CityOfAngels

Disclaimer: Whenever you see me quoting the man who is the subject of this thread, I am paraphrasing.

I was going about my day, listening to my iPod, submitting an invoice to my old job, and on the way back I picked up some Del Taco. Walking home, listening to one of my favorite songs, I see a man in front of me. He said something to me so I took the headphones out of my ears and asked him to repeat himself. He asked what I had in the bag to eat, so I gave him my Macho Chicken Burrito and a few packets of Del Scorcho, and just as I was about to say, "alright, man, have a good one," he decided to tell me that he's a Desert Storm veteran. I wasn't really doing anything so I decided to stick around and hear what he had to say.

He told me the specifics of where he was working while serving our country, said some numbers that could've been regiment numbers or maybe his army identification numbers; going into detail where as I was trying to pay attention as much as I could, being that I'm deaf in my left ear. As he was talking, he would occasionally stop, and then go on with words as if he was still talking. For example (and this is a fictional example): If he said, "Apples are apples, oranges are oranges" it would've sounded like, "Apples are apples...oranges." I figured he had a few loose wires, but he didn't seem threatening at all, and he had a look on his face as if he had something really really important and deep to tell me, so I still listened as best as I could.

He went on to tell me that he worked on laser-guided missile systems, doing technical work for the army, etc. etc., and he said, "Well look where I am now. I'm a scientist, and now I have to beg." He said that where he worked, EVERYONE had a gun on them at all times, as if something odd was going on at that place. He'd trail around different points, making the conversation sound like a bunch of unrelated statements, but I was getting the jist of what he was saying. He told me that when he was "released" (he used the word released as if he was being released from a prison), they injected him in the left side of the neck (he was pointing so it could've been his back or whatnot) with "something" (he didn't know what they injected him with) to make it so he can't tell anyone about the things he saw. He said he remembered everything clear as day, but...again he stopped talking, once in awhile saying words that sounded unrelated but could possibly have been part of one sentence that he was trying to complete.

He told me that now he has "some lady" drive him around gang neighborhoods, and that he gives talks wherever he can, trying to encourage positive development within those communities. One thing he told me that he tells gang-members was, "You're not in a gang. Stop calling yourselves gang-bangers. You're a part of an organization. Any time there is money involved, deals being made, it is an organization. This isn't your family; it is a company you work for." I guess his point was that gang members feel attached to their sets because everything is taken so personally, but just like any business, the "organization" doesn't really care about you. It's just there to make money.

One thing that caught me off-guard was when he asked me, "You heard of Stargate?" I was gonna say, "That movie?" but I didn't, because this whole time I've been listening to him, taking him as seriously as I can out of respect, and for him to start talking about movies? Naw, it couldn't be. But sure enough, he said, "You know, that show? It's real." Of course my response was, "huh?" He said, "That's why we're in Iraq. That's why our government has tried so hard to get us on their side for a war that seems so pointless. The crystal is in Babylon. Where do you think all the indians went? I'm telling you, it's true." To tell the truth, I never payed any attention to the movie or the show, so I had no idea what he was talking about. It was hard for me to take him seriously after that, but I was still trying my best to. Later on in the conversation he went on to say that Mexico has "the crystal" too.

Out of nowhere, he recommended two books for me to read:
* Behold a Pale Horse by William Cooper and
* Genesis Revisited by Zecharia Sitchin.
While he was telling me all this, I said to him: "I can't say I believe you, but I can't say I don't either." He said to me, "Don't believe me. Don't believe anyone. Don't believe anything unless you see it for yourself."

I dunno; it's hard for me to describe this conversation because it was hard for me to fully understand him. He wasn't slurring his words, and he wasn't drunk, but as I said sometimes he'd trail off to a new topic before revisiting an old one, or sometimes he'll do that thing where he stops talking and then says words that could either be random or part of a sentence he was trying to complete. One of the last things he told me was that Ronald Reagan issued a report of some sorts, stating that our country needs to start getting prepared for some sort of alien invasion. He said that Reagan's alzheimers wasn't really alzheimers; "they turned his brain to jelly." Whoever "they" are, I assumed he meant the behind-the-scenes government officials, who in our eyes don't exist, but they really control everything.

