Rekna

In the last year the Dow has fallen around 40% in the last week it has fallen 23%. It is clear that our economy is in trouble. My question to you all is how much have you lost in the last year? Have any of you decided to pull your money out of stocks in the last year?

Myself i'm fortunate. I'm to busy working on my schooling to invest in the stock market so instead I put savings into high yield savings accounts (3-5%). Being the nature of a savings account I cannot lose money and instead only not gain it.


A co-worker of mine has been working for the University for many years and he commented yesterday that for the first time ever his 401k is worth less than he has put into it.

This is scary.

abaya

In the last year, we have lost 50% of the value of our savings due to the fall in value of the Icelandic kronur. If ktsp had not decided to convert what was left of it (the 50%) into USD and EUR last week, we would have lost damn near all of it, given what the live market exchange rates are right now (and what the Icelandic government refuses to make public). So we're lucky to get away with what we have. Luckily, we do not invest in US stocks.... I haven't lost any money in my CD's and other FDIC-insured accounts, thank god.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

snowy

Zero. One of the minor perks of having no money to lose.

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If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

Rekna

I want to add another question to this thread. Where will you be investing your money in the future? Savings, stocks, bonds, etc?

ASU2003

I've lost around $5,000. I haven't put any new money into the stock market in the past 18 months though (except for my 401k and company stock, both are doing better than the average).

What's scary is how the market is setup on emotions instead of logic and performance... And another strike against privatizing social security in a just put it all in stocks and hope it goes up 8% each year type of way.

And I'm not hurting at all. I know there are people that have lost lots.

ktspktsp

ISK/Euro a year ago: 85
ISK/Euro a month ago: 127
ISK/Euro on October 1st: 157 (this is when I converted our Icelandic savings to foreign currencies)
ISK/Euro now: 305 (You cannot buy foreign currencies at the bank anymore. Or send money out of Iceland. It's all frozen. But this was the rate at mid-day today according to the the European Central Bank website which lists the inter-bank rates)

I could say we lost half the value of our savings, but for now the money is basically frozen so we don't even have that. So we'll have to see.

I have a small 401K in the US but I have no idea what's in it. Probably not much right now :P

abaya

I will never put my money in the Giant Casino known as stocks. CD's have served me well for most of my life... perhaps the pay-off is not as high, but I am not a high-risk person when it comes to money, whatsoever. It's about security, to me. Having a mother addicted to gambling will do that to you.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

Charlatan

I have some money in a mutual fund in Canada as part of my RRSP. I haven't looked at it and don't plan to. It is meant as a long term investment. If it has dropped in value, which I am sure it has, I don't want to know. It will rebound by the time I need it.

I have the rest in laddered CDs.

I might put some in some more Mutual Funds. The prices are lower right now. They will go up.

__________________
"My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars."
- Old Man Luedecke

Willravel

I lost a bit on my left over Apple stocks, but that has more to do with Steve Jobs' health issues.

Now, if BofA has problems I could start to lose real money. I know I've lost a lot of house value, but that's theoretical.

PonyPotato

None, really. I don't even have a savings account at the moment (two checking accounts and I haven't opened a savings account because I don't have enough extra money at the moment to start the kind of account I want).

Now, I've lost about $500-600 in vet bills on my horse in the last two weeks. For three vet visits to solve a problem that should have taken ONE. The vet who came out the first two times will NOT EVER get any more of my business. EVER.

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"Without passion man is a mere latent force and possibility, like the flint which awaits the shock of the iron before it can give forth its spark."
— Henri-Frédéric Amiel

ratbastid

I shudder to think. I don't even want to look at my 401(k). I set it up and forget it--I don't even know how to check its value, except when they mail me quarterly statements. But I'm sure it took a good hit.

Strangely, the latest assessment has our house about $80k up from when we bought it in 2005. So that ought to more than offset what I lost in the market, if it's true and it sticks around.

highthief

About 35% on both the RRSPs (retirement) and RESPs (kids education). Fortunately, both have long time horizons so plenty of time to make it back (I hope!)

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Si vis pacem parabellum.

Seaver

I have 10% of my income (with matching 4%) set to high-risk 401k. I've lost 50% of the total worth, but to be honest I could care less. I'm 40 years from retirement, all this means is I get lots more stock for the same amount of money. Honestly my only concern is keeping my job.

