03-27-2008, 05:56 AM | #361 (permalink) | |||
let me be clear
Location: Waddy Peytona
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BTW, thanks for the backhanded compliment. But if Hillary is hiring, she absolutely needs someone to help keep her embellishments (lies) and distortions organized. Perhaps you can find an application on her website. Quote:
Someone left ratbastid's echo chamber on. Quote:
For the Dems ... perhaps these two will self-destruct and out of the smoke strolls in good old wacky Al Gore. Reality TV could not write a better script. Wow ... just found an article eluding to such a possiblity. Is Al Gore the Answer? http://www.time.com/time/politics/ar...725678,00.html McCain ... ehhhh ... oh well. Hopefully a sobering review of politics will bring maturity and civility back to the art of backstabbing and deal making.
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"It rubs the lotion on Buffy, Jodi and Mr. French's skin" - Uncle Bill from Buffalo Last edited by ottopilot; 03-27-2008 at 08:42 AM.. Reason: Automerged Doublepost |
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03-27-2008, 06:48 AM | #362 (permalink) | |||
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Location: Chicago
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Le temps détruit tout "Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling |
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03-27-2008, 06:51 AM | #363 (permalink) |
Junkie
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I find otto's exuberance interesting. It's been a while since any reasonable conservative had anything to lord over anyone on the left, with the economy being a disaster and the situation in Iraq so clearly being a colossal mistake. Cheers to you, otto, you've finally found something to be proud of... or something.
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03-27-2008, 07:21 AM | #364 (permalink) | |||
let me be clear
Location: Waddy Peytona
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I guess I'm a little exuberant in the sense of how entertaining the players and their apologists have become. The only light moments in the tedious drama of political apologists. The topic is Rev. Wright, racism and the affect on Obama's campaign ... is it not? I'm proud of a lot. However, I'm disappointed in the shallow adoration of Obama and the apologies made for his mistakes. I'm disappointed in people willing to justify racism for any reason. Are you proud of those things? What are you proud of? Stick up for it rather than attempting to guilt someone with smarmy dismissiveness. Regarding the other topics you decided to lump in with and label me as a conservative, I am not a fan of Bush, or happy with the current economy, or any stereotype you would like for me to fall in to. What are you? Your form of reply has become a patterned response mechanism to any negativity toward Obama and you are contributing to the empty rhetoric of the cycle. This is the game ... isn't it? Quote:
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"It rubs the lotion on Buffy, Jodi and Mr. French's skin" - Uncle Bill from Buffalo Last edited by ottopilot; 03-27-2008 at 08:43 AM.. |
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03-27-2008, 09:02 AM | #365 (permalink) |
Her Jay
Location: Ontario for now....
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So otto's favourite catchphrase isn't 'white guilt', it's 'apologists', just so I'm on the right page as to who's using what phrase of the day, you go otto, we shall call you Minitwo....
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Absence makes the heart grow fonder |
03-27-2008, 09:40 AM | #366 (permalink) |
Human
Administrator
Location: Chicago
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So, anyone who agrees with you is following the 'facts' (as you see them, of course), and anyone who disagrees, or points out that apparently plenty of people disagree, has their integrity determined by the news cycle? Are you that incapable of recognizing that, though perhaps shocking to you, there are people who have different opinions than you do?
I posted about the poll numbers not because they tell me that I shouldn't care about Rev. Wright (or, at least, that Obama's speech was a sufficient response to the issue). I posted them, first and foremost, as a response to flstf's post, which was specifically about the effects of this and other controversies on how the voters view the candidates. Secondly, I posted the information because it shows that, clearly, there are plenty of others who would agree with some or all of what ratbastid, filtherton, or I am saying. That's not saying we form our opinions based on what others think, but it is saying that the opinions we're expressing shouldn't be treated like they're shocking statements. There is a difference between forming opinions based on the news cycle and simply being aware of the news.
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Le temps détruit tout "Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling |
03-27-2008, 01:05 PM | #367 (permalink) | |
let me be clear
Location: Waddy Peytona
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Chime in any time.