Was this man crazy?
Was he telling the truth?
Truthfully, I don't know.
But the last thing he said to me hit hard.

During the course of the conversation, we came back to gangs. He said he doesn't know what color he's supposed to be wearing in what areas; he's gotten jumped numerous times just because of that. He said he gets it from all races; mostly whites AND blacks, and then hispanics. He stated again how they're criminal organizations, working for an illegal profit. I told him, "Well what do you think a country is?" We both said at the same time, "It's just a huge gang." I said, "We need a revolution." He said, "Yeah it's comin'. When all the people of the earth unite; all races, all nationalities."

I was amazed. That's what's been in my head all along; in order to have peace within' our own countries, our own lives, we must unite. Some sort of World Treaty that would not only keep everyone from warring with each other, but bring them together as brothers and sisters. A united world as one people: humanity. Amidst this guy's "crazy talk," he had a message that related to a true problem. And I say crazy talk as in what a person without patience to listen and analyze would think about it. I would've found it funny that he asked for a dollar if he wasn't so poor that he had to. That's because I completely forgot he was homeless; I saw him as a true person, trying to convey a message to me. And suddenly this man's asking for a "spare buck" surprised me, reminding me of our brutal class system.

I gave him a five. No not a hand-five but five dollars. I'm poor, too; can't be handing out twenties. But I wish I could. I wish I could hand out billions to bring the world together, and it hurts knowing that people can, but they decide not to.

So what do you think? "Crazy talk" or possibility. I'll stick with his suggestion: "Don't believe me. Don't believe anyone. Don't believe anything unless you see it for yourself."

__________________
The words "love" and "life" go together. It is almost as if they are one. You must love to live, and you must live to love, or you have never lived nor loved at all.

alpha phi

That story gave me goosebumps to read
I imangine you hair standing on end.
There is a fine line between genius and insane.

I have always thought there is something important in Babylon
Every major empire has sought to control that region of the world.
I suspect it has something to do with how we got here on earth.
the garden of eden, so to speak.
It is the cradle of civilization after all.

Crazy?......could be...he makes sense
If this was your test on "what if you met Jesus on the street"
I'd say you passed....I can't say I'd be so patient.

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Toaster126

I wouldn't go that far. I believe the Holocaust happened, for example, even though I've never seen any physical evidence. But the premise of being careful of what you believe and trying your best to verify things is a good idea.

__________________
"The question isn't who is going to let me, it's who is going to stop me." (Ayn Rand)
"The truth is that our finest moments are most likely to occur when we are feeling deeply uncomfortable, unhappy, or unfulfilled. For it is only in such moments, propelled by our discomfort, that we are likely to step out of our ruts and start searching for different ways or truer answers." (M. Scott Peck)

CityOfAngels

Yeah; I wish everyone else could've been there, so it wouldn't be a "story." But the best I can do is tell it from my perspective.

It's funny you say you imagine my hair standing on end; I've had my hair spiked up all day.

__________________
The words "love" and "life" go together. It is almost as if they are one. You must love to live, and you must live to love, or you have never lived nor loved at all.

Aladdin Sane

Crazy as they come. Absolutely bonkers.

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Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

dlish

a few loose screws,a few cents short of a dollar, a few marbles.. call it what u like, this guys crazy..his testimony wont stand in an court so why should u believe him?

__________________
An injustice anywhere, is an injustice everywhere

I always sign my facebook comments with ()()===========(}. Does that make me gay?
- Filthy

macmanmike6100

interesting encounter with the guy; i give you credit for listening to him for so long, but there's a reason why this thread's in paranoia...

optik_nerve

He seems crazy but whatever he had to say seemed important and true. It's the details that make him seem crazy, not the message he's conveying about world peace.

dlish

i met a ranting lunatic once before.. i was dropping my brother off at home and this guy i'd seen preach in this plaza close by walked past with some pamphlets..walks up to the car and says hello.. i was like...'here we go'....

