Looks like Springsteen wasn't "Born in the USA" - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

sixate · 04-27-2003, 09:43 AM

LINKY

I'm not surprised by this at all. Just look at his song WAR. That'll pretty much give you his point of view.

Why is it all the dumbass entertainers can use their freedom of speech against our president, but they think that the public should keep their mouths shut when it comes to them? Fucking hypocrites!

Quote:

Springsteen backs Dixie Chicks
'The Boss' says country singers getting raw, un-American deal

Posted: April 27, 2003
7:28 a.m. Eastern

By Joe Kovacs
© 2003 WorldNetDaily.com

Rock legend Bruce Springsteen is coming to the defense of the Dixie Chicks, saying the country trio is getting a "raw deal" in the wake of a wartime comment critical of President Bush.

<center>
Bruce Springsteen</center>

Perhaps best known for his "Born in the USA" anthem, the singer/guitarist nicknamed "the Boss" has posted a message on his website unequivocally expressing support for the group:

The Dixie Chicks have taken a big hit lately for exercising their basic right to express themselves. To me, they're terrific American artists expressing American values by using their American right to free speech. For them to be banished wholesale from radio stations, and even entire radio networks, for speaking out is un-American.

The pressure coming from the government and big business to enforce conformity of thought concerning the war and politics goes against everything that this country is about – namely freedom. Right now, we are supposedly fighting to create freedom in Iraq, at the same time that some are trying to intimidate and punish people for using that same freedom here at home.

I don't know what happens next, but I do want to add my voice to those who think that the Dixie Chicks are getting a raw deal, and an un-American one to boot. I send them my support.

For his part, Springsteen has made his own anti-war statements during several concerts this year, often performing the late Motown singer Edwin Starr's protest hit "War." He's also lamented what he feels is the loss of civil liberties in America.

The Dixie Chicks became embroiled in controversy after singer Natalie Maines – a Texan – told a crowd of London concertgoers last month, "Just so you know, we're ashamed the president of the United States is from Texas."

Sales of their No. 1 album "Home" have since dropped, and some radio stations have yanked the group from playlists.

Though ticket sales for the group's upcoming concerts have remained strong with many venues selling out, MSNBC reported this week that Lipton would not confirm whether the iced tea brand is still the title sponsor of the tour.

During a nationally broadcast interview on ABC, Maines said she spoke against President Bush and the invasion of Iraq out of frustration. She said she regrets her choice of words but makes no apologies for thinking critically.

"It was the wrong wording with genuine emotion and questions and concern behind it. Am I sorry that I asked questions and that I just don't follow? No," Maines said.

Fellow country artists Faith Hill and Vince Gill have also expressed support for the beleaguered band, and President Bush himself told NBC's Tom Brokaw that the Dixie Chicks were "free to speak their mind."

The group is raising eyebrows again in the latest edition of Entertainment Weekly, posing nude on the strategically positioned cover.

<center>
Dixie Chicks on Entertainment Weekly cover</center>

Maines told the magazine said she went through a range of emotions once the backlash started.

"It sort of felt like how people say it is when someone dies, how you go through every stage – angry, disappointed, confused. Some days I just feel proud," she said.

The provocative cover is already being spoofed on the Internet, with a mock version of the magazine entitled Airbrush Quarterly.

<center>
Spoof cover mocks Natalie Maines' weight(StrangeCosmos.com)</center>

Meanwhile, a poll this weekend by America Online indicates at least four out of ten users of the Internet service would boycott an artist over their views.

With just under two million responses, 41 percent say they'd boycott, 38 percent would not, and 19 percent answered "maybe."

The_Dude · 04-27-2003, 09:47 AM

so what??????? they can say whatever they want, they can support whoever they want, why is it bothering you?

i listen to an artist because of their music, and not because of their political views.

sixate · 04-27-2003, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by The_Dude
so what??????? they can say whatever they want, they can support whoever they want, why is it bothering you?

Because these artists blast our president then get pissed when the public blasts them. Why is it they think they should be held to a different standard.

If an artist has political views I don't like. I won't support them.

splck · 04-27-2003, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by The_Dude
so what??????? they can say whatever they want, they can support whoever they want, why is it bothering you?

i listen to an artist because of their music, and not because of their political views.