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"Smite the rocks with the rod of knowledge, and fountains of unstinted wealth will gush forth." - Ashbel Smith as he laid the first cornerstone of the University of Texas

The_Jazz

Overall, I'm down about 10%, although it could have been a whole lot worse. I got some good, timely advice and took it. That said, I'm actively looking for bargains and trying to decide if the car companies are going to survive or not. If they are, it's the steal of the century.

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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - B. Franklin
"There ought to be limits to freedom." - George W. Bush
"We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo

ratbastid

That's really the thing, for those of us under 40 or so. The economy WILL recover, and even if it takes a decade or two, we'll come out of it strong by the time we're retiring.

It's the folks in their late 50s like my parents that are in real trouble.

clavus

Since January 1 of this year -

nearly SEVENTY THOUSAND MOTHERFUCKING DOLLARS

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Ass, gas or grass. Nobody rides for free.

ngdawg

Gee, thanks for making me feel really old.....

Cynthetiq

I'm afraid to look....

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snowy

My dad is apparently older than your dad.

At any rate, my parents are on the verge of retirement. But they've got most of their money tied up in real estate that, contrary to the current market, is retaining or gaining value. Their only major investments are a series of CDs. Their retirement is guaranteed by the State of Washington, one of the benefits of being a public employee in these times. The only thing that's going to hurt is the decreased value of their IRA, but that was supposed to be their extra fun money anyways, and most of it is an inheritance from my grandfather.

So Dad is going to work another year, which increases his retirement payment, and further closes the gap between retirement and collecting a Social Security check. His only worry is selling his current house, but they're quite content to wait out the market and sit on it a few years, as the second house (the house I'm in) is easily rentable, given its location in a college town and proximity to the university itself. It also gives them more time to put more "sweat equity" into their current home.

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If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

ASU2003

It's the people 50-60 that really could get screwed. I mean, even if the economy doesn't come back (Maybe if we ran out of oil, but not due to a credit issue), I could still see myself doing fine.

pan6467

SILVER

THE AFFORDABLE METAL.

Gold is way too unaffordable for me now... but SILVER is always in high demand and extremely low even today.

I do a lot of stone work and jewelry so I'm investing heavily {all I can afford} into SILVER and probably some Copper and lesser metals like Argentium. Plus, stones like Amethyst, Citrine, Kyanite, Malachite, Azurite, Opal and so on.

But I've made decent money buying silver the past few years. It's gone down a bit this year but I expected that. I was buying it at 5 bucks an ounce a few years ago.... and just waiting.... still buying it when I can and waiting. I see it hitting a 30 dollar high within a year or two.

If money ever falters the metals and stones should work for awhile.

__________________
I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

samcol

Yes this is what I've been buying (gold and silver). I don't trust these bankers any further than I can throw them and I dont feel like I have a big enough understanding in the stock market to play that game.

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It's time for the president to hand over his nobel peace prize.

ratbastid

My parents are kicking ass, ngdawg, and so are you.

Dammitall

Don't ask...

Yesterday I liquidated my small but long-suffering stock portfolio. These were the leftovers of investments my parents had made on my behalf years ago and stupidly I was never really involved in that process. Dumping those stocks is something I should have done months and months ago. Thankfully I should be able to write off the losses from my taxes for the next few years, but ugh.

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If one million people replaced a two mile car trip once a week with a bike ride, carbon dioxide emissions would be reduced by 50,000 tons per year. If one out of ten car commuters switched to a bike, carbon dioxide emissions would be reduced by 25.4 million tons per year. [2milechallenge.com]

Rekna

I thought about buying gold and silver but I have to wonder if that is a good idea. It seems to me that one of the primary uses of gold and silver is jewelry. If the economy goes into depression the demand on jewelry would drop greatly and thus the value of those two metals would also drop. Their price seems to be to elastic to me. Copper on the other hand might be good depending on how elastic/inelastic the demand is on that metal.

Maybe the best thing for us to invest in is canned goods and a storage closet

remy1492

I am 32 and (last I checked) had $50,000+ in my roth IRAs. I am not even going to look. Like the others, it will go back up and looking will only ruin my day. I too just want to keep my job. (military, so I wont exactly lose it right away but military receives cuts in hard times too).

pan6467

Canned goods and storing water by the barrel....

My feeling is gold, silver, even copper have never been worthless. There will always be someone who will be willing to trade or barter for them, because times always get better. Same with land, but it's too expensive right now, for me. Those are the things wars are fought over. Gold, Silver, gems and land. No matter how bad times get they always have value.

