stevie667

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/5068606.stm

Damn, we better watch out, because if all these terror suspects keep hanging themselves, we could have another war on our hands!

I mean honestly, asymetric warfare? Hanging oneself to attack ones captors? I'd imagine that the guards would be happy there are three less prisoners to look after more than concerned mass riots will happen or whatnot.

The US military does make me wonder at times...

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MechCow

Yeah I read this today. I guess that you spend enough time dehumanising people eventually you can trick your mind into separating people into terrorists and non-terrorists. It reminds us that although the society we see around us appears to be a stable functional environment that rewards and punishes us, it is underpinned by a basic human empathy which is itself a product of the society . Under the right circumstances the mind forgoes empathy when it is no longer convenient, as in the case where you must make peace (reduce dissonance) with the fact that you are the commander of an evil institution created as a political stunt to help Americans get some sense of revenge.

I believe that America was fragile before 9/11 and is now beginning to implode upon itself unable to cope with the stress of the position that it occupies in the world. The rising household, government and foreign debt combined with the fact that oil is now being traded in euros is straining a world power that has no idea what it should be doing with its power and little values or wisdom beyond capitalism to offer to the world. Only the dominance in technology and booming tech industry will cushion America in the coming years.

Getting back to this article I'm somehow drawn to parallel's with Apocalypse Now. Add stress to any situation and you widen the possibilities of what people will accept or what they will do. In this case these individuals have become so divorced from reality that they see suicide as a personal attack on them because of the inconvenience that it serves to their purpose.

I guess we should all join Amnesty International? I have no idea how you convince an angry superpower to behave rationally.

CSflim

"medical teams had tried to revive the men, but all three were pronounced dead."

Quick! Get these men to the emergency ward! We're not through torturing them!

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Nimetic

It's a sad sad world these days. Sometimes I can barely believe it.

stevie667

Now they are saying it was a big PR stunt to get more sympathy for the inmates. Is it just me, or are they actually able to get anymore sympathy, i think everyone is pretty much maxed out on the crap that goes on there.

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Elphaba

That's quite a turn around from his previous statements. By all means, Mr. President, shut it down now.

Seaver

Since when do PoW's get trails while the wars are still going on?

Oh right, they dont.

Pacifier

Huh? those are "enemy combatants" not POW's

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ObieX

According to Bush this war will be a war that goes on for decades like the war on drugs. So these guys are supposed to sit around imprisoned without trial for how many decades? Its already been multiple YEARS. These guy's lives are already destroyed. And what about hte families of these men that probably depended on their income? Their wives and children probably homeless and starving (unless they've been blown up or shot already.)

Think about it.

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Nimetic

With which country exactly is the US at war with?

There was a war with Iraq, but that's over now.

hulk

Not over, it's a war _in_ Iraq We're at war there too, remember?

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Daniel_

It gets worse.

The BBC have just announced that one of the men was going to be released, as they had decided that he was no risk to the US.

Sadly they have a policy on not informing the men in these circumstances.

That makes this the second time (at least) that a G'tmo prisoner has committed suicide after the authorities had decided that they were safe to release, but before the prisoner had been told.

This begs the question, why would a man that has been declared innocent and no risk commit an act of war?

Either ( a ) the man was really a risk - therefore declaring him safe shows that the American system has failings, or

( b ) the man was no risk - therefore he probably wasn't committing an act of war, but rather an act of desperation - so the American system has failings.

Someone is bound to point out that my silly liberal British views are in some way giving in to terror, but I honestly cannot see things from the US point of view right now.

It's getting pretty bad when the only way out of jail for an innocent man is in a coffin.

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Gatorade Frost

He could have been comitting suicide out of desperation, but its effects will be seen as a failing of the American system and another point of criticism for Gitmo.

Whether a risk or not, it could be argued that at one point he was a risk to soldiers or citizens, but since he was captured and sent to Gitmo the risk he posed changed. That is very much like former wars when people have been sent to POW camps and after the war they were released since they are no longer a risk. People probably killed themselves in those POW camps, too, whe ther they be in Germany holding US/British/French citizens or in the Pacific with Japanese soldiers.

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Daniel_

I understand the distinction that you make, but I feel it is not totally valid, as the US have by fiat of government placed the camp on foreign territory (seemingly to avoid US law) and ignored the rulling of SCotUS saying that the prisoners ought to have access to due process.

I am pre-disposed to believe that the current US administration is taking an odd route to peace.

Having pent several years hearing the point of view of the US administration (and to a lesser extent that of the UK and Australia) it was interesting to me to read Moazzem Begg's book "Enemy Combatant: A British Muslim's Journey to Guantanamo and Back".

It is an interesting story, and seems to match up well with the available external reports.

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╔═════════════════════════════════════════╗
Overhead, the Albatross hangs motionless upon the air,
And deep beneath the rolling waves,
In labyrinths of Coral Caves,
The Echo of a distant time
Comes willowing across the sand;
And everthing is Green and Submarine
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krwlz

Unfortunatly both of those wars seem to cost too much money, and accomplish absolutly nothing...

Janie

According to certain people, most of the prisoners were captured in Afghanistan, and I do believe the States are no longer at war with them. So if they do indeed have POW status, they should have received their fair trials by now.

Does anyone know the truth of this particular fact?

And of course, they are only awarded POW status in accordance with the Geneva convention, but I guess it's pretty hard to determine if they are "terrorists", or "civilians who just screamed a lot, so I got nervous and threatened them with guns" (HUGE exaggeration) if no one in the international community really knows how/where they were captured except the captors themselves.

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Charlatan

Moved to Politics

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