Right on The_Dude, you hit the nail on the head for me. Big fuckin' deal what an artist has to say about poitics, I listen to the music not the rhetoric. Some people take things way too seriously.
Never cared for the Dixi chicks and the boss keeps pumping out the same old shit...that's the reason I don't support them.

George W Bush · 04-27-2003, 10:14 AM

" I said say little boy with yer pants hanging down is your daddy home is he around uh huh I got a bad desire whooaa Im on fire"

Whaoooo hooooo hooooo ooooo who oooooooooo o o ooooo

I hate Springsteen his music sucks and he's a dumbass

gibber71 · 04-27-2003, 10:47 AM

Actually, I think Springsteen is wrong to say the criticism the Dixie Chicks are getting is un-American.If anything it is completely American since the last I checked the U.S is a democracy.If you open your mouth and take a stand,especially if your a public figure,you deserve to get what ever is thrown back at you.If Microsoft says everyone who buys their software are idiots,or if Ford says people who drive their trunks are assholes then they deserve whatever shortcomings that come there way.It doesn't mean people can't have an opinion,but more often then not people shoot their mouths off and then regret it.If the Dixie Chicks still stand by what they say so be it.The other people who disagree with them have every right to not support them or their music if they don't want to.

rock_bottom · 04-27-2003, 10:53 AM

Is it surprising? Springsteen's "Born in the USA" was pretty anti-war, if you listened to the lyrics. So add him to the witch hunt, I guess.
But I don't think these celebs are mad that Joe Fan is boycotting them, they're mad that radio stations, corporations and many similar organizations are taking a pro-war stance by banning the music and doing other similar things. I mean, people would be up in arms if pro-war music got banned, or if anti-Bush signs were sold at Kroger's and Walmart like pro-war signs already are.
I really don't think artists are saying people can't critisize them, but they're saying it's not right for institutions that serve the public to take such a strong political stance.

Phaenx · 04-27-2003, 01:32 PM

If they have the right to slam the president, people have the right to not buy their products. The thing is they're the only ones bitching about it. Watch your ass entertainers, say what you want but not enough for everyone to figure out you're stupid.

redravin40 · 04-27-2003, 01:45 PM

A Little History On The Song "WAR"

In 1970, Edwin Starr began work with one of Motown's finest writers and producers, Norman Whitfield, who had been responsible for the continuing success of the Temptations. It was Norman and composer Barrett Strong who came up with perhaps the label's most controversial hit single ever.

"'War' was originally recorded by the Temptations," recalled Edwin. "It was buried on one of their albums. But then a lot of mail came in, mostly from students, asking why they didn't release it on a 45. Well, that was a touchy time, and that song had some implications. It was a message record, an opinion record, and stepped beyond being sheer entertainment. It could become a smash record, and that was fine, but if it went the other way, it could kill the career of whoever the artist was."

Apparently, the Temptations were afraid of the song, and so it was given to Edwin Starr.

"Nobody really understood what we were talking about on that song," he continued. "It wasn't about Vietnam. It never once mentioned the war in Vietnam. It just so happened that, at the time, the war was going on, and the words just lent themselves to the occasion. Actually, we were talking about a war of people -- the war people wage against each other on a day-to-day basis. All the words are applicable to neighbors who fight with each other, you know, 'War, what is it good for?' That's what the song was about, at least for me."

"War" became a political anthem in 1970 and soared to number one during the long, hot summer. It sold more than three million copies and earned a Grammy Award nomination for best Male Rhythm and Blues Vocal Performance.

And the lyrics.

Quote:

War
Edwin Starr

War -- Edwin Starr
Oh no-there's got to be a better way
Say it again
There's got to be a better way-yeah
What is it good for?
*War has caused unrest
Among the younger generation
Induction then destruction
Who wants to die?
War-huh
What is it good for?
Absolutely nothing
Say it again
War-huh
What is it good for?
Absolutely nothing
Yeah
War-I despise
'Cos it means destruction
Of innocent lives
War means tears
To thousands of mothers how
When their sons go off to fight
And lose their lives
I said
War-huh
It's an enemy of all mankind
No point of war
'Cos you're a man
*(Repeat)
Give it to me one time-now
Give it to me one time-now
War has shattered
Many young men's dreams
We've got no place for it today
They say we must fight to keep our freedom
But Lord, there's just got to be a better way
It ain't nothing but a heartbreaker
War
Friend only to the undertaker
War
War
War-Good God, now
Now
Give it to me one time now
Now now
What is it good for?

