Scape

Im not sure if this has been disscussed or not before but i recently had an interesting thought. Whoever it was that said we are living in a dream might have a good idea going.
In basic Psych 101 class stuff you learn that there are several different theories on why we dream, one of them being the, we dream to solve problems, theory. Now, I totally believe in that because ive had it happen to me. I was working on some type of construction and was stuck at a part I would go to sleep and the idea would pop into my head and it would work.
Where im going with this is, "life" can be looked at as ONE BIG problem or a set of sub problems. Things like money, survival, children, etc. And "we" live life so we can constantly go and try to "fix" these problems. Although it doesnt sound rational it makes sense to me that we could be someones dream, and we are a sub catogry of their brain working on problem solving. And perhaps when we die, and lifes problems "end" this is like the wake up call. Since time is relevant to any different view point, what may seem to us as a life time can only be a few seconds to someone else.
Also, why do we then need to go to sleep? Well perhaps when we sleep because we cant solve it while we think we are awake and us sleeping is really the unconcsious of who we are being dreamt by. Also since WE can solve better when we are sleep, it makes sense that when we go to sleep its a deeper level of thought for the outside person.
Maybe its dumb, but still interesting.. we just might be living in a dream world.

taliendo

perhaps look at it this way. Your physical existence is based upon a molecular combination of atoms, electrons/protons, quarks, and getting even smaller in the newest of theories little vibrating strings.

Now the second part of this only works if you concede that you are also made up of something innately not physical -- a spirit, or soul of some sort. (but perhaps made up of the same kind of particles at different frequencies of vibration that do not make up physical particles.)

This life (the physical one) is a time to build experiences that will change the vibrations of the non-physical part of you. Perhaps when you work out all of your iniquities and vices (problem-solving, if you wish to call it that.) You will be afforded the opportunity to advance to a completely higher plane (call it Nirvana or Heaven or whatever you wish.) Until you reach this "enlightenment" you will simply be reincarnated into another physical form to have a chance to work at those problems some more.

Maybe its not exactly like a dream, and I'm not sure if I explained it very well, but its just a thought....

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-LIFE IS ABSURD-

lordjeebus

I sometimes think that dreams may be to life what life is to a transcendental level of (perhaps collective) consciousness.

"Dreams are real while they last, can we say more of life?" -- Havelock Ellis

"Once Chuang Tzu dreamt he was a butterfly, a butterfly flitting and fluttering around, happy with himself and doing as he pleased. He didn't know he was Chuang Tzu. Suddenly he woke up and there he was, solid and unmistakable Chuang Tzu. But he didn't know if he was Chuang Tzu who had dreamt he was a butterfly, or a butterfly dreaming he was Chuang Tzu. Between Chuang Tzu and a butterfly there must be some distinction! This is called the Transformation of Things." -- Chuang Chou

Amarth

I think it's not dumb, only I don't think it's an outside person dreaming. I think it's just us dreaming a shared dream. We're learning to become better entities. It's interesting though to think of what this makes death mean. When we die in a dream, we don't stop dreaming. Does that mean that when one committs suicide, they just hover around, still dreaming, invisible to the rest of us?

SparklingDot

I know that there are some pretty weird and awful things happening in the world. But they don't really resemble the weird and awful things that I dream...

Technically, dreams are a mishmash of things that have happened to us, problems we need to solve, and a means of sorting out random neural activity. Maybe that explains the screwy state of the world if we are all in one shared dream...

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17 seconds is all you really need
- Smashing Pumpkins

Rodney

Dream or not, I've still got bills to pay.

duckznutz

I agree with Rodney . . . but you know the voices we all hear in our heads before we fall asleep each night . . . why do they scream sometimes? It can take half an hour or more to block them out . . . does anyone else take as long as that to quieten the voices?

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Where your talents and the needs of the world cross . . there lies your vocation.

Mantus

I can’t recall any solution or idea that has popped into my head after I woke up from sleep. Of course I they could have come in my dreams yet I became conscious of them later on in the day. So I am a bit skeptical on this theory of yours. Not that I think it’s not possible think while dreaming, I just don’t think that thinking is the main function of dreaming.

On the other hand, my greatest ideas usually come after a period of detachment from the subject. So perhaps your moments of insight after dreaming happened because you were able to perceive the problem from a fresh perspective after a period of rest.