i said hello back..he introduced himself and told me how the world is gonan end and how america is evil and crap about the big apple and the end of the world...i dunno..crap of the fire and brimstone sort.. anyways.. i was like uhuh..yep..uhuh.. sure. dont get me wrong the guy was well read, well spoken and knew a lot about a lot. its just that these kinda people, if they dont start out nuts, they become nuts.

this guy made me late..i had people over too.... made ,me look bad in front of my guests, although i did tell him im late cos i have guests coming over, but he persisted about some iraqi conspiracy meddled with the end of the word and the interpretation of certain words in the bible...

to put it plainly.. anyone can interpret anything to mean anything they want. its up to u if u want to take it so seriously as to make ureself paranoid and eventually nuts.

__________________
An injustice anywhere, is an injustice everywhere

I always sign my facebook comments with ()()===========(}. Does that make me gay?
- Filthy

guthmund

I don't usually buy into the outlandish, but I don't like to just write it off arbitrarily either.

Was this guy crazy? Maybe.
We've sent a satellite to Saturn to probe the mysteries of her moons, we've sent two remote control rovers to Mars to take pictures of the Martian landscape, there is serious talk to build an elevator into space and just the other day there was an article online about the feasibility of a hyper-drive. We've 'discovered' black holes, speculated on worm holes and the latest notion from the world of theoretcial physics is that everything is made up of tiny vibrating strings of various sizes...a theory, I should point out, that calls for the existence of up to 11 dimensions (it is 11, right? I don't have it sitting right in front of me...). 20 years ago, these ideas were pretty ridiculous. So, is the notion of a 'star gate' really that out there?

If it were anywhere, why wouldn't it be in Babylon? Cradle of civilization and, like alpha pointed out, the center of a bajillion different conflicts and the nexus of no less than three of the world's major religions.

Do I believe that Reagan had his brains scrambled by aliens... He did fade awful fast from the limelight of his Presidency...Alzheimer's or not. Not to mention...
Just a little food for thought...

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No signature. None. Seriously.

SERPENT7

Your street person is a textbook scitzophrenic. paranoid-type.
But he is low-level, and therefore high-functioning. That is why he can beg off of you in the streets, and not get institutionalized. (The mentally ill are always released unless they are a danger to themselves or others.)

Cynthetiq

as far as gangs and organizations...


FREAKANOMICS discusses that in detail.

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I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

Brewmaniac

Just running into people on the street or where ever, I usually talk to those who single me out(I'm an easy target being in a wheelchair) I let them go on about what's on their minds and try to be empathic, putting myself in their shoes for a moment. After hearing what's on their minds after a few minutes, I excuse myself and after reflecting on what's transpired I usually feel as if I benefited from being approached!

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"That's a joke... I say, that's a joke, son"

Zeraph

I doubt what the guy said is true... but the best way to keep a big secret would be to make it public with disinformation (like making a scifi show about, or telling it in a way that the people telling seem bonkers) so who knows for sure.

dlish

im with serpent... i was thinking the same thing..scitzo...

__________________
An injustice anywhere, is an injustice everywhere

I always sign my facebook comments with ()()===========(}. Does that make me gay?
- Filthy

darens42

the testimony in court didn't stand up against OJ.... but I know what I believe....

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I'm not superstitious - it's bad luck to be superstitious

CityOfAngels

Or like calling a war for oil a "war on terrorism."

May I please add that quote into my signature? The wisdom of that statement just kicked me in the face. I also might want to use it on my myspace. I'll credit you however you like.

__________________
The words "love" and "life" go together. It is almost as if they are one. You must love to live, and you must live to love, or you have never lived nor loved at all.

crow_daw

Nobody ever believes the guy in the movies until its too late.

That being said..... that guy was batshit-crazy.