As well as Bruce Springsteen's rendition, System of Down and Henry Rollins have done well known versions.

sixate · 04-27-2003, 02:36 PM

I shoulda mentioned that I knew he didn't write the song.
As far as the lyrics go do you think there is no need for war ever? Unfortunatly there is. If there is a better way then why hasn't anyone found it yet?

mean-spirited · 04-27-2003, 03:11 PM

Never cared for him anyways.What do you expect, liberal philosophy to me means do what I say, not what I do. So many of them believe that they are above us. If we disagree then they start the name calling. I think that if they think this is such a terrible place to live, they need to move to China and see what kind of "rights" they have. What does Babs have to say on this subject I wonder?!

BoCo · 04-27-2003, 03:56 PM

War brings/ensures peace, as does the threat of war.

Nice article, sixate. That's another celeb I'll add to my idiot list.

The_Dude · 04-27-2003, 04:44 PM

i also think that the celeb's who make these comments should be able to withstand the backlash that these can cause.

i do feel a lil sorry for the dixie chicks, they received threatning letters, and other illegal stuff. now that's not blacklash that they're supposed to receive.

maximusveritas · 04-27-2003, 04:51 PM

Kinda funny, when Dr.Laura and Michael Savage were getting boycotted by gay groups, it was the conservatives screaming censorship and the liberals saying it was their right to boycott. Now that some liberals are getting boycotted by rednecks, its the liberals screaming censorship and conservatives saying that its their right to boycott.

I understand partisanship, but at the very least, try and stay consistent.

Liquor Dealer · 04-27-2003, 04:55 PM

It's really kinda' hard to tell the players without a program!

The_Dude · 04-27-2003, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by maximusveritas
Kinda funny, when Dr.Laura and Michael Savage were getting boycotted by gay groups, it was the conservatives screaming censorship and the liberals saying it was their right to boycott. Now that some liberals are getting boycotted by rednecks, its the liberals screaming censorship and conservatives saying that its their right to boycott.

I understand partisanship, but at the very least, try and stay consistent.

wait, i for one am not screaming censorship.

i just dont think it's right for rednecks to write threatning letters and do other illegal stuff to intimidate people who voice their opinion

darksparkles · 04-27-2003, 07:17 PM

you can be patriotic and still not like war. i'm starting to sound like a broken record.

Nad Adam · 04-27-2003, 08:42 PM

Anybody supporting GWB doesn't have much credability when it comes to talking about double standards in my book.

And I also thought that the artists made most of their money on concerts etc while the record money went to the record companies. No-one in their right senses buys records nowadays anyway.

Kadath · 04-27-2003, 09:02 PM

I think the worst thing about the Dixie Chicks is that they totally bitched out when they got hit in the pocket book and backed down. Tim Robbins and Susan Sarandon got shit on for their views, and they stay with them. Robbins' speech at the NPC was pretty good, in my opinion, and addresses the issues at hand.

smooth · 04-27-2003, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kadath
I think the worst thing about the Dixie Chicks is that they totally bitched out when they got hit in the pocket book and backed down.

They haven't been hit in the pocketbook yet since people are still going to their concerts. Seems to have been more related to true remorse or concern over their safety than album revenue (which Nad Adam already pointed out lines the labels pockes more than the artists).

KillerYoda · 04-27-2003, 09:26 PM

Before you go blacklisting everyone, remember that even Metallica (who I know is popular around the TFP) has written anti-war songs. Last time I checked "One" is based on "Johnny Got His Gun," one of the most anti-war books every written.

