11-15-2003, 09:18 AM | #1 (permalink) | |
Confused Adult
Location: Spokane, WA
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The Bush administration is jettisoning real scientists in favor of yes-men
http://www.gristmagazine.com/muck/muck111203.asp
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just like a rapist cares about thier victim? |
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11-15-2003, 09:38 AM | #2 (permalink) |
Psycho
Location: Just outside the D.C. belt
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Ties in neatly with faith based intelligence reporting, a faith based economy, and a faith based propaganda effort.
Reason dispells fear and the current administration are fear mongers of the highest order, ergo get rid of reason. 2Wolves |
11-15-2003, 11:11 AM | #3 (permalink) |
Addict
Location: Nottingham, England
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When will scientists learn they are not there to find the truth, or facts about a subject, but to find some kind of evidence that agrees with whatever weird theory the politicians & big business have come up with. Like finding evidence that smoking is good for you, that pollution is actually good for the environment, and they really are WMD in Iraq !
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11-15-2003, 01:32 PM | #4 (permalink) |
Dubya
Location: VA
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Like I needed something else to keep me up at night.
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"In Iraq, no doubt about it, it's tough. It's hard work. It's incredibly hard. It's - and it's hard work. I understand how hard it is. I get the casualty reports every day. I see on the TV screens how hard it is. But it's necessary work. We're making progress. It is hard work." |
11-16-2003, 11:46 AM | #6 (permalink) |
Crazy
Location: South East US
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I see that the article has laid out well the political disagreements, but what is the fuss about? They want to flush the Missouri, then have the rivers and lakes at drought levels all summer. To help a plover? What has a plover ever done for me? Screw em, they dont like it, they can dam their own river.
Why are scientists conferred such vurtue? The politicians have to deal with all the affected parties, Plover and sturgeon dont vote.
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'Tis better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than open one's mouth and remove all doubt. Samuel Johnson (1709 - 1784) |
11-16-2003, 11:31 PM | #8 (permalink) |
Psycho
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There's a big surprise. Remember kids, there is no such thing as global warming and we will be finding those WMDs in Iraq any day now.
Seriously though, the responses I see to issues like this trouble me greatly. Are we honestly to consider this sort of thing acceptable because politicians need to keep their jobs and fish can't vote? Beyond the fact that the removed scientists plans would also prevent future flooding, the attitude that its alright to eliminate entire species because of convience and politics is a very disturbing thought. What does this kind of mindset say about our culture and the way we not only view the Earth but "others" in general?
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"The courts that first rode the warhorse of virtual representation into battle on the res judicata front invested their steed with near-magical properties." ~27 F.3d 751 |
11-17-2003, 06:19 AM | #9 (permalink) | |
Crazy
Location: Vermont
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The article suggests that intellectually dishonest practices are compromising the information published by Fish and Wildlife. If that information is indeed compromised, then real public debate can never even occur. Which seems to be the whole point. I couldn't care less about plover, but I am outraged that the scientific research paid for by my tax dollars has been corrupted to favor political ends that I didn't vote for. /// On an aside, who is/are "Muckraker?" Are they credible?
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Skwerl. Its wuts fer dinner. |
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11-17-2003, 06:24 AM | #10 (permalink) | |
Dubya
Location: VA
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"In Iraq, no doubt about it, it's tough. It's hard work. It's incredibly hard. It's - and it's hard work. I understand how hard it is. I get the casualty reports every day. I see on the TV screens how hard it is. But it's necessary work. We're making progress. It is hard work." |
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11-18-2003, 03:52 PM | #12 (permalink) |
Psycho
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LOL, thanks for the praise. Its always a pleasure to meet more Dune fans.
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"The courts that first rode the warhorse of virtual representation into battle on the res judicata front invested their steed with near-magical properties." ~27 F.3d 751 |
11-20-2003, 09:22 AM | #14 (permalink) | |
Dubya
Location: VA
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11-20-2003, 10:15 PM | #15 (permalink) | |
it's jam
Location: Lowerainland BC
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nice line eh? |
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11-23-2003, 08:42 PM | #16 (permalink) | |
Archangel of Change
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Duke Leto... why him? Leto II was so much cooler. Back on topic, that disgusts me. Replacing real scientists with "yes men" will only twist the world into a grotesque place. Hmm, Dune was a fairly environmentalist book, Dune fans = environmentalists? |
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11-23-2003, 09:48 PM | #17 (permalink) |
Psycho
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http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/1106-05.htm
Bush administration strikes out against science and the environment once again! Here they are gutting the Clean Water Act and denying the science that water is interlinked! Will it never end? On the Dune note, its heard to compare the Duke and the God Emperor. Duke Leto was a great man and would not likely have approved of Paul or Leto II empires. I do agree that there is a very environmental twinge to the books. I particularly like them because of the interspersing of science fiction, religion, politics, etc. I particularly appreciate the all the sprinklings of Judaism in the novels. If you are interested perhaps we should continue this conversation in another forum. PM me if you start a thread. EDIT: I went ahead and made the new thread in Entertainment just for the heck of it.
