What turned you against your religion? - Page 2 - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

emotes · 10-02-2003, 11:01 AM

Born and raised what I believe to be the Nazi's of all religion - Catholic.

For me, the "rules" of the church and doctrine did it for me. (IE - the lack of respect for women, everything you do is a sin... you get the idea).

Going to Sunday school I was never allowed to question why something was the way it was within the church. I always was told "because that is the way it is". This didn't last too long for me and, by the time I was in fourth grade, I stopped trying to believe what was being forced on me. I ended up finishing my Sunday school classes because a) my parents would not allow me to quit and b) so I can get money when I was confirmed.

Don't confuse my distain for religion with a lack a belief in god. I believe in a higher power, without a doubt.

papermachesatan · 10-02-2003, 11:55 AM

I initially started looking at other faiths because I just didn't want to goto church... which resulted in me finding deism.

Then, after hanging around various science and logic-orientated websites, I came to the realization that there is no rational basis to support a belief in God.

emotes · 10-02-2003, 12:01 PM

God and religion are, imo, two different things.

My belief in God isn't based on science or logic - it's based on personal experiences. Things which science or logic could not explain.

emotes · 10-02-2003, 12:02 PM

papermachesatan - nice pix, btw.

papermachesatan · 10-02-2003, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotes
God and religion are, imo, two different things.

My belief in God isn't based on science or logic - it's based on personal experiences. Things which science or logic could not explain.

I prefer to stick with objective data. Move into the category of subjective things like emotions and feelings(which are highly manipulable whether it be drugs or an electric clock doing the manipulating) and you start gettings things like gobblins and ghosts.

i.e.:

Quote:

Department of Psychology, Laurentian University, Ontario, Canada.

A left-handed Roman Catholic female adolescent with a history of early brain trauma reported nightly visitations by a sentient being. During one episode she experienced vibrations of the bed, an external presence along the left side that moved into her body, inner vaginal (not clitoral) and uterine sensations, and the sense of being impregnated by a force she attributed to the Holy Spirit. After the latter experience she felt an invisible baby superimposed upon her left shoulder. Analyses of the measurements for magnetic anomalies within her bedroom indicated an electric clock about 20 cm from her head while she slept. The complex form of the 4 microT magnetic pulses generated by the clock was similar to shapes that evoke electrical seizures in epileptic rats and sensitive humans.

Science and logic are much more reliable when it comes to determing what's bullshit and what isn't. I'll take them over "feelings" anyday.

papermachesatan · 10-02-2003, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotes
papermachesatan - nice pix, btw.

hehe thanks.

papermachesatan · 10-02-2003, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotes
Things which science or logic could not explain.

a minor nitpick...

things that science and logic cannot currently explain.

CSflim · 10-02-2003, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by papermachesatan
I prefer to stick with objective data. Move into the category of subjective things like emotions and feelings(which are highly manipulable whether it be drugs or an electric clock doing the manipulating) and you start gettings things like gobblins and ghosts.

i.e.:
Science and logic are much more reliable when it comes to determing what's bullshit and what isn't. I'll take them over "feelings" anyday.

Could you post a link for that story?
I heard about it before, and mentioned it in a thread, but I didn't have a link/names to back up what I was saying.

thanks.

emotes · 10-02-2003, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by papermachesatan
a minor nitpick...

things that science and logic cannot currently explain.

No, not a nitpick.

Actually, I'm all about logic. For the most part in my life, most things are black and white... this is the one major thing for me that isn't.