Phaenx · 04-27-2003, 09:37 PM

Well, "Don't tread on me" also says:

"Liberty or death, what we so proudly hail
once you provoke her, rattling of her tail
never begins it, never, but once engaged...
never surrenders, showing the fangs of rage

don't tread on me

so be it
threaten no more
to secure peace is to prepare for war
so be it
settle the score
touch me again for the words that you'll hear evermore...

don't tread on me

love it or live it, she with the deadly bite
quick is the blue tongue, forked as lighting strike
shining with brightness, always on surveillance
the eyes, they never close, emblem of vigilance

don't tread on me

so be it
threaten no more
to secure peace is to prepare for war
so be it
settle the score
touch me again for the words that you'll hear evermore...

don't tread on me

so be it
threaten no more
to secure peace is to prepare for war

liberty or death, what we so proudly hail
once you provoke her, rattling on her tail

so be it
threaten no more
to secure peace is to prepare for war
so be it
settle the score
touch me again for the words that you'll hear evermore...

don't tread on me"

Doesn't sound like they're very anti-war, but I'll have a look at one.

boatin · 04-27-2003, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rock_bottom
Is it surprising? Springsteen's "Born in the USA" was pretty anti-war, if you listened to the lyrics. So add him to the witch hunt, I guess.
But I don't think these celebs are mad that Joe Fan is boycotting them, they're mad that radio stations, corporations and many similar organizations are taking a pro-war stance by banning the music and doing other similar things. I mean, people would be up in arms if pro-war music got banned, or if anti-Bush signs were sold at Kroger's and Walmart like pro-war signs already are.
I really don't think artists are saying people can't critisize them, but they're saying it's not right for institutions that serve the public to take such a strong political stance.

Nice try rock_bottom, but this point is way to 'shades of gray' for people to get. There are have a bunch of attempts by various tfp'ers to make this point, but it just goes in one ear and out the other.

Always refreshing to see it again though. thanks.

Kadath · 04-27-2003, 09:54 PM

They haven't been hit in the pocketbook yet since people are still going to their concerts. Seems to have been more related to true remorse or concern over their safety than album revenue (which Nad Adam already pointed out lines the labels pockes more than the artists).

When there was public outcry and radio stations began to reduce or eliminate playtime of their songs they saw the writing on the wall. Given that as soon as the first Chick made the initial comment another one grabbed the mic and made a clarification, I think they were pretty well aware of the danger of criticizing the administration in the climate. They knew that people have been whipped into a fervor that allows for no dissent. Not a good sign for us.

oane · 04-27-2003, 09:56 PM

I don't care what his political views are, Bruce Springsteen fukin rox!

OTOH, I can understand Sixate's stand that "If an artist has political views I don't like. I won't support them". Fair enough, I say!

KillerYoda · 04-27-2003, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Phaenx
Doesn't sound like they're very anti-war, but I'll have a look at one.

Congratulations, you feel into my trap. Celebrities are hypocrites who's opinions are about as important as the dude who serves you food at Burger King. I hope this clears things up. Listen to the music, not the bullshit rhetoric they put behind it.

No hardfeelings, Phaenx, just trying to prove a point.

Phaenx · 04-27-2003, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by KillerYoda
Congratulations, you feel into my trap. Celebrities are hypocrites who's opinions are about as important as the dude who serves you food at Burger King. I hope this clears things up. Listen to the music, not the bullshit rhetoric they put behind it.

No hardfeelings, Phaenx, just trying to prove a point.

You damn kids!! I'll shake my fist the HELL OUT OF YOU!!!

KillerYoda · 04-27-2003, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Phaenx
You damn kids!! I'll shake my fist the HELL OUT OF YOU!!!

I knew you'd like that conniving shit. I'd also like to add, as much as I liked Rage Against the Machine, they also had a tendency to be on the "full of shit side." How can you support Marxist ideals and be rich at the same time off of capitalism?

smooth · 04-27-2003, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by KillerYoda
I knew you'd like that conniving shit. I'd also like to add, as much as I liked Rage Against the Machine, they also had a tendency to be on the "full of shit side." How can you support Marxist ideals and be rich at the same time off of capitalism?

One way is by utiilizing the revenue to organize protests and charity funds.

KillerYoda · 04-27-2003, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by smooth
One way is by utiilizing the revenue to organize protests and charity funds.

I guess you got a point. Lenin said, "the capitalist will sell you a rope to hang him with."

Phaenx · 04-27-2003, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by KillerYoda
I guess you got a point. Lenin said, "the capitalist will sell you a rope to hang him with."

He's just mad communism sucks.

KillerYoda · 04-28-2003, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Phaenx
He's just mad communism sucks.