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"The courts that first rode the warhorse of virtual representation into battle on the res judicata front invested their steed with near-magical properties." ~27 F.3d 751 Last edited by MuadDib; 11-23-2003 at 10:10 PM.. |
11-24-2003, 08:43 AM | #18 (permalink) | |
Crazy
Location: Vermont
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Did you read the article, MuadDib? Seriously, where do you come up with the "strikes out against science" and "denying the science that water is interlinked" stuff anyway? Come to think of it, what does that mean? "Denying the science that water is interlinked?"
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Skwerl. Its wuts fer dinner. |
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11-24-2003, 01:26 PM | #19 (permalink) | ||
Psycho
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"State water quality officials and conservationists said the wetlands and streams that would lose protection under a rule change are essential to maintaining the health of the larger rivers and lakes that would still be protected by the law. Wetlands filter pollutants and retain water after rainfalls to lessen flooding. Ephemeral streams reduce flooding. Both provide healthy habitats for fish, birds and other wildlife. The government received more than 130,000 comments about its proposal to rewrite the rules, and EPA and White House officials said the government had not yet decided whether to follow through with a new rule. " Science has shown that waters are interlinked and interdependent. You can't just go dumping in "lesser bodies of water" and think that nothing is going to come of it. The strike against science here is akin to the strike against science in denying global warming. This administration has continously ignored scientific evidence on all environmental issues and dangers since it took office. Seriously, if Bush's EPA or Whitehouse doesn't deny the science showing that water is interrelated and that there is global warming then how could they justify this proposed changed or the inappropirately named Clear Skies Initative?
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"The courts that first rode the warhorse of virtual representation into battle on the res judicata front invested their steed with near-magical properties." ~27 F.3d 751 |
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11-24-2003, 02:42 PM | #20 (permalink) |
Crazy
Location: Vermont
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Thanks for the clarification.
Nonetheless, let me point out that neither Bush nor any member of his administration has denied or refuted the notion that water is "interlinked." Furthermore, the question of whether or not the CWA should give the EPA regulatory control over a puddle in my driveway is an entirely valid one.
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Skwerl. Its wuts fer dinner. |
11-24-2003, 03:04 PM | #23 (permalink) | |
Dubya
Location: VA
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Straw man argument - caricaturing (or stereotyping) a position to make it easier to attack. Please read over your quote again, thanks.
__________________
"In Iraq, no doubt about it, it's tough. It's hard work. It's incredibly hard. It's - and it's hard work. I understand how hard it is. I get the casualty reports every day. I see on the TV screens how hard it is. But it's necessary work. We're making progress. It is hard work." |
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11-24-2003, 03:13 PM | #24 (permalink) |
Crazy
Location: Vermont
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No no, Sparhawk, Thank you
The article posted by MuadDib refers to a proposed rule that would remove from the Act's jurisdiction "ephemeral" bodies of water that do not have groundwater as a source. Ephemeral - adj. - Lasting for a markedly brief time, Living or lasting only for a day, as certain plants or insects do. American Heritage Dictionary Puddle - n. - A small pool of water, especially rainwater. American Heritage Dictionary
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Skwerl. Its wuts fer dinner. |
11-24-2003, 03:22 PM | #25 (permalink) | |
Dubya
Location: VA
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Sigh...
For those just following along in the thread, let's give your quote a little context, shall we? Quote:
You're welcome.
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"In Iraq, no doubt about it, it's tough. It's hard work. It's incredibly hard. It's - and it's hard work. I understand how hard it is. I get the casualty reports every day. I see on the TV screens how hard it is. But it's necessary work. We're making progress. It is hard work." |
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11-24-2003, 03:43 PM | #26 (permalink) |
Crazy
Location: Vermont
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While you and I might prioritize between bodies of water, the Clean Water Act does not.
If you think that the puddle in my driveway is an absurd example, then I'm sure you too would welcome some clarity regarding the limits of the Act's jurisdiction.
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Skwerl. Its wuts fer dinner. |
11-24-2003, 03:55 PM | #27 (permalink) | |
Dubya
Location: VA
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/moves on... |
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Tags |
administration, bush, favor, jettisoning, real, scientists, yesmen |
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