Originally Posted by ubertuber

Tecoyah, I absolutely agree that the way we treat our vets is shameful.

The military medicine and VA systems have been seriously broken for decades now, and the current strains we are putting on them are really bringing these issues to the fore.

If you read what ex mil-med types have to say about the system, I think you'd find that the flaws here are so systemic and long-standing that it is nearly impossible to decide how to fix it.

Originally Posted by Rudyard Kipling

Tommy

I went into a public-'ouse to get a pint o'beer,
The publican 'e up an' sez, "We serve no red-coats here."
The girls be'ind the bar they laughed an' giggled fit to die,
I outs into the street again an' to myself sez I:

O it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, go away";
But it's ``Thank you, Mister Atkins, when the band begins to play,
The band begins to play, my boys, the band begins to play,
O it's ``Thank you, Mr. Atkins, when the band begins to play.

I went into a theatre as sober as could be,
They gave a drunk civilian room, but 'adn't none for me;
They sent me to the gallery or round the music-'alls,
But when it comes to fightin', Lord! they'll shove me in the stalls!

For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, wait outside";
But it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide,
The troopship's on the tide, my boys, the troopship's on the tide,
O it's "Special train for Atkins" when the trooper's on the tide.

Yes, makin' mock o' uniforms that guard you while you sleep
Is cheaper than them uniforms, an' they're starvation cheap;
An' hustlin' drunken soldiers when they're goin' large a bit
Is five times better business than paradin' in full kit.

Then it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy how's yer soul?"
But it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll,
The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
O it's "Thin red line of 'eroes" when the drums begin to roll.

We aren't no thin red 'eroes, nor we aren't no blackguards too,
But single men in barricks, most remarkable like you;
An' if sometimes our conduck isn't all your fancy paints:
Why, single men in barricks don't grow into plaster saints;

While it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Tommy, fall be'ind,"
But it's "Please to walk in front, sir," when there's trouble in the wind,
There's trouble in the wind, my boys, there's trouble in the wind,
O it's "Please to walk in front, sir," when there's trouble in the wind.

You talk o' better food for us, an' schools, an' fires an' all:
We'll wait for extry rations if you treat us rational.
Don't mess about the cook-room slops, but prove it to our face
The Widow's Uniform is not the soldier-man's disgrace.

For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Chuck him out, the brute!"
But it's "Saviour of 'is country," when the guns begin to shoot;
An' it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' anything you please;
But Tommy ain't a bloomin' fool - you bet that Tommy sees!

Retrieved from "http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Tommy"

Originally Posted by The_Jazz

Tec, I'm sorry, but other than Spec. Cruz's deplorable situation, this isn't news. It's a shame. It's a minor tragedy. It's a sad statement. It's not news.

Originally Posted by willravel

Clinical depression and suicide among veterans is news, and something must be done. I don't even approve of the troops actions a lot of the time, but I'll be damned if I'll ignore them in their time of need. A minor tragedy would be something like /this.

Not only are our troops being killed, but those who survive are mentally distressed to an extreme degree and ignoring them is absolutely wrong.

Originally Posted by The_Jazz

Will, again, this is nothing new, and it's not news. It's a tragedy, but it isn't even unexpected. There is always a higher rate of depression and suicide among combat veterans. There always will be.

You're in the extreme minority position on this board in that you're actually able to do something about the problem. The rest of us are neither educated enough nor licensed to be of any help.

Originally Posted by Shauk

it's really not news, Vietnam vets dealt with it as well, its a normal side effect of war veterancy. I'm surprised how many people don't see this as a risk to enlistment. I guess its easy to go blind in the face of promises of a stable income, housing, and an education. The military quite often promises the world to prospecting recruits without mentioning just how fucked up in the head you can become from watching your buddies have thier bodies torn apart, or watching the target of your gun become a mutilated shower of red mist.

any NORMAL person would be fucked up from seeing this in person, and if they aren't well chances are they already had issues.

meh, Its sad, yes, but not news, My family was military as were my family's friends. That was enough of a taste of it for me.

I agree that ignoring them is wrong though. They really do need counseling and support when they come back.