Paq

anyone watching CNN noticing how the men/women seem to be completely divided on who to support?

__________________
Live.

Chris

Willravel

Women want Obama.

tisonlyi

I had a curry last night, these pants, indeed, are glowing.
-----Added 15/10/2008 at 09 : 56 : 48-----
Chavez helping the FARC?

Err. No. The dodgy laptop, belatedly, has been called way dodgy by interpol.

*shakes head*
-----Added 15/10/2008 at 10 : 01 : 41-----
ZERO!

*McCain looks completely flabberghasted*

__________________
"I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place." - Winston Churchill, 1937 --{ORLY?}--

Paq

wow....
wow...
obama finally became the angry black man
ZERO!!!
haha
called out mccain...

__________________
Live.

Chris

Manic_Skafe

Fuck you, Joe.

__________________
"Porn is a zoo of exotic animals that becomes boring upon ownership." -Nersesian

fresnelly

McCain is flatlining on the meter thingee.

__________________
Building an artificial intelligence that appreciates Mozart is easy. Building an A.I. that appreciates a theme restaurant is the real challenge - Kit Roebuck - Nine Planets Without Intelligent Life

Paq

FUCK JOE
period

FUCK him in the ass

now...mccain is faltering like crazy on this healthcare stuff...

and i thought, honestly, that mccain supported roe v wade.

__________________
Live.

Chris

Jozrael

Wait what? Did I miss something here? What did Obama say about Joe? He actually cursed on national TV? @_@.

And I did not know that about McCain. He just shot up in my opinion on how he dealt with the appointment of judges. Extremely mature viewpoint.

tisonlyi

I wouldn't apply any litmus test, but if a judge has supported Roe Vs Wade, I think that would count against their qualifications.

Disingenuous.

__________________
"I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place." - Winston Churchill, 1937 --{ORLY?}--

Jozrael

Well Obama said the exact same thing, reversed .

Paq

wow, obama just had a ..reasoned response to abortion and late term abortion

and mccain needs to stop huffing and puffing into the mic...
-----Added 15/10/2008 at 10 : 26 : 36-----
ok, the freaking snide comments...whomever is handling mccain needs to show him the tapes and show him that it is not effective and just seems grouchy/crotchety....

__________________
Live.

Chris

tisonlyi

Joe the plumber

-----Added 15/10/2008 at 10 : 49 : 59-----
That had to be something that was staged for McCain, but didn't really work.

heehee

__________________
"I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place." - Winston Churchill, 1937 --{ORLY?}--

abaya

I actually thought I heard him say... "A breast of freth air," which would have been even more hilarious. Yeah, I don't know who the hell Joe Plumber is, but my dad's a plumber and there's no way in hell he would EVER vote for McCain.

McCain just fucking annoys me, now. He is so unbelievably condescending, now more than ever. His laughter, chuckles, and general "you don't know whatchoo talkin' bout, boy" tone towards Obama makes me want to puke. I'm even more impressed that Obama CONTINUES maintaining his cool, except for that one brilliant moment of "ZERO!" about health care, when it was necessary.

Going to bed, last time we stay up this late on a weeknight! (Except maybe election night.) I've marked my absentee ballot and am taking it to the US embassy in the morning.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

Tully Mars

I really would have prefer Obama handle this statement differently- "I'm not Bush, if you wanted to run against him you should have run four years ago." I think Obama should have countered- "No, certainly I know you're not. But if you wanted to run away from him you should have done that years ago. Instead you've continue to support him on almost every issue. You've consistently shown that support in every way, including most of your votes."

BTW- who the fuck is Joe the plumber?

__________________
I used to drink to drown my sorrows, but the damned things have learned how to swim- Frida Kahlo

Vice President Starkizzer Fan Club

tisonlyi

Joe the plumber IS that guy in the video.

Literally. Joe WoznaPolishname.
-----Added 15/10/2008 at 11 : 04 : 10-----
Worzenbach?

__________________
"I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place." - Winston Churchill, 1937 --{ORLY?}--

Jinn

McCain messed up his last name even.

I think McCain actually started quite strong, but it fell apart when he (unprompted) threw that Ayers/ACORN bit out there.

__________________
"I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel

Tully Mars

Ah, missed that. Thanks- makes more sense, still sounds lame.

Watched the debate at a friends house. All Canadian mainly. I'm certain if the world got a vote Obama would win by 90%.

__________________
I used to drink to drown my sorrows, but the damned things have learned how to swim- Frida Kahlo

Vice President Starkizzer Fan Club

Paq

i honestly thought mccain was winning until about 20 minutes in, then he started slipping a bit...then the healthcare stuff really cinched it for obama.

just my opinion, but mccain's plan seems very complicated and doesn't seem to be as helpful to people. that's just me.

the ayers thing really irked me. Mccain's campaign has been harping on it, then he just says "I don't care about an old terrist"...wtf is that.

and i personally LOVED obama's response to the bush thing. "sorry, your policies are not different"

__________________
Live.

Chris

Willravel

Thanks for posting that vid, tisonlyi. That clarifies things a lot.

dc_dux

The flash polls have it wider than I would have expected:

CBS - Obama -53, McCain -22
CNN - Obama -58, McCain -31 and McCain's "unfavorables" went up from 45 to 49.

