Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community  

Go Back   Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community > The Academy > Tilted Philosophy


 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 04-20-2007, 05:42 AM   #1 (permalink)
Illusionary
 
tecoyah's Avatar
 
End of the Debate

With this book release, I cannot see how anyone taking the time and effort to understand can doubt Evolution as a reality. I just finished a second reading (rare,but I wanted this to sink in completely),and found the information absolutely definitive. For ANYONE wishing to be fascinated, and sometimes amazed.....I highly recommend reading this book.

"Carroll's fascinating new book, The Making of the Fittest(Norton) follows this strategy by taking a more general look at evolution focusing not only on the forms but also how they are connected to the evolutionary patterns revealed in the DNA. He starts out with a discussion of DNA in forensics, noting the contrast between the acceptance of DNA evidence in forensics with the skepticism in our society about evolution.

He considers it ironic that while people are almost 100% supportive about DNA evidence in the court room, more than 50% of citizens in the United States deny that evolution happens even though the patterns revealed by DNA studies speak more strongly than any other evidence about the reality of evolution. The goal of his new book is to make the case for the reality of evolution beyond any reasonable doubt. He clearly is taking on anti evolutionist and lawyer Phillip Johnson who in his writings during the 1990's tried to cast doubt on the reality of evolution, even though he does not once cite or mention Johnson.

Chapter one introduces us to a fascinating informal grouping of fish called "ice fish" which has a suite of adaptations to the extremely cold waters of the antarctic and he returns to these fish throughout the text to illustrate some of the patterns revealed in the DNA of many organisms.

Chapter two gives a brief and painless introduction to the mathematics of evolution emphasizing the power of even modest amounts of natural selection to affect evolutionary change in populations. He clearly explains the key concepts related to some classic examples of natural selection such as the Pepper moth and industrial melanism, so badly mangled by creationist Jonathan Wells in his Icons of Evolution.

One of the strongest sections is his discussion of fossil genes- for instance, the genes related to smell in which the number of pseudo genes or no longer functioning genes is highest in mammals with color vision. For instance mice have about 160 functional Vtr olfactory receptor genes while of the 200 such genes in our genome in our genome only 5 are functional, the rest are fossil genes. He hammers at this pattern with example after example so that by the time the punch line comes the reader is well prepared. The punch line of course is that fossil genes are evidence against two common erroneous notions: that evolution is progressive and that design or intent are involved in the development of life.

Later, he takes on another creationist canard, namely that evolution cannot give rise to novel biological forms and complexity and he makes his case convincingly using one of the favorite examples of creationists, namely the eye. He discusses the genetic underpinnings involved in the development of animal eyes, and in the rest of the chapter hammers creationist claims with example after example of complexity arising in the absence of an intelligent designer. He picks up one the themes of his research namely that animals share a common tool kit of genes involved in development and body planning.

Next he draws parallels between the tactics of anti evolutionists to Lysenkoism, and opposition of Chiropractors to vaccination noting in all three groups the same basic six strategies to under cut empirical science:

1. Doubt the science
2. Question the motives of scientists
3. Magnify disagreements among scientists and cite gadflies as authorities
4. Exaggerate potential harm
5. Appeal to personal freedom
6. Claim that acceptance (say of evolution or vaccination) repudiates key philosophy

I had to smile at these since this six fold strategy is exactly the one used by the previous Kansas Board of Education in its "hearings" on evolution the other year.

The book also gives many of the standard but important examples of the application of evolution to human problems and ends with a sobering look at how we are inadvertently causing the demise of fisheries due to poorly thought out and unintentional experiments in natural selection. The ending of the book is quite sobering noting that while we debate the existence of evolution our inadvertent evolutionary experiments are destroying the Earth's marine resources."


http://www2.wwnorton.com/catalog/fall06/006163.htm

I wanted to place this in "eye openers reading list".....or "threads on Evolution",But both are closed.
tecoyah is offline  
Old 04-20-2007, 06:22 AM   #2 (permalink)
Addict
 
braisler's Avatar
 
Location: Midway, KY
Tec, it sounds like a good read. I'll definitely check it out.

But to state that it is the end of the debate, one would have to accept that there is a debate going on. There isn't. You have reason on one side, faith on the other. That isn't a recipe for debate or discussion. If the other side believes they are right because they believe they are right and for no other reason... well, what can you do? Nothing.

Religious folks don't debate evolution, they refute it based on their faith.
__________________
---
You do not really understand something unless you can explain it to your grandmother.
- Albert Einstein
---
braisler is offline  
Old 04-20-2007, 06:34 AM   #3 (permalink)
Lover - Protector - Teacher
 
Jinn's Avatar
 
Location: Seattle, WA
Except that God and evolution can co-exist. Christians using Jesus as an excuse to ignore science are doing it because they don't want to bother learning about evolution, not because it is contrary to God's teachings.

The sad part is that evolution is not difficult to understand, nor difficult to believe.
__________________
"I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel

Last edited by Jinn; 04-20-2007 at 06:36 AM..
Jinn is offline  
Old 04-20-2007, 06:37 AM   #4 (permalink)
Upright
 
ProfessorMayhem's Avatar
 
Location: Austin, TX
The controversy only exists in the minds of people who can't reconcile their faith with reality.
ProfessorMayhem is offline  
Old 04-24-2007, 12:32 AM   #5 (permalink)
Upright
 
*******************************************************************************************************************************************************

Last edited by cmpbpv; 04-24-2007 at 04:56 PM.. Reason: banned
cmpbpv is offline  
Old 04-24-2007, 03:40 AM   #6 (permalink)
Illusionary
 
tecoyah's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmpbpv
I'm pretty sure most of us can agree that evolution exists on Earth, but I think the real question is what is the last universal ancestor to everything in the universe?
First we would need to find all the living creatures in the Universe....which we cannot do. Likely we can do so for the Earth, and perhaps the Solar System if we find life offworld. Many theories abound at this point, but I find the Mimivirus Connection quite compelling.....if incomplete.

"Viruses are parasites, so they can rely on the protein engineering of the host cell," Raoult said. He therefore found it "bizarre" that mimivirus would bother carrying around translation genes. The researchers are not yet sure, though, if the virus actually uses them.

Mimivirus’ unique nature may hold some key to the evolution of singe-celled organisms three billion years ago. Although it will likely take time to generate any consensus for it, the researchers advocate a fourth branch of life for mimivirus, and any other giant viruses that may turn up.

"It really is an organism," Raoult said. "You cannot believe it is just a biomolecule."


http://www.livescience.com/animalwor...ant_virus.html

It seems a possibility that something of this sort, allowed for the formation of self replicating cells in the distant past, and could therefore have started the ball rolling for evolution.
tecoyah is offline  
Old 05-02-2007, 05:40 PM   #7 (permalink)
still, wondering.
 
Ourcrazymodern?'s Avatar
 
Location: South Minneapolis, somewhere near the gorgeous gorge
The smallness
evolved much better
into largeness.

Thanks, tecoyah!
__________________
BE JUST AND FEAR NOT
Ourcrazymodern? is offline  
 

Tags
debate, end


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:30 PM.

Tilted Forum Project

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
© 2002-2012 Tilted Forum Project

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54