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Old 06-22-2003, 06:12 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Individuality, Can You Be Completely Unique?

So basically, just think about it for a second, is there really something such as individuality? If you look at it there are people in groups and who believe in certain things but your not being an individual if there are other people thinking that way. I don't think that a person can completely be an individual. If you think a certain way I bet you that there is someone out there who thinks the exact same way as you do about life and your philosophy. We read books and watch tv and get thoughts from your surroundings and they come from somewhere even if you alter them or do come up with something on your own I don't think your becoming and individual.

Basically I just feel like you can't really be your own person if other people also want to become so, then you become a group of individuals which doesn't really make you different if you there are other people like you.

Or maybe I'm just confusing myself
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Old 06-22-2003, 06:16 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Well the answer to your question is Yes and No. There ARE true inviduals out there but they are extremly rare. If they were common then they would just be the norm and not individuals.
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Old 06-22-2003, 07:08 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Differentiate between "free thinker" and individual,

In my opinion, the world is full of individuals who don't make their own choices based on what they want. They are still individuals, though.
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Old 06-23-2003, 06:21 AM   #4 (permalink)
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actually, I'm surprised that many people on board have the same opinions, thoughts & values I do.

I've always been a GDI (god-damned independent),
and I've always thought out a viewpoint for myself,
and been resistance to ideas that don't make common sense.

Yes, many times it's a burden, both from being different
and also the energy it's takes to form your own viewpoint.
But that's what I am, I can't be anything else.
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Old 06-23-2003, 06:30 AM   #5 (permalink)
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It seems to me that no one is truly unique, though we're all unique in our own way. One of the most important parts of growing up is the formation of one's identity -- a deeply complicated process, to be sure. But from what I've seen, we form our identity by using the stereotypes available to us in our culture. The complexity of the stereotypes we use determines how much of an individual we are perceived to be by others. Some people simply live as a single stereotype, and these are generally the people who are perceived to be dominated by groupthink. Others use some combination of two or three, and these are more often perceived to be individualistic.

It is perhaps worth mentioning that 'individualist' is itself a very common stereotype that people follow (I'm not saying that you fall into this camp, rogue49), and so they purposefully form their opinions to be contrary to what they perceive the general opinion of society to be. Of course, this sort of person is no more unique than the solidly bourgeois office worker.

Do we have free choice in this? Well... Of course which stereotypes we tend to follow depends on our native abilities and the enviroment we grow up in. Someone with high native intelligence is more likely to think of themself as a nerd than someone without such gifts. But our natural gifts are also highly fluid, and how we exercise whatever natural talent we have has a significant impact on what talent we have at the end of the day. Someone for whom the image of athlete is really appealing can turn themself into such, even if their natural talents are not primarily in that area.
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Old 06-23-2003, 07:07 AM   #6 (permalink)
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everyone believes they are unique
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Old 06-23-2003, 08:26 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I believe that there are some truly unique pepole. Charles Manson is one of them. There is nobody out there like charles manson and nobody that is trying to emulate him.
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Old 06-23-2003, 08:43 AM   #8 (permalink)
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I really liked what asaris said, partially because it was what I was thinking (where's the individuality here?, lol). I liked his comments about sterotypes (A contemporary of Freud called them Archetypes) and I liked that he pointed out that taking a postion counter to a group is still being influenced by the group.

I see it that I am an individual that is subject to the culture and perceptions I've gathered throughout my life. I am aware of social norms and abide by the ones I see fit. (I pay my check and leave a tip in restraunts as my parents taught me), I think in English which was a language that was around before I was born. Yet within these confines I also create my individual choices: sometimes I sneek into other movies at multiplexs; and Sublue is a word of my own choosing.

As I'm sitting here thinking of "an individual" Picasso comes to mind. His Art was completely unique for it's time and that's what made it stand out. Yet did he copy? Sure. He used paint, brushes, and canvouses just like everyone else.