As for pondering the idea of the truth of our reality, I think it is useless. For even if the world around us is not what we perceive to be its still very real.

“If one mistakes a rope for a snake, one is still seeing something that is real”

Even if we were to wake up into another reality, how would we know if that was the real reality or if that world was just a dream, within a dream, within a dream, and on and on.


Duckznutz,

I used to have allot of trouble going to sleep because I could not shut off my thoughts. My reasons for this problem was mostly psychological. I was feeling guilty that I was wasting my life away by not pursuing my dreams; had serious family problems; and was spending very little time in contemplation as most of my waking hours were taken up by brainless activities. I guess these things where catching up with me every night.

After I started trying to get my life back on track things got better. Then I started meditating and doing exercises before I went to bed. Now I fall asleep almost as soon as my head touches the pillow.

wilbjammin

This goes to show the vast metaphorical wealth of the human mind.

Personally, I've become terrified with the increasing regularity that I'm dreaming of simulations and simulacra. My dreams are hyperreal and in them I know that everything is too perfect to be real. My dreams often take a video game like atmosphere, not that I am necessarily in a game, but everything feels completely out of my hands. I'm simply an agent doing things I have to do in a world that is functioning repetitively without any sort of intention. It simply acts and I react. Often I am being chased or somehow fighting against innumerable odds. Sometimes I am just travelling in one direction without and purpose. The scenery is always intense, the motion is always intense, and the leaps between one landscape to the next are always extreme.

If dreaming does represent some sort of ultimate reality, then I'm going to be truly depressed, because I actually value my ability to make choices as an active participant in my life.

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Innominate.

mac Daddy

The brain energy is tremendous. We need to sleep to recharge ourselves. If not we would burn out. Energy displacement. We are not fision reactors. Energy must be built up. We can't use the energy we spend to create new energy. Brain overload. Trying to control what you dream of and control the dream itself is useless. Some say you can some say you can't. I have been working on it for almost twenty years. The only form found to control what you dream would be from outside stimulous while you are sleeping. That is still no guarentee.

rogue49

"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away."
Philip K. Dick

duckznutz

nice one rogue! Reality is the alarm clock that wakens us from the dream!

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Where your talents and the needs of the world cross . . there lies your vocation.

Mantus

Then the next question is have we ever tried hard enough to disbelieve?

My self? I think there is no point in trying. How can we hope to transcend into another reality, when we do not yet understand the one we are in?

dragon2fire

does it truly matter?


lets say life is a dream


does it seem real to you?


if life is a dream does that mean i am having this conversation with my self?


if so then it does not matter if its a dream or not

CSflim

It is beyond my capacity to dream up a world as incredible as the one I find myself living in.

To me, my dreams are dull and prosaic in comparison.

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rogue49

No...what is mean is that no matter what you believe or disbelieve
or what state of mind you are in.

Reality is still there.

When you sleep or are depressed or halucinating or even comatose,
when you come back to a normal...or even if you don't
Reality is still there.

Earth is still there, sky is still there, stars are still there,
it's you that have changed perception, not it.

Reality is what's left after you stop believing in it
It defines itself, you define your life.

Sho Nuff

Amen

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I know Nietzsche doesnt rhyme with peachy, but you sound like a pretentious prick when you correct me.

Paeder

thats Hinduism man.

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"If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music which he hears, however measured or far away."----Henry David Thoreau

:::OshnSoul:::

Scape, taliendo, lordjeebus, mac Daddy, Rogue49- you said what I would say. Well put.

Yes.

The whole point of evolution is evolution, itelf- to just keep evolving. Nothing is bad about those who evolve slower than others. It's their chosen pace. Yes, many of us don't understand Life, but that's what we're here for, to take the opportunity to find out- and it's usually the hard way. The hard way of understanding life, however, is the best way.

skyscan

On the fake or dream discussion. I agree that it doesn't matter but for a different reason.


No one after a certain age can believe FULLY that the world they believe they exist in is fake without large ammounts of proof.

Lets say you design a system that requires that they FULLY believe everything they have ever known is fake to be shown that it is fake. This could continue forever because none of the people in the system could bring themselves to believe, without any doubt, that everything doesn't exist. They would need the proof that can only be given if they believe fully. It's sort of a loop.

Think about it, is it easier to believe that your family, your house, and your friends don't "exist", or just sit back and pretend that this concept is impossible?

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Media Stew