Shh.... we want the conservatives to start putting a value in education and intelligence.

Heck yeah it does! :) Mike wants to ignore the significant portion of the Western United States that votes Democratic, I suppose.

I scored 11/12 on the NewsIQ quiz. I underestimated the number of U.S. dead in Iraq. :(

I scored pretty high too, but I'm not some sort of political genius or anything, I just happen to discuss it from time to time. I really shouldn't be in the 97th percentile. There should be a lot of people way more aware than I am. :sad:

Nope you're wrong. That's how I read.


So democrats aren't left coast/right coast elitists?

Why don'tcha tell us how you really feel, Mike? :)

Apparently the TFP is way more informed than the average population... interesting. I also got 11/12, missed the Dow average.

I was disappointed to see that women did so much more poorly than men. I wonder why that is, seriously. I commented to ktsp once that I very rarely see women on buses, subways, etc reading newspapers... usually they are reading magazines, which tend to have less substance (on average). What do you all think? Do you notice a lot of women reading newspapers in your area?

Beat ya by 1%, I'm guessing that has more to do with the number test takers at the time of each of our tests then our score.

I did think twice about the Dow. And Kosovo kind of threw me, but only because I miss interpreted a previous post.

that's kinda offensive since you know, all the redneck, inbred religious nuts in west virginia who won't vote for a black guy be "well, we don't trust the coloreds' are a huge portion of republicans...

yea, this could get nasty :) let's just say both parties have their fair share of uneducated people, just that some are inner city urban dwellers and some live 'off the paved road'

(no real offense intended ot those from Wva, i like the state, but that one interview stuck out in my head just now)

:(. 10/12 with several good guesses.

I'm not very well-informed, I suppose :\

Me neither. I read up on current events some but I'm certainly not an expert. But at the same time I'm not surprised unfortunately.

The only reason I scored 12/12 was because I happened to read an article about the Dow Jones today... I never follow the Dow Jones that closely.

Why would they deny it? The population of the US is large and diverse it only makes sense that both parties would have a good portion of undereducated supporters. And while the democrats might be proportionately more urban, the republicans are likely more proportionately rural.

The thing is, neither undereducated group is running either party.

Conspiracy theorists are already on watch for evidence of Palin wearing a wire during the debate.

I on the other hand am beginning to think that the debate won't be able to live up to the hype.

i am beginning to feel like ignatius p. reilly, finding so many things idiotic, an offense against all taste and geometry.


edited next day: dont post after a few beers if you're feeling cranky.
that's the moral of this story.

I scored 10/12. I underestimated the dead in Iraq and didn't know the senate majority leader name. I'm dissapointed in myself :(

I can't wait to see the debate on Thursday - I'm gonna record it so I can watch the Canadian leaders debate as well.

What it's like to debate Sarah Palin

this is really disturbing about what is really going to happen on the debates. Palin's going to appear genial and spin stories, etc, answer very little and come off looking great while not saying anything. the issue is: will the people buy the fluff? Personally, i think biden should obliterate her. as i once heard: play to win..if you're playing your own grandmother and the score is 5 to 4, then you should play to beat her 50 to 4.

That says it all. Interesting article, paq.

I find it unreal (I must be dreaming) that so much of this country actually stands behind candidates like this. They call it bashing when we question the capabilities of someone who could potentially run this country? We wouldn't want to hurt her feelings. :orly:

What a wonderful welcome to politics and what a stunning role model for our young girls in this new millennium.

what set me off last night was the appearance of a new and improved version of the old conservative canard of "the liberal media" which is now being set up as an "explanation" for the treatment sarah palin's been getting in the press. it appeared across the vehcile of that cnn asshat lou dobbs, who talked about it with a straight face while sitting in front of an american flag. approving commentary was provided by one of the dutiful lackies of the right brought to you by the heritage foundation ("what would reagan do?")

this blog from salon does a good job demolishing this idiocy and provides a little more information about palin-in-alaskan-politics.