Te people who think long term and are not easily sent into frenzy will buy stocks in companies now and everyday as the market declines. Why? Because eventually it goes back up.

IF you play the market:

I looked at the crash in '29. That doesn't tell the story. On July 1st, 1929 the market hit a high 343. Then it fell. April 1st, 1932 it bottomed at 42.84.

Then it climbed back. It went back up and it took 22 years, July 1st 1954 to get over the 343.... closed 360. From there it has pretty much gone up... some valleys but never a true sustained fall.

I have also observed that throughout history, one thing becomes very strong, nationalism. Which in turn leads to wars. Which in turn leads to better economies. Now, if we can take out the wars and just get to the rebuilding part.... everyone will be okay.

Just hold onto your stocks. If you have a company you don't like but you do like one cheaper, sell the one you have that you think will not make it and buy the cheaper one, you think will make it, with that money.

The biggest thing is to be smart. In reality you lose NOTHING until and ONLY UNTIL you sell. Just like you have no profit until and only until you sell.

The 2 biggest problems on Wall Street and in the stock market are: the institutional computer programmed buys and sells.... because they see blips and react according to their program. So they will continue to sell as the market goes down, thus forcing the market to continue falling. The other is the nervous investor who put his future on the market and pulls out because he is scared. Thus, creating more of a selling atmosphere, thus pulling the market lower, setting off more institutional computers to sell, lowering the market getting people scared to sell and take a loss... and right now we could very well be in that form of a cycle.

But the smart money knows, you just wait it out. Buy as people panic. Hold onto what you have and use this market to your advantage.

Let's say I bought 10 shares of X 2 years ago at 10. 100 bucks I have in. It started to fall....

at 7 I buy 10 more shares now I have 20 shares with 170 invested.... my average is now 8.5 a share.

it falls again.... at 5 I buy 20 shares now I have 270 in with 40 shares, my average is ... 6.75

Today X is trading at 2..... I know X is a strong company and will eventually comeback.... if it doesn't well I am only out what I have in... so I'll buy 60 shares.

Now, I am sitting on 100 shares of X.... valued at 200, but I have 390 in. My average is now 39 a share. Now.... I wait.

As X goes up, I buy 100 at 3. 200 shares with 690 in, my average is now 3.45 a share.

So I sit and when X climbs back over 3.45 I have made profit. If I had been selling at each down tick tho... I would have kept losing.

That is how the market should be played. Buying as it is going down, accepting the loss but knowing when it goes back up your losses will be gains and in the very worst case if the stock totally never goes up or zeroes.... you only lose what you have in. And it's like Vegas, baby. You only go into the market with what you can afford to lose.

Bank stocks right now are plum for the picking. RBS maybe a good one to consider. Fifth Third is definitely one bank stock to grab a hold of. Bank of America will e going down more but should bottom out soon. National City and KeyCorp I would watch closely. Start buying small shares and wait. National City is probably going to sell out. Key may but they aren't in that bad of shape.

GM and Ford also.... buy as they go down, they are damn close to rock bottom and will go back up.

Look at companies that will thrive in a depression and buy into them. Campbell's soup is always a smart buy.

Point is if you don't like what you are holding sell and buy something that is losing stock value but will eventually go back up.

Think LONG TERM... if you panic easily, sell everything take your money out of the bank and put it in your mattress. Because in the end if the market truly bottoms out.... our money will probably be as worthless as the stocks you pulled out of but you have extra padding to sleep more comfortably on.

And if you have nerves of steel keep buying. Because if it does go back up, you will have a very very nice nest egg for yourself, and you didn't have to spend much.

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I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

ShaniFaye

I was the same way until yesterday lol I finally called Vanguard to find out how to login online to see my account...I have to say it wasnt nearly as bad as I thought it was going to be....I'd lost 1700 dollars since the last quarterly statement (June).

As I said in the other thread, Im not in a panic....I still have time and Im sure in the next 22 years it will rebound lol

Its my parents Im worried about

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I want the diabetic plan that comes with rollover carbs. I dont like the unused one expiring at midnite!!

Baraka_Guru

Yeah, I guess we're the real winners here, eh?



Never mind.

Anyway, I hope for those of you with investments (using advisors or not) that you had the discipline to have some of your portfolios parked in cash, in addition to other protective measures. The smart advisors out there have known that something like this was coming and have been vocal about it. And now they're out there bargain hunting.

