A Chilly Time to Visit Norway - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

genuinegirly · 12-10-2009, 03:27 AM

President Obama has arrived in Oslo for the Nobel Peace Prize.
All I keep thinking is that he must be cold. I'm also wondering if he's feeling a different sort of chill. How will his recent decision to send more troops to Afghanistan impact his reception?

Quote:

Obama arrives in Norway to accept Nobel Peace Prize

Oslo, Norway (CNN) -- President Obama arrived in Norway early Thursday to accept the Nobel Peace Prize, a smile on his face and the first lady's hand in his.

Obama, along with the first lady, shook hands with a welcoming group and chatted before getting into a car adorned with the flags of both countries.

The president's 26-hour trip to Oslo will include a visit to the Nobel Institute. There, he will meet the five-member panel that unanimously awarded him the prize, said Mette Owre of the Foreign Affairs Ministry.

The president and first lady also will meet with King Harald V and Queen Sonja. He will then accept the Nobel at an afternoon ceremony and attend an evening award banquet. The prize includes a $1.4 million check, a gold medal and a diploma.

dlish · 12-10-2009, 04:15 AM

anyone who acts with violence to bring about peace is breaching the very tenants that they pretend to uphold.

the argument here isnt about whether sending additional troops or not is the right thing to do. it's about whether someone can be given a peace prize for bringing further war and misery to an already screwed up nation. not in my books.

a year in office, he's done a fair job by anyones estimates, but he's far from the messiah some make him out to be.

i wish jesus was around

genuinegirly · 12-10-2009, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlish

i wish jesus was around

Or at least another Gandhi

dlish · 12-10-2009, 01:21 PM

sorry, but this is so full of cracklefucks...

a man accepts a peace prize and justifies war in the same breath.

what were these guys thinking when they nominated him?

i like the guy and all, but i dont think he deserves a peace prize. i know i dont deserve one if i endorse a war..why should anyone else?

Quote:

Barack Obama justifies war in Nobel Peace Prize speech | News.com.au

Barack Obama receives Peace Prize
Says war is sometimes justified
He needs to live up to honour, say some

MORE than 6000 people marched in Oslo today after Barack Obama accepted the Nobel Peace Prize, urging him to live up to the accolade after a speech justifying war.

The crowd marched in a peaceful, torchlight procession aimed at denouncing nuclear weapons and ended up outside Mr Obama's hotel in the Norwegian capital, police and organisers said.

The US president - who in his acceptance speech said "war is sometimes necessary, and war is at some level an expression of human feelings" - waved to the crowd from his hotel balcony for several minutes with his wife Michelle, protected by bullet-proof glass.

Some of the demonstrators carried banners reading No to Nuclear Weapons or bearing peace symbols.

Another 3000 protesters took part in a demonstration organised by the Norwegian Peace Initiative, calling for an end to the war in Afghanistan, a controlled arms trade, a halt to nuclear weapons and the end of Israeli settlements.

"Yes, Yes, Yes We Can, Stop the War in Afghanistan," they chanted.

"We are here to give Obama a push so that he acts in the spirit of the Peace Prize, that he takes concrete measures to stop the war in Afghanistan," said one of the organisers for the Norwegian Peace Initiative, Benjamin Endre Larsen.

He also urged Mr Obama to implement rules "to control the arms trade", pursue nuclear disarmament "at a quick pace", and pressure the Israeli government "so that the settlements stop on the West Bank".

In his speech, Mr Obama said: "Our actions matter, and can bend history in the direction of justice.

"I am responsible for the deployment of thousands of young Americans to battle in a distant land. Some will kill. Some will be killed,'' he said.

"And so I come here with an acute sense of the cost of armed conflict - filled with difficult questions about the relationship between war and peace, and our effort to replace one with the other.''

He said war was "never glorious, and we must never trumpet it as such'', bur he argued that it could "sometimes be not only necessary but morally justified''.

roachboy · 12-10-2009, 01:34 PM

yeah well this is kinda awkward isn't it?

i still think that the main thing that obama did that got him the peace prize was to not be george w bush.
but the platform he ran on accepted the lunacy of the "war on terror" and argued that afghanistan was a "legitimate theater" of operations within it. all that did really was make a separation between the "good" war there and the other one in iraq. which doesn't seem to be quite as over as one would hope.

so i've been a bit baffled by the peace prize thing since it happened.
i mean it's not like something on the order of what's happening in afghanistan should be a surprise...it follows in a straight line from the positions he outlined during the campaign.

given all that, it's hardly surprising that he made the speech that he did.
what else could he have said, really?
it's not plausible that he could pretend that the escalation in afghanistan didn't just happen.
to justify that, he had to argue from the assumption that the "war on terror" is legitimate.
i don't buy that premise.

it's all kinda surreal.

