What the hell is it - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

girldetective · 03-07-2008, 09:10 AM

I dont work on Fridays and I couldnt sleep so Im eating shelled pistachios and thinking about love. I might be falling in love, but who knows and really who cares. That will figure itself out. In my mired thoughts the one thing of interest to me is how do emotions work. I believe emotions are chemically and electrically induced and that for various reasons those chemicals vary in potency from day to day and that we may react differently to stimuli based on their levels and interaction. Sometimes they change based on our senses, sometimes our thoughts and perspective. For example, if I look at a crane in the distance I feel and think differently about it than I do close up. Far away I might think about the structure, the beauty, the work that went into making it, the work it does. Standing next to it I may feel fear, excitement, interest in its operation and how it works, I feel more personal about the hunk o steel. This makes sense. I realize the sense memories, survival instinct, vicinity, and all that great junk. But how does it work? How do our naturally occurring chemicals get us to feel, which feels so completely different than thinking or sensing or remembering. How does something so physical come to feel so removed? What the hell is it?

Bees · 03-07-2008, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by namako

I believe emotions are chemically and electrically induced and that for various reasons those chemicals vary in potency from day to day and that we may react differently to stimuli based on their levels and interaction.......

But how does it work? How do our naturally occurring chemicals get us to feel, which feels so completely different than thinking or sensing or remembering. How does something so physical come to feel so removed? What the hell is it?

namako,

I love the way you write about your insight into why you believe our emotions are chemically and electrically induced. I certainly do not have the qualifications to attempt to answer your questions as to why and how this works nor do I possess your eloquence. I too have had similar perceptions of this phenomenom.

Would you believe that there is a movie, it's a kind of documentary, that attempts to explain this phenomenom? According to this movie your insight into how electricity and chemicals might induce changes in our brains that drive our emotions is RIGHT ON! What amazes me even more is what recent scientific research into the theory of quantum mechanics has revealed about this process (as presented in the movie).

WHAT THE BLEEP DO WE KNOW?
www.whatthebleep.com/whatthebleep

When you go to this page a short trailer from the film will play:
www.whatthebleep.com

Quote:

WHAT THE BLEEP DO WE KNOW?! is a new type of film. It is part documentary, part story, and part elaborate and inspiring visual effects and animations. The protagonist, Amanda, played by Marlee Matlin, finds herself in a fantastic Alice in Wonderland experience when her daily, uninspired life literally begins to unravel, revealing the uncertain world of the quantum field hidden behind what we consider to be our normal, waking reality.

Quote:

The film employs animation to realize the radical knowledge that modern science has unearthed in recent years. Powerful cinematic sequences explore the inner-workings of the human brain. Quirky animation introduces us to the smallest form of consciousness in the body – the cell. Dazzling visuals reinforce the film’s message in an exciting, powerful way.

snowy · 03-07-2008, 10:40 AM

It's not a documentary at all. It's propaganda put together by a cult:

Quote:

What the Bleep Do We Know!? (also written What tнe #$*! Dө ωΣ (k) πow!? and What the #$*! Do We Know!?) is a 2004 film, followed by an extended 2006 DVD release, which combines documentary-style interviews, computer-animated graphics, and a narrative to describe a metaphysical connection between science and spirituality.[1][2] The plot follows the story of a fictional deaf photographer as she struggles with her life.

Bleep was conceived and its production funded by William Arntz, who co-directed the film along with Betsy Chasse and Mark Vicente all of whom are students of Ramtha's School of Enlightenment.[3] A moderately low-budget independent production, it was promoted using unusual, grass-roots marketing methods and opened in art-house theaters in the western United States, winning several independent film awards before being picked up by a major distributor[4] and eventually grossing over $10 million.[5][6]

The film has been criticized for misrepresenting science[7][8][9][10] and containing pseudoscience[7][8], and has been described as quantum mysticism.[11][12]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/What_th...Do_We_Know!%3F

Quote:

Ramtha's School of Enlightenment or RSE, is a school based in the rural town of Yelm, Washington, in the United States. The school's curriculum is based on the alleged channelings by JZ Knight of the entity Ramtha.[1] The school has denied being a religion[2] or a cult.[3] It is estimated that the somewhere between 1,000-3,000 people who attend live within a fifty mile radius of the school in the Yelm area. RSE does not hold the status of a non-profit and so pays the required taxes for a US corporation. The organization is run as a business with more than fifty employees. The school offers classes (called "events") which can last for just one evening, a weekend, or more. Specialized events are run twice yearly for students to stay "current" in the school which allows them to be able to attend all other classes. These required retreats are now held worldwide. In addition to organizing these events, the school sells clothing, books, tapes, DVDs, and other merchandise.