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"It rubs the lotion on Buffy, Jodi and Mr. French's skin" - Uncle Bill from Buffalo |
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03-27-2008, 01:19 PM | #368 (permalink) |
Asshole
Administrator
Location: Chicago
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Before you make another post that refers to another member AT ALL, reread the Politics Sticky. Any personal attacks after Post #368 will result in an immediate 3-day vacation. So before you type someone's name or use the word "you" or any of it's permutations, make sure that it is in no way a personal attack. Despite our best efforts, this thread is turning into an embarrassment.
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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - B. Franklin "There ought to be limits to freedom." - George W. Bush "We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo |
03-27-2008, 01:29 PM | #369 (permalink) | |
let me be clear
Location: Waddy Peytona
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- the news cycle is a guide for determining whether integrity should continue be questioned? - form opinions based on the news cycle? - if it's no longer in the news, certain events and statements are no longer valid? That's an interested point of view.
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"It rubs the lotion on Buffy, Jodi and Mr. French's skin" - Uncle Bill from Buffalo Last edited by ottopilot; 03-27-2008 at 01:33 PM.. |
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03-27-2008, 01:34 PM | #370 (permalink) |
... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.
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You know, "God damn America" is a stupid thing to say, but not because it isn't patriotic. It's stupid because it was made from a place of emotion instead of reason. It'd be more reasonable to make commentary from a place of facts. "The US is making a mistake by doing..." would have been a more responsible statement. Instead he was just spewing nonsense.
I'm not going to critique his preaching style for religious content (that'd be innapropriate for an atheist), but he'd do well to give his position the respect it deserves. |
03-27-2008, 01:36 PM | #371 (permalink) | |
Pissing in the cornflakes
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Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps. |
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03-27-2008, 01:40 PM | #373 (permalink) | ||
let me be clear
Location: Waddy Peytona
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"It rubs the lotion on Buffy, Jodi and Mr. French's skin" - Uncle Bill from Buffalo Last edited by ottopilot; 03-27-2008 at 01:44 PM.. Reason: Automerged Doublepost |
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03-27-2008, 02:39 PM | #374 (permalink) | |
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Location: Chicago
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To specifically address your three questions: - never said that - never said that, and explicitly pointed out that it's not the case - never said that either But, really, I just don't understand what you're trying to get at. I'm not being sarcastic or anything, I honestly have no clue how your post is responding to mine in any way.
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Le temps détruit tout "Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling |
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03-27-2008, 02:50 PM | #375 (permalink) | |
Living in a Warmer Insanity
Super Moderator
Location: Yucatan, Mexico
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I used to drink to drown my sorrows, but the damned things have learned how to swim- Frida Kahlo Vice President Starkizzer Fan Club |
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03-27-2008, 02:55 PM | #376 (permalink) | |
... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.
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03-27-2008, 03:01 PM | #377 (permalink) | |
Living in a Warmer Insanity
Super Moderator
Location: Yucatan, Mexico
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Call me a cynic... but good luck with that.
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I used to drink to drown my sorrows, but the damned things have learned how to swim- Frida Kahlo Vice President Starkizzer Fan Club |
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03-27-2008, 05:40 PM | #378 (permalink) | |
let me be clear
Location: Waddy Peytona
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"It rubs the lotion on Buffy, Jodi and Mr. French's skin" - Uncle Bill from Buffalo Last edited by ottopilot; 03-27-2008 at 06:06 PM.. |
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03-27-2008, 06:16 PM | #379 (permalink) |
Human
Administrator
Location: Chicago
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OK, but it's not even remotely close to what I said, and in some cases I explicitly said the opposite of what you wrote.
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Le temps détruit tout "Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling |
04-01-2008, 09:38 PM | #382 (permalink) |
Lennonite Priest
Location: Mansfield, Ohio USA
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Ok, so the blacks have the right to be pissy and say "God damn America" in church, have their church leaders visit a country's leader known to sponsor terrorism, pass along Hamas propaganda and overall just teach hate and negativity. Because the majority had ancestors enslaved maybe. (The maybe means that I'm sure some came to America on their own, some came from "freeman" ancestory" and so on.....")