Sarah Palin and Mark Halperin's complaints of "liberal media" - Glenn Greenwald - Salon.com

it's too long to bite here.
because it's a blog, i would invite you to check the sources linked.

the palin style of actually governing is alarming...far more than is her seeming inability to answer a question.

roach, i swear i read that exact post somewhere. something about lou dobbs and the heritage foundation saying "the liberal media is treating palin unfairly' followed by a poll something like "should the liberal media treat palin more fairly' or some stupid shit. at any rate, i have to say, take off the kid's gloves bc man or woman, NO LEADER OF A FOREIGN COUNTRY CARES AND WILL ALTER THEIR STANCE bc you put a woman up.

they didn't have kid's gloves with clinton..obama..mccain...quayle...bush sr...clinton...gingrich...so why should she get any different treatment. I don't get this whole "oo, i'm a woman' thing. You're vying to be in line for the 2nd most powerful person..in..the.freaking..world. If you can't handle someone saying "maybe you don't know the issues...maybe you're unprepared' then get the fuck out. this is getting ridiculous.

perhaps someone should bring up the sexist argument. it's quite sexist to assume that any media outlet is being unfair to her. it's also quite sexist for the campaign to hold her in a box. we need to know what she's about in order to vote for or against her. McCain is certainly losing in his judgement argument.

thankfully, Biden already said he wouldn't be wearing kiddie gloves. let's just hope he doesn't become the wind bag gaffe that he can be sometimes.

Heyyyyyy now, Ahmadinejad's all about the kid gloves... especially when it comes to women. :rolleyes:

seriously, i don't get it, are we going to protect her from the world if she becomes pres? Hell, give me clinton, i know she'll bust some balls....palin would smile and ..do what, exactly?

are we so far behind that we really have to alter how we deal with a political figure bc of race or sex...seriously? I don't even see obama getting much press on his race..i mean, did you know he's half white :)

of course we've come to this point.. look.. when it comes to radio and television.. the conservatives pay the freight so to speak.. so naturally we'll see the spin on their side. Notice that douche bag Glenn Beck has become more and more conservative by the day? There's a reason for that.

This is simple attempt by people who support the McCain camp to get more attention back on Palin. She "energizes" voters.. McCain makes them go to sleep.. hopefully, though, people will see beyond the fluff and all the Moose burgers and see what's really there.

i have noticed glenn went from "eh, i don't agree with him on much, but ok" to "holy fucknuts, is he channeling hannity, limbaugh and oreilly in one???"

i was very VERY glad people saw through mccain's "I"m going to suspend my campaign and fix the economy' stunt....very happy, kinda surprised, but it gives me "Hope"

It's kind of hard not to see through that stunt when his own party asks him to leave and the fuckwads can't even get to the floor knowing they have the votes..and then blame it on a supposedly hyper-partisan speech.

:rolleyes: At this point, given the economic issues.. I really can't see McCain doing anything.. I'd even to venture that his campaign is dead in the water.

but what do I know? I'm not a conservative.. :rolleyes:
-----Added 1/10/2008 at 03 : 45 : 04-----
oh and now we have an issue with the debate moderator. :rolleyes: The moderator has a book coming out about politics and race.. and naturally the McCain camp didn't know about it. Like she's going to ask questions that help Obama.. seriously.

Ifill's book was no secret - Yahoo! News

Leave it to Faux News to make a big deal about this

Hypocrites much?

Flip the Ifill scenario and see how you feel about it. Bloody murder would be screamed if "that douche bag Glenn Beck" was moderator. Ifill has a vested and financial interest in the successful election of Obama. I believe it is reasonable to also claim a conflict of interest for iFill to preside.

It shouldn't be a big deal... just reassign one of her colleagues the task. The appearance of objectivity is all that's really necessary.

the problem with this wrangling is that it's public. because it's public, it's theater. because it's theater, it isn't going to be read as transparent, and so it looks like the mc-cain campaign is trying to get someone self-evidently sympathetic to a conservative outlook to "moderate" the debate. but if the campaign's really concerned, and if it imagines that it actually had the possibility of changing the moderation--as if that matters---you'd think they'd play this in a backchannel manner. so the fact that it's public seems to indicate that there's no hope of this happening, and what's being set up is a proactive tactic aimed at providing an explanation for failure.

Not hard. The next presidential debate is being hosted by Tom Brokaw, NBC's liaision to the McCain campaign and spreader of McCain lies on Meet the Press. Do you hear many liberals complaining about it?

To me the Ifill thing does kind of smell funny. So far playing the victim is the only thing Palin has done well. This Ifill situation is simply one more set up for her to play that role. I'd sure like to stop giving this women ready made excuses for when she falls on her face. The other day it was "it's all gotcha journalism" Then it was "that doesn't count the question came from a voter." Seems like everyday it's "the media's all "mean" to her." Yeah they're mean, they ask her questions and she give nonsensical answers. Damned evil media. Hell call someone like Bob Schieffer and see if he's free that night.

I hate the thought of giving her and the McCain camp one more excuse why her answers make no sense.

Seriously can you imagine if Obama stared blankly when asked about SCOTUS cases other then Roe V. Wade? Or answered "Magazines and newspapers? Oh, I read them all, you know any that are put in front of me." It'd be on a 15 minute loop 24/7 for a week on Fox.