Poppinjay · 12-10-2009, 01:41 PM

What's funny is that the majority of Americans say they support this move of sending more troops. Bush, they did not. I'm betting this is mostly due to Bush fatigue.

Xerxys · 12-10-2009, 05:56 PM

^^ I refuse to believe that Obama is just another Bush.

dc_dux · 12-10-2009, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poppinjay

What's funny is that the majority of Americans say they support this move of sending more troops. Bush, they did not. I'm betting this is mostly due to Bush fatigue.

I think it is more due to the fact that the issue now is Afghanistan, where many Americans still believe the al Queda threat to the country resides...as opposed to Bush's abandonment of that front in order to pursue the surge in Iraq, which few Americans ever perceived as a threat to US national security.

Charlatan · 12-10-2009, 07:38 PM

I agree. The true battle was always in Afghanistan and not in Iraq. Iraq was a waste of lives and treasure (as they tend to put it).

It's like Obama is finally doing the right thing.

The peace prize thing was not his doing and it's good to see he's sticking to his guns (so to speak).

Xerxys · 12-10-2009, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlish

anyone who acts with violence to bring about peace is breaching the very tenants that they pretend to uphold.

the argument here isnt about whether sending additional troops or not is the right thing to do. it's about whether someone can be given a peace prize for bringing further war and misery to an already screwed up nation. not in my books.

a year in office, he's done a fair job by anyones estimates, but he's far from the messiah some make him out to be.

i wish jesus was around

You know why Jesus is no longer around? Because only a handful people "claimed" to have seen him rise from the dead and float on to heaven. Thing is, he died, he just ... died. We want peace, but to achieve that we have to level the playing field and there are many folks (US included) not playing fair. Dlishs do you really think removing everyone from Iraq and Afghanistan would do even the natives any good?

dlish · 12-10-2009, 08:59 PM

xeryxs, i suggest you read my posts again before making ludicrous accusations about what i said in this thread.

This thread has nothing to do with jesus's divinity or ascention. Please stick to the topic.

As a man jesus was a peaceful man. he did not say one thing, and do another. This is why jesus would get my vote, and not Obama.

Please show me where i said removing anyone from iraq or afghanistan would do good. This is about a man who speaks of peace but does the exact opposite by justifying a war in the same breath as recieving his prize. i'd actually have more respect for Obama if he handed the Peace prize back because at least it'd then be in line with what he really thinks.

Seaver · 12-10-2009, 09:05 PM

I thought it was a great speech. I still feel the same way as when it was announced, that he received the award for not being Bush, but that's a moot issue at the moment. He made a great speech which, in my opinion, speaks to the realities of the world. A country must arm it's citizens to avoid the aggressors (and try to avoid becoming one).

Xerxys · 12-10-2009, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlish

... Please show me where i said removing anyone from iraq or afghanistan would do good. This is about a man who speaks of peace but does the exact opposite by justifying a war in the same breath as recieving his prize. i'd actually have more respect for Obama if he handed the Peace prize back because at least it'd then be in line with what he really thinks.

You missed my half hearted joke about heysus and for the record your post inferred withdrawal. So this is the relevant part of your response I was addressing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlish

... the argument here isnt about whether sending additional troops or not is the right thing to do. it's about whether someone can be given a peace prize for bringing further war and misery to an already screwed up nation. not in my books. ...

The argument is now intricately related simply because you mentioned it. War and Misery (your words) as I stated earlier is "necessary" to some point to achieve some form of stability. Whether or not the action deserves a nobel peace prize, NOT sending more troops in is out of the question.

Derwood · 12-11-2009, 07:58 AM

According to Sarah Palin, he just lifted his speech from her book:

Quote:

I liked what he said, in fact, I thumbed through my book quickly this morning to say 'Wow, that that sounded really familiar' because I talked in my book too about the fallen nature of man and why war is necessary at times and history's lessons when it comes to knowing what it is that we engage in warfare and a couple of the other things he said were I thought, wow, those were a ni-nice, a broad message so broad I just wrote about those and a lot of Americans right now are getting to read off of my take on when war is necessary.

Bill O'Rights · 12-11-2009, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlish

what were these guys thinking when they nominated him?

It was nothing more than an international slap in the face to George W. Bush. I’m not saying that it wasn’t a deserved slap, but Obama has to know this. I feel that he should have declined the award based on that knowledge alone. Unless, of course, his ego is telling him that he actualy deserves this award on some unknown level.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poppinjay

What's funny is that the majority of Americans say they support this move of sending more troops. Bush, they did not.

I supported the war in Afghanistan then, and I support it now. Bush…Obama…it doesn’t really matter. Afghanistan is where we belonged, not Iraq. As messed up as Iraq was, it wasn’t our business. Afghanistan, on the other hand, was.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xerxys

I refuse to believe that Obama is just another Bush.