Bottom line, McCain is not convincing undecideds or soft Obama supporters to take another look.
-----Added 15/10/2008 at 11 : 31 : 27-----
The most outlandish comment - McCain: "ACORN is on the verge of perpetrating the greatest voter fraud in US history."

__________________
"The perfect is the enemy of the good."
~ Voltaire

Paq

wasnt' mccain a keynote speaker at an acorn meeting?

__________________
Live.

Chris

dc_dux

And before anyone gets frothy....ACORN does not support or promote voting rights for non-citizen immigrants.

__________________
"The perfect is the enemy of the good."
~ Voltaire

Rekna

McCain looked incredibly angry at a couple points in the debate.

tisonlyi

dcdux, what do you think will happen to republican midwest votes with that renunciation of the corn pledge by McCain?

__________________
"I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place." - Winston Churchill, 1937 --{ORLY?}--

Rekna

The joe the plumber video was good. Obama had a very good discussion with that guy.

dc_dux

I think he knows he already lost Iowa (Bush won in 04) and wont pick up Wisconsin where he once thought he might have a shot.

And it played to the base that he absolutely has to hold (and have them show up to vote).

One state where it could make a difference is in Nebraska, the cornhuskers!....very red, but one of the few states that splits the electoral votes..... Obama Chases Nebraska Electoral Vote

__________________
"The perfect is the enemy of the good."
~ Voltaire

guyy

What Midwest votes? He's losing in Illinois, Iowa, Wisconsin, Michigan, Minnesota, the latest poll from ND say he's losing there, too. He's still in the chase in Indiana and Missouri. He can count on 4/5 of Nebraska, Kansas, & maybe SD.

I have to say that this is about the only thing i agree with him on. Ethanol is a terrible idea. Not that i trust him to maintain the position into next week...

flstf

I think McCain's campaign realizes that their run for the president is all but lost and are now trying to shore up support with the base to salvage as many of the down ticket as possible. His dismissive remarks about women's health in regards to abortion policy will probably not go over very well with independents but the religious right will agree with him.

tisonlyi

Yeah, I take that on board, but afaik he's only a few points up... I reckoned, rightly or wrongly, that a good few points would be lost in the booth to a touch of secret racism... Just wondered what someone who is, perhaps, a bit of an insider? would consider as the amount of points you lose in the midwest for sticking it to their economy...

__________________
"I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place." - Winston Churchill, 1937 --{ORLY?}--

Lasereth

I'm a Republican and McCain obviously won the debate. I'm a Democrat and Obama obviously won the debate.

Debate discussion in general is worthless because each side will say the other side got slaughtered just to try to get him in office. These debates are nothing more than proving if the candidates can publicly speak (which is good) and reinforcing the crappy fake commercials that air on every channel now saying the other side is a terrorist/idiot.

guyy

Just about all the Democrats around here (Wisconsin) are pro-ethanol. I guess they think it's win-win: look pro-farmer and alt fuel/green. I think the assumptions behind this are flawed. For one, even in these states the number of farmers is small and shrinking. Concentration of capital has given us large corporate farms with underpaid undocumented workers. And from the other side, ethanol is at best faux-green.

In any event, Obama has substantial leads in many of these states. The last poll from Wisconsin has Obama up by 17% and McCain has given up (no adverts after Tuesday). Michigan, Iowa, Illinois are similarly hopeless. I suppose being against ethanol might hurt McC in ND. It won't matter too much in Indiana. In sum, i don't think McCain had much to lose by coming out against it.

tisonlyi

It's all theatre, like the rest of politics, but still... You can only browse porn for so long.

__________________
"I do not agree that the dog in a manger has the final right to the manger even though he may have lain there for a very long time. I do not admit that right. I do not admit for instance, that a great wrong has been done to the Red Indians of America or the black people of Australia. I do not admit that a wrong has been done to these people by the fact that a stronger race, a higher-grade race, a more worldly wise race to put it that way, has come in and taken their place." - Winston Churchill, 1937 --{ORLY?}--

Derwood

the "no fine" moment was the best. McCain looked a) flustered, then b) like he wanted to kill his fact checkers

filtherton

I wasn't aware that the McCain campaign employed fact checkers.

roachboy

i tried to watch this debate, i really did. but i found that after even a few second of it, i got really really interested in the phillies game again.

__________________
a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle
spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear

it make you sick.

-kamau brathwaite

hunnychile

...........still chuckling over that one!


McCain looked and sounded flustered and desperate. His 4 "sound bites" were repeated at least a dozen times.

__________________
"I need compassion, understanding and chocolate." - NJB

Paq

http://images.dailykos.com/images/us...ain_buggin.gif

Seriously...he hears "Let me tell you the fine for joe the plumber..ZERO" and mccain acts surprised....

then mccain goes on to talk about how obama would fine joe the plumber..
-----Added 16/10/2008 at 10 : 26 : 21-----
my fave commentator: "2/3 of the people thought mccain was running a negative campaign..and mccain spent 90 minutes trying to convince the other 1/3"

__________________
Live.

Chris