What God said about Al Franken's "Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them" - Page 2 - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

eple · 09-21-2003, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SkanK0r
Again, I'd rather deal with someone who is stupid enough to lie 100% of the time than one who finds clever ways to disguise their bullshit and call it "fair and balanced."

Edit:
oopsie daisy. sawry for being stoopid.

Kadath · 09-22-2003, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by eple
Dude the "fair and balanced" is satire, directed at fox news. Please read, comprehend, reply.

Um...open mouth, insert foot. Take your own advice.

josobot · 09-24-2003, 05:17 PM

Winston Churchill noted that if you are young and not a liberal , you have no heart; but if you are old and not a conservative you have no brain. It still holds...my daughter is young and doing volunteer work in the UK...I am an old hippie Viet-Nam vet and very conservative. Conservative ,not for my ego, but for the good of all peoples.

josobot · 09-24-2003, 05:23 PM

What advances liberals brought so swiftly to humanity, have a hundred times more brought war, death, and pestilence on that same humanity.

JSD · 09-24-2003, 07:18 PM

Too bad Franken didn't end up like that other SNL guy, Hartman. By the way, what about his big lie saying he was associated with a university or something.

Kadath · 09-24-2003, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JSD
Too bad Franken didn't end up like that other SNL guy, Hartman.

Way to elevate the level of discourse, dude. That's troll-tacular!

SkanK0r · 09-24-2003, 09:10 PM

eple: I think you're misunderstanding my point. I wasn't talking about Al Franken - I was talking about someone like Coulter verses something like Fox News. I was saying that I'd rather be lied to 100% of the time (like Ann Coulter) than deal with people who lie but mix it in with news stories, and claim not to have an agenda (like Fox News).

And JSD: Actually, I've heard a lot of talk on this from the right-wing media pundits like Laura Ingram and Sean Hannity. It's funny how wrong they have it - they keep saying it like he forged a letter and then got in trouble for sending it on Harvard letterhead. He DID get in trouble for sending it on Harvard letterhead, but not for the reasons they list. And he didn't "lie" in the letter - the letter was sent as a joke to John Ashcroft and other members of the Bush administration to make a point. Funnily, the right-wing knee-jerk attack on this letter proves one of his books main points - people will form an opinion on something without getting the facts. He CLEARLY EXPLAINS what he meant by writing the letter, but the pundits distorted his argument and claimed he did something that he did not. My assumption is that they didn't actually read the section, but instead read out-of-context quotes provided by people with ideals similar to theirs.

I hope that doesn't come across as a right-wing bashing post. When I use "right-wing" so venomously I'm almost exclusively referring to the pundit-army of the extremely conservative talk-radio crowd.

matthew330 · 09-29-2003, 11:53 AM

Apparently the only part of the book he wrote was "Lies and the Lying Liars who tell them" and "A Fair and Balanced Look and the Right"

Very profound title - half of which is straight from Fox News.

Why would you decide to write about something when the first thing you need to do is hire 20 some harvard liberal professors to accomplish it. And someone mentioned something about Coulter being and idealogue.

I would love to see Franken go up against Coulter, Limbaugh, or Hannity. I've heard him on TV, and the previous poster was right - all he could muster was essentially "Uhhh, Uhhh - big uhhh, big uhhh, fat liarheads" - much to the delight of the liberal audience. He is a political idiot. It's funny to see liberals delight at him pointing out that Coulter referred to "endnotes" as "footnotes" (which i'm sure some Harvard English teacher had to point out to him).

Phaenx · 09-29-2003, 10:14 PM

Can't say I like the guy, he already hates me because I'm a mother fucking baby killer conservative and I've yet to meet him.

I'm dissapointed, I'd thought he would have something more constructive to say rather then spewing hateful rhetoric. What's worse is it's being glorified by people who I may disagree with, but still respected as individuals with some measure of integrity.

Kadath · 09-30-2003, 06:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by matthew330
Apparently the only part of the book he wrote was "Lies and the Lying Liars who tell them" and "A Fair and Balanced Look and the Right"

Very profound title - half of which is straight from Fox News.

Why would you decide to write about something when the first thing you need to do is hire 20 some harvard liberal professors to accomplish it. And someone mentioned something about Coulter being and idealogue.

He had a staff of Havard students as research assistants. He acknowledges every one of them and their specific accomplishments insofar as the book is concerned. A good chunk of writers have research assistants.

Quote:

Originally posted by matthew330

I would love to see Franken go up against Coulter, Limbaugh, or Hannity. I've heard him on TV, and the previous poster was right - all he could muster was essentially "Uhhh, Uhhh - big uhhh, big uhhh, fat liarheads" - much to the delight of the liberal audience. He is a political idiot. It's funny to see liberals delight at him pointing out that Coulter referred to "endnotes" as "footnotes" (which i'm sure some Harvard English teacher had to point out to him).