Bob Schieffer moderated one of the debates in 04. It was well known that he had long standing social ties to the Bush family and that he was a frequent personal golfing buddy of GW. In fact, Bush appointed Schieffer's brother to be ambassador to Australia in his first term, and ambassador to Japan after his reelection. He and McCain go back together a long way as well, with Schieffer being an enthusiastic traveler on the "straight talk express".....btw, Schieffer will moderate the last debate.

In any case, Iffil should make some disclaimer at the start of the debate.

dc - Regarding the relationship with Schieffer to GW or McCain, I don't see the parallel with Ifill standing to benefit substantially from book sales if Obama wins. It's like Pete Rose betting on Reds games.

I agree that appearances of cronyism should not have been tolerated if that truly was the case with Schieffer. The ambassadorship to his brother could be questionalble, but two of my siblings are opposites politically to my little sister and me. Bob Schieffer's brother could have earned that all on his own... who knows? So I have difficulty seeing the Schieffer analogy as being equal, but give points on the appearance of some kind of relationship.

If the McCain camp is OK with an Ifill disclaimer, then I think that would be fine. It could make things more interesting depending on the questioning and performance of the candidates.

-----Added 1/10/2008 at 07 : 49 : 48-----
Tom Brokaw is an evil white conservative. :thumbsup:

Well, not to mention that the book has been public knowledge since at least July, before McCain agreed to her as the moderator. If he's not going to do a minimal amount of research on the moderator's background before he agrees to her as moderator, he has no grounds for complaint the day before the debate.

I am posting this..but i'm going to have to take it all in...this is the 2nd time i've seen it and i'm still just in awe...i have to pick my jaw up off the floor...again

Right, she can sell it to the Democratic base that, according to reconmike, is uneducated.

umm
if you're talking about mccain doing research....

ummmmmmmmmm....did you see who he chose for vp and how much he researched her?>

Look, it's obvious that Ifill has some vested interest in OBAMA. She has not interest in Biden. It doesn't matter if Obama looses or wins..the book will still sell because it's about the race lines being broken in politics..not how great and mighty and powerful Obama is ;)

This is just a sad attempt for the McCain camp to downplay any expectations and it gives the republican spin room ample ammunition in case she fucks up majorly. "She would have done a better job if there was a different moderator asking the questions. She did great considering that fact" :rolleyes:

This isn't the first time (as so clearly defined above) that moderators have ties with candidates.. and I'd venture to say that it's more damaging to have a personal relationship with the candidate than having a vested interest in the candidate.. come to think of it.. WE ALL have a vested interest in the candidates.

..and this whole uneducated base thing.. I don't even want to comment on something so ignorant.

Wow, this reads like a fresh story covering the recently finished debate.

sprocket..no kidding, i can barely tell the diff between willravel's page and exactly what i saw on tv and from the analysts. She was trying too hard to sound folksy, look cute, and deliver SCRIPTED MEMORIZED lines about as well as your average 3rd grade actor on stage.

my favorite: "what is your Achilles heel" "my executive experience will be used effectively" or some shit like that. complete...complete disregarding the question..when a question was asked that she didn't have an answer for, she'd simply change the question to something she knew. 'i want to continue talking about taxes" Nobody had mentioned taxes.

seriously, it played out about like i expected, expectations were so low for her that this is being touted as a win by some.....msnbc put it as "a tie for palin is like a win'....
so far, al the polls i'm seeing show biden as the winner, but i'm sure it will be construed as a win for whomever someone liked before the debate.


Oh, last thing...her "You betcha's" and "bless their hearts' and the "maverick" lines...just sounded forced..like a constipated poodle.

I suppose it's not done for a moderator to pull the "repeat the question" trick?

It's what a few journalists here have done in the past with public figures that give non-answers, effectively calling them out on their bullshit answers?

NUK U LAR

She looked at her notecards way to much but no real big flubs. I really like the way Biden did, he took aim at McCain and didn't let up. As far as personal "moments" when he was talking about being a single father after losing his wife and child, it really connected, cause it was truly from the heart and not a play like Palin tries to make it.

I didn't know much about Biden other than he's been a long term congessman, after this debate I feel better about Biden. Palin still scares me, I don't want "Joe six-pack" in the White House, mayor six-pack is OK and Governor six-pack may be OK, but President six-pack no thanks..

Shouldn't she had said "Joan six-pack"?

HATE OUR FREEDUMB

Turns out she's George Bush in lipstick.