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"We each have a star, all we have to do is find it. Once you do, everyone who sees it will be blinded." - Earl Simmons

Lwang9276

yea thats pretty crazy.. so any ideas what the books mentioned are about?

alpha phi

Behold a Pale Horse
Behold a Pale Horse MP3
Genesis Revisited
Genesis Revisited author Zecharia Sitchin

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dlish

ok if you guys are interested in that sort of stuff, mind manipulation, ill give ya another book to read.. i read it in 2 days. i found it really interesting but some things are far fetched.

its called "the men who stare at goats". its an odd title for a book, but its about mind manipulation of prisoners ( esp in the war on terror) told by none else but a former soldier of course! . with me being an advocate for civil rights of war on terror detainees i found it an intruiging book though u gotta take some stuff with a grain of salt. heres the linky on amazon if your interested...
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/074...lance&n=283155

__________________
An injustice anywhere, is an injustice everywhere

I always sign my facebook comments with ()()===========(}. Does that make me gay?
- Filthy

Zeraph

Of course. You can use Zeraph, or M.A.K.

CityOfAngels

Thanks!

__________________
The words "love" and "life" go together. It is almost as if they are one. You must love to live, and you must live to love, or you have never lived nor loved at all.

Martian

As has been mentioned, the man shows several indications of suffering from schizophrenia, either paranoid or disorganized. In particular, his habit of jumping around topics seemingly at random, his habit of 'leaving out' words, as it were and his delusions of persecution seem to indicate that. Tell me, what sort of mood did he seem to be in? Did he smile or grimace a lot while you were talking with him?

The thing to remember about the homeless is that anyone who lives on the street is there for a reason. Sometimes it's just bad luck or circumstances, but more frequently it's an addiction or mental disorder that causes the person to have trouble remaining self-sufficient. With that in mind, I'd say it's important to take anything a homeless person tells you with a grain of salt, no matter how lucid they seem.

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I wake up in the morning more tired than before I slept
I get through cryin' and I'm sadder than before I wept
I get through thinkin' now, and the thoughts have left my head
I get through speakin' and I can't remember, not a word that I said

- Ben Harper, Show Me A Little Shame

Dragonknight

Yeah sorry to say that I'm with everyone whos going with the crazy side. Babylon is a wierd place though in truth. I was there during OIF I and it does have a "feeling" about it, but it is a VERY old place. The guy went through a lot, and IMO saw some things to change his life and mind forever, obviously by the way he was acting.

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Freedom is NOT Free.

shadowfiend

Seconded. The 'stories' he told you sound too unbelievable, they might be true. I'd say you're one lucky guy to have him came up to you.

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Have you ever looked into a mirror and just said... damn... I'm one sexy f**ker!!! Yeah... me neither.

Jinn

I had a friend whose mom was a paranoid schizophrenic, and she talked almost exactly as you've described. The strange thing about paranoid schizo is that they'll jump between lucid and insane during a conversation. She'd be having a normal "small-talk" conversation and then she'd have to run inside because the government was watching her. You'd go inside and she'd be talking about the weather and the news, and the you'd have to hide under the table because the Paparazzi was nearby.

Mental illness is so intense, especially in the case of this guy. It sounds like he's going in and out. He's an ex Desert Storm soldier, and he remembers that.. but his paranoia overflows into having been drugged. He remembers Stargate and books he's read, but then his paranoia overflows into them being real and tangible.

All in all, I'm glad you stopped to listen to this guy (and even more, type out the whole story for us). It was a great read, and I almost wish my city had more bums.. I'd start listening myself.

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"I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel

rlynnm

A lot of experiences are a matter of perception, his perception seeming a little jaded if that would even be the proper word. I imagine certain climactic events occuring in such places but I myself have trouble in faith, so I couldn't say that I find all the stories to be completely legit. They are worth looking into, as is any other factor that can lead to some sort of unity. However, your efforts in hearing him out are very commendable, I don't think I could have been able to sit with the same patience that you had.

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The hardest thing is to be honest with yourself, especially if that means completely redefining the world you've come to know.

Don't look too hard, I'm right in front of you.

ariekitten

interesting

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paulskinback

sounds to me that the guy was a nutsac, he may have been a desert storm vet (although a lot of homeless beggars use that line) but I think the more likely story is that he is just a crazy fuck up with no-one to talk to.

timalkin

I've also had a homeless guy yell to me that cops poison people. Although I already knew this, his lack of bathing and toothless grin didn't help his credibility.

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Trinity: "What do you need?"

Neo: "Guns. Lots of guns."

-The Matrix