Franken handled O'Reilly just fine, I think he could take the rest in the same stride. As for Coulter's endnote/footnote thing, if you're familiar with footnotes, they're at the bottom of a page, thus making it easy to read them as you come across the notation. Endnotes are stuffed together in the back of the book. It's not a semantic difference. It's the same as having the fine print in an ad legible and not. I hope that distinction isn't too unclear.

matthew330 · 09-30-2003, 06:27 AM

yeah - we most of us can comprehend the endnote/footnote thing without hiring research assistants; but the point still stands - the both do the same frickin thing. In fact, the only reason they aren't footnoted is because there are so many references over half of each page would be footnotes. But i wouldn't expect you to know that - you liberals see the cover of a book like Coulters and half to take a few steps back, start hyperventilating and have a friend console you for a half hour. I on the other have read portions of Franken's book (yeah i have some liberal friends - i can look past that part of their personality).

matthew330 · 09-30-2003, 06:29 AM

oh and your right - plenty of people do hire research assistants when writing books. But not generally when it comes to writing books which outline a philosophical opinion. If you need researchers to validate an opinion - your not far enough along to have one, much less write a book about it.

little limey · 10-02-2003, 04:17 PM

So would you reccomend reading this book or not? I don't have a lot of time this semster, but this book is in my top 5 to read outside of school.

Phaenx · 10-02-2003, 04:34 PM

I haven't read it, but I bet I can sum it up in a sentence or two and save you some time: "I hate conservatives, so should you. Also, Bill O'Reilly eats babies."

Kadath · 10-02-2003, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by matthew330
yeah - we most of us can comprehend the endnote/footnote thing without hiring research assistants; but the point still stands - the both do the same frickin thing. In fact, the only reason they aren't footnoted is because there are so many references over half of each page would be footnotes. But i wouldn't expect you to know that - you liberals see the cover of a book like Coulters and half to take a few steps back, start hyperventilating and have a friend console you for a half hour. I on the other have read portions of Franken's book (yeah i have some liberal friends - i can look past that part of their personality).

"You liberals see and just assume..."
No irony here, it's dead, folks. And kudos on having braved portions of Franken's "book"...did you take a stab at the others?

Quote:

Originally posted by matthew330
oh and your right - plenty of people do hire research assistants when writing books. But not generally when it comes to writing books which outline a philosophical opinion. If you need researchers to validate an opinion - your not far enough along to have one, much less write a book about it.

Maybe you should hire a research assistant to handle grammatical checks. The researchers check facts, so Franken's attack on conservatives for not fact-checking doesn't utterly blow up in his face. I think he's pretty secure in his opinion.

Quote:

Originally posted by Phaenx
I haven't read it, but I bet I can sum it up in a sentence or two and save you some time: "I hate conservatives, so should you. Also, Bill O'Reilly eats babies."

Oh come on!

HarmlessRabbit · 10-02-2003, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Phaenx
I haven't read it, but I bet I can sum it up in a sentence or two and save you some time: "I hate conservatives, so should you. Also, Bill O'Reilly eats babies."

ok, that made me laugh.

also, it's true. you should sum up o'reilly and coulter now.

Phaenx · 10-02-2003, 07:33 PM

Coulter is pretty much the same thing Franken is.

I like O'Reilly though, he gets a lot of flak for being a whitehouse ass-kiss, like all foxnews anchors do, but he's like a grumpy old man that criticizes everyone really.

09-29-2003, 10:14 PM	#49 (permalink)
Phaenx The Northern Ward Location: Columbus, Ohio	Can't say I like the guy, he already hates me because I'm a mother fucking baby killer conservative and I've yet to meet him. I'm dissapointed, I'd thought he would have something more constructive to say rather then spewing hateful rhetoric. What's worse is it's being glorified by people who I may disagree with, but still respected as individuals with some measure of integrity. __________________ "I went shopping last night at like 1am. The place was empty and this old woman just making polite conversation said to me, 'where is everyone??' I replied, 'In bed, same place you and I should be!' Took me ten minutes to figure out why she gave me a dirty look." --Some guy

10-02-2003, 04:34 PM	#54 (permalink)
Phaenx The Northern Ward Location: Columbus, Ohio	I haven't read it, but I bet I can sum it up in a sentence or two and save you some time: "I hate conservatives, so should you. Also, Bill O'Reilly eats babies." __________________ "I went shopping last night at like 1am. The place was empty and this old woman just making polite conversation said to me, 'where is everyone??' I replied, 'In bed, same place you and I should be!' Took me ten minutes to figure out why she gave me a dirty look." --Some guy