Why? I mean why is it so easy to believe that you were lied to by one and not the other? At least with Bush you knew what you were getting. Obama, I feel, is just as much a front man as George Bush ever was. He’s just a hell of a lot better at it. Bush was a joke on an epic scale. But Obama scares me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charlatan

The true battle was always in Afghanistan and not in Iraq. Iraq was a waste of lives and treasure (as they tend to put it).

Exactly.

pinkie · 02-07-2010, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derwood

According to Sarah Palin, he just lifted his speech from her book:

Hey, is there a source for this quote?

---------- Post added at 06:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:08 PM ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by pinkie

Hey, is there a source for this quote?

NM. I found one.

12-10-2009, 04:15 AM	#2 (permalink)
dlish Currently sour but formerly Dlishs Super Moderator Location: Australia/UAE	anyone who acts with violence to bring about peace is breaching the very tenants that they pretend to uphold. the argument here isnt about whether sending additional troops or not is the right thing to do. it's about whether someone can be given a peace prize for bringing further war and misery to an already screwed up nation. not in my books. a year in office, he's done a fair job by anyones estimates, but he's far from the messiah some make him out to be. i wish jesus was around __________________ An injustice anywhere, is an injustice everywhere I always sign my facebook comments with ()()===========(}. Does that make me gay? - Filthy

12-10-2009, 01:34 PM	#5 (permalink)
roachboy Super Moderator Location: essex ma	yeah well this is kinda awkward isn't it? i still think that the main thing that obama did that got him the peace prize was to not be george w bush. but the platform he ran on accepted the lunacy of the "war on terror" and argued that afghanistan was a "legitimate theater" of operations within it. all that did really was make a separation between the "good" war there and the other one in iraq. which doesn't seem to be quite as over as one would hope. so i've been a bit baffled by the peace prize thing since it happened. i mean it's not like something on the order of what's happening in afghanistan should be a surprise...it follows in a straight line from the positions he outlined during the campaign. given all that, it's hardly surprising that he made the speech that he did. what else could he have said, really? it's not plausible that he could pretend that the escalation in afghanistan didn't just happen. to justify that, he had to argue from the assumption that the "war on terror" is legitimate. i don't buy that premise. it's all kinda surreal. __________________ a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear it make you sick. -kamau brathwaite

12-10-2009, 01:41 PM	#6 (permalink)
Poppinjay You had me at hello Location: DC/Coastal VA	What's funny is that the majority of Americans say they support this move of sending more troops. Bush, they did not. I'm betting this is mostly due to Bush fatigue. __________________ I think the Apocalypse is happening all around us. We go on eating desserts and watching TV. I know I do. I wish we were more capable of sustained passion and sustained resistance. We should be screaming and what we do is gossip. -Lydia Millet

12-10-2009, 07:38 PM	#9 (permalink)
Charlatan Getting it. Super Moderator Location: Lion City	I agree. The true battle was always in Afghanistan and not in Iraq. Iraq was a waste of lives and treasure (as they tend to put it). It's like Obama is finally doing the right thing. The peace prize thing was not his doing and it's good to see he's sticking to his guns (so to speak). __________________ "My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars." - Old Man Luedecke

12-10-2009, 08:59 PM	#11 (permalink)
dlish Currently sour but formerly Dlishs Super Moderator Location: Australia/UAE	xeryxs, i suggest you read my posts again before making ludicrous accusations about what i said in this thread. This thread has nothing to do with jesus's divinity or ascention. Please stick to the topic. As a man jesus was a peaceful man. he did not say one thing, and do another. This is why jesus would get my vote, and not Obama. Please show me where i said removing anyone from iraq or afghanistan would do good. This is about a man who speaks of peace but does the exact opposite by justifying a war in the same breath as recieving his prize. i'd actually have more respect for Obama if he handed the Peace prize back because at least it'd then be in line with what he really thinks. __________________ An injustice anywhere, is an injustice everywhere I always sign my facebook comments with ()()===========(}. Does that make me gay? - Filthy

12-10-2009, 05:56 PM	#7 (permalink)
Xerxys Junkie Location: My head.	^^ I refuse to believe that Obama is just another Bush.

12-10-2009, 09:05 PM	#12 (permalink)
Seaver Junkie Location: Fort Worth, TX	I thought it was a great speech. I still feel the same way as when it was announced, that he received the award for not being Bush, but that's a moot issue at the moment. He made a great speech which, in my opinion, speaks to the realities of the world. A country must arm it's citizens to avoid the aggressors (and try to avoid becoming one). __________________ "Smite the rocks with the rod of knowledge, and fountains of unstinted wealth will gush forth." - Ashbel Smith as he laid the first cornerstone of the University of Texas