Now, by that reasoning, the Jews in Germany and in Russia should hate their countries. The Jews should be preaching hate against the Vatican. The Jews would have reasons to hate the Egyptians (quite possibly their strongest ally in that region... the first to sign a peace accord with them.) The Jews would have reason to hate America because until Pearl Harbor, the majority of the populace wanted to remain deaf and stay out of the war, a minority actually helped Hitler rise to power and supported him. So, the Jews have a right to "God damn America". The Asian community has every right to hate America because of how we treated the Chinese in the late 1800's early 1900's. They were considered less than equal. Then in WW2 the camps we held them in (partial for their own safety). So they should be "God damning America". The Irish were treated as second class citizens when they came over, called Micks, saw signs saying "Irish need not apply" "Dogs and Irish keep of the grass". They were portrayed as lazy. (yet, without them and the Chinese our railroads may not have been built.) Then being Catholic made matters even worse. Should their religious leaders be allowed to say "God damn America" or maybe just a "Fuck America" will suffice. Anyone of Italian descent for almost 100 years has been thought of as a mafioso. They were called "degos" and again had a hard time finding work because of background.... but... they weren't hated that much , sooooo maybe just a "Fuck America" from them will work. Oh let us not forget the American Indian.... we took their lands and put them on reservations after exterminating MILLIONS of them...... They truly shuld be "God damning America". The pagans in the middle ages were hunted down and killed in Europe, should they be yelling "down with Europe and Christianity"? Then to this day there is still religious prejudice blatantly out there.... should they be "God and Goddess damning America and it's Christian Leadership"? My point is ultimately EVERYONE can find a reason to hate this country, (the KKK went after not just blacks but those of Jewish backgrounds, Catholic backgrounds, Asian, Pagan... basically everything not WASP..... but we don't want to accept that.... no it's just the blacks they went after and have a right to bitch... no one else.) but I don't see those people who hate this country eager to leave. If everyone hated and "God damn America" for what happened to their ancestors..... this great country would have ceased to exist long ago. I truly do not see how anyone in their right mind can see hate as a productive outlet. Why not work towards solutions instead of bitching, moaning and "God damning..." the country you live in? And if you truly want to teach that why not move out of your 1.6 MILLION dollar house on the golf course in a primarily white, gated community and stay in the area your sermon in, living on the median income of those you supposedly are serving?????? NOOOOO, it's all about the fucking power isn't it? Now, for a presidential candidate to state this man is his spiritual adviser, but then states he never saw any of this, or maybe he did but it was like an old crazy uncle and he didn't listen.... but his wife and kids may have.... but they didn't..... and the Rev. has the right to say all that but let Imus say something and "I want his job". Tells me 1 of 3 things.... either this presidential candidate is truly lying because he believes the hate spewed, which I cannot support...... OR he is lying and excusing it because he's a 2 faced backstabber.... which I don't want as president..... OR he saw this as a way to get "street" cred with the blacks. After all, he is NOT of American slave descent but true African, then white, brought up in Indonesia and Hawaii (by a white grandmother), went to Harvard (A school the REV. Wright seems to want blacks to believe they cannot go to because of the government) and the editor of their Law School review (or whatever)... which the REV Wright would have his followers believe is not possible in the US of KKK A....... which is the scariest, yet most believable theory for me. In other words in order to be accepted as "Black enough" he had to go to an extremist church and become close with the most extreme of church leaders he could find. Otherwise, with his past credentials and background, he wouldn't have that "street" cred in the "black community". He'd be looked at the same as Colin Powell, Condaleeza Rice, Clarence Thomas and so on. If this last one is the true one, then that means this man is pathological and dangerous, extremely dangerous. But that would explain this supposed "Charisma" this man has. (This is the one I find most believable and believe to be true.)
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I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?" Last edited by pan6467; 04-01-2008 at 10:18 PM.. |
04-01-2008, 10:35 PM | #383 (permalink) |
Human
Administrator
Location: Chicago
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Why come back to this thread after it has been dead or dying for almost a week, and then add nothing new to it other than to rant, once again, on the subject?