And, hey, if science proves me wrong I'll be the first to say I was wrong. I have no problem with that.

papermachesatan · 10-06-2003, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotes

And, hey, if science proves me wrong I'll be the first to say I was wrong. I have no problem with that.

burden of proof fallacy.

papermachesatan · 10-06-2003, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CSflim
Could you post a link for that story?
I heard about it before, and mentioned it in a thread, but I didn't have a link/names to back up what I was saying.

thanks.

linky

jvwgtr · 10-07-2003, 07:50 AM

For me, it was largely due to a Women's studies class at college.
I was partly outraged by the notion that women are "second-class citizens" in the Catholic church...somehow not holy enough to be priests?
But the main spark came from discussions of the personal bias of historians and archeologists in recording history.
Here's an example: for many years, cave dwellers were thought to be hunters, based on cave drawings of animals and weapons/spears...but closer examinations (with maybe a vegetarian-bias) show that the "weapons" depicted have hooks pointing in non-productive directions...leading some scholars to believe these are, perhaps, not weapons at all, but depictions of grain...that kind of mis-interpretation/assumption can shape your whole thinking about people.
Skip ahead now, and if all of history--and all religious writings--are the product of an individual's or group of individuals' personal bias/agenda, what can you believe?
Think about the kindergarten game of "Telephone", where you sit in a circle, and whisper a single word or phrase, on down the line. When the last person says aloud what was whispered, it comes out completely different.
Think about eyewitness accounts...five people witnessing the same event have five completely different stories.
It all added up to one underlying theme for me: The absolute truth is unknowable. In all things.
It's foolish for Man to presume to know or understand God, or for one person to believe they have a deeper understanding than others, and proceed to instruct...
It's hard for me to accept any religion, when the Truth is out of reach. I'm all for common-sense, broad concepts, like being good to one another.
My hope is that in the next life, we'll become part of something bigger, and that elusive Truth will be revealed.

opentocomments · 10-07-2003, 06:58 PM

Im gonna go witht eh cult fanatisism

Dibbler · 10-08-2003, 06:29 AM

Religion has killed more people than all other reasons combined.

Religion, like communism, is great in theory but never works the way it's intended.

I turned from religion when I was a kid due to my disgust with tele-evangelists. I just couldn't understand how a god could stand back and allow these crooks to steal little old ladies pension money. They were all so corrupt it just turned me off. Nowadays my disdain for religion is renewed by the Catholic Church. How could a god allow this crap?

cartmen34 · 10-16-2003, 11:15 AM

I grew up a Jehovah's Witness. My mom was into it, so of course, she forced me to be one as well. (Note the word forced) Anyway, about the time I turned 14 I actually started paying attention to what I was being force fed and I realized that all these people were blindly following an intrepretation of a book that was written THOUSANDS of years ago. In my mind I couldn't bring myself to continue to listen to a bunch of people who were basing all their opinions off a single book. Add to that the fact that every religion has their own intrepretation of the same book, thusly the different religions, and you have one mass confusion that is not worth my time or effort.

Think about this. Prove to me the bible is the truth. You cannot. How do we know that the guys who wrote this book weren't simply high on some drug, claimed to see god, then decided to write about it. Drug addicts have halucinations all the time.
Or someone decided to make up a story about how humans came to be, then invented this "god" to explain where everything came from. then some other guy picked up the story and decided to add to it. Before you know it, you have a book with several authors and no real basis. You may argue, "Well, it must be true because we've found artifacts and locations that are described in the bible!" Well of course you are going to find stuff like that! The authors of the book used what was around them to write their story to make it sound real.

Think about it. Don't blindly follow just because someone else says it's the truth.

bonbonbox · 10-16-2003, 10:46 PM

I have never turned away from my religion, I have only turned away from one thrust upon me. That being Christianity. Reason is it made no sense. I went to confirmation classes because I was forced to. When the time came to commit the decision was left to me and me alone, and I chose not to. Wasn't a popular decision around the house, but by definition it was my chioce to make. I wasn't looking for a loophole, but I knew one when I saw it.

jimk · 10-17-2003, 04:44 AM

i grew up lutheran. didn't hate it - i just didn't feel it. stopped attending church as a teen, but always felt there had to be some being/force bigger & wiser than the human race.

when my first son was born, i decided to get him baptized, just to make the grandparents happy. slightly hypocritical, maybe, but if it got my mom off my back, i was fine with it.

so i called up the church back in michigan where MY grandma went EVERY day until she died, my dad was still a member of, and i was a junior usher in grade school. they wouldn't do it. because i wasn't a "member" (read: there on sundays to put a fin in the hat).

fuck 'em.

wannabenakid247 · 10-17-2003, 08:32 AM

When i realised that i was gay and that there was no place for me within any religeon any more.