According to the school's website, Ramtha's School of Enlightenment was founded in 1987. Before that time, classes (or "dialogues") were arranged nationwide and worldwide. The school was then formed and settled into one location where students travelled to attend events. The school's campus is located on a property owned and managed by JZ Knight. The school falls under the umbrella of JZK, Inc., a corporation formed and operated by JZ Knight that exists as the parent organization to several other business ventures.

Ramtha's School of Enlightenment teachings have been described as part of the New Age movement, and the organization's practices have been criticized by religious and media groups as being similar to established cults. Controversial religious scholar J. Gordon Melton wrote a book countering this argument, called Finding Enlightenment: Ramtha's School of Ancient Wisdom. The school has hosted several high-profile speakers since its formation 20 years ago.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramtha%..._Enlightenment

Johnny Rotten · 03-07-2008, 07:35 PM

At any rate.

You can picture emotions as nothing more than chemical reactions, but that doesn't make love any less "real" than fear, lust, jealousy, or depression. And chemical reactions are triggered by sensory input (along with memories, which are just archived sensory input). They don't just coalesce spontaneously, which is to say that the result is not arbitrary. It's based on preference, which starts out physically and is perpetuated through mental stimulation.

And by "mental stimulation" I don't just mean philosophical discussion. There are certain things that make you laugh, cry, and cringe. The person who triggers the positive responses the most -- both mental and physical responses -- becomes your preferred mate.

All things considered, sometimes it is good enough to have the luxury of emotional and physical attraction. Millions of people go their whole lives never finding anyone who really rocks their boat.

I don't know if this addresses your concerns -- I've had a couple beers

girldetective · 03-07-2008, 11:26 PM

Okay. But the thing is what the hell are feelings? I mean have you ever seen a brain? I dont know of any system so complicated that looks to the eye so simple. And going to a more microscopic view aren't brain cells basically the same as other cells in the body, with their own "programming"? The endocrine system, blood system, and so forth, when looked at seem complicated and I can often see how they work, as well as understand how they work, With the physical brain I really can't see how it works, but I can read about it and understand the electrical/chemical processes that take place, and thinking and remembering seem to me like physical processes. But what about feelings, another sort of built in system? It doesn't seem to me that feelings are always a reaction to a way of thinking, or a physical stimulus. Sometimes even if I try to dissect a feeling into parts and what may cause it, there seems not be no apparent reason other than maybe chemical. And yet they seem so far removed from chemicals. I can't see them (although I can see their effects). I can think about them, but they may effect my thinking. I don't really feel them physically, but they can affect me physically. I can read about them, but I have yet to find a definition that seems satisfactory about what they are in and of themselves.

PS: It is now about 12 hours after writing the original post and I am back in the same spot, with the same lighting, wearing the same thing, eating pistachios, and thinking about the same things. I feel as if no time has passed and nothing has happened in those 12 hours, but of course it has.

archetypal fool · 03-14-2008, 02:47 PM

I think you already understand what emotions are - you nailed it in the OP:

Quote:

I believe emotions are chemically and electrically induced and that for various reasons those chemicals vary in potency from day to day and that we may react differently to stimuli based on their levels and interaction. Sometimes they change based on our senses, sometimes our thoughts and perspective.

There isn't much more that could be said about what emotions are without diving head-first into neurology-speak and a full technical/esoteric discussion into the limbic system and the evolution of emotions.

If I may be so bold, I'd say that you're stuck in a loop of awe at the complexity of the mind, rather than a genuine lack of understanding - it happens to me and my friends all the time - and just like what happened to you, the contemplation eats up a lot of time...