The fact is, the Italians, Irish, and Asians, among others, do not continue to have the same degree of problems as the black population does, due to the country's continued history of oppression towards them in one way or another. As for the Native Americans, they have every right to be angry at the country, and many of them still are, they just express it differently. Not to mention they don't have the same numbers as the black population - after all, our genocide of Native Americans was perhaps one of the most successful genocides in modern history. Really, though, there's no point in debating this topic any longer. You (and others) have clearly made up your mind, and no matter what is said you will not change it. Anytime someone answers a question you pose, you either ignore it or reject it. If you're not going to accept any answers, don't bother asking the questions. Is it that hard to understand that your experience of life in America is so fundamentally different from the experience of the black population? If you still can't recognize this, even after Condoleeza Rice has come out and commented on what she rightly called the "birth defect" of our nation, and even after the vast majority of black commentators have come out in one way or another on the side of Obama and/or Rev. Wright (I've actually not seen or read a single black commentator express any sort of outrage over Rev. Wright's statements, but I'm sure there are a few out there), and if you're incapable of saying to yourself, "gee, that's really interesting that there's such a racial divide in outrage over this topic, even when it comes to people like Secretary Rice," then there's really no hope for this discussion at all. Because if the glaringly obvious fact that the reaction to Rev. Wright and the general topic of racism in America has been so vastly different between black and white populations does not make you realize that maybe you and I, as white men, are incapable of understanding what it's like to live in America as a black man, then nothing will. EDIT: And, by the way, you're grossly misinterpreting/misunderstanding Rev. Wright's view. To use your Harvard example, it would be far more accurate to say that Rev. Wright believes that no one is going to help the typical black man get into Harvard - certainly not the public school system, where the schools the kids in his area go to are so terribly underfunded compared to the great schools in the predominantly white neighborhoods I grew up in - and so, if any of them want to accomplish something like go to Harvard, they will need to work and pray extra hard, because they, as black men, have no one but themselves and their community helping them out. And in case you didn't read this the first time, I'm posting it again because you desperately need to read this if you think Rev. Wright is "the most extreme of church leaders." Again, your experience as a white man is so vastly different from that of the typical black man, it's hard to understand that preachers like Rev. Wright are common in black churches all across America. In fact, they're downright normal. Please Read: Just a Typical Black Person click to show And a few new links that ought to be required reading/listening for people who are going to debate about this... Black Liberation Theology, in its Founder's Words Black Liberation Theology: A Historical Perspective
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Le temps détruit tout "Musicians are the carriers and communicators of spirit in the most immediate sense." - Kurt Elling Last edited by SecretMethod70; 04-01-2008 at 11:32 PM.. |
04-01-2008, 10:59 PM | #384 (permalink) | ||||||||
Junkie
Location: In the land of ice and snow.
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I'm going to put a couple forward, and you feel free to tell my why they are implausible. 1) It could be possible that Obama was attempting to gain insight into the black experience in America because he wanted to understand it, but couldn't relate to it very well. 2) He just happened to find jesus, and decided to attend the church of the man who helped him find that jesus and that the words of that man concerning non-jesusey things aren't that important because Obama recognizes that that man isn't necessarily an expert in non-jesusey things. 3) Obama, being a grown man capable of forming independent relationships with other people, forms friendship with and receives spiritual guidance from a man with whom he disagrees on nonspiritual matters. 4) Some combination of these. I'm not saying you're interpretations aren't valid, just that they seem to be very heavily weighted towards the "Obama is a lying sociopath" side of the issue, a fact which is more a reflection of who you are then what is actually going on with Obama. Quote:
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04-02-2008, 07:27 AM | #386 (permalink) | |
Darth Papa
Location: Yonder
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So, there's that. But to deal with it at the level of whether they have the right or not misses the point completely. The point is, by understanding WHY Wright and others like him say what they say, there's an opportunity to heal the fundamental divide of our country. I'm beginning to think, pan, that you're not interested in that. Which is okay, you don't have to be interested in that. But I'm REAL interested in that. I also get the impression Hillary isn't interested, and I get the impression Obama is. |
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04-02-2008, 07:35 AM | #387 (permalink) | |