MSD · 10-18-2003, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sixate

Religion teaches hate. Religion teaches you to hate everything that your religion doesn't teach.

I was raised Catholic, and I was taught that God wanted nothing more than for us to love each other and work toward a peaceful world. We learned in Sunday School that what people should do in order to get to heaven is to help the less fortunate, not hurt others and never think that we're better than anyone else because were have more than them. We were told by priests that the only difference between religions is that other people worshipped God in a different way, and that we should embrace our similarities instead of dewlling on differences. Recently, they have been forced by the diocese to read a letter and ask that we sign petitions to oppose homosexual marriage. Our church's petitions added that while marriage is sacred, civil unions should be allowed. I don't see the hate in that.

The reason that I turned away (not against) is that I disagree on issues such as birth control, gay rights and womens' rights (the higher-up peoples' opinions,) and premarital sex. I also disagree with fundamental beliefs, such as the existence of hell and afterlife vs. reincarnation.

Tman144 · 10-21-2003, 05:54 PM

I was raised Unitarian Universalists. I thought it was a pretty good religion, tolorance for all, universal salvation, but that changed recently. There was a dispute about who was going to be the new minister and everyvody took sides. It got real ugly, and I realized that they weren't any diffrent from other people, and that religion is something you believe to make yourself feel good and that they never really took the tenates to heart.

Two, the idea of a God, or perfect being, is illogical. It can't exist. There is no way to be all powerful and all kowing (the creating a rock so heavy He can't lift it, ect.). If God is all knowing then he will know what He is going to do, and therefore has no free will. And something with no free will can't be all powerful.

wannabenakid247
You could try Unitarian Universalists, the leader of the choir was gay.

1337haxor · 10-21-2003, 06:30 PM

One day my logic just said to me "WTF!?"
Last day I believed in "god"

la petite moi · 10-29-2003, 10:38 AM

I was never raised to believe in a certain religion. Over time I've tried a couple different paths: Christianity and Wicca. Both of these seemed silly and included things that defy the laws of science.

So now I am a proud agnostic.

MSD · 10-29-2003, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by redlemon
Anyone try the Belief-O-Matic™?

Ironically, I was raised Roman-Catholic, and that was at the bottom of the list. I agree with 4 times as many Scientologist beliefs than Catholic, (61% vs. 15%) if you want to put it in perspective.

I'd also like to point out something about my previous post; I mentioned that I don't believe in hell, but I said nothing about disbelief in heaven.

Gun · 10-30-2003, 09:07 PM

Reason, logic, and common sense.

And terrorism. Anything that can justify terrorism, I want nothing to do with. Ever.

Ustwo · 10-30-2003, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MrSelfDestruct
I was raised Catholic, and I was taught that God wanted nothing more than for us to love each other and work toward a peaceful world. We learned in Sunday School that what people should do in order to get to heaven is to help the less fortunate, not hurt others and never think that we're better than anyone else because were have more than them. We were told by priests that the only difference between religions is that other people worshipped God in a different way, and that we should embrace our similarities instead of dewlling on differences. Recently, they have been forced by the diocese to read a letter and ask that we sign petitions to oppose homosexual marriage. Our church's petitions added that while marriage is sacred, civil unions should be allowed. I don't see the hate in that.

The reason that I turned away (not against) is that I disagree on issues such as birth control, gay rights and womens' rights (the higher-up peoples' opinions,) and premarital sex. I also disagree with fundamental beliefs, such as the existence of hell and afterlife vs. reincarnation.