Hehehe, Lenin also said "Duh, I'm preserved in a box for the rest of my life."

Daval · 04-28-2003, 05:22 AM

I've never understood the american tradition of villifying anyone who does not agree with them.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion

frenik · 04-29-2003, 03:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Daval
I've never understood the american tradition of villifying anyone who does not agree with them.

It's not exactly an American tradition, it is human nature to want to silence dissenting opinion.

In this specific situation, it is a case of a group of people not wanting to support these artists who have opinions that they feel are wrong. By supporting the artists, you support the messages that they put out when they hit the stage. It's a sad statement, but celebrities in America wield great influence over their fans. By buying their work, you give them the funding to keep spreading their message. The artists are entitled to their opinion, and the disagreeing group has the option of not using their money to keep the artists in the limelight.

I believe it's called the dollar vote. Artists are no different than any other business. For example: Say Pepsi began running a commercial in Afghanistan that featured bin Laden drinking a Pepsi, a message at the bottom of the screen proudly proclaiming "Pepsi: Gives you the burst of energy needed to kill thousands of Americans!". I believe that Pepsi would be boycotted by the majority of America. This is almost perfectly related to the Dixie Chicks situation: business makes statement pandering to a foreign crowd that a group of Americans don't agree with, that group votes with their dollar by organizing a boycott.

james t kirk · 04-29-2003, 05:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by frenik
It's not exactly an American tradition, it is human nature to want to silence dissenting opinion.

For example: Say Pepsi began running a commercial in Afghanistan that featured bin Laden drinking a Pepsi, a message at the bottom of the screen proudly proclaiming "Pepsi: Gives you the burst of energy needed to kill thousands of Americans!". I believe that Pepsi would be boycotted by the majority of America. This is almost perfectly related to the Dixie Chicks situation: business makes statement pandering to a foreign crowd that a group of Americans don't agree with, that group votes with their dollar by organizing a boycott.

That has to be the most absurd comparison ever.

Oh brother....

james t kirk · 04-29-2003, 05:34 AM

I always liked Bruce, still llike Bruce, in fact, I like him even more now cause he has the balls to stand up to bullshit.

Since 911, it has been just about Sacrilege to criticize Bush, or US policy.

Well, i can see now that that is starting to come to an end.

Case in point (which you probably won't get)

There is a show here called "This hour has 22 minutes", it's a comedy tv show that is brilliant, but i won't go into details. There is one sketch featuring Rick Mercer that was called "Talking to Americans". Essentially Rick would travel to the US and interview Americans asking their opinion about the most absurd things.

For example, he got the governer of Iowa to say congratulations Canada for adopting the 24 hour clock (he had people convinced that we used a "metric clock" that only had 20 hours. Or he would ask people on the street in Chicago if they agreed with bombing Saskatchewan (which they all did) or the mall in west Edmonton.

Or, the best, he managed to catch George W Bush while campaigning for president and get George to thank the Canadian Prime Minister "Jean Poutine" for endorsing his candidacy. (Jean Chretien is the prime minister by the way, and poutine is a quebec delicacy - french fries with gravy and cheese curds)

Anyway, it shows just how ignorant most americans are concerning their neighbour to the north, even Bush.

It's a hit here, and Rick Mercer even ended up on nightline with Ted Kopel.

Blah blah blah.

Anyway, they had done a special which was 1 hour long, but after 911, they thought it too disrespectful to re-run the special on prime time.

Well, it's back.

It was on last night, and was great.

You had people at Princton signing a petition to ban the Polar Bear slaughter that the Mayor of Toronto was going forward with.

Great stuff.

You are going to see a whole lot more criticism from the previously silent artists. After the last gulf war in 91, U2 took George Bush Sr. to task every night at their concerts. Can't wait to see what happens now with the right wing extremists coming down on Bruce and the Dixie chicks.

I think Bruce is just the start.

Get used to it.

Simple_Min · 04-29-2003, 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sixate

Why is it all the dumbass entertainers can use their freedom of speech against our president, but they think that the public should keep their mouths shut when it comes to them? Fucking hypocrites!

[/b] [/B]

Because they are artists. And do you know what artists do? Express their opinions about stuff.

Art = music, poetry, cartoons, literature.

