02-2004 at 06:34 AM..

03-02-2004, 10:37 AM	#45 (permalink)
Kadath Muffled Location: Camazotz	Ah, let me clarify. I was refuting the logic that just because a person is Christian, they would support a Catholic priest. That is all. No comment upon what Bush actually has done or will do was intended. __________________ it's quiet in here

03-02-2004, 11:52 PM	#50 (permalink)
Scipio Mencken Location: College	The waters on this issue are so muddy right now. Aristide bad! No, Aristide good! Aristide: "They abducted me, I tell you! At gunpoint!" Powell, Rumsfeld, et. al: "What, are you gonna listen to this guy? We'd never do anything like that! You trust us, right?" We have evidence, and now I don't know what to think! __________________ "Erections lasting more than 4 hours, though rare, require immediate medical attention."

03-03-2004, 01:36 AM	#52 (permalink)
hammer4all Insane	Also, all you have to do is look at our past history. The United States, the CIA in particular, has a rich history in overthrowing democratic countries and installing pro-American, often murderous, dictators. Now, we don't like to talk about this -- CIA coups are rarely mentioned in our high school text books or in the U.S. corporate news media. This is perfectly understandable because it is not in government or corporate interests for people to know about it. But all of this history is widely known as fact and accepted in the alternative media and sometimes even foreign corporate media. People just have to know to look. "The truth is so often the reverse of what has been told us by our culture that we cannot turn our heads far enough around to see it." -- Howard Zinn Last edited by hammer4all; 03-03-2004 at 01:40 AM..