Now I have to get back to worrying about having nothing to lose.

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Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
—From "Burnt Norton," Four Quartets (1936), T. S. Eliot

Yakk

I don't think any of my investment blocks are at lower values than the average price at which I purchased them. (Naturally, money I put in over the last few years has a less than 1 ROI).

I have some investment money in basically cash.

I have lost a significant amount off of the peak value of my investments: a good 25% to 35%+.

I'd rather not talk about actual dollar values. :-)

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Last edited by JHVH : 10-29-4004 BC at 09:00 PM. Reason: Time for a rest.

Jinn

I set up my 401k two weeks ago, at 15% with 6% matching 50 cents on the dollar. It's supposed to 'activate' two to four weeks after setup, so I'm hopefully getting in on the very bottom with lots of room to grow.

__________________
"I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel

pan6467

I kind of agree and disagree about worrying for our parents.

First, if they had invested 25 years ago when the market was real low anything they have now is pure profit.

Unless, they borrowed on the profit as it came. That is what a lot of people did. They saw the market they invested in increase so their paper value increased so they mortgaged that profit into credit. As long as the profit out runs the credit you are fine.

But if you get caught mortgaging profit as the profit decreases, and your credit tightens it leads us to where we as a country are.

The Boomers don't have much to worry about, they are in power, won't hand it over easily and have always made sure they have theirs ..... even if it meant destroying the future generations.

My fear is for my son's generation and his childrens generation. in the end they will be the ones faced with all the debt from the baby boomers and perhaps us 1 or 2 generations removed.

__________________
I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

ShaniFaye

um how does it make it any better that the money the are living on is profit from 25 years ago? Its still money they live on and its still disappearing. The fact that it was invested 25 years ago doesnt really change the fact that their retirement accounts are being depleted at a horrible rate.

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I want the diabetic plan that comes with rollover carbs. I dont like the unused one expiring at midnite!!

pan6467

No it doesn't make it any easier. And we may have to take our parents in.

To me the Baby Boomer generation was the biggest self centered narcissistic generation since the Jazz Age.

During their watch this country became extremely greedy, more corrupt and for the past 20 years the generation that retired before them cried how they barely had enough to eat, had to take part time jobs at places like Wal Mart as greeters or work at McDonald's {because they could not afford to live... yet if they worked full time they would lose their benefits from Social Security}.

That generation made EVERYTHING possible for the Boomers and my generation. In the end when it came time for them to enjoy their retirement, many had to sell their houses, get those part time jobs and worry about finances. Meanwhile, the Boomers kept pushing greed and sayings like "he who dies with the most toys wins". The Boomers went from free love to divorce to "I spilt coffee on me, I'm suing, because I can't admit I fucked up and tried to drive with a cup of fucking hot coffee between my legs."

The Boomer generation was in it for "what can you give ME." And now, nw we are paying for it.

Am I sour? No. IMHO, the Boomers had over the past 20 years to figure out a retirement that worked. Instead they chose to keep playing games, push greed and "what's in it for me". They did nothing to help the generation before them, they stole from generations after them and it is catching up to them.

Karma for the generation is a bitch.

Unfortunately, there are many innocents in that generation that bought into what they were told and they invested in stocks for their retirements and maybe bought rentals.... but they also took out second mortgages and in the past 10 years when everyone could see financial troubles coming, they continued to elect greedy assed people who promised them everything. f people stood up and said "hey our infrastructure is falling apart because there is no money being invested into building new bridges and fixing the inner cities" they were ignored by the Boomers. "WE NEED TAX CUTS."

When people said, "hey, where's our manufacturing base? How are we going to afford shit without a manufacturing base and people working for a living wage?" They were ignored by the boomers. "WE NEED TAX CUTS."

When people were saying 20, 10 and even 5 years ago..... retirees are having to reverse mortgage, are having to work part time jobs to make it, are eating cat food...... the Boomers ignored it. "WE NEED TAX CUTS".

30+ years ago..... "we need to invest in alternative fuels"..... "Screw you WE NEED TAX BREAKS AND DON'T EVEN THINK OF DRILLING OFFSHORE BECAUSE WE DON'T WANT OUR BEACHES RUINED...."

Now, the Boomers are ready to retire and that big balloon they kept pumping up but never took time to see if it could hold all the air, is exploding.... they are still wanting everything and wanting to give nothing back.