Oh and slamming Resident Bush...

If we do not question a official who has so much control of our lives then what good is freedom?

frenik · 04-29-2003, 06:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by james t kirk
That has to be the most absurd comparison ever.

Oh brother....

I see it as a perfect comparison. Explain why you don't.

Artists are a form of business. If a business says something that their customers don't like, their customers will not purchase their goods. This puts less money in the pockets of the business, and reduces their opportunity to spread their message.

The Dixie Chicks made a statement that many fans didn't agree with, now the fans have begun a boycott. In my example, Pepsi made a statement that their consumers didn't agree with, so the consumers began a boycott. I fail to see how this is an invalid comparison.

Simple_Min · 04-29-2003, 06:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by frenik

The Dixie Chicks made a statement that many fans didn't agree with, now the fans have begun a boycott.

Actually, they are more popular now than ever. This fact was covered on MSNBC a while back. The boycott was orchestrated by the gop and was very small, but of course that was all that got media coverage.

Liquor Dealer · 04-29-2003, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Simple_Min
Actually, they are more popular now than ever. This fact was covered on MSNBC a while back. The boycott was orchestrated by the gop and was very small, but of course that was all that got media coverage.

There current tour is almost sold out - it was almost sold out before Maines made her statement. The sale of all other products and their place on the charts has gone steadily down hill and is still going down. An article that came out today said they had hired bodyguards because they didn't feel safe. I would imagine when all is said and done the only thing they need worry about is their bottom line. It is still looking for the bottom. The GOP had nothing to do with whatever boycott exists. The people that are the buyers of country music are not nearly as forgiving as are those who support other forms of entertainment. The Chicks screwed up and are reacting to this screwup in a way that is only increasing resentment toward them

04-27-2003, 09:47 AM	#2 (permalink)
The_Dude The GrandDaddy of them all! Location: Austin, TX	so what??????? they can say whatever they want, they can support whoever they want, why is it bothering you? i listen to an artist because of their music, and not because of their political views. __________________ "Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity." - Darrel K Royal

04-27-2003, 10:14 AM	#5 (permalink)
George W Bush Tilted Location: The Great Lone Star State	" I said say little boy with yer pants hanging down is your daddy home is he around uh huh I got a bad desire whooaa Im on fire" Whaoooo hooooo hooooo ooooo who oooooooooo o o ooooo I hate Springsteen his music sucks and he's a dumbass __________________ "Rarely is the question asked: is our children learning" "You teach a child to read and he or her will be able to pass a literacy test."

04-27-2003, 01:32 PM	#8 (permalink)
Phaenx The Northern Ward Location: Columbus, Ohio	If they have the right to slam the president, people have the right to not buy their products. The thing is they're the only ones bitching about it. Watch your ass entertainers, say what you want but not enough for everyone to figure out you're stupid. __________________ "I went shopping last night at like 1am. The place was empty and this old woman just making polite conversation said to me, 'where is everyone??' I replied, 'In bed, same place you and I should be!' Took me ten minutes to figure out why she gave me a dirty look." --Some guy

04-27-2003, 03:56 PM	#12 (permalink)
BoCo Fear the bunny Location: Hanging off the tip of the Right Wing	War brings/ensures peace, as does the threat of war. Nice article, sixate. That's another celeb I'll add to my idiot list. __________________ Activism is a way for useless people to feel important.

04-27-2003, 04:44 PM	#13 (permalink)
The_Dude The GrandDaddy of them all! Location: Austin, TX	i also think that the celeb's who make these comments should be able to withstand the backlash that these can cause. i do feel a lil sorry for the dixie chicks, they received threatning letters, and other illegal stuff. now that's not blacklash that they're supposed to receive. __________________ "Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity." - Darrel K Royal

04-27-2003, 10:47 AM	#6 (permalink)
gibber71 Loser	Actually, I think Springsteen is wrong to say the criticism the Dixie Chicks are getting is un-American.If anything it is completely American since the last I checked the U.S is a democracy.If you open your mouth and take a stand,especially if your a public figure,you deserve to get what ever is thrown back at you.If Microsoft says everyone who buys their software are idiots,or if Ford says people who drive their trunks are assholes then they deserve whatever shortcomings that come there way.It doesn't mean people can't have an opinion,but more often then not people shoot their mouths off and then regret it.If the Dixie Chicks still stand by what they say so be it.The other people who disagree with them have every right to not support them or their music if they don't want to.