Living in a Warmer Insanity
Super Moderator
Location: Yucatan, Mexico
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I used to drink to drown my sorrows, but the damned things have learned how to swim- Frida Kahlo Vice President Starkizzer Fan Club |
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04-02-2008, 07:38 AM | #388 (permalink) | |
Lover - Protector - Teacher
Location: Seattle, WA
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"I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel |
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04-02-2008, 10:14 AM | #389 (permalink) | ||||||||||||||
Lennonite Priest
Location: Mansfield, Ohio USA
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The Robertson, Falwell, Wright, Sharpton, Farrakhan types are just as successful at this. Quote:
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If I stand up in a church and tell my people how nothing is their fault, it's the government's, it's the white man's, it's everyone's fault but theirs. They will listen to what I say because no one likes to have to accept responsibility for choices that adversely affected them. "You dropped out, you failed in life because you put a crack pipe to your lips.... the US of KKK A did that. The government did that not you." Be surprised how many addict use this as their excuse. Why not preach hope, self responsibility and help build self esteem? Meanwhile it's affecting suburbia just as badly, but that's ok, the whites deserve it. "We live in communities where our men impregnate our women and disappear, refusing to take care of the families they have created. Not your fault.... it's the government's, they propagate this among our communities, they did this to us." "The government planted AIDS in the black man's community." Really? Hmmmm than why do whites have it? If I as a pastor talked about how maybe this should be a sign of all our failings and that perhaps it shows we need to get back to family or at the very least promote safe sex..... that puts the problem on the person's behavior. can't do that.... sooooo we'll blame the government. And so on. Quote:
However, if we don't like the message we'll put pressure on and force them to lose their jobs, maybe even get government involved and infringe on his free speech. In context Imus said a very poor joke that maybe back 30 years ago may have gotten a laugh. In context, Wright used his pulpit to continue hateful, racist, anti-governmental, anti-semitic conspiratorial messages. Quote:
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I do think 2 and 3 of my scenarios are more closely attached if not the same Quote:
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Maybe my definition of spiritual leader is different. Quote:
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I supported Edwards..... I went to Hilary.... I can say I would have gone to Obama... but then Billy Cunningham had his job threatened because he said "Barack Hussein Obama" and people demanded his job. From there I looked at things I dismissed, the lapel flag pins, the refusing to put the hand on the heart, then I looked at what Wright was saying..... and now, now there is no way in Hell. I believe him to be the worst candidate on numerous issues, but this closes the door. I am wrong a lot, I run on my emotions, read and believe what I CHOOSE to and make my own decisions. I maybe wrong here and now and if elected, for our future I hope I am very wrong about the man and I will happily admit such. So he only lost my vote..... but wait..... how many Hilary supporters is he disenfranchising by having his people tell her to quit. But he has "Charisma and talks about change and has street cred, he's no Uncle Tom." so he doesn't really need any of Hilary's supporters come Nov. So what if 20% of her supporters decide for various reasons decide to vote for McCain?
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I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?" |
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04-02-2008, 10:34 AM | #390 (permalink) |
Pissing in the cornflakes
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I don't know if it was brought up in this thread, I haven't read it, but I haven't read every post and every reply, but apparently the esteemed Reverend thinks that HIV was created by the US government to kill black people and said so in one of his sermons, (at least once, the one I saw).
God Damn America indeed.
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Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps. |
04-02-2008, 11:02 AM | #392 (permalink) | ||
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04-02-2008, 11:05 AM | #393 (permalink) | ||
Lennonite Priest
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BUT Wright is not the way. I'm sorry. I do not believe you can fight prejudice and hatred by adding to it. The only way to fight is to supply positive messages and work toward positive answers together. Not just blame one side. It's a fundamental and moral difference. If Obama was seriously interested and wanted to solve things in a positive way, then why was he going to a church that gave out racist messages for 20 years? Why didn't he stand up against that? Sorry, give me Rev. like George Foreman, who preach positively and work positively for positive changes..... and I can make a better country. Give me Wright, Sharpton, Robertson, Falwell and I'll show you how to ruin a country and make divisions even deeper. Obama follows Wright..... ummmmmm yeah.