I had much of the same upbringing, but I my reason for leaving was a bit different. I was sitting in Church (I had gone on my own, almost every school morning at this point, of my own free will) at 8 years old I had that epiphany that god doesn't exist. I still think religion is good for most people, just not for me.

10-07-2003, 06:58 PM	#53 (permalink)
opentocomments Psycho Location: St. Louis	Im gonna go witht eh cult fanatisism __________________ How do we know that the sky is not green and we are all color-blind?

10-16-2003, 11:15 AM	#55 (permalink)
cartmen34 Psycho Location: the hills of aquafina.	I grew up a Jehovah's Witness. My mom was into it, so of course, she forced me to be one as well. (Note the word forced) Anyway, about the time I turned 14 I actually started paying attention to what I was being force fed and I realized that all these people were blindly following an intrepretation of a book that was written THOUSANDS of years ago. In my mind I couldn't bring myself to continue to listen to a bunch of people who were basing all their opinions off a single book. Add to that the fact that every religion has their own intrepretation of the same book, thusly the different religions, and you have one mass confusion that is not worth my time or effort. Think about this. Prove to me the bible is the truth. You cannot. How do we know that the guys who wrote this book weren't simply high on some drug, claimed to see god, then decided to write about it. Drug addicts have halucinations all the time. Or someone decided to make up a story about how humans came to be, then invented this "god" to explain where everything came from. then some other guy picked up the story and decided to add to it. Before you know it, you have a book with several authors and no real basis. You may argue, "Well, it must be true because we've found artifacts and locations that are described in the bible!" Well of course you are going to find stuff like that! The authors of the book used what was around them to write their story to make it sound real. Think about it. Don't blindly follow just because someone else says it's the truth. __________________ "The problem with quick and dirty, as some people have said, is that the dirty remains long after the quick has been forgotten" - Steve McConnell

10-17-2003, 04:44 AM	#57 (permalink)
jimk Addict Location: Chicago	i grew up lutheran. didn't hate it - i just didn't feel it. stopped attending church as a teen, but always felt there had to be some being/force bigger & wiser than the human race. when my first son was born, i decided to get him baptized, just to make the grandparents happy. slightly hypocritical, maybe, but if it got my mom off my back, i was fine with it. so i called up the church back in michigan where MY grandma went EVERY day until she died, my dad was still a member of, and i was a junior usher in grade school. they wouldn't do it. because i wasn't a "member" (read: there on sundays to put a fin in the hat). fuck 'em. __________________ raw power is a guaranteed o.d. raw power is a laughin' at you & me -iggy

10-02-2003, 11:01 AM	#41 (permalink)
emotes Upright Location: Ohio	Born and raised what I believe to be the Nazi's of all religion - Catholic. For me, the "rules" of the church and doctrine did it for me. (IE - the lack of respect for women, everything you do is a sin... you get the idea). Going to Sunday school I was never allowed to question why something was the way it was within the church. I always was told "because that is the way it is". This didn't last too long for me and, by the time I was in fourth grade, I stopped trying to believe what was being forced on me. I ended up finishing my Sunday school classes because a) my parents would not allow me to quit and b) so I can get money when I was confirmed. Don't confuse my distain for religion with a lack a belief in god. I believe in a higher power, without a doubt.

10-02-2003, 11:55 AM	#42 (permalink)
papermachesatan Psycho Location: Texas	I initially started looking at other faiths because I just didn't want to goto church... which resulted in me finding deism. Then, after hanging around various science and logic-orientated websites, I came to the realization that there is no rational basis to support a belief in God.

10-02-2003, 12:01 PM	#43 (permalink)
emotes Upright Location: Ohio	God and religion are, imo, two different things. My belief in God isn't based on science or logic - it's based on personal experiences. Things which science or logic could not explain.

10-02-2003, 12:02 PM	#44 (permalink)
emotes Upright Location: Ohio	papermachesatan - nice pix, btw.