04-27-2003, 10:53 AM	#7 (permalink)
rock_bottom Crazy Location: Indiana	Is it surprising? Springsteen's "Born in the USA" was pretty anti-war, if you listened to the lyrics. So add him to the witch hunt, I guess. But I don't think these celebs are mad that Joe Fan is boycotting them, they're mad that radio stations, corporations and many similar organizations are taking a pro-war stance by banning the music and doing other similar things. I mean, people would be up in arms if pro-war music got banned, or if anti-Bush signs were sold at Kroger's and Walmart like pro-war signs already are. I really don't think artists are saying people can't critisize them, but they're saying it's not right for institutions that serve the public to take such a strong political stance.

04-27-2003, 02:36 PM	#10 (permalink)
sixate Registered User Location: Somewhere in Ohio	I shoulda mentioned that I knew he didn't write the song. As far as the lyrics go do you think there is no need for war ever? Unfortunatly there is. If there is a better way then why hasn't anyone found it yet?

04-27-2003, 03:11 PM	#11 (permalink)
mean-spirited Crazy	Never cared for him anyways.What do you expect, liberal philosophy to me means do what I say, not what I do. So many of them believe that they are above us. If we disagree then they start the name calling. I think that if they think this is such a terrible place to live, they need to move to China and see what kind of "rights" they have. What does Babs have to say on this subject I wonder?!

04-27-2003, 04:51 PM	#14 (permalink)
maximusveritas Winner	Kinda funny, when Dr.Laura and Michael Savage were getting boycotted by gay groups, it was the conservatives screaming censorship and the liberals saying it was their right to boycott. Now that some liberals are getting boycotted by rednecks, its the liberals screaming censorship and conservatives saying that its their right to boycott. I understand partisanship, but at the very least, try and stay consistent.

04-27-2003, 04:55 PM	#15 (permalink)
Liquor Dealer Super Agitator Location: Just SW of Nowhere!!! In the good old US of A	It's really kinda' hard to tell the players without a program! __________________ Life isn't always a bowl of cherries, sometimes it's more like a jar of Jalapenos --- what you say or do today might burn your ass tomorrow!!!

04-27-2003, 07:17 PM	#17 (permalink)
darksparkles Insane Location: Seattle	you can be patriotic and still not like war. i'm starting to sound like a broken record. __________________ "I could be the walrus ... I'd still have to bum rides off people." -Ferris Bueller.

04-27-2003, 08:42 PM	#18 (permalink)
Nad Adam Psycho Location: Sweden	Anybody supporting GWB doesn't have much credability when it comes to talking about double standards in my book. And I also thought that the artists made most of their money on concerts etc while the record money went to the record companies. No-one in their right senses buys records nowadays anyway. __________________ Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones. - Psalms 137:9

04-27-2003, 09:02 PM	#19 (permalink)
Kadath Muffled Location: Camazotz	I think the worst thing about the Dixie Chicks is that they totally bitched out when they got hit in the pocket book and backed down. Tim Robbins and Susan Sarandon got shit on for their views, and they stay with them. Robbins' speech at the NPC was pretty good, in my opinion, and addresses the issues at hand. __________________ it's quiet in here

04-27-2003, 09:26 PM	#21 (permalink)
KillerYoda The Original Emo Gangsta Location: Sixth Floor, Texas School Book Depository	Before you go blacklisting everyone, remember that even Metallica (who I know is popular around the TFP) has written anti-war songs. Last time I checked "One" is based on "Johnny Got His Gun," one of the most anti-war books every written. __________________ "So you're Chekov, huh? Well, this here's McCoy. Find a Spock, we got us an away team."