10-02-2003, 07:33 PM	#57 (permalink)
Phaenx The Northern Ward Location: Columbus, Ohio	Coulter is pretty much the same thing Franken is. I like O'Reilly though, he gets a lot of flak for being a whitehouse ass-kiss, like all foxnews anchors do, but he's like a grumpy old man that criticizes everyone really. __________________ "I went shopping last night at like 1am. The place was empty and this old woman just making polite conversation said to me, 'where is everyone??' I replied, 'In bed, same place you and I should be!' Took me ten minutes to figure out why she gave me a dirty look." --Some guy

09-24-2003, 05:17 PM	#43 (permalink)
josobot Insane	Winston Churchill noted that if you are young and not a liberal , you have no heart; but if you are old and not a conservative you have no brain. It still holds...my daughter is young and doing volunteer work in the UK...I am an old hippie Viet-Nam vet and very conservative. Conservative ,not for my ego, but for the good of all peoples.

09-24-2003, 05:23 PM	#44 (permalink)
josobot Insane	What advances liberals brought so swiftly to humanity, have a hundred times more brought war, death, and pestilence on that same humanity.

09-24-2003, 07:18 PM	#45 (permalink)
JSD Upright	Too bad Franken didn't end up like that other SNL guy, Hartman. By the way, what about his big lie saying he was associated with a university or something.

09-24-2003, 09:10 PM	#47 (permalink)
SkanK0r Crazy	eple: I think you're misunderstanding my point. I wasn't talking about Al Franken - I was talking about someone like Coulter verses something like Fox News. I was saying that I'd rather be lied to 100% of the time (like Ann Coulter) than deal with people who lie but mix it in with news stories, and claim not to have an agenda (like Fox News). And JSD: Actually, I've heard a lot of talk on this from the right-wing media pundits like Laura Ingram and Sean Hannity. It's funny how wrong they have it - they keep saying it like he forged a letter and then got in trouble for sending it on Harvard letterhead. He DID get in trouble for sending it on Harvard letterhead, but not for the reasons they list. And he didn't "lie" in the letter - the letter was sent as a joke to John Ashcroft and other members of the Bush administration to make a point. Funnily, the right-wing knee-jerk attack on this letter proves one of his books main points - people will form an opinion on something without getting the facts. He CLEARLY EXPLAINS what he meant by writing the letter, but the pundits distorted his argument and claimed he did something that he did not. My assumption is that they didn't actually read the section, but instead read out-of-context quotes provided by people with ideals similar to theirs. I hope that doesn't come across as a right-wing bashing post. When I use "right-wing" so venomously I'm almost exclusively referring to the pundit-army of the extremely conservative talk-radio crowd.

09-29-2003, 11:53 AM	#48 (permalink)
matthew330 Banned	Apparently the only part of the book he wrote was "Lies and the Lying Liars who tell them" and "A Fair and Balanced Look and the Right" Very profound title - half of which is straight from Fox News. Why would you decide to write about something when the first thing you need to do is hire 20 some harvard liberal professors to accomplish it. And someone mentioned something about Coulter being and idealogue. I would love to see Franken go up against Coulter, Limbaugh, or Hannity. I've heard him on TV, and the previous poster was right - all he could muster was essentially "Uhhh, Uhhh - big uhhh, big uhhh, fat liarheads" - much to the delight of the liberal audience. He is a political idiot. It's funny to see liberals delight at him pointing out that Coulter referred to "endnotes" as "footnotes" (which i'm sure some Harvard English teacher had to point out to him).

09-30-2003, 06:27 AM	#51 (permalink)
matthew330 Banned	yeah - we most of us can comprehend the endnote/footnote thing without hiring research assistants; but the point still stands - the both do the same frickin thing. In fact, the only reason they aren't footnoted is because there are so many references over half of each page would be footnotes. But i wouldn't expect you to know that - you liberals see the cover of a book like Coulters and half to take a few steps back, start hyperventilating and have a friend console you for a half hour. I on the other have read portions of Franken's book (yeah i have some liberal friends - i can look past that part of their personality).

09-30-2003, 06:29 AM	#52 (permalink)
matthew330 Banned	oh and your right - plenty of people do hire research assistants when writing books. But not generally when it comes to writing books which outline a philosophical opinion. If you need researchers to validate an opinion - your not far enough along to have one, much less write a book about it.

10-02-2003, 04:17 PM	#53 (permalink)
little limey Psycho Location: Room Nineteen	So would you reccomend reading this book or not? I don't have a lot of time this semster, but this book is in my top 5 to read outside of school.