I think our American culture loves the individual Archetype. That's why films like Rambo or A man with no Name are so popular. We love the idea of the lone cowboy who lives by his own rules. (I think its funny that we are developing a shadow to this thought - if you don't agree with Mr. Bush, then you're a traitor and a terrorist)

It's a great question Duck2Day. I'm glad you asked it, and I'm curious, is it important for you to see yourself as an individual and not a member of a group?
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Old 06-23-2003, 12:21 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I am unique.... just like everybody else.
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Old 06-23-2003, 12:50 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Can anyone be completely unique?

Of course not! Anyone who actually belives that they are completely unique is horribly horribly deluded.
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Old 06-23-2003, 05:54 PM   #11 (permalink)
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agreeing with asaris, within everyones upbringing are teh beliefs of their parents, and the expectations of their elders. They will form heroes during their life, and those heroes will, to a certain extent, influence their path of life. The friends that they make, coming from THEIR parents beliefs,etc, will influence them as well. A humans actions are influenced by the melting pot that they were poured out of, and the mold that they were broken into.
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Old 06-23-2003, 10:49 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Nobody is completely unique. Everyone is a product of their enviroment, even if they tend to live on the outskirts of said enviroment.
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Old 06-24-2003, 07:59 AM   #13 (permalink)
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When I hear the word Individuality I think or thinking for myself based on my exeperiences. No one can be completely unique that is for sure. Even as a child when you are developing your personality and around the toddler years when you are asserting your self autonomy so much you are conforming to your environment. Part of that is ingrained in our instincts as a method of survival. The odd creature is ostracised in nature and left to survive on it's own. There is strength in numbers and that situation (being ostracised) is less desirable to our Id. My daughter who isn't even three yet says phrases that either my husband, myself, or her friends say. That is what she's heard and she is attempting to conform as part of that instinct. It's only later when we begin to feel like duplicates of our family and want to be different that we start dying our hair purple or listening to different music than our family etc. I believe to be individual you must think through things for yourself. If you really truely like something you see in fashion I would say go ahead and get it and wear it even after that fashion has faded away. Be respectful to others (the traditional manners - tips, thanks, opening doors, etc.) but don't do things because everyone else is or wants to. If you are doing it because its what you want that you are your own individual. If someone else wants to copy you and do it too then take it as a compliment and nothing more. It's like the little kid in preschool "TEACHER! He's copying me!!" There is nothing wrong with it. Rebellion is conformity in reverse and no better.
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Old 06-24-2003, 01:26 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I don't know, I think people can be unique but no one person is completely unique. I bet there's always going to be someone out there just like you.
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Old 06-25-2003, 05:08 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Unless you grew up in utter solitude, you are not 100% 'unique' Everyone is everyday influenced by those around them. Everyone is everyday changing due to these influences. A person picks up habits, ideas, and many other things due to these changes, and they are from other people, who have gotten them from other people, but changed them a small bit. every time an (idea, habit etc.) is passed on, it is changed a bit, which is why everyone is not exactly the same. But, the princile idea remains similar.

Hope that made at least a little sense, I often veer off the path into obscurity while trying to explain things.
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Old 06-25-2003, 10:00 PM   #16 (permalink)
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As far as the physical goes, there are no true individuals. fingerprint, voiceprint, retinaprint, these are all used because the mathematical probability of there being two matching of these is so large, that so far as the current population goes, they're effectively impossible. The mental on the other hand... I think that no one can really be the same. You have all the outside factors, parents, media, etc. influencing. you have the life you have experienced yourself, you have your friends experiences, many things that influence you, but you put them together in your own way. Yes, you might have the same opinion on an issue, or even have the same basic stance towards life as another person, but the process used to arrive at the same end will be completely different.
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Old 06-25-2003, 11:29 PM   #17 (permalink)
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You can never truely be unique, as someone will always do something you do.. it's just a matter of time.
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Old 06-26-2003, 10:53 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Everyone is fucking unique! Even Britney Spears! There is at least one thing in the 1.000.000.000.000.000.000.009 things about you that cannot be applied to anyone else on the planet.
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Old 06-27-2003, 12:17 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by CSflim
Can anyone be completely unique?