10-07-2003, 07:50 AM	#52 (permalink)
jvwgtr Completely bananas Location: Florida	For me, it was largely due to a Women's studies class at college. I was partly outraged by the notion that women are "second-class citizens" in the Catholic church...somehow not holy enough to be priests? But the main spark came from discussions of the personal bias of historians and archeologists in recording history. Here's an example: for many years, cave dwellers were thought to be hunters, based on cave drawings of animals and weapons/spears...but closer examinations (with maybe a vegetarian-bias) show that the "weapons" depicted have hooks pointing in non-productive directions...leading some scholars to believe these are, perhaps, not weapons at all, but depictions of grain...that kind of mis-interpretation/assumption can shape your whole thinking about people. Skip ahead now, and if all of history--and all religious writings--are the product of an individual's or group of individuals' personal bias/agenda, what can you believe? Think about the kindergarten game of "Telephone", where you sit in a circle, and whisper a single word or phrase, on down the line. When the last person says aloud what was whispered, it comes out completely different. Think about eyewitness accounts...five people witnessing the same event have five completely different stories. It all added up to one underlying theme for me: The absolute truth is unknowable. In all things. It's foolish for Man to presume to know or understand God, or for one person to believe they have a deeper understanding than others, and proceed to instruct... It's hard for me to accept any religion, when the Truth is out of reach. I'm all for common-sense, broad concepts, like being good to one another. My hope is that in the next life, we'll become part of something bigger, and that elusive Truth will be revealed.

10-08-2003, 06:29 AM	#54 (permalink)
Dibbler Psycho Location: Initech, Iowa	Religion has killed more people than all other reasons combined. Religion, like communism, is great in theory but never works the way it's intended. I turned from religion when I was a kid due to my disgust with tele-evangelists. I just couldn't understand how a god could stand back and allow these crooks to steal little old ladies pension money. They were all so corrupt it just turned me off. Nowadays my disdain for religion is renewed by the Catholic Church. How could a god allow this crap?

10-16-2003, 10:46 PM	#56 (permalink)
bonbonbox Banned	I have never turned away from my religion, I have only turned away from one thrust upon me. That being Christianity. Reason is it made no sense. I went to confirmation classes because I was forced to. When the time came to commit the decision was left to me and me alone, and I chose not to. Wasn't a popular decision around the house, but by definition it was my chioce to make. I wasn't looking for a loophole, but I knew one when I saw it.

10-17-2003, 08:32 AM	#58 (permalink)
wannabenakid247 Registered User Location: Wales, UK	When i realised that i was gay and that there was no place for me within any religeon any more.

10-21-2003, 05:54 PM	#60 (permalink)
Tman144 Tilted	I was raised Unitarian Universalists. I thought it was a pretty good religion, tolorance for all, universal salvation, but that changed recently. There was a dispute about who was going to be the new minister and everyvody took sides. It got real ugly, and I realized that they weren't any diffrent from other people, and that religion is something you believe to make yourself feel good and that they never really took the tenates to heart. Two, the idea of a God, or perfect being, is illogical. It can't exist. There is no way to be all powerful and all kowing (the creating a rock so heavy He can't lift it, ect.). If God is all knowing then he will know what He is going to do, and therefore has no free will. And something with no free will can't be all powerful. wannabenakid247 You could try Unitarian Universalists, the leader of the choir was gay.

10-21-2003, 06:30 PM	#61 (permalink)
1337haxor Insane Location: PA	One day my logic just said to me "WTF!?" Last day I believed in "god"

10-29-2003, 10:38 AM	#62 (permalink)
la petite moi Filling the Void. Location: California	I was never raised to believe in a certain religion. Over time I've tried a couple different paths: Christianity and Wicca. Both of these seemed silly and included things that defy the laws of science. So now I am a proud agnostic.

10-30-2003, 09:07 PM	#64 (permalink)
Gun Banned Location: Long Island	Reason, logic, and common sense. And terrorism. Anything that can justify terrorism, I want nothing to do with. Ever.