04-27-2003, 09:37 PM	#22 (permalink)
Phaenx The Northern Ward Location: Columbus, Ohio	Well, "Don't tread on me" also says: "Liberty or death, what we so proudly hail once you provoke her, rattling of her tail never begins it, never, but once engaged... never surrenders, showing the fangs of rage don't tread on me so be it threaten no more to secure peace is to prepare for war so be it settle the score touch me again for the words that you'll hear evermore... don't tread on me love it or live it, she with the deadly bite quick is the blue tongue, forked as lighting strike shining with brightness, always on surveillance the eyes, they never close, emblem of vigilance don't tread on me so be it threaten no more to secure peace is to prepare for war so be it settle the score touch me again for the words that you'll hear evermore... don't tread on me so be it threaten no more to secure peace is to prepare for war liberty or death, what we so proudly hail once you provoke her, rattling on her tail so be it threaten no more to secure peace is to prepare for war so be it settle the score touch me again for the words that you'll hear evermore... don't tread on me" Doesn't sound like they're very anti-war, but I'll have a look at one. __________________ "I went shopping last night at like 1am. The place was empty and this old woman just making polite conversation said to me, 'where is everyone??' I replied, 'In bed, same place you and I should be!' Took me ten minutes to figure out why she gave me a dirty look." --Some guy

04-27-2003, 09:54 PM	#24 (permalink)
Kadath Muffled Location: Camazotz	They haven't been hit in the pocketbook yet since people are still going to their concerts. Seems to have been more related to true remorse or concern over their safety than album revenue (which Nad Adam already pointed out lines the labels pockes more than the artists). When there was public outcry and radio stations began to reduce or eliminate playtime of their songs they saw the writing on the wall. Given that as soon as the first Chick made the initial comment another one grabbed the mic and made a clarification, I think they were pretty well aware of the danger of criticizing the administration in the climate. They knew that people have been whipped into a fervor that allows for no dissent. Not a good sign for us. __________________ it's quiet in here

04-27-2003, 09:56 PM	#25 (permalink)
oane Insane	I don't care what his political views are, Bruce Springsteen fukin rox! OTOH, I can understand Sixate's stand that "If an artist has political views I don't like. I won't support them". Fair enough, I say! __________________ Make me Mad. Make me Sad. Make me feel Alright.

04-28-2003, 05:22 AM	#33 (permalink)
Daval Junkie Location: The True North Strong and Free!	I've never understood the american tradition of villifying anyone who does not agree with them. Everyone is entitled to an opinion __________________ "It is impossible to obtain a conviction for sodomy from an English jury. Half of them don't believe that it can physically be done, and the other half are doing it." Winston Churchill

04-29-2003, 05:34 AM	#36 (permalink)
james t kirk Junkie Location: Toronto	I always liked Bruce, still llike Bruce, in fact, I like him even more now cause he has the balls to stand up to bullshit. Since 911, it has been just about Sacrilege to criticize Bush, or US policy. Well, i can see now that that is starting to come to an end. Case in point (which you probably won't get) There is a show here called "This hour has 22 minutes", it's a comedy tv show that is brilliant, but i won't go into details. There is one sketch featuring Rick Mercer that was called "Talking to Americans". Essentially Rick would travel to the US and interview Americans asking their opinion about the most absurd things. For example, he got the governer of Iowa to say congratulations Canada for adopting the 24 hour clock (he had people convinced that we used a "metric clock" that only had 20 hours. Or he would ask people on the street in Chicago if they agreed with bombing Saskatchewan (which they all did) or the mall in west Edmonton. Or, the best, he managed to catch George W Bush while campaigning for president and get George to thank the Canadian Prime Minister "Jean Poutine" for endorsing his candidacy. (Jean Chretien is the prime minister by the way, and poutine is a quebec delicacy - french fries with gravy and cheese curds) Anyway, it shows just how ignorant most americans are concerning their neighbour to the north, even Bush. It's a hit here, and Rick Mercer even ended up on nightline with Ted Kopel. Blah blah blah. Anyway, they had done a special which was 1 hour long, but after 911, they thought it too disrespectful to re-run the special on prime time. Well, it's back. It was on last night, and was great. You had people at Princton signing a petition to ban the Polar Bear slaughter that the Mayor of Toronto was going forward with. Great stuff. You are going to see a whole lot more criticism from the previously silent artists. After the last gulf war in 91, U2 took George Bush Sr. to task every night at their concerts. Can't wait to see what happens now with the right wing extremists coming down on Bruce and the Dixie chicks. I think Bruce is just the start. Get used to it. Last edited by james t kirk; 04-29-2003 at 05:46 AM..