The truth is the income tax rate {especially for the wealthy} is at one of the lowest points ever. BUT, there is no manufacturing base, no good paying jobs to pick up the slack. So government goes more into debt. Without good paying jobs and a busted, unaffordable educational system here, people look for the cheapest items to buy. We lose manufacturing more tax flow more good paying jobs.... so the Leaders said, "we're fucked. SubPrime lending, open up equity loans on homes, and so on." So they did.... but we continued to not do a damned thing to rebuild a strong manufacturing base, rebuild our infrastructure, or find ways to get good paying jobs back.....

In turn, people lost more jobs, people got paid less.... loans were made to people who could not afford the payments.... defaults and foreclosures resulted.

Banks don't want to take the hit, the leaders don't want to tell he Boomers they were a selfish bunch.... so bailouts hoping that that will keep all this from happening.... but it didn't because we still lack the necessary tools for correction.... a solid tax base from manufacturing and decent waged jobs.

Do the innocent deserve this? What did the innocent do to prevent this? To say you didn't see it coming when people have been yelling this was going to happen for the past 2 decades and you chose to buy Japanese cars, invest in the stock market but have no idea how it works, buy buy buy, run up your credit, don't save, buy every nice little toy out there, and so on...... then how innocent are you, really?

I's time to pay the piper and no one wants to because they don't want to give up all the nice toys and greed they lived for. They knew someone would have to pay for it eventually, they just never truly thought it would be them.

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I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

dc_dux

Wow..and I thought the baby boomers (born after WWII through the early 60s) were the ones who led the civil rights movement, the environmental movement, the social justice movement, the anti-war movement.....

I'm at the tail end of the baby boomers and I think your characterization of blaming an entire generation is a gross exaggeration.

But anyway, I've lost a fair amount in my 401(k) but I have also planned reasonably well with a balanced and diversified portfolio.

__________________
"The perfect is the enemy of the good."
~ Voltaire

pan6467

In the 60's and early 70's they did. They also had great leaders and inspirational people like MLK Jr., JFK, Bobby Kennedy, John Lennon, Nader, and so on.

But in the 70's {the "ME" decade} that changed. They had a taste for POWER, and with that POWER instead of continuing to change for the better.... they became greedy, narcissistic and "what's in it for me?". Hippies became Yuppies.

And then somewhere during Reagan...... ASK NOT WHAT YOUR COUNTRY CAN DO FOR YOU, ASK WHAT YOU CAN DO FOR YOUR COUNTRY..... WE ARE THE TORCH BEARERS FOR A BETTER SOCIETY THAT WILL BETTER THE WORLD..... became..... GREED IS GOOD..... TAX BREAKS..... CHEAPER GOODS FROM COUNTRIES WITH NO HUMAN RIGHTS SO WE CAN BUY MORE.

Instead of "GIVE PEACE A CHANCE.... ALL YOU NEED IS LOVE", their creeds became "Touch mine I'll break your fucking head and sue your ass...... He who dies with the most toys wins...... and so on".

Name just 10 prominent boomers still around today {people born in the US from 1946 to 1965} that still follow the teachings of MLK Jr, JFK, Bobby, Lennon.... and so on.

Just 10.

__________________
I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

dc_dux

pan....I cant do it with a straight face when you put John Lennon in the same category as MLK, JFK, RFK, etc.

__________________
"The perfect is the enemy of the good."
~ Voltaire

pan6467

Then take Lennon out. Or I can. To many of that time he was extremely inspirational. He wasn't JFK, MLK, RFK.... but he was up there in many people's eyes. He was extremely influential in the war movement. He was a major reason rock musicians were able to become socially active. Without Lennon there never would have been Bono.



TO THE MODS: CAN WE PLEASE MOVE MY LAST 2 POSTS {AND THIS ONE} TO A NEW THREAD SO AS NOT TO THREADJACK THIS ONE??????

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I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

dc_dux

pan...I'll give you just example, in the mode of Lennon, but far more accomplished in his humanitarian efforts and positive impact on world politics and social justice:

Bono.

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"The perfect is the enemy of the good."
~ Voltaire

pan6467

Not A US born Baby Boomer and without Lennon.... there'd be no Bono. Probably no Geldof, or Sting either.

Just 10 prominent US born baby boomers that have put MLK, JFK, RFK and so on teachings ahead of their greed and power.

Just 10.

__________________
I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"