If you haven't already, I suggest picking up some materials on the mind, and I'll recommend a few which I've found particularly interesting:

NOVA: Secrets of the Mind (2001)

A Brief Tour of Human Consciousness: From Impostor Poodles to Purple Numbers

Phantoms in the Brain: Probing the Mysteries of the Human Mind

The Emotional Brain: The Mysterious Underpinnings of Emotional Life

Synaptic Self: How Our Brains Become Who We Are

03-07-2008, 09:10 AM	#1 (permalink)
girldetective sufferable	What the hell is it I dont work on Fridays and I couldnt sleep so Im eating shelled pistachios and thinking about love. I might be falling in love, but who knows and really who cares. That will figure itself out. In my mired thoughts the one thing of interest to me is how do emotions work. I believe emotions are chemically and electrically induced and that for various reasons those chemicals vary in potency from day to day and that we may react differently to stimuli based on their levels and interaction. Sometimes they change based on our senses, sometimes our thoughts and perspective. For example, if I look at a crane in the distance I feel and think differently about it than I do close up. Far away I might think about the structure, the beauty, the work that went into making it, the work it does. Standing next to it I may feel fear, excitement, interest in its operation and how it works, I feel more personal about the hunk o steel. This makes sense. I realize the sense memories, survival instinct, vicinity, and all that great junk. But how does it work? How do our naturally occurring chemicals get us to feel, which feels so completely different than thinking or sensing or remembering. How does something so physical come to feel so removed? What the hell is it? __________________ As far as possible, without surrender, be on good terms with all persons...be cheerful; strive for happiness - Desiderata

03-07-2008, 07:35 PM	#4 (permalink)
Johnny Rotten lost and found Location: Berkeley	At any rate. You can picture emotions as nothing more than chemical reactions, but that doesn't make love any less "real" than fear, lust, jealousy, or depression. And chemical reactions are triggered by sensory input (along with memories, which are just archived sensory input). They don't just coalesce spontaneously, which is to say that the result is not arbitrary. It's based on preference, which starts out physically and is perpetuated through mental stimulation. And by "mental stimulation" I don't just mean philosophical discussion. There are certain things that make you laugh, cry, and cringe. The person who triggers the positive responses the most -- both mental and physical responses -- becomes your preferred mate. All things considered, sometimes it is good enough to have the luxury of emotional and physical attraction. Millions of people go their whole lives never finding anyone who really rocks their boat. I don't know if this addresses your concerns -- I've had a couple beers __________________ "The idea that money doesn't buy you happiness is a lie put about by the rich, to stop the poor from killing them." -- Michael Caine

03-07-2008, 11:26 PM	#5 (permalink)
girldetective sufferable	Okay. But the thing is what the hell are feelings? I mean have you ever seen a brain? I dont know of any system so complicated that looks to the eye so simple. And going to a more microscopic view aren't brain cells basically the same as other cells in the body, with their own "programming"? The endocrine system, blood system, and so forth, when looked at seem complicated and I can often see how they work, as well as understand how they work, With the physical brain I really can't see how it works, but I can read about it and understand the electrical/chemical processes that take place, and thinking and remembering seem to me like physical processes. But what about feelings, another sort of built in system? It doesn't seem to me that feelings are always a reaction to a way of thinking, or a physical stimulus. Sometimes even if I try to dissect a feeling into parts and what may cause it, there seems not be no apparent reason other than maybe chemical. And yet they seem so far removed from chemicals. I can't see them (although I can see their effects). I can think about them, but they may effect my thinking. I don't really feel them physically, but they can affect me physically. I can read about them, but I have yet to find a definition that seems satisfactory about what they are in and of themselves. PS: It is now about 12 hours after writing the original post and I am back in the same spot, with the same lighting, wearing the same thing, eating pistachios, and thinking about the same things. I feel as if no time has passed and nothing has happened in those 12 hours, but of course it has. __________________ As far as possible, without surrender, be on good terms with all persons...be cheerful; strive for happiness - Desiderata Last edited by girldetective; 03-08-2008 at 12:08 PM.. Reason: Automerged Doublepost