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I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?" Last edited by pan6467; 04-02-2008 at 11:14 AM.. Reason: Automerged Doublepost |
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04-02-2008, 11:21 AM | #394 (permalink) | |
... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.
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04-02-2008, 11:55 AM | #395 (permalink) | |
Pissing in the cornflakes
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I'd pick one out for you but I don't have sound here to make sure its the correct one.
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Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps. |
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04-02-2008, 12:22 PM | #396 (permalink) |
... a sort of licensed troubleshooter.
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ROFL, Wright is a fucking nut.
Still, it's hard for me to condemn Wright for believing an unsupported conspiracy theory and not condemn people like Michael Crichton for their unsupported conspiracy theories about global warming being a hoax. Or Bush's unsupported conspiracy theory about al Qaeda in Iraq... or WMDS... or terrorism in general. Still, it's tough for me to say, "Wright is crazy and Obama used to go to church there, therefore Obama is crazy." Is there any evidence that Obama believes in any of the wild conspiracy theories that Wright seems to believe in? |
04-02-2008, 12:22 PM | #397 (permalink) | |
Lennonite Priest
Location: Mansfield, Ohio USA
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What abut my first amendment right here and how people tell me to be quiet, I don't know what I am talking about? Or UsTwo's or Host's? I never said anything about him not being allowed to say it. I said I do not believe it should be said in the pulpit. But the 1st amendment much like many others are only applicable to those who are approved, anyone else better watch what they say. The government may not go after them but by God the extremists will. So don't play this game with me.
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I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?" |
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04-02-2008, 01:07 PM | #398 (permalink) | ||||
Darth Papa
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Also, nobody's telling you to shut up, and nobody's ever been modded off this site because of their OPINION. How they express it, sure, but never in my 5 years of membership have I seen anyone banned because of the opinion they expressed. So don't give me this "you want to shut up dissent" crap. Besides, just because you have a right to spout off about something doesn't mean you have a right not to have people tell you you're off base. Quote:
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You know what, though? You're right: this First Amendment stuff I've brought up is a distraction. I really only meant it as a side point. I'll tell you what: you respond to the MEAT, the IMPORTANT part of the post you selectively quoted from here (by which I mean the entire rest of it), and I won't play whatever game you think I'm playing. See, in my opinion, we're not having the INTERESTING part of the conversation we could be having. I'm SO BORED by the conversation we ARE having, and I'd SO MUCH like to have the conversation we COULD BE having. So PLEASE go back and respond to the rest of my post. Last edited by ratbastid; 04-02-2008 at 02:12 PM.. |
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04-02-2008, 01:22 PM | #400 (permalink) |
Asshole
Administrator
Location: Chicago
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Ratbastid, thanks for trying to clear up one of my pet peeves - misinterpretation of the First Amendment. Let's all get this clear: the only entity that can infringe on your right to free speach is the government. If you're shouting political speach from your apartment balcony, your landlord is well within his rights to tell you to shut the fuck up or he'll evict you. If Hal decides to ban you because you call me a selfrighteous prig, he hasn't infringed on your First Amendment rights. If Don Imus' employer decides to fire him because a bunch of people complain about him and sponsors threaten to pull their ads if he keeps his job, there's no First Amendment violation.
So pan, if I tell you to shut the fuck up, it has not one thing to do with the First Amendment. I'm not the government. They're not a part of the conversation. Now I wouldn't do that because it's not nice and it's not allowable by the rules of this place, but those are completely separate. One last thing, and this is just a minor quibble, but there have been lots of people "modded" off this site for their opinion. I like to think that I've helped a lot of them never find their way back here. Their opinion? That you, the members, should buy their products or invest in their scams. That's their opinion, and they're welcome to it, but they can't express that here.
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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - B. Franklin "There ought to be limits to freedom." - George W. Bush "We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo |
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jeremiah, rev, wright, wrong |
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