Of course not! Anyone who actually belives that they are completely unique is horribly horribly deluded.
I agree completely. Also, the second they think they are unique, that automatically puts them in a huge group of people who also think they are independant and unique, throwing them into a contradiction.
 
Old 06-27-2003, 05:09 AM   #20 (permalink)
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IMO, The parts that make an individual are not unique.. but the combination of those parts create many many different sums. =) I think some of those sums could be nearly same, but not identical.

So.... by some of your "no one is unique" rational.. if you try to be exactly like someone else, it means you = them?

It seems some of the folks in this thread are talking about different degrees of unique.
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Old 06-27-2003, 10:39 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Here's my two cents worth, (and Canadian too!). Even if it was possible for someone to be exposed to the same material and "life scenes" as I was up until this point, it is unlikely that that person would be "identical" to me.
Person X could read every book, watched every TV show and been party to every conversation I've ever had and so on...but 'X' would receive different points from those exposures than I did. Whether it was a commercial that caught more/less notice than I gave or a passage of the book that was skimmed instead of read word for word.
Is 'X' going to be moved by the exact scenery while bicycling as I was? Possible though not likely.
Individuality seems to be like a colour wheel. From three primary colours we blend to secondary, tertiary and so on up to the 16 000 000 colours Pshop and Illustrator deal with. That is also limited by the RGB of the screen or CMYK of your printer. Human interaction isn't limited that way.
I shall now be known as Colour 16 000 001 and counting!
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Old 06-27-2003, 10:39 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Now does any of that make sense?
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Old 06-29-2003, 02:10 PM   #23 (permalink)
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I just think it's funny how people wear those shirts that say "You laugh at me because I'm different, but I laugh at you because your all the same". I wonder if they realize that those are shirts that are mass produced and there are millions of them existing and there are thousands of people who are actually wearing them. Now what does that say wearing a name brand shirt with the exact same saying as more people. If you wear one of those shirts I'm sorry, but I'm going to laught at you lol.
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Old 06-29-2003, 02:25 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Everyone is a unique pattern of experiences and thoughts each of which individually have all been thought or experienced before but combined with your pattern are entirely unique. Well maybe, maybe not. All I know is that there a lot of people trying to be individuals out there.

I think forgotten_dream said it best

Quote:
I am unique.... just like everybody else.
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Old 06-29-2003, 09:48 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Location: with the dust bunnies
there is a school of thought that states:
"if you've thought about it, someone has done it."
a truly frightening idea, but i agree.
even identical twins raised together, gone to the same school and spend all thier time together can't be the same, even if it's just that one had a pimple that the other didn't.
there is no possible way that someone could experience every moment that another has.
you can certainly share traits, names, ideology, stds, instincts, tastes and even fears; but you can NOT share a lifetimes worth of living.
everyone differs in some way. and everyone is unique....
but some people hide it well.
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Old 06-29-2003, 10:08 PM   #26 (permalink)
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someone needs to define completely unique. If it is absolutely everything about you, then no, nobody is completely unique because you're a human. I think that people are unique in ways, but are never completely unique.
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Old 06-30-2003, 08:57 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by monody
there is a school of thought that states:
"if you've thought about it, someone has done it."
a truly frightening idea, but i agree.
I really agree with that too. I once was thinking about when I was an old man and thinking to myself "when I'm old, I'm going to speed, steal, and all that other bad stuff because it won't make a difference". A few days after a comedian on tv was talking about that. I don't know......wierd.....
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Old 06-30-2003, 04:53 PM   #28 (permalink)
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What is with this "completely unique" phrase im seeing in this topic. There is no such thing as being "partially unique"; you are either unique or you aren't. The only thing it takes to make someone unique is some minuscule difference between that person and everyone else. anyone here ever heard of genetics? Genetics make almost everyone unique...even most identical twins are unique due to random mutations that are caused by the environment in which they live. if you can find 2 people (besides identical twins) that are the same be my guest.
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